[Music] you I was the first one to be picked up so they put me in a cell they locked me in there in this degrading little outfit I gotta go doctor I've never screamed so loud in my life never been so upset in my life it was an experience of being out of control Stanford University Northern California one of America's most prestigious academic institutions and in 1971 the scene of one of the most notorious experiments in the history of psychology [Music] I was interested in what happens if you put good people in an evil place [Music] does the situation outside of you the institution could come to control your behavior or does the things inside view your attitude your values your morality allow you to rise above a a negative environment the negative environment Zimbardo chose to test his ideas was a prison he would convert the basement of the university's psychology department into a subterranean Jail we put prison doors on each of three office cells in the cells there was nothing but three beds and and it was very actually very little room of anything else because they were very small and here we had solitary confinement which we call the hole and in the hole was was the place where prisoners would be put for punishment it was a very very small area when you closed the door was totally dark [Music] all the guards wore military uniforms and we had them where are these silver [ __ ] sunglasses and what it does is you can't see someone's eyes and so that loses some of the human is the humanity in general we wanted to create a sense of power that is the guards as a category are people who have power over others in this case power over the prison's a decade earlier psychologist Stanley Milgram had also looked at how we respond to Authority in order to understand how people were induced to obey unjust regimes and participate in atrocities such as the Holocaust he set up an experiment volunteers were told they were taking part in scientific research to improve memory you open those and tell me which of you is which please burn I separated by a screen the teacher would ask the learner questions in a word game an administer an electric shock when the answer was incorrect he was told to increase the voltage with each wrong answer cloud horse rock house answer wrong hundred fifty volts answer horse shut the honor get me out of here please continue please the experiment requires you continue teacher please continue participants didn't know that the learner was really an actor and the so called shocks harmless you know get a shot under navy volt I'm not gonna kill that man there I mean who's going to take the responsibility if anything happens to that gentleman I'm responsible for anything that happens here continually an excellent slow walk dance truck music two-thirds of volunteers were prepared to administer a potentially fatal electric shock when encouraged to do so by what they perceived as a legitimate authority figure in this case a man in a white coat 375 volts I think sometimes that I following that monkey no answer he was hollering all those voltage and to check in to see if Hilary please Milgram's findings horrified America they show that decent American citizens were as capable of committing acts against their conscience as the Germans had been under the Nazis like Milgram Zimbardo was interested in the power of social situations to overwhelm individuals his experiment would test people's responses to an oppressive regime where they accepted or act against it Zimbardo experiment was conducted against a backdrop of civil rights activism and protest against the Vietnam War there was a sense of student power student dominance and student rebellion against against the authority in general it was from the student body that Zimbardo selected his participants after passing tests to screen out anyone with a psychological abnormality they were paid $15 a day each was randomly assigned to the role of God or prisoner what a prison to me it still is a prison to me I don't look on it as an experiment or a simulation but just as a prison that was run by psychologists instead of run by the state I was 20 and that September I was going to college and it would be nice to have a summer job but there sure wasn't a lot of time left and I looked in the want ads and I found this thing which was just going to fit it was just two weeks that's it you put a uniform on and are given a job to keep these people in line you really become that person what you put on that khaki uniform you put on the glasses you put on it you take the nightstick I was on summer break from my first year in college and I was looking for a job had to choose between that and making pizzas that sounded like a lot more fun as well as running the experiment Zimbardo took on the role of prison superintendent he began by briefing the gods I said you have to maintain law and order if prisoners escape the study is over and you can't use physical violence it's a fear there can be a notion that their life is totally controlled by us that the constant surveillance we have Co empowering situation and they have done prisoners were brought to the basement prison blindfolded to confuse them about their whereabouts they were stripped and deloused of course the guards started making fun of their genitals and humiliating them and really it's a start of what's known as a degradation process which not only prisons but lots of military type outfits use that process when I first got here even though it has a strip they would call me name I still didn't feel at all I have no friends no just looking out