Transcript for:
Holistic Approach to Diet and Wellness

it's really great to like learn about how someone eats it's kind of funny I remember like um I think all of us try to say like it's easy we try to sell it to people like it's easy like uh Mike Dolce was saying on his uh Instagram start roll yeah Mike Dolce was saying on his uh Instagram that he is like barely on a diet but then he was also talking about like Ezekiel bread and he was talking about like you know really watching his like fats you know but he doesn't feel like he's on a diet because he's on a whole Foods diet right so he has a lot of good options but I was just thinking like there's people that they don't barely know what a carbohydrate is they barely know that there's sugar in milk um there's people have no idea how much fat they eat how many calories like they just don't have any base and so for those people it would feel like a diet it would feel very very difficult if you just said hey you know what all you got to do is just get rid of some of the processed foods that's probably like 70 or 80% of their diet at the moment so after today's video I put a link down below for an infrared sauna blanket a lot of people don't want to Shell out the money for a sauna and I don't blame them they're gigantic they're expensive but an infrared sauna blanket is a way for you to utilize a sauna but in a very portable and convenient and inexpensive form so that is a 15% off discount link for Bond charges infrared sauna blanket if I am on the road if I'm traveling or if I'm just in my gym and I don't have a big sauna in my gym then I will hop in that thing I'll use it as a warm-up it makes it feel like my joints are ready to go but I also break a sweat really quick infrared is different from a dry heat sauna so you a lot of times sweat faster with an infrared because it's for lack of better term kind of heating you up from the inside out versus a sauna that you sit in like a a high heat sauna heating you from the outside in so this is really cool you can adjust the heat plus it's got all kinds of other features but highly highly portable and much more affordable than a giant Barrel sauna so use that code down below Del 15 for the bar charge sauna blanket do you do you think diet really means what people think it means though I mean like when you look at the word diet I think People's First connotation is sort of restrictive right but I don't see it that way I see diet as I mean your diet can be processed foods that's your diet right it's like it's almost there's some there's a there's a possessive nature of whatever diet you're doing my diet your diet this diet that diet doesn't necessarily imply that it's a restrictive diet so I but do you think that we need more diets do you think do you think that it's productive and this is a it's not a loaded question actually I mean do you think it's productive or do you think it starts a a negative cycle when there's different diets that people can do I think that we're in a really weird time I think there's been a lot of like research and there's been a lot of like studies over the years on diet diet nutrition and I think that uh nutritional science is like the king of junk science it's almost like it it almost has taught us nothing but it also has taught us everything so it's an interesting thing because the only way that we would know that a Whole Food's diet is the best is not necessarily just to eat it especially in the presence of these other Foods there's a lot of other foods that are convenient and easy to get to and if our ancestors were here you took some from some tribe and they don't have access to uh the foods that we have access to if they were here in America and they hung out with us for a little while they might be eating pizza and all the other crap that we're eating but you really don't it's hard it's hard to really truly know that until you start to hear piled up data and now we have a lot of piled up data the point where we know that Ultra processed foods are offensive and our new but we also know that dieting can be uh something that's sort of dangerous for you you both of us have you know over fasted and um you know didn't have good electrolyte balance you know cramping up or having um you know restless nights of sleep and so on and doing things that you get so excited about it that you do the very thing that you're supposed to be doing for your health but it's to the detriment of your health because it can also sometimes cause stress so your diet needs your nutrition needs to be nutrition ious and that is exactly why I have this Fork here at Thomas toow because I have brought for you I'm trying to have you level your game up I have brought for you some I know I packed it up a couple times here because Thomas and I were having a conversation about cod liver oil and I was like no bro I'm like actually eating cod liver and so I brought you oh I actually packed a fork in a spoon already I actually brought you some cod liver and this will make a giant mess but let's just try it anyway let's have you try it on the air here today crack this open it's sitting in its own oil oil but it's vitamin A vitamin D it's got you've heard me talk so I mean I'm a huge C Ro fan sometimes I catch some for it but there we go so this is just sitting in its own oil and this is like the most nutrient slided over on the on the wrapper on the thing ever it's uh it's got like 30 gram of fat never before done on Thomas Delow podcast kind of looks dude you're going to be shocked it's actually it kind of smells like cat food so good cod liver is like the greatest food ever I love it it tastes like it tastes like the the fatty end of ribey you know that little mixed with like a little anchovy taste kind of but yeah you throw a little salt in there yeah people that don't like fish are going to be like dude you guys are crazy but anyone that even remotely likes a little bit of fatty fish you're like this is great you're completely stunned no dude that's legitimately incredible Have You Ever Had It J yeah save something for me okay yeah Seafood well anyways you know back to kind of my point is that you know your nutrition has to be nutritious and we're hearing people try to fill in the blanks with uh a lot of supplements and stuff like that and I don't really think that's a great route either I just think that we have to I'm a fan of supplements I like supplements I take you know things like magnesium and zinc and like I get excited about some of the stuff and I have cabinets full of uh not just supplements but like vitamins minerals um I don't know I hear something on a podcast I hear um you know this guy talking about this thing and this other guy talking about another thing and I'm like let me just try it let me just that sounds interesting let me try let me try that out but the answer kind of always comes back to the middle and if we can just try to be rational I think at the first place when we think about like B vitamins or we think about vitamin A or vitamin D what are the natural how do we naturally get it you know how do how do can we get it from the Sun can we get it from our food and the answer is yes so I think start to you start to poke around with some of that and you start to get answers on how you should structure your diet and once you start to kind of fill in the blanks on that you end up with a full day of of eating quite a bit of food to try to get the nutrients that you need if you're exercising if you're lifting and things like that how much on a scale of 1 to 10 do you think calories matter the calorie thing is is a really interesting one and uh we have to Define things better you know like a lot of times we say that something works or that we say that something doesn't work um working and like working forever are like two different things uh there's never you'll never find a diet that you're going to do for x amount of time and then discontinue the diet and go back to some sort of Reckless Behavior that's ever going to really have a a great net benefit you're going to have to at some point uh be an adult and uh be more responsible for your nutritional Behavior you can't just do keto and then come off keto and be like keto didn't work you can't just count calories and then lose 15 pounds and then say and then you come off of that for a little bit and you say it didn't work you're like well when you were doing it it looked like it was working what do you mean it didn't work let's get into that more so I I actually think that I actually think that if you're only looking at calories I don't think that's uh super effective obviously um you know if you go to Lane Norton you're talking about like literally if you weigh yourself on the scale I I don't know if this is his definition it's probably probably the definition for being in caloric deficit if you look at the scale and it's going downward you are in a caloric deficit if the scale is not going downward then you're not in a chloric deficit so there's a lot of nuances in there because we have like this Energy System some people use the energy super efficiently uh some people uh throw in a dollar and they get four quarters out and some people throw in a dollar and they get 75 pennies you know everyone's body is has a different uh efficiency and that could be determined by a multitude of things that could be your genetics could be your mitochondria it could be um your pancreas I mean your pancreas might secrete more insulin or your body might be more sensitive to insulin I mean the list of things can go on and on um you could just simply have more muscle tissue than somebody else so I always found the calorie thing to be a really interesting uh equation I think we do I think it's helpful to have a measure of something um but is four calories of carbohydrates the same for Thomas Del as it is for somebody who's 33% body fat is it the same M maybe maybe it's the same outside the body but maybe it's in once it's ingested by you and once it's ingested by this other person uh maybe the reaction to those calories is quite different maybe that person tends to store that energy a little bit more because their body doesn't know how to turn that into efficient energy and maybe your body's like hey we worked out twice today like like let's just uh have that go into repair and uh glycogen and things like that have you heard of the uh constrained energy model go for it tell me wild I talked about this with Paul too uh and a lot of people when they're here oh you talk to Paul about it it's completely false but it's not Paul's idea or Theory like this is a very flushed out theory that is still Theory but is very backed up as well it it's the constrained energy model basically describes us as having like this set amount of energy that we will really expend in a given day U or a given time period because I always say like body doesn't flip and know like if it's midnight you know I mean maybe it does circadian Q's whatever but I mean x amount of calories in one day or x amount of calories over 47 hours like right but the constrained energy model says if we work out really really hard this morning our body might start to actually conserve later in the day because our body is trying to protect and keep us within a certain range so as a result unbeknownst to us happening unconsciously we're actually burning less through I have actually I want you to carry on with some of this because I want to learn more but I have actually noticed this in myself so if I do 10,000 maybe 12 12,000 15,000 steps good sweet spot start to do 20 and my body just doesn't seem to react the same so it's not like I