it's time for Windows weekly Paul thot here Richard Campbell's here we're going to talk about the implosion at Intel rave reviews for the new chips from AMD Paul's got some thoughts about the co-pilot plus PCS and Snapdragon and it's the return of word star I know you've been waiting for it all that coming up next on Windows weekly podcasts you love from people you trust this is TR [Applause] [Music] hey this is Windows weekly with Paul thrat and Richard Campbell episode 893 recorded Wednesday August 7th 2024 the word star look it's time for Windows weekly the show we cover the latest news from Microsoft and joining me in the little tiny boxes to my left and right Paul thorat thot.com do you feel cramped in your little tiny box I'm feeling boxed in today Leo uh nothing wrong with a three shot three shot makes me happy and Richard Campbell Yeah we actually can do eight up to eight if you if you want to invite some on CNN from Run As radio this is the new method you might as well get used to it kids because there's no more old method after today this is the last Windows weekly from the studios go stud up into the attic I have taken but you know what's funny I I have I don't know a few Awards it's eight or nine and I uh was going to leave him here and then slowly one by one I've go well I can't you know like Steve Martin jerk I can't but all I need is this well I need this and so I've brought them all home and now there's a shelf which I always said I would never do of uh of awards I don't um I don't think much of this kind of self my stuff my this stuff myself but my wife got a writing award a couple years ago that's cool and I said um my daughter was like oh that's really you that's really impressive I'm like yeah I mean it's it's probably just a coincidence that came eight or nine years after I got one but you know and then and I said um I said there's a little Riv I was like do they make them smaller now my award is quite a bit bigger yeah I have an Emmy but it's the little Emmy I have the there's a a regular Emmy which is pretty massive with a big thing and then I have a regional Emmy Award which is like compact sure it's I have the comp with the region yeah I even brought my zff Davis editors or what was it was uh oh boy Publishers Circle or uh Chairman's Circle nice back when it was uh when the chairman was uh oh I can't even remember his name now zff or Davis it was it wasn't it was after Bill zff um oh I forgot his name which is probably a blessing um I have a tech TV award I mean I go wait I these Awards go back 30 years now wow since I took over the company I have given myself the best boss award best boss award I have that mug nice so that's good I have the mug the old days of the MVP program one of the things you could do is you could request a letter from Microsoft to someone to say you're an MVP a so I send it to the same friend every year just oh that's cute congratulations just to let you know you're an MVP in our an MVP I am feeling a little inadequate though because I have an R2-D2 but it's smaller than yours I get I guess it's like the Emmy Paul has the big R2 and I have the little R2 my R2 is falling apart I don't know if you can see it but I'm little Parts oh those pieces from the gonna it's going to Teeter over I don't know this r unit needs a little work R2 crisis let's talk about Windows 11 cuz that's why people are here MH we welcome all members and all the people watching on all seven count them seven streams there's discod for the club members there's youtube.com twili for the YouTubers there's twitch.tv twit for people who like to watch on Amazon's money losing twitch streams there's kick which is the new guy in town he's like no one knows him he's sitting in the corner we should make friends but so far we haven't uh there's Linked In for no apparent reason but it is a Microsoft platform so that's good does it arrive in LinkedIn as like a sponsored uh message from someone undoubtedly I have no idea I've never visited it there's also Facebook but my favorite we're on the fascist platform x.com so now and we're gonna sue people who don't watch us if you don't watch us we're going to court over that buddy it's going to be an anti suit too isn't that hysterical what is wrong with that man I don't what is this first you know a year ago he said go f yourself to sponsors yeah now he's saying wait a minute hold on anyway so seven streams pick the one you want watch we have a unified chat so if you're chatting in one of those platforms I will see it may not respond because I don't I only have two hands um welcome to all of you and especially to our club Twi members now the week D mystery [Music] continues I feel like this is the only reason I exist anymore just to make sense of this nonsense but um just to kind of recap things everybody knows about Patch Tuesday second Tuesday of every month Microsoft issues quality updates for Windows um security updates are included these days a lot of new features etc etc um they have an Insider program for testing new features that they you know ignore kind of willy-nilly but whatever they have various channels and then I don't know I think it was last year sometime last year or so they added to switch to Windows updates so anybody using Windows 11 could opt into preview updates which are delivered also once a month but on the Tuesday of the fourth week of the month the week this is the week d update as we call it right everyone with me so far so um this past year two years has been kind of interesting on the Windows update front because Microsoft keeps changing the way that they update Windows right so there are different literal methods for updating windows but also just the schedule and how things are done and so forth and so this year I'm not going to remember all of them but the big one is that 24 H2 which historically or typically would be delivered in the second half of the year was partially delivered in the first half of the year for people on Snapdragon X based PCS the co-pilot plus PCS and there'll be a second release later in the year for everyone else um I provided a tip probably two three months ago now where anyone could get this if they want but for this little magical slice in time we have three supported versions of Windows all with roughly the same Fe the goal is for them to all have the same feature set we've talked about this right um yep what else am I missing I'm missing all kinds of stuff but you know we'll just talk our way through this so a few weeks back we uh you know we had Patch Tuesday in July and and that got Windows 11 22 H2 and 23 H2 roughly caught up to where 24 H2 was and then a couple weeks ago we had that weekd update and the Tuesday came and went we did Windows weekly I actually forgot about it and then and I think it was Thursday or Friday they delivered Microsoft did a week D update for Windows 1122 and 23 H2 belatedly right a couple days late and that's been happening this year this is probably the third time that's happened it didn't go out on the Tuesday but it did go up and okay and you look at these updates and you see okay well this a a couple of new things in there um minor updates to the start menu the taskbar um this is the duplicate tab thing in explorer that everyone is so excited to have and those features are actually not in Windows 11 24 H2 and there was no 24 H2 week D update but coincidental to that on the same day Microsoft put a new build of Windows 1124 H2 into the release preview channel of the Windows update sorry the windows um Insider program and the new features in that update map to the features we see in week d uh for 22 and 23 H2 so my theory at the time was August is going to come around next week let me look at the calendar to be sure yeah next week is Patch Tuesday and you know maybe this was a little off maybe they intended for this to be the week D update they just you know whatever they ran out of time whatever there must be some release window who knows and uh this is going to be what would have been the week D update and so that's that was the story as of last Wednesday then Microsoft on August 2nd which was probably Tu no it was Friday sorry on August 2nd am I doing the wrong yeah so they released a weekd update for Windows 11 in August