of the job I recalled sort of walking up and down the very short hallway which was the prison hall and looking in on the prisoners in there basically lounging around on their beds I felt it was like the day in summer camp the first day I said this might be a very long very boring experiment because it's conceivable nothing will happen I arrived independently at the conclusion that this experiment must have been put together to prove a point about prisons being a cruel and inhumane place and therefore I would do my part yeah to to help those results come about I was a confrontational and arrogant 18 year old at the time and you know I said somebody ought to stir things up a bit here on the second morning the prisoners had decided to stir things up as well the guards found some of them had used their beds to barricade their cell Prisoner eight six one two was one of the ringleaders of the rebellion initially I was stunned I didn't expect the rebellion because not much happened and it wasn't clear what they were what they were rebelling against but they were rebelling against the status rebelling against being anonymous against having to follow orders from from these these other students as punishment for the rebellion prisoner eight six one two was put in the hole and the guards turned on the other prisoners the guards felt that they now have to up the ante of being tough the prisoners made the mistake of beginning to use profanity against the guards in a very personalized way so not against the guards but you know you little punk you you big [ __ ] and so and the guards got furious [Music] here it is never count prisoners were repeatedly woken in the middle of the night the guards made them do menial physical tasks and clean out toilets with their bare hands we made it a point to not give them any sense of comfort or what to expect it you know that anything could happen to them at anytime including being rousted from their sleep at any hour and forced to stand up in a line and have me hurl insults at them and make them do exercises when you interrupt people sleep they tend to become a little disoriented and since there was no daylight in the prison they had no idea whether it was night or day I think that I was the instigator of this whole schedule of harassment the harassment of the guards took its toll on rebellion leader eight six one two he told Zimbardo he wanted to leave the experiment Zimbardo responded not as a psychologist but as a prison superintendent I said well I can see to it the guards don't hassle you personally and in return all I would like is some information from time to time about what the prisoners are doing so essentially I'm saying I'd like you to be a snitch an informer and I said think it over and if you still want to leave fine confused prisoner eight six one two returned to his cell and told the other prisoners that no one could leave while he believed that we wouldn't let him go although we've never said that but the fact that he was a ringleader of the rebellion and he told the other prisoners they won't let you leave that really transformed the experiment into a prison I was told that I couldn't quit and at that point I just felt totally hopeless more hopeless night ever felt before soon after returning to his cell prisoner eight six one two started showing signs of severe distress damn it [ __ ] up you don't know you don't know what I mean Jesus Christ I'm burning up inside don't you know he came up with a plan that if he acted crazy we would have to release him you know I gotta go to a doctor anything I can't say nothing duck I don't know I just went home [ __ ] up inside Oh No it starts with make-believe and then he's doing it and cursing and screaming and you know whatever that little boundary is that he moved across not that he became really crazy but he became you know excessively disturbed I mean so much so that we immediately said we have to release him as an experience it was unique I've never screamed so loud in my life never been so upset with my life and it was an experience of being out of control the boundary between reality and make-believe was to become blurred even for Zimbardo a rumor circulated that released prisoner eight six one two would return with friends to liberate the remaining prisoners I quickly convinced myself that you know my most important function was you know not to allow this prison liberation to occur and what could I do to keep my prison going not the experiment gone the prison was dismantled and the prisoners moved to another part of the building Zimbardo waited in the empty corridor preparing to tell 861 to and his friends that the study was over when a colleague appeared and began asking questions about the scientific basis of the research I'm trying to get rid of him then he says what's the independent variable I get furious because he doesn't understand that is riot about to take place that this prison is about to erupt I had totally lost that this whole other identity of scientists researchers psychologists the rumored jailbreak never materialized the guards had dismantled the prison for nothing and had to rebuild it they took their frustration out on the prisoners they escalated again the level of control the level dominance the level of humiliating behavior 8 1 9 was the next prisoner to rebel against the harassment of the gods he barricaded himself in his cell and refused to take part in the [ __ ] so what you're going to be is altering yeah for 8 1 9 s disobedience the guards made his cellmates do mindless work this undermined any vestige of solidarity