exponentially seem to lose more and I know someone could say well you got to account for the calories in a very particular way but I think it's uh it draws a point to kind of what you're talking about there yeah there's there's absolutely a line of diminishing return and I think that you can squeeze more out of it but it's happening Against the Grain and very inefficiently and I've absolutely noticed this firsthand and when I learned about this I just learned about this 6 weeks ago maybe and like so much more makes sense because I guess I never really thought about how much of our caloric expenditure our energy expenditure comes from non- exercise activity thermogenesis I I knew it was big but I just never really I couldn't fathom how much of it it is it's everything it really I mean outside of our BAS metabolic rate of course but that fluctuates so much with people it's almost hard to even talk about it like some that's obese and never worked out before and tell them what's your BMR what's your Bas I mean they're going to look at you like you you know you're from another planet right but when you explain to them non- exercise activity thermogenesis it clicks people get that ah okay yeah am I walking through the parking lot to the grocery store I doing the dishes my little things and I've experienced it as a runner where like we all know those elite elite Runners that will go out and run like 20 miles but then they're couch potatoes the rest of the day and it's not because they're lazy or anything like that it's things that a lot of Runners don't have great physiques either no that's very true but things that are almost out of their control I me I say this out of their control because there is a like a an unconscious pull to conserve and maybe there's a psychological play too like I ran 20 miles I earned it I'm just going to sit down the rest of the day but all the way down to fidgeting and how much you move I don't know if people realize that us sitting here the difference between doing this drinking moving things and doing this and not moving at all I mean we're talking 3x 4X 5x you know more above our BMR right so independent of BMR it's like am I going to burn 10 calories from neat or am I going to burn 100 by you know over the next two hours but if we exhaust ourselves then our body unbeknownst to us it just starts to say hey don't do that so much but we would never know because it's an unconscious maneuver so we're just we're we're moving quite a littleit less we're not vising as much we're maybe not going and doing the dishes when we might go do the dishes otherwise these things are like why don't I feel like doing the dishes well there's like an unconscious pole saying like conserve conserve conserve to keep you in a specific range on the contrary if we go do the minimum eff of dose and we say let's go just train pretty hard for 30 minutes but let's just kind of leave it at that then suddenly without even thinking about it you burn more calories throughout the rest of the day and stimulate more recovery because you're not beating yourself into the ground so it's a really it's mind-blowing and once you learn it you almost can't unlearn it it's like like this is real maybe I don't need to be blasting myself into the ground you're bringing up a crazy interesting point because I mean what if you were to give yourself let's say this magic number of 2,000 calories is like this sweet spot um for somebody just to maintain their body weight right um but they take it to uh 2500 calories and they're actually concerned that they're going to gain weight but maybe their energy output increases so your metabolism in my opinion it is a is a moving Target and this is why personally I don't really love uh dropping the calories but when you talk about you know the people that are going to say that it works at works at Works those are the people that are usually like getting on stage for something they're usually like bodybuilders they're usually Fitness competitors and they're people that are super diligent and they weigh their food and everything it's as close to being in a test tube as you can get to being in a test Tu yeah and I don't know like I don't I don't want to say like that's not good because you're doing too much work cuz that's not fair cuz somebody might not think it's too much work or they just enjoy it they enjoy yeah they enjoy it they want to be lean they want to be in shape they like the results they get they don't mind weighing it doesn't take extra time they're used to the tracking they're used to like either writing it down or using an app or whatever it is and that might be a great strategy for them but normally what we see is from what I've seen and helping a lot of people people lose weight and even in helping myself to lose over 100 lbs um was that when I reduced the food that I consumed I started to really reduce it too much there was always blowback every single time there was always blowback my body didn't want to respond to it now I'm not saying that my body uh because I wasn't eating enough that my body was like holding on to Fat um I hear people uh say things like that and I'm not going to doubt that there could be potential for like you're so stressed that your body just is like in this weird Funk and can't produce the energy that it needs um but that's not really what I'm talking about what I'm talking about is what you were mentioning is like your motivation like everything just starts to take a little bit of a nose dive and if you think about your worst day just think about when you wake up one day and you're like whoa something is wrong like you feel really really sick what are you going to do that day you know that day you're going to be like oh man I I think I got a call in to work oh man I don't think I can go do that basketball game that I was going to do tonight after work I don't I can't go to my kids baseball game like you start to everything starts to get like squashed down you're like I oh my God I can't do anything I'm going to go from the bed to the couch to the couch to the bed and that's what I'm going to do for the day and obviously it doesn't happen to that same extent when you're like dieting but you can put yourself into that position where it's just no more no no more longer uh enjoyable to go on a walk it's it's no longer enjoyable to go and do cardio or to go lift and you're like man what is wrong with me and I think in those moments I think it's a good idea I've been there a bunch of times before it's a good idea to back your way out of that just say you know what the next I think I think it might take a little bit of time like I'm not talking about two three days I'm talking about like two or 3 weeks you give yourself like two or three weeks to just you don't have to go Hog Wild and you don't have to eat everything in sight because that will make you anxious probably too cuz you probably will gain some body fat and you won't be too pum pumped about that but you do need to put everything on pause for a moment and probably restart I would agree and I feel like remember you told me a long time ago probably like five six years ago maybe not that long maybe four or five years ago you told me we talking about my testosterone levels and wasn't too happy with where they were was fasting a lot and I think it was just in a choric deficit a lot and I was like in the high 200s or something and uh you told me I was like you know you're know Thomas A lot of times what people just need to do when that happens is take a week off of training just like eat more take a week off of training and I didn't take a full week off of training I lasted like three days right but I did start eating more and I remember you know pretty much like clockwork I mean my testosterone went up a good 75 points you know I'm like okay now that there's Merit to this you know I I could see how this works and that's purely anecdotal but I think that that it's one thing after another after another after another you know you start you cut down the calories a little bit maybe you cut down one particular macronutrient whatever then it's I don't know law of attrition it's like this little bit little bit little bit until it's a lot like you know you shaved off 2% of your workout performance today and you shaved off another 2% next week and another 2% and then you're finally you're at 10 15% drop off in your workout performance you start noticing it and then you're like well I'm not working out as hard so I need to eat a little less because I'm not expending as much so I'm going to eat a little less and then it's like another 1% drop in my performance well shoot I'm barely working out I need to probably should just fast today see how it begins and the next thing you know the last thing to kind of go is just your drive in general next thing you know you don't want to work out you don't want to move right and digging yourself out of that is hard because it's not like I don't think it's linear that you can just reverse your reverse diet yourself out of that it's almost like you need to in some ways you need to just say I'm G to dedicate myself to eating unprocessed Whole Foods I'm just going to eat as much as I can comfortably not gorging yourself but being unlimited eggs unlimited chicken unlimited steak just go just go unlimited veggies definitely unlimited veggies unlimited fruits and just see what happens and it's kind of what I had to do just to like that was my emergency break when I was like realizing my motivation was down my tra my emergency break was actually to eat more whereas my old emergency break was to fast I still like to fast but that used to be my e bre like H things are getting out of control fasting will reset it no now the reset is dive into good food and it's amazing what happens you know you see a lot of people again do this when they're sick you know they just sleep you know just like it's like intuition you're just like I don't feel very good I can't go anywhere I can't do anything I got chills I'm just going to be wrapped up in a blanket I'm just going to sleep and so I think there needs be times where you just allow yourself some sort of reprieve or some sort of rest and you might find it in your calories you might find it in eating more food you might find it in uh meditating you might find it in relaxing you're going to hear people you know over the next couple years probably talk a lot more about meditation relaxation um I don't know what the science says on stuff like this but I do know that you know even just like a good night asleep your metabolism can be so much different than if you only slept for like four hours so imagine a scenario where you listen to Thomas Del you listen to Mark Bell you're all fired up you're like okay these guys are great they talk about like eating a lot of protein and they talk about um you know intermittent fasting can be a great strategy sometimes too so I'm going to try that today you know they and they give it a go and they just maybe have some coffee in the morning real minimal calories almost next to nothing in the morning and then I don't know 400 p.m. or something rolls around and they're getting getting home from uh or 5:00 p.m. rolls around they're getting home from work and they're just like in this like frenzy and they were stressed all day at work they were they they didn't give themselves an opportunity to sit down they didn't take a shower they didn't meditate they didn't relax I I realize people are thinking like man I ain't got [ __ ] for nothing you know like I don't have three minutes like sit down and chill but again using that scenario of how