that was for July and it is in fact the same stuff that was in that release preview build okay and some other stuff right so this is a bunch of new features so uh that we're probably all going to get next Tuesday uh or start to get because cfrs right which is one of those other you know um new methods that Microsoft has for rolling out updates right they don't just blur it out into the world at the same time like the features come out randomly essentially right so we're going to have things like the ability to drag pinned start menu app shortcuts down to the taskar to pin them there um we're going to have the ability to duplicate tabs we're going to have the ability again uh because this is a regression problem to drag uh files up to the address bar in file explorer and then move or copy them to a different location in the breadcrumb bar like we used to be able to do um this is the four lock screen widgets you know all that stuff right there's a million new ways to use window sense that like a bunch of people are on vacation and so like the kids are just having a good time I have no sense um I have the the in fact it is if anything nonsense right I mean I don't that's the thing and honestly that's been what I mean ever since Windows 11 it's been confusing and alarming and uh just I feel like this is paralleled to you being on the show I I think I feel like one the things the whole update process I'm not saying it's a causal relationship but it's it's interesting that I or to my memory anyway I seem to recall one of the earliest conversations we had was hey there are like three different versions of one drive now anyone know what's going on there and to this day they have never acknowledged that that happened it was like that for a year year and a half or or more I mean it was you know and then this is when features just started appearing in Windows that were never T and fragmentation is a constant problem with a company that's big you know everybody has access to code bases and they take advantage of it yep I I there's a there's a there's kind of a bigger topic here in a way that has to do with Microsoft and the markets it does well in and doesn't do well in and the thing that's so weird about this is this is not what its primary and most important customers want at all it's not what almost any customers want but I could sort of excuse behavior that ignored consumers to some degree because maybe they're not as important to Microsoft I would get that but or at least they don't understand it it's funny because I just put a Windows Server show in the can for run as which is a good you know six weeks away or something okay and by the way you mind if you or Thomas okay nice right only guy I know who's written more books than you MH yeah yep it's like he's clearly not learning uh but one teach people how much money server makes like those servers aren't going away yeah this is the so this isn't like the return of vinyl right no it's not like uh you know we're we're not all going back to buying CDs and stores and not using Spotify or whatever but I for Microsoft because of the marketing or maybe marketing is the wrong word but the it's almost like a fiduciary need to Market um Azure during those many years where it was like 70% growth 70% growth 70% growth you know this is what drove Microsoft's market cap up with its share price right um was this this um Wall Street excitement over the cloud and um they didn't talk about it a lot of course they very purposefully obscure their financials so they don't have any specifics but yeah I mean Azure was growing but it's very likely that for a lot of that time server was the bigger business money money money money because the stuff's not going away and it was to me it was very gratifying to spend time with aurin talking about server and active directory and like the thing that every listener to run as has for it this is like my excitement over WPF it's like it's back baby you know it never went away really went away but but it's back in the back in the context again and it's and it never stopped being important it never never left anyone's budget I you know always I'm not claiming this is purposeful um but I think it might be you know that Microsoft all of a sudden is talking about server again at a time when Azure growth has not leveled off but has slowed dramatically and now uh talking about server wouldn't have a negative impact on analysts watching a company for growth right um they've been kind of worried about Azure for a while now frankly and now we have got AI oh look over here another new thing we can wave our hands at well I think we have this terrible conflict of interest where we're they want to move the stock price more than they want to serve their customers yes it's the Enterprise and certification yeah you know because it makes you know all that leadership has an awful lot of stock yeah and you know in theory they have a fiduciary responsibility to shareholders that's what the Harvard Business School keeps telling them you know they're and then even when you get down to the employee level if your leadership is banging on about Azure your best promotion path is focusing on Azure so it doesn't matter what you're good at what makes money you know they they're in the Trap I I lived this nightmare because the topics of the products that I care about at Microsoft the most are client products right they're what we might think of as consumer products but they really not really right but just client products um the entire company had a pivot on the cloud and the way that happened in Windows as as a client was Windows is a service let's take this spaghetti code of Legacy you know infra well infrastructure client infrastructure and uh we'll pretend it's an online service and we'll just update it all the time and it was really really bad for a really really long period of time um Terry myerson's um pay package was or his uh bonuses were based on that kind of growth y that he was never going to achieve they cooked the books they were counting VM installs remember they were trying to get to a billion uh installs of Windows 10 at one point some really fast period of time and the irony or the the weird coincidence I guess of all this is that honestly today they got really good at updating Windows yeah maybe because now they just I guess anyone with a desk can pull a switch and something goes out to Windows now I don't know what's happening but um yeah so hopefully the the as I see Microsoft starting to stop stopping to pretend that Windows Server isn't a thing when the Jeff wises of the world who have never went away are suddenly back you know in public again talking I I love that because uh although when I did the show on the next version of server he wasn't allowed to say server 2025 he had to say server V Next well it was probably just the timing of the you don't want to well you know what if they miss the I don't know I hear you if you miss 2025 you really miss something like that's so yeah this is um this is where we're at right and so we just don't like I said uh it doesn't make sense to me that Microsoft does things so erratically and chaotically because it's primary customers it's it's and it's probably a big higher percentage now than it's ever been but the the historic number we've always used is you know 2/3 of Windows from a revenue perspective comes from commercial not from consumer right yeah but my god there been a lot of focus on you know co-pilot plus PC local AI but that that's not happening on the server side the server side incremental improvements because what do you want from a server but reliability have they added co-pilot to the Windows Server desktop yet why no no they have not in fact they're doing their very best to get rid of the desktop entirely right they don't want to RP into those servers anymore they don't think you should have a gooey there anymore yep I sure yeah we're all not wrong well I mean I think one of the Hut new tips of 2025 is going to be the same as it was in 2005 which is how you can get a copy of Windows server and make it run like a Windows client you know you can get escaped from all the terribleness that's happening yeah no I did that at one point I had one I had one of my P4 laptops