amongst the prisoners who now chose to accept the tyranny of the guards rather than risk further harassment that was one of the surprising things to me is that there was so little that the prisoners did to support one another after we started our campaign of you know divided conquer isolated and distraught prisoner 81:9 told Zimbardo he wanted to leave while i'm interviewing 8 1 9 and saying okay you know it's all over thank you for your participation you know I'll give you money for the whole for the whole two weeks even though you're leaving early he hears the prisoners shouting 8 1 9 did a bad thing did a bad day prisoner 8 1 9 did a bad day prisoner 8 one night and said I can't leave he's crying he says I can't leave so what I mean you can't leave said no I have to go back because I don't want them to think you know that I'm a bad prisoner and that's that's when I really flipped out and in such a such a short time you know a college students thinking could become so distorted I said you're not a bad president you're not a prisoner and this is not a prison and it was this thing where he opened his eyes it was just really like a cloud being lifted seeing things clearly prisoner 81:9 reverted to his original request and was released to replace him the experiment is called in one of their reserves from the standby list I got a phone call saying are you still available as an alternate cheery female secretary voice I said yes sure and so she said could you start this afternoon and I said yes sure and my role and experiment really began [Music] I was blindfolded and then stripped and supposedly deloused he came into a madhouse full-blown all of us had gradually acclimated to increasing level of aggression increasing powerlessness of the prisons increasing dominance of the guards he comes in and says what's happening here at the other prison I said yeah you better not make trouble it's really terrible it's a real prison and and he says yeah I'm out of here I don't and they said none denied you can't leave once you hear you stuck this is a real prison geologically Frankenstein so nice right Frankenstein you stay here prisoner four one six was soon subjected to the harassment of David Schuman nicknamed John Wayne because of his macho attitude I want to walk away like Frankenstein and say that you love me oh thank God I made the decision that I would be as intimidating as cold as cruel as possible yeah get up cause I love him to a tree I love it your legs he's my buddy without any temperature whoo I just watched a movie called Cool Hand Luke and the mean intimidating you know southern prison warden character in that film really was my inspiration for the role that I created for myself fine a video with you laughs you speaking he was creative in his evil he would think of very ingenious ways to degrade to demean the prisoners one of the best guards was also on that shift and instead of confronting this bad guard the sadistic guard essentially because he didn't want to see what was happening he became the gofer he would go out to get the food and things of this kind and that left the John Wayne kick guard and another guard on that shift to be dominant we were continually called upon to act in a way that just is contrary to what I really feel inside just continually giving out [ __ ] it's just really were the most oppressive things you can do you sing amazing grace ready down the madness of the experiment started to affect prisoner four one six why I began to feel that I was losing my identity until finally I wasn't clay I was 416 I was really my number and 416 was gonna have to decide what to do prisoner 4 1 6 decided to go on a hunger strike they were pushing my limits but here was the thing that I could do that could push their limits after I had missed a couple of meals I saw that this was not a matter of indifference to the guards I was making headway they were upset I thought how dare this newcomer come in and try to change everything that we had worked for the first three days to set up and by God he's going to suffer for that yeah frustrated by his continued defiance John Wayne through prisoner for one six into the whole after punishing the other prisoners for his disobedience John Wayne encouraged them to vent their anger at four one six directly we would use our night sticks to bang on the door and we would kick the door so hard that you know what must have you know shaken him very seriously inside scared the life out of him he yelled at me and threatened me and actually sort of smashed a sausage into my face to try to get me to open up but I didn't have any intention of eating until I was out for one six should have been at some level of hero because he's willing to oppose the authority of the system in fact the prisons except the guards definition of him as a troublemaker I remember some of them saying you know would you eat goddammit you know we're sick and tired of this and you know that was proof that you know there was no solidary there was no support between the prisoners while four one six was still in the hole John Wayne made a final attempt to break him by giving his fellow prisoners a choice they could vote to release him by making a small sacrifice you can give me the virus and sleep on the bare mattress or you can keep your blanket and for one six we'll stay in another day now what would it be what would it be over here how about five or six oh one second we got three favorite teeth look like we got three against one keep your blanket for one six you're going to be in there for a while but just get used to it the