your sleep can have such a crazy impact on your metabolism and especially the metabolism of your carbohydrates what do you think that scenario is when you're eating in your kitchen when you're cooking your food when you're simultaneous simultaneously got the TV on as you're trying to catch up with your wife and your kids at the same time there just just a lot going on and I'm not saying that everything needs to be uh this like Seance ritual and that you have to sit down you know with your chriscross applesauce and like you know have this great posture and like eat and stuff but I do think it's important to try to find a way to relax a little bit can you at least take a few minutes can you when you get in your car rather than turning anything on rather than listening to the next podcast that's going to make you better just drive in some silence and just work on some breathing just think about your day think about maybe a couple things that you're grateful for practice some uh balancing of your mind practice some gratitude and just just try to just just calm down a little bit like hey today's over that was pretty cool you know I got you know a b and c tomorrow but now is time to like rest and repair and you're supposed to be in this uh rest and relax kind of state but you're really not you're like somewhere in the middle you're in this like gray area and I don't think um and I've heard uh John wellborne and many other people talk about having like these crazy breakthroughs just by telling people to sit down take a moment before they eat just close your eyes you don't have to pray but if that's your thing you can do something like that or you can just think of a couple things you're grateful for and Che your effing food take a moment like chew like you know what I mean like sometimes I get home from work I'm totally guilty of this I'm like grabbing a bunch of stuff and I'm like oh my God I'm like a I'm like a bear yeah let me just like relax let me be grateful for the food that we Pro that my family and I provided let me enjoy this this is like a really amazing piece of meat that I have in front of me let me let me Savor this thing rather than just like inhale it through a straw yeah I mean I think I'm guilty of that too for sure I'm going I Chow Down like mad man all the way from satiety signals to whatnot that's not a good thing to do right but I do think that our habits are very very hard to kill and if the Habit is the stimulus response is this feels good even if you consciously know that it's bad when you get home and you raid the pantry I've been there too I mean it's it's it's almost impossible to override that until you have some kind of pattern interrupt so it's so weird how um like nothing's enough for us you know you can't you can't just watch TV you have to have a phone with you and you can't just watch TV and have your phone with you you also need food with you you know like we're like really balancing a lot of different things and I'm again I'm not saying like that I think you should kill these things all the time but it's good to be conscious of them and say ah you don't have to really worry about it just say all right taking my phone let me put it over here taking this and I'm actually just GNA concentrate on my food shut the TV off eat and then boom TV you're not really concentrating on it probably anyway I would argue that most of us are sitting in the sympathetic nervous system almost all the time now I mean it's there's a product and this is not a plug for them at all but it's uh have you heard of the shift wave no but that sounds great yeah it's pretty wild it's uh I've only tried one on like demo but like people have sworn by him I know that uh what's his name um why am I drawing a blank the quarterback for the Rams Matt Stafford he is a he's a big fan of that he uses my physical therapist that I use that'll come help me is Stafford's traveling physical therapist and he was telling me that you know uses this thing it's device that you basically get in you sit on it and using some kind of electrical impedance I don't really know how it works it shifts you into a parasympathetic state so it's it's like a $10,000 device I'm like all right well it's not something I'm just going going to go out and buy until like maybe try it a few more times and see but the anecdotal stories that people have talked about like it just basically kicks you out of the sympathetic and it does it by just rearranging kind of your electrical system again I don't really know how it works but when you're talking about like professional athletes I mean they are always on right like they travel they get to the hotel like their schedules are insane they're always on their recovery systems are a lot of times being forced through Pharmaceuticals too just to like get them to like relax or get them to be not in pain or get them to Aid recovery I'm not talking about peeds I'm just talking about anti-inflammatories and Mobic and crazy amounts of ibuprofen um and just manipulating that recovery as much as they can to squeeze this performance out just before they break right but being able to turn that off the difference between a professional athlete and someone that is maybe a corporate executive that's stressed out doing the same thing as a professional athlete has an off seon right so most people that are just in regular life I think they're always on and if you're always on there's no way that you are in control you're just not in control like you're not going to be able to make the right food choices you're not going to it's just not going to happen I mean you can force it you can I always say like prefrontal cortex your way through it a little bit but the amount of discipline that takes I mean there's only so much actual willpower that you have before you're just like okay I'm going to cave and not even realize that you cave I think you know just to give people people something tangible that they can do um just try it like once a day just see if you can lay down on the ground for 3 minutes put your feet up on the couch and just breathe you know I don't really care a ton about how you breathe you can do some box breathing 4 seconds out 4 second hold 4 seconds in something like that you can follow almost any protocol but you just really need to just try to Cal try to just calm down and if you think about it like whether you're utilizing that for a food practice before you eat or you're just utilizing that period um it's like who who do we know that wouldn't benefit from pumping the brakes on on their day for for just a moment and even if you you know even if you have to do it you know as your lunch break or wherever you can just just give it a shot I used to think all these things are stupid too and I know that there's people listening and they're like bro you need to get back to calories you you've uh you jump the shark like you need to get back to teaching people about protein leveraging and all these things they they do work um but we have to Define work work for how long you know you and I have been in this for a long time I've been doing this since I was 12 years old and to to see how your body reacts to it it's not just a day-to-day thing it goes in these it goes in these cycles and uh I kind of think the Body Works in at least just like a pattern that I know that I've noticed and I don't know why it I don't know why my brain thinks this way but um three hours three days and three weeks you you're there going to be some sort of signal to do something about your food probably about every 3 hours every 3 days you're going to notice a response in your body from the foods that you've been eating three days that's all it takes like especially if someone's really heavy three days they might have lost like six pounds if they you know never before had a dietary invention or intervention they may lose a bunch of water weight in just a couple days and then 3 weeks is going to be uh where you start to really feel you you start to feel what you did and now and now you could be if you if what you did previously in the previous 3 weeks uh was right and it led you to this next thing that you're going to go through then you'll probably feel okay and if if it wasn't then you're probably going to feel like and you'll start to have a lag and then as you know and many people listening that have uh really followed through with a diet or followed through with Just Fitness in general that you don't get back out of that for just a day or two like it takes it can take a while so it can be really frustrating can be really annoying there's no there's no really right way and what I'm learning more and more and more and it's um it's really an interesting concept but I think you have to be your own expert you have to be your own doctor you have to be your own Advocate because you're not an expert I'm not an expert we do know a lot about this stuff but what I'm finding out more and more is the experts aren't experts we only know what's available for now and what's available for now gets [ __ ] on all the time and the only way to really science this stuff is to have a really open mind and to understand whatever science and data and information that we have now it's going to continue to change the only thing that might remain the same is being in tune with how you feel because how you feel changes how you feel changes quite a bit but most more than likely you're going to find the foods that feel right you're going to find the exercises that feel right and that is going to come and go a little bit as well so you have to get yourself in tune with that what have you found works for you when it comes down to Fat Loss now we've talked about this a little bit just offline right like if you say okay I need to lean out it's not just about saying okay well I'll just reduce calories or I'll just do XYZ or I'll just leverage protein more here like what have you found undeniably works for Mark it's amazing there's so many strategies but I would say uh there's two strategies that I have that I think have been really effective one is I did a meal plan where I ate five or six meals every day and I ate almost the same foods every day that is not something that I could realistically repeat for any real length of time I just did that for a bodybuilding show one time um if I really felt like you know you and I are having a competition or something or or we start talking about you know maybe doing a bodybuilding show that's where I would utilize that strategy if I really felt like I needed this like boost but again like to you know figure out like a cup of rice like I I don't I don't want to be in that category I don't like doing that um I don't count calories I don't track I don't um I don't have Tupperware I don't carry F Well except for the Cod Liver that I brought you today I don't typically carry food around with me um I'm not like popping food in the microwave at work so for me personally some forms of fasting works great and I don't know if you want to call it intermittent fasting or just like not eating for a few hours fractal eating as Mar calls it yeah yeah yeah there you go that's that's about what it is um I'll give you just a typical day typical de t a typical day I will wake up I will I do a little bit of hippie dippy stuff cuz I believe in some of these things so I'll go outside I'll see the sun I will walk in my front yard a little bit Barefoot um it's a practice I've been doing for a while now and that's just feeling good for me I feel like uh don't have any injuries don't have any pain body's feeling good I feel like I'm getting more mobile and getting some good