you know the one you could cook food on MH uh that I ran a server edition of I think 2000 I think it was 200 we all we all tried this at point I mean just something something to leave me alone so I have stuff to do God forbid yeah anyway sorry for the distraction because no no it's it all ties in together I mean it's honestly those two things parallel each other right so totally Windows was the thing that didn't fit it was the Square Peg and everything else was round holes it just didn't make sense in Microsoft still doesn't right um server never stop making money yeah well the parallel there is uh Apple 2 in the 80s was the thing making all the money for Apple but they were selling the Mac yeah you know they they kind of wanted it to go away the difference there is that that transition was always going to happen um with the server and this is true and the client to a little small degree but the server especially because of the um you know the nature of the cloud and infrastructure and so forth I mean it was never really it was never going to go away no uh the question was what the plateau was and I think it ended up the higher than they thought we deployed net code to Linux instances now because it saves us 25% right off the bat yeah nice right hopefully they're running on Azure but that's that's fine that's where they're running but you can run them elsewhere they run fine on gcp and they run fine on on AWS as well but why right right uh and if you've got IAS chops app service seems very familiar like it's not hard to to get around in there you'll recognize it right but on the client side changing clients is hard you know folks we folks I me we were joking before the show about the difficulty of going from a Mac keyboard to a Windows keyboard and back again and that's just the smallest little corner of that well and I'm wearing my run ass hat here it's about administering them right it's about controlling images controlling driver sets and common Hardware sets and all of those I am responsible for X many thousand desktops and by golly I know how to do that in Windows and it's not the same with a map I have to think that Microsoft strategy um you know pushing out that 23 H2 as oh just a monthly update for 22 H2 just kidding you know that kind of thing um is part of a broader plan just to beat down it and and just hope that some of them just give it what are they doing effectively but it's like you can have any update you want because they're all the same exactly which version of Windows do you want to be on oh 22 H2 sure you can have that or you can have all the new features but you're on 22 H2 you win keep that I'll keep that made concession yeah exactly it's it's but it's the it I really it is beautiful I mean it beautiful and sad but Twisted man this is this is orwellian it's unbelievable I know that's why like you know you said something about making sense of something early on I'm like there's no sense to be made here it it is just a coping strategy and just some form of submission you know just like it's brilliant also it's like no no I'm going to get you to use this I'm just going to tell you whatever you need to hear yep there it's look it's easy to be cynical um period it's super easy to be cynical big Tech uh Microsoft in particular but it's hard not to look at their behavior sometimes and think you know antitrust Regulators they have started looking at Microsoft too but they they're really starting to pay attention to like apple Google you know yeah we're going to get into that later today right they're like yeah and they're like you know uh when the uron is looking the other maybe we could Scurry around in here and do what we want see what happens you know hey you know what I I I'm more than ever and you made this very clear to me the Brad Brad Smith strategy works yeah right th those folks are looking for talking points to to get them reelected and you don't give them it's like we're happy to comply let's go now it doesn't mean whether they are or not but they say the thing that leaves no talking points so doesn't make the news we don't know what happened with uh teams bundling in the EU exactly I'm sure it will come out someday but um it's that's the one weird exception where Microsoft uh offered concessions then they just did it they they didn't wait for the EU to agree they said okay we're just gonna we're gonna unbundle it we're gonna do the right thing it's it you know you're like wow this company's really changed and then the EU is like nope like what happened like what I do you just have to do something different could you give us any guidance no we cannot no but what you did was wrong yeah it was just wrong we didn't like it so now the was acting like a chat so I don't say and I think again that's the the the you know Windows n was like that yes you know your effort to protect customers has now hurt customers what would you like us to do next in the late 90s and early 2000s because of what happened to Microsoft with the US government you know a lot me and other people like me and you I'm sure we all had to learn about antitrust you know we had to sort of understand what was happening yeah and so we're going to apply this knowledge later in the show um because you know Google had this big event this um week this past week that parallels what happened to Microsoft 20 plus years ago and I mean like really parall like it's crazy like shockingly it's explicitly paralleling it and um you know I think we all have our own memories of that time I I cannot tell you how strong the belief is out there that Microsoft won that case you know um that they settled and and they got everything they wanted and it's like o we're going to look at that a little bit but but that's not true but that is not true at all but no no that you know basically Steve Balmer got his job and made his job the first year he had that job when he successfully negotiated compliance officer basically but he spent a year making it come true yeah the victory for Microsoft was that the breakup order was taken off table Yeah Yeah so that was the big thing but I think the important point to know from back then is that uh the guilty verdict and the findings of fact those were not taken away those those were all legal precedent that that's those are all things but you're now complying in a way that allows us to not have to en Force the remedy you know now that we're 25 years later to believe um what if Microsoft were broken up dor contention was that would have been a good thing how many hours you have shareholders and everybody else right so the two the two um the two big what ifs of that era to me are that right like what would two microsofts look like an app been bad yeah I you would have seen uh you know office by the time Windows 8 was coming out office had already created office for the iPad and Steve Balmer said no we're not putting it out right um the office of that era 15 years earlier or whatever that is would have put it on Linux would have put it on the web faster would have you know done a cross-platform uh thing that the you know that the integrated Microsoft of the early 2000s would never have done the the the windows Focus Microsoft right that's that's probably the big one I would it have been successful is no one you know who cares I mean in some ways right but the the bigger one to me is what would have the 2000s and 2010s have been like if Microsoft was like it was in the 90s companies like Google Amazon the resurge resurge in apple to some degree and Facebook would never have happened um if Microsoft could have Netscape those guys which they would have yep our world would look like East Germany today it would be you know there's no it would be horrible oh no no be just be Bish it would be you know we talked yesterday it's also the 27th anniversary of Bill Gates looming over Steve Jobs announcing that they were going to give Apple $150 million without which Apple would not have survived Lally and it's I think likely although there's some debate over this that the reason Microsoft did that was because of looming regulatory absolutely yeah um very recently I heard I read somewhere I I I put this aside um I'll be able to tell you where it was eventually but um someone had a story