study shows that power corrupts and how difficult it is for people who are the victims of abuse to stand up and defend themselves why doesn't anybody who was being abused by a spouse or something like that just say stop it and we realize now that that's not as easy as it sounds by the end of the fifth day four prisoners had broken down and been released for one six was on the second day of his hunger strike and the experiment still had another nine days to run at this point the fella psychologist visited Zimbardo's basement prison and would witness the brutality of the experiment firsthand the guards had lined up the prisoners to go to the toilet had bags over their head chains on their feet and we're marching by and I looked up and I saw this this circus this parade and I said hey Chris you know look at that I looked up and I just began to feel sick to my stomach I had this just chilling sickening feeling of watching this and I just you know I just turned away and I just let loose in this emotional Tyree I just lost it I was angry scared I I was in tears and I'm furious I'm saying you're supposed to know we had a big argument us to be a psychologist this is this interesting dynamic behavior in such a few day but I'm going through this whole thing the power of the situation says no no it's that young boys are suffering and you are responsible you let happen I said oh my kind of question right the next day Zimbardo ended the experiment studies like his stimulated heated debate about the ethics of using human subjects clearly young men suffered verbally physically prisoners felt shame and they're all guards felt guilt so in that sense it's it's unethical that is nobody has the right the power the privilege to do that to other people in the wake of experiments like Zimbardo's and Milgram's ethical guidelines changed introducing greater safeguards to protect participants in the stanford experiment Zimbardo might have spared his volunteers distress had he not taken on a dual role in the study if i was going to be the prison superintendent I should have had a colleague who was overseeing the experiment who was in a position to stop it at any point or I should have been the principal investigating it and get somebody who was going to be the prison superintendent I realized that was a big mistake to play both those roles and be shifting back and forth after the experiment Zimbardo brought all the participants together to talk about their experiences John Wayne would now come face to face with the hunger striker he had tormented I was a little worried I said oh my god he's really going to come down on me hard now now that we're on equal footing it harms me how did it harm you how does it harm it just to think about anything that people can be like yeah it let me in on some knowledge that that I've never experienced firsthand because I know what you can turn into I know what you're willing to do when I look back on it now I behaved appallingly um yeah it's just a horrid to look at I think I tried to explain to at the time that you know what you experience in what you hated so much was was a role that I was playing that that's not me at all he was trying to dissociate himself from what he had done that did make me angry everyone was acting out apart playing a role prisoners guards staff everyone was acting out apart it's when you start contributing to the script that's you in thus it's something you should take responsibility for I didn't see where it was really harmful it was degrading and that was that was part of my particular little experiment to see how I could your particular little experiment yes like not only about that I was I was running with experience of my own tell me about your little experiments okay I wanted to see just that kind of verbal abuse that people can take before they start objecting before they start flashing back if I have any regret right now it's that you know I made that decision because it would have been interesting to see what would have happened had had I not decided to divorce things it could be that I only accelerated them that the same things would happen but we'll never know if the extreme nature of Davis woman's behavior tested the prisoners it also presented the other guards with a choice to intervene or not it surprised me that no one said anything to stop me they just accepted what I said and no one questioned my authority at all and it really shocked me why didn't people say what I started to get abused people so much I started to get so profane that and still people didn't say anything there were a few guards who hated to see the prison suffer they never did anything which would be the meaning of the prisoners the interesting thing is none of the good guards ever intervened in the behavior of the guards who gradually became more and more sadistic over time we like to think there is this core of human nature that good people can't do bad things and that good people will dominate over bad situations in fact one way to look at the Stanford Prison study is that we put good people and evil place and we saw who won well the sad messages in this case the evil place won over the good people it did show some very interesting and maybe some unpleasant things about human behavior it seems like you know every century every decade they would go through you know we're suffering the same kind of atrocities and you need to understand why these things happen you need to understand why people behave like this [Music] there's a similar experiment starting this Tuesday night on BBC 2 details coming up next [Music]