results and it could be because of some of those practices along with a handful of other things pop back inside and I have what I call the super smelly Shake which is uh iced coffee with uh my brand uh within you uh steak shake with uh I'll usually throw some of my hydration in there as well and that's kind of like a chocolate like mocha type of thing almost drink that go to work um or usually I'll go and like either lift or run depending on the time of year in the uh summertime I will most likely go and lift and then I will run later in the day to get more sun um so I'll go to I'll go to the gym I'll do like uh like lift and or run and then podcast and then I may lift and or run after the podcast and then I haul my home and then I go and eat and the foods that I usually consume are pretty much like maybe about five or six different things um various forms of meat I do like seafood a lot I think that people are kind of I don't think everyone has to eat seafood but I do think that a lot of people are missing out I do think there's some value in not just the Omega-3s that you get from uh fish and not fish oil I I don't again I don't I'm not against supplementation but I think that you have to do a lot of other things right in order for supplementation to even really work agre so if you were going to have fish oil on top of occasionally having some fish or being conscious of finding other sources of Omega-3s I would be more on board with that than you just thinking that you're going to get everything you need from a pill um but I like oysters a lot I like shrimp um I like uh scallops so all those things are sort of fair game salmon mackerel and then you know when people think of meat they just think of steak all the time and so I think it's time we get a little bit more creative I do eat a lot of steak ped montis beef I'm a huge fan of that uh product they're sponsor of my podcast and they have the lanus meat and it's super tender at the same time grass-fed grass finished I think people should try to do that wherever they can if they can't I don't think that's like the missing piece in your late weight loss Journey Health Journey because I think the hierarchy of most people's Health in the United States is to take care of the weight problem and to take care of the weight problem um and we can get to this in a moment but to take care of the weight problem I think people need to chop out a lot of fat calories that they're consuming um but it's kind of round out my day I will you know have dinner with one of those forms of meat um sometimes a potato um sometimes after a run I might have like some fruit sometimes before a run I might have some fruit something like that and then I'll usually have like another protein shake or I might make in the Ninja creamy um which is the greatest thing I've ever do you have one of those I don't but I I need to get one they're they're unbelievable I mean it change your life it's it's crazy you can make uh you can make ice cream that has like 90 grams of protein and and just like seven or eight grams of fat or something it needs some fat in there but really amazing uh macros and just a nice way to like you know finish your night off with a little little dessert he yeah go to bed and like repeat that's pretty much uh the way I eat in a nutshell so it sounds like the biggest lever that you can pull based on your diet okay if I need to button it up it's just reducing the fat a little bit reducing the fat is a huge part of it yeah um so there's there's a lot of things to consider right so I did mention like not eating for periods of time so that can get tricky if you don't have fat because fat is um fat is something that can kind of make the food last longer it can make the digestion slower and so if you start to pull fat out you can start to feel really hungry but hunger I don't think is like an enemy of ours I think feeling some pulse of hunger here and there I think is actually kind of a nice thing um I actually I actually like that but what I've noticed is that doing that doing that like every single day and doing that to like a um kind of sitting in that for hours on end is not not a great spot for me to be so I need to be conscious of that too because I do like to run and I do like to lift at some point it will be too much and I'll just wear myself to nothing nothing have you seen sort of that stuff that implies that there's almost two types of hunger like when you get really hungry and you're like actually like I am hungry it's a like a protein related response where essentially there's a different level of hunger it's like being a little bit hungry when you have kind of that that glucagon Spike insulin drops glucagon you know whatever a little bit of elevation of glucagon that's telling you hey yeah like we're out of food you know whatever um little bit of amk phosphorilation happening all the downstream stuff that's saying yeah you know you're currently in a deficit but maybe it's not necessarily time to eat and like when you're in tune with your body you feel that you feel uh it's almost like how you feel with maybe a fasted workout in the morning where you're like yeah like by the end of it you're kind of hungry but you're not ravenous but then there's those periods of time where like I am actually feeling fatigued I'm feeling hungry and there's people that claim and there's actually some legitimate research behind it like yeah that's a more protein related like when you start starving a protein it's like an elevated hunger response so when you start getting to this point of I am really effing hungry it usually it seems to be somewhat protein related but what's interesting is obviously these different things come into play like I've been on four five day fasts before where I never reached that point of feeling ravenously hungry so I'm sure is highly individual I mean I'm sure your level of fat adaptation plays a role and just being used to it so I don't know how much I completely buy into it um it seems like if you if you push your hunger off like once or twice it's like not that big of a deal but sometimes it does feel like it comes roaring back with like a Vengeance and I don't know what the difference is I don't know why sometimes it it it Fe I don't know why sometimes it feels like I'm going to kill somebody unless I get some food like if I fast versus doing a bone broth fast I'm infinitely more hungry on a bone broth Fest even though I'm taking in calories right it's like explain that if I eat breakfast I'm I'm super hungry game over yeah it's you know I'm doing this thing right now I'm like I'm training for this uh long Ruck in Normandy France and so like my training protocol for it has me rucking quite a bit and Chris Hinshaw who wrote the program for me uh and I'm doing the nutrition part he the one the one say he did have on he and I are very aligned nutritionally like he's a big fan of fasted training I know that is a point of contention for a lot of people I still stand behind I feel like maybe there's not evidence to support it 100% but it just there's something about it maybe not training fasted but training in a depleted State whether you're fasted or just depleted right being depleted does something like when you're depleted of carbs and you're depleted of fuel and you're just in a serious depleted State and you train in that fashion it's the simple train low uh train higher sleep low studies right I mean like it it does do something but anyway the one nutritional point that he did add in there that he's like hey I want to take some control of this he's like I want to have you get up one day out of the week when you're doing a double day of your long rucks like get up in the morning you're going to eat prior to your ruck that day and you're going to go Ruck like eight miles or something and then you're going to fast the rest of the day and then you're going to do your evening Ruck close to 12 hours after your morning Ruck fasted and I was like well that's not really fasted I ate that day and then I'm like wait a minute no it's fasted like it's just was the same day it a different kind of fast like a midday fast and he's like well you're doing this you know more for the mental thing I'm like what do you mean he's like well it's going to be so much harder for you like if you woke up in the morning and you were 12 hours into a fast you could go out and grab that Ruck no problem he's like but do it and tell me how much harder it is to eat breakfast and then fast the rest of the day and do that Ruck at an end of the day fast when you're just flat out depleted but you've already had hunger signals he's right it was infinitely harder I was thinking about food the whole I was wrecking and he had told me he's like this is a psychological thing the reason that I have you do that is not because there's something magically metabolic going on he's like maybe there is maybe there isn't but it's like when you go into these long rucks 30 40 50 60 miles he's like you need to be able to psychologically deal with being hungry and being miserable and this is the best way we can simulate that without depleting you so much that it would be deleterious to your training so he's like we can simulate misery by having you eat in the morning train remain fasted train again where you're just thinking about food you're just thinking about finishing because you want to get done and that's when you get to eat again and he was right that second Ruck I'm just like every step just like ah I'm going to have some ground beef when I get back that ground beef sure sounds good you know it it's pretty wild I would say I don't know if I've noticed like I definitely noticed feeling good doing stuff fasted but I'm not really sure if I other than my powerlifting days with which was different I don't really know if I've noticed like being fueled well by food yeah you know I'm not like out on a run being like w this Run's so easy cuz I ate a bunch of rice I don't think I've ever really experienced that before and lifting a little bit because you know you get a pump and you also um I used to eat before I would go to the gym and bench press I used to eat what I call bench bagels and uh this this is actually like we get some smelly science here um you know I used to say the gluten is free and when I would have when I would have Bagels I'm like it's got gluten it's supposed to cause inflammation and uh I I want to be inflamed I want to be like puffy I want to be like as big as possible and so I ate uh i' have three bagels and they were salt bagels and I wouldn't even eat them with butter but they were like almost like sourdough yeah and this is not like training advice but uh what it would do is it literally make me heavier and I and I would feel feel uh Fuller and I think a lot of like bodybuilders a lot of other people a lot of powerlifters um Can attest to this having like that pressure and then having your muscles kind of swelled up and maybe even being like just more bloated like it sounds like doesn't sound like a great idea to be blo from an internal leverage standpoint for much of anything but for lifting to have this like internal pressure is actually like a a great Advantage but again uh back to my main points like I I've done stuff where I'm like wow my brain's really firing my body feels like it's really firing and you know I didn't even eat anything you know but I would also say there have been times where again I haven't felt an extra bonus from food necessarily again except for maybe with a little bit of lifting but I uh I have felt before like if I fasted too long or fasted too much or it's too many days