where supposedly Steve Jobs went to Gates and said hey you know we've all that U lawsuit stuff around look and feel and intellectual property you know it we could make this go away but just so you know like we actually have more and if you guys don't agree to help us out like we're going to launch another lawsuit suit against you and supposedly that played a rule a role I've never heard that before in my life so I I it this just came up recently I was like I don't know about that one but um yeah and and there were you know we'll talk about Google later but there were parallels uh between that Microsoft and Apple and uh today with Google and Mozilla right that if uh Google stopped paying Mozilla that company would probably disappear in about two seconds you know it's some 90 something per of their uh operating um uh revenue or or cash flow or whatever it is every year is comes from Google right they pay them um some hundred I think it's 500 something million dollars a year or whatever it is so yeah there's a lot of parallels I'm not sure how we got off an an trust there but uh but anyway uh but with to Rich's Point earlier yes the um now that Microsoft has kind of uh just just through natural business um Evolution you know I should slowed down it's still you know now it's a real business doing great right um the focus is elsewhere and I think Windows Server can come out from the Shadows again and say yeah remember us we're still here and they'll never admit to it but I bet that's a huge percentage of intelligent Cloud a huge percentage way more than people would imagine because they've incessantly marketed the cloud right um just like Windows is I mean we don't know the exact number but it's probably 8 to 10 billion a quarter right out of Windows client right every like consistent forever it's just like an enduring cash machine but it's treated so horribly by this company and I think it's because the upper level Executives have their eye on a different prize these days right which now is AI okay um Windows okay so um in the past week not much going on with the windows inside of program there was a very small build last week in the beta Channel um uh an equally small build to Dev but today they put out something very interesting and it's hard not to believe that this wasn't purposely timed because I just updated this chapter in the book but they're issuing a major update to the window Store app that will um eventually it's not public but it's in the uh Canary and Dev channels yeah um kind of a proba would call it the third major redesign of the Library part of that app and they're separating it separating out updates and downloads uh from there which honestly is probably overdue that was kind of a mish mash or it is today if you go look at it today it's actually very confusing and they've changed it over time so that in fact I'm just going to bring it up so I can speak to this more intelligently but if you go into library today in the window the Microsoft store app what you'll see is a well a library but the default view is um well things you might need to update at the top but the library view itself is actually apps that are installed on your computer right now um I sort of think of this I'm not really sure why anyone would need that view honestly the default view in the beginning was your actual library right so if you go in there and click the little sort button over on the right uh and you unclick show installed products only what you'll see is a list of all of the apps and games that you've ever purchased or download downloaded through the Microsoft store including by the way on Xbox and elsewhere although there's even I think there's even there might even be Windows Phone stuff in here although they might be finally filtering that out by now but some of that stuff you can't actually do anything with if it's from a you know for a different platform um and I use this to go in there and find the handful of like expensive apps that I purchased like Affinity photo or Adobe Photoshop Elements so that I can reinstall them quickly right because in this case they both being with the letter a and they're both right next to each other so it's kind of easy I can just go click click and kind of install it so they're going to separate these two functions out so that updates and downloads will be its own View and then Library will be its own view which is what it I think it's what it was uh some time ago but it's what it should be and it will be coming back or at least changing in that direction and then some other stuff that's not super um interesting about um you know special deals and things that will pop up from here and there but this is kind of a kind of a not structural but it's it's a big it's it's it's it's a good update because like I said I just updated the chapter in the book and I as I wrote you know this is what this is it was like man this doesn't make any sense like this is is this interface actually does not make any sense so um they're going to fix it so that's good and based on the fact that it's in Canary and Dev I we'll probably have it in stable uh tomorrow or Friday uh because we don't know when things come out that's the point that's come out after you talk about them on the ship yeah yeah oh did th update's book yeah okay ship it y yeah make sure you change all the graphics while you're at it yeah exactly the one thing that's the one thing I looked at was if these people you know when I talk like that it's getting bad but when they if they updated that nav bar so I literally have to change every single screenshot in this chapter yeah I'm gonna lose my brain and uh yeah there's a change so fantastic because that's what they do awesome okay well let's see so when did we have this discussion sometime in the past few weeks we would have talked about this notion this is before you know we're get later show we'll talk about Intel's financials and all the bad stuff happening there but you know Microsoft shipped or Microsoft and it Partners shipped these co-pilot plus PCS right running qualcom Snapdragon X processor you know very efficient much better battery life very good not perfect but very good compatibility seems to solve a problem you know but um you know we have to be measured here right obviously we knew and know now even more that AMD and Intel are uh going to or have now in one case shipped some of their nextg chips and and part of the design of these chips is to address some of their shortcomings compared to arm right sure but you also get this kind of knee-jerk reaction on the other side where it's like oh my God oh my God Intel's screwed x86 is over you know and it's like guys guys guys easy easy there settle down um but the thing is it's not just uh maybe we should call it x64 but x86 x64 right the the Intel architecture um it's that's not necessarily the primary target although obviously we want that to improve as well right um I don't in the same sense that Windows server is probably never really going to go away um x64 is not really going to go away and honestly in the windows world it's probably going to be dominant for the foreseeable future I don't really see that changing but we got we had people writing stories like Intel's doomed they don't address this right now that you know if they don't do they got to have to pull a Hail Mary here and it's like guys uh Intel's running into a lot of problems right now literally because they've been pulling Hail Mary so the past three four years in a row they got to stop throwing the long ball right yeah for Intel they've been actually moving pretty aggressively like you know one might say too aggressively we'll get to that but um but we know you know in the AMD mobile chips right now the AMD desktop chips are going to be out in the middle of the month so about a week from now uh Intel's on track to ship lunar Lake which is the uh mobile version of their nextg cor alter chips in early September IFA it's this is a great time to be alive if you love Hardware but the other Target and honestly kind of the explicit Target is Apple and the Mac right and the Apple silicon chips um apple or Microsoft made it very obvious that the MacBook Air was a Target if not the target at the co-pilot plus launch right I mean