in a row I've been in the middle of some workouts or some runs where my legs are way more tired I'm breathing harder my heart rate's higher and those are things that sometimes you're like what is this and then you just think that you're like off for the day like you can't you can't really figure out what it's accountable for but back to what I said about stress earlier about like you know lying down and and really trying to get yourself to relax and breathe I mean what do carbohydrates do you know yeah they definitely make you relax yeah carbohydr is like yeah especially I mean you know we got like things like ice cream and pizza and they have like so many other things going on than them just being carbohydrates they're loaded with a lot of fat and things that override your ability to recognize like almost how much you ate and so on but uh I mean think about you get done with a run if you were to have like a smoothie or something like that would just feel incredible feels like it's like going going the glucose is going like right to your brain you know to I talked with uh Mike iser about this like he I asked him is there you know legitimate research behind carbohydrates post training as far as like sympathetic Fair parasympathetic he's like oh like undoubtedly that knocks your ctis exactly what it does and that's the thing is like I don't think cortisol is one of these things where after training it's going to like completely destroy your effect you remember how they or cortisol is going to make you fat or something yeah there used to be this thing like oh you keep your training under 50 minutes because that's when cortisol is going to start spiking I don't think that's a thing like we used to kind of like talk about but there is something effective about okay yes carbohydrates right after training sort of just kick you into this recovery mode that you from a CNS standpoint just wouldn't be ready for I'm really learning just the power of proper rest I used to think the rest was just taking a rest day but now it's more about actually I'd rather train a little bit every day but rest and recover appropriately throughout the rest of the day and that includes adequate nutrition adequate fuel enough calories and strangely enough I have found such a Monumental difference in my recovery day in and day out by because I train in the morning almost entirely but then by adding an extra walk-in or something in the evening has actually made my recovery so much but also just being being in control of the volume right it now makes more sense for me to make a small deposit every day than a moderate to large deposit 5 days out of the week as far as my training is concerned and body composition Wise It's reflecting better performance- Wise It's reflecting better mental well-being it's reflecting better sleep it's reflecting better but for some reason I still sit there thinking it's not enough like I need to tr and I really I was thinking about this when I was walking yesterday I was like if my performance improves but my body composition took a negative hit I could see why I might say oh I need to go back to my old ways but my body composition is improving my performance is improving and my rest is improving all by toning it down a little bit some days and pushing it harder other days and just really throttling things differently and I'm like okay well yet I still struggle with is it being enough I'm like every single box that I could possibly want to check is being checked so why is it that you still want to go hard all the time and it's like okay at this point I am now comfortable and looking at myself and saying that is purely a psychological ego piece there you're trying to satisfy something mentally that is detrimental to your physical body um it's been amazing like when you say okay well what else do I really want because if I start adding more it's just going to be a problem I think every day you know needs to be like a six or a seven and that's not really romantic I think people want to kind of David goggin it and have things be much harder but what they may not recognize or realize from someone like David gogin or someone uh like my friend Zach bidder like these these guys um they're training at very low percentages a lot of the times to get better MH so on a scale of 1 to 10 you know or or if you take percentages they're at like 60% yeah you know David goggin you know he even has like a quote like you you're you know you think you're going really hard you think you're going 100% but you're only like 60% there but truthfully to like have your training be dialed in correctly for running for Lifting for any of these things a lot of people not always not everybody but a lot of people are going to use lower percentages more frequently to build up their strength or build up their tolerance to any form of exercise um sprinting is the same way husin bolt you know he he only ran as fastest times when he had to yeah you know he didn't he didn't he didn't waste that in training he probably ran 70% of that he probably ran 60% of that and maybe once in a while as coach would say hey let's kind of see where you're at at I want you to go about 80 but if even if you look at the Olympics like what did he do he just like he just stopped like he ran and he just slowed down and he like still crushed everybody so these people that we follow and these people that we admire that lift these heavy weights and run these cool speeds and stuff Nick bear and all these other guys you get excited but you don't really realize I mean for myself as well building a squat over 1,000 lbs uh the most of the time like a huge percentage of my training probably would say about 80% of my training was utilizing around 400 to 500 lb which is a lot of weight right it's a lot of weight but it's relative half of a th000 PBS right because it was about execution it was about putting a positive input into my body and the inputs that we put into our body have to be they don't all have to be positive they can be we can deal with all kinds of different stress but how much stress are you really going to be able to deal with Y how much stress are you going to really be able to handle and a lot of that has to do with if we're talking about stress from exercise and we're talking about stress from like nutrition well that's just you're kind of like meat head stress you know and somebody can build a good tolerance towards that but what about your mental stress you know are you a maniac are you a lunatic are you like real real Angry are you um you know having trouble expressing your emotions are you uh being dragged around by your emotions you know or or do you have better balance are you able to be stoic in your life have you reviewed some of these things so there's so many things in health and nutrition that we just don't ever talk about I mean people there's so many things that there's so many things that come into play that just aren't Fair it's just not fair that like you have to have so many things in place because you even have to have a good relationship you know try being lonely you know just try that on for size like that is going to make that is going to make your diet choices really difficult like I I'm I'm a big teddy bear like I love smooching on my wife I've been married for 23 years you take that away from me and I'm I'm I'm going to be I'm going to be fat and I'm probably not going to be as motivated I'm very motivated by my wife she exercises and swims and does all this cool stuff too so uh we don't really realize that if if sometimes you take some of these like fundamental things that we probably take for granted just pull that away can't see your kids for 3 months yeah it's like oh like I'm saying going to get fat like maybe you'll lean into it more and just be like I'm going to concentrate on this even more but it's going to be a rough go in terms of your overall health yeah yeah you don't think about the the arguments you have the conflicts you have and how that pulls from this bucket of stamina that you have and that's it's pulling hard it's pulling really hard and you think oh well I'm not physically stressed well yeah you are it's just not you know stress on your bicep you know it's a completely different ball game and I think that there's certain things that when when I'm stressed I lean into more moderate lifting whereas I used to like running was a coping mechanism for me for stress but I realized that running was like this cardiorespiratory stressor that was just infinitely more destructive when I was mentally stressed even though it provided me with like this feeling of reprieve and relief when I would do it the stress running is stressful in the body especially when you're you know a Clyde Dale running around like it's just it's a lot of Ecentric contraction it's a lot of muscle breakdown and that was just too much I'm like okay when days when I'm stressed and being able to recognize that is is huge because if you maybe go on a walk instead go on a walk or just go lift but don't try to destroy the place you know it's like because I feel like I do feel like putting some tension on the muscles is always a good reminder and always centers me and you can probably attest to this and this is going to get like woo wooy and weird but it's just 50 lb is always 50 lb 100 lb is always 100 lb 500 lb is always 500 lb sometimes it feels like a th sometimes it feels like 100 right but that 500 lb is 500 [ __ ] pounds and it's just it doesn't lie to you so I feel like it's the most grounding thing outside of physically grounding that I can do so when I'm stressed it helps me whereas running is there's like all these subjective kind of like oh I feel like okay well I'm extra winded and this and that there's these other things like yes you could say the same argument like five miles is five miles sure but something about the weight I just feel like it's just good to put yourself under a little bit of moderate load even if it's not crazy heavy whereas running I would have a tendency to push it too much and then I'd get sick or something because then it's like okay well push it too hard I'm already central nervous systems already taxed and it comes to a different discussion of like when you're when you're in the weight room you're creating some damage you're creating some response but you're really not putting that much of an impact on your body unless you're like doing something crazy like you'd be lucky if you're burning 200 calories in a weight training session I mean unless you're doing like an eom kind of thing right so if you're doing a typical bodybuilding hypertrophy session I think it's stressful on the body but it's not as stressful as going and doing a metcon or going for a run I think you know what some of what you're touching upon kind of reminds me of this idea of like working in rather than working out you go to the gym and you you're you're like working out and I think that we think that we're going to like work out our problems that we're literally going to work them out or you have heard people before you know say oh if you're stressed or have anxiety you know maybe get like a punching bag and you can get your like your aggression out um you're not really getting your aggression out when you do that I'm not saying that it's not healthy it probably still is a good move to just to just burn some energy uh is probably is almost probably a good it's almost always probably a good idea to do something like that but you're actually just expressing more of that you know you have this heavy bag in front of you and you're pissed off about something and now you're smashing it you're you're um you're not being like introspective on that particular position that you have and so a different strategy which is probably again is probably not that I people might not it's not that appealing but is to think about what made me pissed off like what got me this way because no one can make you that way it's your own mind it's your own perception it's your own reality that you're kind of building you're you're bending uh the situations around you to put you into this state and it might have something to do with your dad it might have something to do with your upbringing it might have to do with somebody wronged you or there's so many different scenarios right um but you still made yourself angry how do you work your way through that going to the gym is um it's just covering up your problems it's just pausing it just like alcohol I think the gym and alcohol are actually way more related than we I can then then maybe then maybe we know um because I think alcohol I actually I actually like alcohol I haven't drank in a long time but I actually enjoy alcohol but I think alcohol is like a pause yeah you know it's like let me just hit this I'm going pause my life and pause everything around me and I'm just going to like forget about everything sweep everything under the rug I'm just going to enjoy this yeah I think that uh exercise is a distraction for the right person for the wrong person I guess exercise for someone that is maybe not like you and I I do think that it helps because they feel a change a a state change right there's there's nothing that is going to elicit a greater like State change for someone that is well I guess healthy and unhealthy but for someone that especially is is unhealthy it will help you work through stuff for sure but for some people like us I do feel like it it's a drug it is flat out a drug and it is an addiction it's flat out an addiction and being to manage that is extremely difficult yeah we know how all of us are behind closed doors and we're like like it's kind of cool because this guy's like me as well like he he just simply wants to do better and sometimes it's to his own detriment do you feel like there's a problem with this constant need to optimize I mean we've got the the huberman boys out there we've got all like this just like optimize optimize optimize optimize like where do we draw the line do you think with with optimization [Music] yeah I think I mean you're starting to see like a lot of like satire of it you're starting to see a lot of like skits and stuff like that you posted the other day was funny yeah yeah there's a lot of uh people poking fun at it and kind of rightfully so because it is getting to be kind of crazy and I'm out there you know in my underware in my front yard walking around and grounding and things like that but I think you know uh I think we're just trying to find some truths you know it it does seem like we've been lied to about a lot of things it seems like um I don't know how intentional it is or the government or conspiracies or whatever but uh it seems like from a nutritional standpoint it seems like you know this is supposed to be a free country and you have to send your kids to school otherwise you go to jail and then like what do they teach you in that school you know there's a lot of things where you're like H you know I'm not saying that school's bad no I hear you though I I I agree I agree with a lot of stuff and I I understand why things are set up the way way they are I'm not proposing that I start to run anything and I don't have Solutions but but I do think that uh you know we're we're just trying to find answers and so I actually think that a lot of these things um you know the we got you know Brian Johnson and you got old school guys like Dave asprey and Ben Greenfield and um we got you know Paul saladino who actually I think more recently he's been kind of leaning into this like like I'm studying myself you know what I mean I think I think for a while he's trying to tell everybody like hey you have to do this cuz he was excited and now I really like his perspective cuz he's kind of flipped it and he's like you know what I apologize for doing that so much but I'm just passionate about it and this is really helping me a lot and so maybe this will help you but the stuff that we're starting to hear about like what things like the carnivore diet or what some of these dietary uh interventions are doing for people or some of these breathing practices or even just getting sunlight like we're starting to learn so many really really cool things and I think we're just we're at the we're in a really good spot right now CU I think we're continuing to learn some really awesome things that will it will help people in a way that so much of this stuff will be way easier 5 years from now and way cheaper we don't have to do it all either right I think that's what people get and not all the time yeah you know there's a time in place and a setting to do each you know to do each individual thing I mean if you I mean it's just like the jokes that are out there I mean if you did everything that I suggested people do or get excited about or at least learn more about I mean you wouldn't have a life you wouldn't have time for anything same if you did everything that hberman talks about it's just there's protocols but then there's also yeah I mean we have real lives you can't do everything all at once but I don't think any harm comes from learning that the sun is good I don't think any harm comes from learning that you could take a break from food now then that's an interesting thing the sun you know it's like we've been so warned about the Sun and then especially with like our children and stuff you're like you're really you got a lot of concern and you should you know you should be concerned I'm taking my child to the beach like what are we going to do but I think the first things you should think about rather than just like sunscreening them to death I think that you should think about proper clothing proper hat especially if you're going on like a boat or something you don't don't want your neck exposed it's really easy to get burnt like still a sunburn like just because we're learning some cool benefits of the sun doesn't mean the sun can't burn you and there's people that are so fair skinned they need to be really super cautious with how much time they spend in the Sun but the first things you're going to think about is just like what a animal would do or what you would naturally do and you would naturally just go like you wouldn't there's probably not a lot in history where we really spend a lot of time intentionally sunbathing you know probably like maybe just naturally like went outside and like ate fruit and stuff like that but you probably weren't like laying out trying to like get tan and if you were and you think about it in in a region where maybe they would be more fair skinned they'd go out they'd be like oh shoot I burned but I got to do this again so I'm going to find a way to just cover up like you know I still need to go out and forage and you still need to go pick my for it too yeah so but you're you're not going to like say okay well I I can't do it it's necessary for the village survive and I'm just going to stay indoors I think the dose makes the poison and I mean it's in people that are fair skinned they're going to they're going to cover up appropriately but maybe their faces are still exposed their hands are still exposed they're getting the right amount of dare I say photosynthesis you know it's like you need a certain level of that and I feel like if you just think about what makes the most sense like maybe just if you're prone to Burning cover up a little bit you know and think about it like that I think that's a great philosophy but also I mean just how you're exposed as a as a young kid probably makes a difference too I would imagine I would imagine that like if we were taking a step back a thousand years probably would have lower instances of burning just because there just more exposure but it doesn't it's so hard to do that because you'd be dosing it in like a very strategic almost prescribed sunlight dosage I think we were talking last time like how funny would it be if like it got to a point where your doctor wrote you a script and said you need like 9 Minutes of sunshine today MH you know but then as funny as it would be it would legitimize it and people would start to take it serious where it's like maybe it's not a like a a legal script you know maybe it's not something where it's like okay you can't get sunlight unless you have a prescription the sun is really interesting it's really like it's it's really like a beautiful and perfect thing um I used to hate the sun I used to want it to burn out cuz I was big and fat and the sun was like my enemy because I was always sweaty but uh nowadays I've learned to embrace it but if you if you just feel the sun like literally just just sit there and just you have your shirt off or something uh you got some skin exposed to the sun you can feel when it starts to be too dangerous yeah it doesn't take long I mean if it's windy out and cold and you're at high altitude that's kind of a different story that's a little bit harder to be in tune with but for the most part if it starts to be spring or it starts to be summertime you'll kind of know when to get out of the sun and the first 3 hours of the day and the last three hours of the day as long as it's not dead center in the middle of the summer and depending on where you live but mainly here in the United States you most likely aren't going to get burned but you need to still build probably a tolerance again if you're really really fair skinned I find the sun to be super interesting and I found what you said were saying earlier about fasting and I can't stop thinking about this idea and I don't know if there'll ever be studies that will ever show this or prove this or how we could have like more evidence of this but there's weird that goes on our body our body makes energy does it make something out of nothing no but there's a lot inside the body already so if we're fasting maybe the body's using some glucose maybe the body is liberating some fat um if we're in some sort of starving State maybe the body has to figure out a way to use utilize some protein or something like that your body the Sun and cold are all things that have the ability when we utilize them to spin your energy up and that is super fascinating to me and it's really not thought about that much we we kind of know it from the bodybuilding and we know it from um there's a lot of bodybuilding coaches out there they're like dude I don't really care what anyone says about fasted cardio it works like it exponentially makes a difference I have been working with you know H rombot uh he helped me in my bodybuilding show he coaches uh he coached Jay Cutler he coached um Chris Bumstead I mean he's worked with the best of the best and uh I was very grateful that he helped me during my bodybuilding show and he was like yeah do all your cardio fasted and he was like it just it just flat out works and so and so we think about some of these things like we kind we kind of forget you know if like one of these guys in here that's working if if they were just kind of sitting over in the corner and they were kind of bummed you'd be like yo let's go for a walk and and why would you suggest that well it's it's going to spin up energy the guy's over there he's kind of bummed we're going to go on a walk we're going to go outside being in nature is like almost a completely