they mentioned MacBook Air again again and again you know and um that's not a surprise I mean back in I think it was February or March whenever uh I purchased a MacBook Air M3 ahead of getting any of these Snapdragon PCS um not because I need to reacquaint myself with the Mac or the software whatever but just because I wanted to experience over a long period of time like well what are the real advantages to this thing and um there are there are very real advantages to it um Snapdragon X has uh made major inroads into battery life and what I'll call efficiency you know instant on stuff y um it's still better on the Mac and I I don't know this for a fact but I suspect I could put my MacBook Air over here on the bed go away for a month come back lift the lid and it would just come on you know it's it's that good yeah uh if that sounds like an exaggeration I hear you but almost not but you're delighted with the snap trag and the fact that you can open it each day and it just comes on yeah so the thing there is a time period at which that stops happening right I don't know what it is um it's probably you had this happen to you now it's happened to me twice right and in both cases it was it was a machine I had reviewed and put aside and you know of course I have to move on to other things and I opened the first time it happened I was like huh like what's happening so it sat for a week or two it was at least a week yeah it was at least a week so I open and not the battery's dead it said no nope the battery's fine um but yeah it look we all know or we have some idea that there are power management States and windows and that there are different configurations where it goes into kind of a light sleep if you will when you first close the lid because you may just come back and want to yeah Beck but at some point sitting there do you think this conserve battery it just actually goes cold after a few days uh yes because one of the other this is minor but it's real um with a Mac uh when you close at least the MacBook Air when you close the lid like the battery doesn't actually go down over time which feels impossible I mean it must right like it must go down by micro amounts but if you put it if you had 100% battery closed the lid went to bed woke up the next morning and lifted the LD it is 100% battery like this it's it's magical I mean maybe it's lying I don't know but it's it's amazing um a Snapdragon will lose 1 to 3% every night um so it's possible that you know maybe after a week it's like oh you know you've had a period of inactivity here we can stop whatever it's version hibernation is it will it will do that I don't know so that's something I kind of want to look into but it's it's hard to test because you need to you need to experience it over a long period of time and you have to you can't just do it once I can't just say hey I did it I know what it is now you know so I'm looking at it but it's it's gonna be a while yeah um still but still better than x86 right sure um at this point anything's better than x86 I I have I happen to be with you on that um but you know uh we have uh at least one staff member who has an I9 I think Bonito has a 99 uh the 13th generation that's you know frying and uh he's got the bug yeah I don't know well he says everything's okay so far but wouldn't you be nervous yep I would be we're going to get we're g to let's get to let's hold off and do the AMD Intel story in just a bit so I could take a break when you're done with the Snapdragon story I just well I just wanted to finish up the uh just the Mac bit of it because I the the especially I think in the windows World um people either ignore it or don't know about it and I I I am exposed to people who are like openly hostile to Apple you know um I I say this a lot I I really do prefer Windows to Mac OS I think this is the for all of the problems we we just describe some of them windows 11 I very much still prefer um windows to the Mac but the Mac has a true full screen mode that Windows lacks it has incred tou gestures that work all the time and are awesome M um it I I've had weird issues with like the lapt surface laptop mous cursor which I explained that survived a reset still a problem but the thing I I think the thing that puts Apple over the top for consumers for individuals right is not necessarily it's not like the Mac or Mac apps or Mac you know um Os or whatever it's uh well the hardware design which it's thinner lighter Etc it's it's that that machine is also unbearably magic magically like light and thin for its size it's kind of crazy um it's the ecosystem right it's the broader ecosystem like um I think that most people using a Mac today are probably there because they started using an iPhone and they had such a really good experience they started Halo affecting their way through the uh ecosystem you know watch the sort of question is like you may like Windows over Mac but do you like iPhone over Android yeah so on that one I'm actually mixed I I like both of them quite a bit I I've been actually been using an iPhone this year a lot and I just did this this morning I picked up the pixel I'm going to update you know when the new pixels come out and this thing is like thinner and lighter and there are parts of the system that I really really appreciate that they don't have on the Apple side there's things on the Apple side I really appreciate like um uh what do you call AirPlay which lets me use Sonos without without having to deal with Sonos which is a huge Advantage because Sonos is terrible son has really broke their app but I've been using that's I'm in such pain that is I it's they're yeah they're in it's inexcusable like it's it's awful terrible company there's a company that should go down with Intel to be honest but okay but the thing is like and this is the thing that will pain people because Microsoft can never get there with this stuff there's the it's the cross device integration stuff that is so amazing and so impossible to do sinlessly on Windows I it's just there's we're never going to get there and so you as an individual have to decide for yourself if it matters you know the the soal ecosystem play you mean yeah I can copy to the clipboard on an iPhone and paste on the MC continuity so great I used this example before but at a Qualcomm event in New York back in I think April I wanted to get a photo I'd taken on the phone into the mac and I was like could I and I went into the camera app copied it the clipboard pasted it into my notes on the Mac and I was like okay this thing is magical now obviously Microsoft's working on stuff like this right there're we talked about file system integration over Wireless last week and file explorer etc etc with Android but you know if you have an iPad which a lot of these guys do right they're they're kind of buying in this thing becomes a second display for your Mac instantaneously if you want it to be a wireless display with multi-touch and apple pencil compatibility yep you can do that too send and receive text messages back and forth between all your devices don't have to have your phone with you at the time Kevin Kevin hold on you don't need to show the Apple page when we talk about Apple it's not an Windows weekly I think proba let's not offend anyone here okay sorry this is my this 20 it's 2024 I have been writing about Microsoft and windows for 30 years this year and if there's anything that I do that's maybe a little different than most of the people who do what I do it's that I've spent a lot of those 30 years looking at all of the Alternatives over time again and again and again and I think you have to be and that means you know I've had I've probably had 15 Macs since 2001 um I probably own more Apple Hardware than most Apple Fans I've had almost every iPad almost every uh iPhone almost every iPod almost every not every Mac but most many Macs and I gotta tell you I do you look you may not want it you may not like them I get that I respect it but you need to understand there's there's a bridge we're never going to cross on this side of the fence because we just don't have that ability so we what we have are I don't want to call them half ass it's unfair but we're always going to have these things that aren't going to work as well or reliable that will do some of the things I just described right you can if you have a high-end Samsung phone and you can get it to work with phone link you could have instant on hotspot capabilities and windows but you know what if you have a Mac you just get it it's just there all the time that kind of thing so the new you know on Sequoia the new uh phone link with the iPhone is basically doing what Microsoft's doing with phone link but it works and it's really nice that's so so yeah so been I've been paying attention to this beta stuff they're doing now I have to say the ability to uh have a remote screen of your phone on your PC is actually not very interesting to me um and there are I don't it's only if your phone is distant like most people I would guess have their phone nearby all the time yeah so if you get a notification or whatever you've got it on your phone but if Jason Snell for some reason he keeps his phone in the house while he's doing the shows so he likes it because he's got his phone on the screen of his computer can I say something though because I yeah I really think despite all that it's merely a matter of personal preference I think the difference between Windows Mac and Linux is just pure there are pros and cons but it's purely person no my the inspiration for this conversation was that um you guys know I the Snapdragon stuff is awesome like it's they did it like I and this I say this after the last decade of like seriously are they ever going to get there and it is amazing but there are people now we're kind of doing this victory dance and it's like guys it's not over we we have this there's way more to do and um you know we'll see what happens going forward I the Microsoft experience works like this we have phone link and sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't if you have a high-end Samsung phone or a handful of other phones you get additional features uh that everyone else doesn't get so this's this kind of bated experience that doesn't make any sense the remote phone display thing we were just talking about if you have that high-end Samsung Ultra whatever you get that that's cool and you even get a feature I don't think is on the Apple side which is actually very cool if you like this kind of thing which is you can run individual apps and their own Windows off the phone on your on your computer you can pin them you can have them be there like apps like alongside your other computers it's not just a view of the phone um I don't think Apple's doing that they maybe they do that in iOS 19 or whatever I don't care but um and it's so you could check that one off and say look see we're doing something Apple doesn't do and it's like yeah for now and only on certain phones you know and and that's if you accept those limitations or you just don't care or you don't like apple anyway so you're not using an iPhone so who cares yeah you're fine right so in the in the United States that's about that's less than 50% of people now I guess but in the world it's probably 75 80 I don't know the perent I think it's because of price more than anything else right well it's price and this choice right you get the choice of Hardware choice of Android are the same price that's true but I think that's why Android's dominant worldwide is not the top tier phones no yeah you're right the $50 same the same reason that Windows is dominant in the PC space yep yeah yeah yeah it's price um I wonder you know I mean but you have that choice I mean you you can have a premium Android experience yeah uh if you like uh Samsung for some reason or maybe I guess maybe pixel you might consider to be in there pixel's more The Bare Bones you know honestly Android phones aren't as diverse as you might think I mean they're all right it's all basically the same there's some Hardware differ when you pay a thousand bucks or more you get a better camera and a better screen the bigger thing that happens with Android phones is that the carriers hijack them right yeah well you don't want to get it from Verizon orri rers right between Android and Windows is so obvious it's just like you know back in the day the and not back in the day today one of the big complaints about PCS is the junk the PC makers put on there yep you know windows will have uh a set of features that are built into the operating system and HP Lenova Dell whatever will put features in themselves that duplicate stuff that's already in Windows but bypasses it just like Samsung does or Verizon does or whatever with Android and it's like guys seriously but they're not you know they're they have different competitive um aims right than the the platform maker or the customer I guess or whatever so yeah anyway yeah we have the choice we definitely have the choice choice is great and I guess in from Apple's point of view at least when they're talking to the Department of Justice the choice is Apple or something else there's no choice within the Apple ecosystem um yeah I well I yeah that that's that's a tough one I mean if you um the Apple stuff is actually similar in some ways to the Microsoft antitrust stuff as well in the sense that they are artificially uh restricting what competitors can do on their platform and uh even something as simple as uh you know there's a 15% fee for a music service that we don't charge our own music service like it's like guys like what you know like come on you know those types of things or messaging apps they can't do everything their messaging app can do because art Apple artificially restricts that or the Safari you know Court the of every browser Etc ETA that stuff to me is hard to defend um but you know that's the D the doj didn't get everything right I mean they sort of suggested like apple should make apple watch compatible with Android and it's like guys this that has nothing to do with their iPhone Monopoly like that is that's ridiculous so yeah there's it's you know it's not it's not 100% straightforward but it's so funny because uh I am now saying things that are pro windows but people are still saying oh Leo's so proactive Leo you have this you can't you you don't win there's no there's no win for you because on this show you'll be like oh you know you should see him on the Mac Show he just on micros I'm just saying it's a it's personal preference it's the only difference honestly that and price price pleas I'm waiting for someone to be in the thing now and say well if you like apple so much why don't you start the Apple super Sage you know like it's like it's like guys that's not the point I'm just saying you have to recognize here's the good news comption is doing there's cross-pollination now between all platforms so just as you said no matter what feature you want on the other platform be patient because it'll you know it'll if it's really a good idea it'll propagate everywhere exactly tribal tribalism is not that smart like we're kind of past that there's it's silly to be tribal that really is my real Point trial past it but yeah no my real point is it's guys it's just your personal preference it's not one's better than the other it's personal preference that's i' like you to briefly imagine I know this is horrifying so bear with me like how horrible it would be to be married to me and what I mean by that is I get up in the morning and I read the comments I think about that all the time I know you should and I had written the article that was the thing we were just talking about what what that was based on and the reason I wrote it is because there is serious tribalism especially in my little community and I wanted to get you know on top of this I I didn't want people to get ahead of themselves yes the Snapdragon X is a huge step forward it is we're not done you know it's it's not over and uh I I I had some people in mind when I wrote this like I know because these people they are they're very tribal and uh this morning when I cracked open my laptop by the way screen came right on love Snap Dragon X um the those some of those people were in there saying like like I laughed out loud when you said that the Apple ecosystem was better than the Microsoft ecosystem we have much better apps on Windows and and it's like yeah I I was talking about the broader ecosystem