separate thing than just the sun itself but there's these things I mean being in nature is going to spin up some energy too and so I just I find it I find it to be interesting that we only really look at our food and we need to start we need to start looking at some other things cuz like why is it that a workout why is it that a workout can spin you up so much and you can feel so like energized not coming from food at that point right I mean came from some previous food we're not saying like but it's being liberated in some weird way I mean I get what you're I mean 100% I mean imagine just doing like 20 Jumping Jacks and 20 push-ups like 15 times a day like would you just be like all jacked up all day long the sun is a burning ball of gas and it's energy right so I mean it's just it's foolish to think that there's not an energy that's coming from that doing something and I know we're not plants but I can't help it unthink the fact that plants grow when they get acted upon by the sun right I mean photosynthesis yes but like come on like there's got to be something that's happening reacting with minerals doing something we can't calculate and look at all this stuff there's not enough research dollars in the world to look at it and we're only who knows like we know nothing about absolutely nothing but I firmly believe that if you go out in the sun there is an energizing component of it I think we're getting something from it mhm and I think it's cumulative but I also think it's immediate too I agree a ton with that just to kind of go back on something we were talking about earlier you mentioned uh fat and I just wanted to kind of talk about that a little bit more do you think that I mean I realize like people are like different sizes and stuff but I think even I think as different as we can be we're all pretty much we're we're very similar you know there could be like a 5ft tall girl like a 7 foot tall guy I realize there's some discrepancies in like body size and stuff like that but do you think it's like even possible for someone to like really gain a lot of body fat if they are if they only eat like 60 grams of fat a day it's a good question I think it would be pretty hard I think that it is pretty energetically difficult to go through denovo lipogenesis and convert carbs into fat it's like a seven six or seven step process I mean it's it's not efficient it's not an efficient way of storing fat absolutely can welcome back to the 1980s everybody lowfat diet is coming back that's probably what that's what they're going to clip clip out of this and talk about me the fat simply stores easier as fat and we've seen this time and time again but I do think that the sugar excess sugar excess carbohydrates damaged the metabolism enough that it becomes exponentially worse with the excess fat the ability to deal with the excess fat the ability to liberate fats the ability to oxidize fats decreases so much from the broken metabolism that could have been spawned by the high sugar diet that then that becomes significantly worse I'm sure there's people that are more efficient at oxidizing fats and I think we've seen it in the literature although I mean it's clearly if someone is doing a ketogenic diet like they're they're leveraging those better but I do find that even with a ketogenic diet like you there's a Tipping Point where too much fat definitely starts to still store right but it's also are you dealing with people with broken metabolisms too so I do think that the biggest lever that people can pull when it comes time to like quickly drop some you know fat pounds is yeah probably reducing fat but if you're trying to co correct a disrupted metabolism I do think it's a combination of reducing fat being the lever that you can pull as the sort of building block but pulling out the carbs as a way of saying hey this is the reason that the mitochondrial Machinery is somewhat disfunctional because it's just overload but at the end of the day I do think it's kind of a tandem approach I think that approach of uh high carb high fat together is seriously detrimental I think that is the problem that we're at and we were talking about before we were filming like I can't really think of a whole lot of reasons from any evolutionary standpoint why our ancestors would have an amazing surplus of fats and carbs at one time like I I just that doesn't I can't really think of a situation where they would have let's just s call a number like okay let's say something that you if you were to have a couple of Twinkies and you had maybe 100 gram of sugar and whatever maybe 60 G of fat I'm pulling that totally out of my rear end I don't know exactly but let's say something like that a typical processed food calorie bomb unless just say 100 g of sugar to 60 to 75 G of fat what would that look like in the wild what would that look like okay so let's say 75 grams of fat that' probably be like two RI eyes maybe and maybe oh shoot like five to seven apples or if it was berries which are so much more like yeah fibery 10 cups right do you I just don't see that really happening that often I mean maybe there would be a freak freak occasion but certainly like if someone so if someone's eating two Twinkies a day that would mean that from an ancestral standpoint like they were coming across two giant juicy fatty steaks and a bunch of fruit to equal 100 grams of let's just say glucose not even fructose so in that case You' need double the amount because how much fructose and glucose is in the fruit that just seems unreasonable to happen every day so I think we have a bombardment of fats and carbs coming in at the same time that just doesn't make sense for our body to be able to handle and you know if if those two things did come together you know some fats and some carbohydrates it would be in the summertime and it might also make sense that the body says oh wow thank you let's store as much of this as we can yeah it would there's more sunlight there's more activity you're doing more things you're you're now up from 7:00 a.m. till at least 7:00 p.m. probably um on a lot of days cuz there's still some sunlight and you can actually gather up the food and bring it back to everybody and all these things and and uh like you said you can kind of store some of that it's interesting that carbohydrates like the natural carbohydrates don't have fats with them like the only things I can kind of think of is like I guess you got like nuts but it's like there's like small amount of carbs like it's not really carbs like like more fibery right yeah I mean there's some like maybe some weird maybe coconut kind of a nut but then what some of the there's a couple of those weird fattier tropical fruits I can't name them off the top of my head but I know there's some that have like a few grams of fat but nothing crazy right just doesn't make a lot of sense that you would have that like almost all carb sources seem to be lean it's just they get adulterated through whatever it is we do to them yeah then even protein you know protein is uh doesn't come by itself usually either usually it's accompanied by fat and so those those two were supposed to come together but when we're talking about like trying to help somebody lose weight or we're talking about somebody like you're saying I think you know the kind of a broken metabolism thing is an interesting interesting thing to think about or look at and I I don't think that you and I are necessarily saying like I I think I think it's easy like if you're if you're way overweight your metabolism probably isn't working very efficiently and if you've struggled to lose weight in the past not just because you can't hang on and you can't do the diet but if you legitimately you know have had diet interventions before and you're walking more and it seems like it's your body's a little stubborn to losing some weight you probably do have a broken metabolism then how do you Unbreak Your Metabolism you Unbreak it by being healthy and by having healthy practices and people may have heard similar speeches from people that are successful like well man I want to be success successful how do I get in on that well in order to be successful you have to first become a success you have to do a lot of things that successful people do and so if you want to be healthy you have to adhere to a bunch of things that healthy people adhere to for a while then your body will become healthy and then as you become healthy it'll be way easier for you to lose weight I'm not saying that you can't lose weight if you're unhealthy but it's just going to probably be harder it probably won't feel as good yeah I think at the end of the day it's the sustainability I me without that I think that's where you and I have both come is like what is the easiest way for us to be able to do this day in and day out with the least amount of mental resistance yeah yeah I don't want resistance in my life like I'm just at that point like the resistance that I want in my life I want to have there for reason but I want to be able to overcome resistance that I'm faced with on a daily basis because it's going to happen but why would I electively add resistance it's like I even think that way about like cold plunging and things like that too it's like I'll do it if I feel like doing it MH but to have a protocol of adding additional stress it doesn't make a ton of sense to me when I'm like I'm already adding enough stress through things that I enjoy adding stress through and occasionally that is going to be a cold plunge occasionally it is going to be a sauna but the moment that it starts becoming like oh my gosh I'm doing something that's you know we we like Joe Rogan talks about like kind of you know tackling his uh inner right like when he's like and I get that I get that but I don't want to craft a life where I feel like I have to do that to myself I would rather be ready to handle the real problem than to train myself so much to the point where I'm broken and not actually able to rise to the occasion and a lot of the special operator or Special Forces operators that I work with like they they say all the time they say like you you never you don't rise to the occasion you def to your lowest level of training which makes a lot of sense right but that is for a special forces operator that is ready to has to be ready to go at any time and the point with them saying that is they say things like if your training is here and you get into a situation where you have to go to hear it's very seldom that you're going to actually like rise to that occasion unless you absolutely need to and having a like a base level of training that's a little bit higher allows you to rise to that occasion the Delta between rising to the occasion is a little bit but the extreme is if you're constantly trying to rise that or make rise to the occasion every day there's a ceiling you're not going to you're going to be so broken that there's no occasion to actually rise to if that makes sense like you're you're trying to balance how much you're able to stress yourself and I don't want to walk through my life saying like Okay I need more resistance I I need to log more food because I want to find the easiest path to check all the boxes that I possibly can so that I have the energy to do the things that I love or the energy to rise to the occasion when I need to yeah I think you're just talking about efficiency like you you're efficient you get to be more efficient at stuff the longer that you do it the longer that you practice it the more you enjoy something the more you're going to do it therefore the more efficiency that you'll have and things won't feel like they're difficult and I can look back at stuff that I've done over the years and I can say it really didn't seem that hard and the reason why I can say that is because to me everything in life Works a little bit like it does in the weight room when you have some resistance not all the resistance when you have some resistance your body can uh start to acclimate to it your body can start to get used to it your body can break some tissues down repair it you can come back literally come back stronger you come back stronger and better every time and so if you kind of take that same philosophy through your life the things that you go through there might be personal things there might be tragedy there might be some things that sideswipe you that you may have uh not really thought about before but for the most part the work that you do in my opinion it doesn't need to be hard and I hear people all the time talking about how hard you have to work when you're an entrepreneur how hard you have to work if you want to be the uh you want to be the top dog in this thing you have to have this this fight in you and I I agree there has to be a point where you can really go but that doesn't necessarily require that you're and it all it doesn't mean by any means that you're going like 100% on stuff all the time because that's not an effective way to get there in the first place and so I think a lot of people are thinking they're going to do stuff with intensity a lot of times I think people are thinking they're going to do stuff with and all those things I think it it requires a lot of you and I think that uh it can just kind of leave you in a state where you're just you're it can leave you in a state where you're just sort of getting flat you're getting flattened by trying to have all these practices um trying to spin all these plates all the time yeah I've said this before in other interviews but you know someone told me when I was first getting frustrated when I was lifting I said Thomas if you got stronger every workout than every would be benching 1,000 PBS right I mean it's that simple it's like if you it doesn't work like that it's not a linear progression it's it's always going to be two steps forward one step back maybe another step back maybe three steps forward and it's just the quicker that you can relate with that and understand that and see that and appreciate that for what it is be a little bit more methodical about it be a little bit more mindful of it the more sustainable It all becomes where you're at you know with uh this like podcast and and uh interviewing so many different people kind of like more recently are you starting to question a lot of your own beliefs more and are you trying to like you and I like know each other pretty well um with some of your guests are you trying to give some of them a little bit more like push back and stuff like that I think I can give push back without it feeling like push back by just raising interesting question uh by being like hopelessly curious I feel like my just interest in learning and just gaining perspective because for my own selfish reasons I I I like to learn from people because of my own gain in life too right like so like I maybe it's a profitable gain or gain with my family or the upper hand in negotiation or whatever I do have selfish reasons for wanting to learn from people uh so I genuinely get curious because I'm like I I get off on like learning and trying something new I don't get off on the optimization and the performance as much as I used to I mean sure I get excited if I perform well I'm like hey but I'm more excited about reverse engineering what I did to get there right and the craft and the mechanics of it so when I challenge people it's usually by asking a question that they may not have the answer to or they may not have been expecting or they may have seen as difficult I like to ask I do like to try to ask questions that make them say I actually don't have the answer for that that's kind of a win because for me not that it's a competition I'm trying to get them to that point but I know that that means I've challenged them in a way that they weren't expecting to get challenged and it's not coming at them like on an offensive it's it's getting them to just think different and so it's like how do you quantify challenge how do you quantify um resistance like Mark if I asked you to you know I don't know tell me how to I don't even know something that you're just not well versed inh that would be a challenge to you but I'm not going to say Mark how do you feel about telling people that saturated Fat's okay while there are millions of people dying from heart disease you know right it's like you you don't have to CH like I saw that video with Dr Mike challenging gundry right did you see that I thought it was very interesting but I also couldn't help and talked about with my team I'm like how do you think that that room was after that podcast was done like did he did Gund just be like bye leave or did they like shake hands take a picture be like hey that was nice thanks like that's so so awkward um but I also as a business person I know like we have platforms and we do have responsibility for what we put out there but I also don't feel like I'm going to be rude with people I'm not a people pleaser but I don't want to have someone come on yeah and highlight their flaws and put them on the spot that's just business practice that's just not cool like I'd rather just not invite them um if I really don't like them and I maybe didn't vet them enough yeah yeah I just don't want to be in their presence like that's different but if there's someone that maybe I disagree with I'm not here to debate them I'm here to highlight their viewpoints and I might challenge with some questions that get them to think like I did that with Dave asprey like it was kind of impossible with him because he would just say no you know way but and that's not even really a knock on them but then like then there's other people that'll be like oh I didn't really think of that or like Paul and I are are close enough now where um we can kind of laugh about it like he's across from me and he's saying I I I see you uh smiling like he's like I think you're you know probably just agreeing with me right it's nice that you can have that right like that's that's where it really needs to be like we don't need to be enemies if we have such an enemy mentality with each other and we're so rigid like discussions don't go anywhere it's like you've gota like you gota I don't know what is it Dale Carnegie was it D no Dale Carnegie said something that was uh who's the guy that wrote The Magic of thinking big um not sure Robert uh I can't remember anyway great book like it was one of the best books I ever read that kind of got me started in any form of Entrepreneurship whatsoever and like first they have to like you then they have to respect you and then you have to speak with logic and reason that is how you get someone close to you and be able to have open conversation they have to like you they have to respect you and you have to speak with logic and reason so Mark you could like me you might even respect the weights that I can put up or whatever but if I talk like a lunatic there's the close of the deal right right so I always go back to that like I have to like someone at a certain level to invite them here you know so like Paul saladino do disagree and I do disagree on a lot of things but there's a lot of things I love about Paul his like infectious personality his energy his I'm like you are a likable dude even though sometimes he doesn't come across that way online Paul is a very likable dude and okay I actually do respect him in the sense that I respect how he really embodies his practice and he actually does speak with logic and reason despite what some people will say the smartest people you ever meet um this is uh was told to me by a guy named Cal Deets who's like one of the best strength coaches in the world Cal said uh and one of the smarter guys I've ever met he said the smartest people will tell you that they don't know yeah and they'll also tell you it goes and even smarter people will tell you that they want to change their answer and that's exactly what Paul saladino did I have text messages with Paul saladino I don't know why he never gives me credit but I am the guy that forced him to eat some carbs or at least I think I am cuz I have some texts where we going back and forth I'm like dude you got to just I don't think you understand like what carbs feel like and I think it wasn't probably too much longer after my bodybuilding show that I did I was like have you ever felt like you know just like a bunch of like glucose in your muscles like it feels amazing like it might help you with performance you might feel you know better when you're doing certain things and at the time I don't think he was like lifting that much you know he like surfs and does a lot of other things which Surfing by the way seems impossible can you surf no I know thoracic doesn't even move that way I just see people doing that I'm like that's unbelievable I don't get it but uh he's he's uh he loves it and he's you know incredible with it but um yeah I was talking to him about carbs I'm like dude you got to at least try some fruit try some rice try some potatoes I was trying to really encourage him to do that a while back no so I'm glad that I'm glad that he has I'm glad he's tried it and I think that's all that any of us can do and that's why I was saying even the experts aren't experts because even Paul saladino while he does know a lot while you know a lot I know a lot we know a lot and we know a lot for ourselves and we can help a lot of people we can help a lot of people in general we can say hey here's some of the general stuff to do but to try to narrow it down individually on what each person does I mean the the information that you share with a loved one with a family member on how to lose weight when they're interacting with you a bunch going back and forth on text is different than anything you can share here on the podcast because it no matter how long a podcast is we can't discuss everything even though we talked about calories at length there's still so much more to continue to talk about on that on that uh on that point both of us would agree that yes if somebody is to reduce their calories substanti EV by 500 or th000 they are literally going to lose weight um but it's like what's the blowback from that you know those are like the things that I think it's the reason why we love podcast because you can just dive into all the little nuances of these things talk about them for infinitely CU nobody actually really knows no agreed man well where can everyone find you brother you can find me right over here sitting across from you e eating c yeah exactly that was amazing I love I love Cod Liver I I didn't know that like cod liver was a thing but you were talking about cod liver oil and I was like I wonder like I was like it must be like literal like cod liver so I was like and that just on Amazon I searched on the internet and I found that on Amazon yeah that's awesome yeah that's like I you could almost like spread it on toast it's like butter it's like yeah I know it's like uh faga or whatever that stuff is it's like little less little more Humane yeah exactly I'm Mark smelly Bell on social media uh my brand is uh I have Mark Bell slingshot if you want to check out any of those products or if you want to check out my supplements it's within brand.com right on man thanks thank you appreciate it