meaning not just the computer and there is nothing on the Microsoft side we just have these half-ass Integrations we try to do in phone link and wherever else like we just have the Cobble together thing that we've always had in Windows and that's that's that was kind of my point so anyway um yes so you can stop thinking about that little relationship but uh sorry all right let's take a break because we do want to hammer on Intel I mean let's I me sorry I'm sorry this I what I meant was I this morning as I'm reading this my wife is sitting next to me trying to read the news and I'm over on my laptop yeah people are not paying attention anyway sorry I try to avoid the news early in the morning I don't want to be angry until noon it is I have more energy in the morning I want to get it out of the way ah I get it like in the afternoon I would just be like eh I you know it's funny uh I wake up cheerful my wife my wife is the other way so it would be like being married to you I guess uh yeah I I wake up like Cinderella you or uh sleep you know going oh it's talking to the birds yeah I don't you know it's like how did you sleep it's like I made some mistakes I didn't do good you know I um I'm going to work on it tonight go well at all I don't have High Hopes I love it all right let's let's take a little time out for our sponsor and get back to more with grumpy Paul and uh and Rich you're kind of a I feel like you might wake up happy I wake up happy absolutely yeah that's what I thought so it's to infuriating no I I wake up ready to write like head going 100 miles an hour like yeah I'm excited for the day I got ideas I want I got things to do I by the way I I do have that to some degree he wakes up cynical I think is what it [Music] is uh loquacious in our YouTube chat says I wake up like sleepy beauty I need a kiss wow we'll see a picture our show today brought to you by one password I am I'm really excited about this we mentioned we've been talking about Collide for a long time and we mentioned a few months ago that one password had just acquired Collide and now the fruit of this Union has emerged do your I got a question do your end users are they good people they always work on company-owned devices using it approved apps no of course not what are you crazy so how do you keep your company's data safe when it's sitting on all those unmanaged apps all those BYOD devices one password hasn't answer to to this question extended access management is the First Security solution that brings all those unmanaged devices and apps and identities under your control it Cho ensures that every user credential is strong and protected every device is known and healthy and every app is visible and it solves these problems in in a way the traditional IM am and MDM just cannot touch that's why it's e imagine your company security like the quadrangle at your at your college campus you know the the IV covered Halls the beautiful brick paths between the buildings those are the company-owned devices the it approved apps the managed employee identities it's all nice and groomed and safe except as you know with every College quad there are the paths people actually use the shortcuts through the grass they're actually the straightest line from uh Hall a to classroom B and unfortunately that's where the your problems your troubles begin right those are the unmanaged devices the shadow it apps the non-employee identities like contractors and most security tools really only work on those happy happy brick paths but but where do your troubles begin where do those security problems happen on the shortcuts on the dirt paths that's why you need one password extended access management it's security for the way we work work today available now to companies with OCTA but good news very good news coming later this year to Google workspace and Microsoft entra you might might want to check this out now go to onep password.com weekly the number one PW rd.com Windows weekly it's not I am it's eam extended access management and it's a really great product from one password.com SL Windows weekly we thank them so much for their support of Windows weekly uh let's get let's get to the the chips we we talked about Snapdragon but it is you know it's a three-headed race right now you got Snapdragon you've got Intel and you got and you got AMD right am I right yeah I mean really what we have is Intel and then I guess there are these other companies sometimes and uh it's well it's weird to me that AMD has not gotten more traction although I think I touched on this last week of the week before you know Intel spends a lot of money to you know keep their position in the market right so uh I can I'm on the kind of other end of the funnel I get these opportunities to review laptops and it's more than nine out of 10 are running Intel chips you know that's that's been like that for a long time um but my experience with AMD has always been very positive so I have high hopes and we've seen the first uh reviews of the mobile version of this new generation of processor from AMD and looks like that's going great um Intel has started talking about lunar Lake a little bit more and we're going to learn a lot more in September um so everything's going great except it's not um so this has been a big week or 10 days of earnings we're going to talk a little bit more about earrings later but we'll do intels now because unfortunately Intel has been suffering I would say for a couple years now with um you know a PC market that's been down and a very slow and expensive transition to this future that their CEO envisions where um they kind of seize on and leverage their historic strength and Manufacturing take advantage of some subsidies that we're getting from the US government because it's a national security concern yes and uh manufactur chips at home here in the United States right so and elsewhere but not that they've ever stopped manufacturing chips in the US because that volume and for others right um the idea here yes specifically the the high the you know extreme ultraviolet stuff yeah it's complicated and expensive and it's going slow so I unfortunately you know from my perspective because I have to write this up every quarter I feel like we're in an endless loop of underperforming it's gonna get better we're we're so close we're hitting this Milestone soon we're doing the and it's like have we actually done anything here is is Intel still using 14 nmet chips or is that just my imagination I mean it it feels make other ones too yeah yeah so um oddly enough I mean this last quarter the part of Intel that makes PC chips experienced a a 9% gain on Revenue 7.4 billion do um uh the rest of the company not not as good but it's just you know it this is not going well so they announced as part of their earnings that they're going to lay off approximately 15% of the workforce which is approximately 15,000 people they're going to restructure again they're going to reduce the number of products that they produce they're going to stop all non-essential work they're going to reduce Capital expenditures um which is you know the part is the term we use to describe I call it building out AI infrastructure at Microsoft but this is the building for the future bit you know yeah a capex um and their goal is to reduce costs by $10 billion well which is you mean issue here is when you're building Fabs Fabs take 10 years to build right and you're supposed to report quarterly on this like that's just tough business I yeah the problem is you got this Confluence of to my mind three things right it's this they they are struggling to make the newer chips and are having problems around all of that the Snapdragon came out with a big old Splash like everybody's real happy about that yeah and then problems with the 13th gen yeah I that one's interesting to me because there's a lot of evidence to suggest that the problems they're having with these chips aren't necessarily any worse than problems they've had with other chips yeah but I do think I think the public has gotten onto a Pyon mentality that you know look at Boeing like a wheel comes off a 777 thanks Boeing like that they're not the ones doing the maintenance on that plane like well yeah yeah so obviously when a company gets big enough they are um you know there's an inertia that takes over they're they're just a superpower they're doing great you also become the butt of jokes you know it's kind of like the you know the the Little Indie band you loved is now like on MTV all the time and they're selling out T you're like oh I used to love those guys they they sold out you know they suck no um so I that's maybe that's just human nature it's kind of hard to say I think you're Wonder certainly it's American cultural nature there you go to build up the little guy until he becomes the big guy then tear him down yeah you're probably right yeah no you're probably right but it's just yeah I am I empathize with Boeing although there's a bunch of things they really have done wrong yeah you know the mcast thing is not funny Starliner is not funny but at the plug door not funny but the you know the other stuff come on and Intel yeah you're right this is but bad news done itself this is totally and and I think it's just like we're in a time of of echo Chambers and you get the wrong Echo going and you get a lot of noise that's a lot of noise yep so yes and and tied to this um in very you know American but capitalism uh this need to grow and grow and grow you know that need is how we get things like Snickers cereal you know breakfast cereal it's like what wait what are we doing run out a good idea work our way down the bad ideas yeah so here's the thing so here's some here's some some some good and bad I guess some some data in the in the wake of this uh Wall Street which is uh akin to Black Magic you know again it's it's a dance you know and Intel spiraling spir spiraling the drain from a sort of PR perspective this stuff kind of piles on so the day after they announced their earnings their stock price went down almost 30% in 24 hours um its biggest loss in the market since 1982 yeah and its second biggest loss of all time since it was a publicly traded company which happened uh started happening in 1980 um its market cap went down by $30 billion it is under $100 billion for the first time since 2009 yeah and it is worth a lot less than any of its competitors most of which are actually smaller companies if you will Nvidia is worth 2.9 2.69 trillion or it was the day I wrote this article TMC um 720 billion yep over seven times Intel uh AMD uh tiny company by the way comparatively 233 billion in Qualcomm 183 billion all of these companies worth more than Intel yeah um so there was a an annal an analyst at what I would call like an industrial um investment firm you know someone who represents uh lots of really rich clients and wrote a letter trying to to explain what's happening with Intel and I thought this was very measured um he said look if this wasn't Intel we were going to we would be having a conversation now where this is a going concern MH but he says we got to look at this more pragmatically this is a company that is getting subsidies from the US government contributions Partners oh because of the chip sack yeah Y and if you look at Millions what they expect what they're what they're doing they will actually add $40 billion of cash to their balance sheet through the end of next year so I yes layoffs are bad you know bad news things are going slow yep but they're doing big work there's a national security issue at at stake here I I I I coined the phrase you know maybe Intel is too strategic to fail right but honestly they're kind of too big to fail and they're generating too much money to fail and so yes at this moment in time this looks horrible yeah well the layoffs mean they're going to generate more money for a while yeah yeah yeah as long as they're not critical people right well I mean one of the little one of the things no one talks about that they expect almost all of those layoffs to come in the form of uh people who volunteer to retire early or maybe it's time you know whatever so we'll see this happens with big companies you get a lot of extra people I don't know how to say this in a kind way well everyone did it the Microsoft uh Apple even uh although I don't think they Apple had to too and everybody never do Google all those all the big tech companies overhire did not only over but then also found that when we have routine layoffs conversations about unions and all of that sort stuff down it's become a I feel like it's become an employee management strategy which I find offensive I do too I do too it does seem to be going on there's I don't know what other explanation there is at this point corporations can be very evil sometimes from a new cycle perspective it's it's hard not to look at Intel and see something cratering here but hey how much of this do you think especially this uh 13 and 14th generation chip problem is YouTube generated yeah I don't this is the thing right so in other words a lot of this comes from YouTubers this is not I this is not a fact I I don't mean to say I've done some investigation and have found but my belief which God you should take that to mean nothing is that I don't know that this is any more serious than any other chip problems they've had over the past last two decades I really don't you'd have to go back could Congressional hearing and what are the failure rates of 11th gen and 12 compared to there there are sites and actually YouTube channels too that are starting to point out that like if you look at failure rates for chips AMD chips are actually way worse than these oh interesting than these exact chips so interesting it's hard to say but but and by the way here's another so Intel over the course of just less than a week says all right look well first of all they acknowledge the problem publicly which they don't do a lot yeah that that it has happened but it not a lot and they said look we're you know we're going to do the right thing for our customers so if you bought a a core processor gen 13 or 14 uh with a PC we're going to just we're just extending the warranty by two years don't worry about it and if you bought it yourself off the shelf which is not a huge Market you know individuals yep no but people do it y uh just contact support and the story at the time was if you contact support obviously we're going to do the right thing for you we're not going to leave customers stranded no they'll just ship you another chip but YouTube guys blogs they're like oh I heard from a reader who uh called and they told him to go screw themselves they're not going to do anything so a couple days later Intel's like all right look we're GNA extend the warranty for everybody you bought it it doesn't matter how you got it if you have one two years so they're going to provide more details on that soon and this is just like everything else we just talked about you could look at this very negatively look it's a a part of a cycle of negativity and bad news around Intel yep it absolutely is but here is Intel doing the right thing for customers and I we should at least acknowledge that too yeah sure right I mean it's part of the story so whether this is overblown or not uh in some ways doesn't matter do girl singer keep his job like that that's not going to be a fun board meeting and and I'm again I'm not going to blame him because I think we're also in a market time where there is this overreact but uh and you know there's a bunch of forces there not just the echo chamber that is YouTube but there are uh certain State actors that like to emphasize any failure of any entity in in the United States that's right they I I don't know I don't remember like when did he become CEO like how long ago is this five years ago not even something like that um he obviously you're looking at a broken company this is a company that made the wrong bets for too long he said everything right to fix it in my I think so the the problem for him is that from a public perspective from an investor perspective you've got the same face the same guy saying the same thing every quarter and it's not getting better it's not I I don't think it's his fault he came back to Intel uh in 2021 to become has that longy the Steven elop of Intel I think that's unfair and I think actually think stepen ol did actually did did good job I know I I said that head who was came along I know very few people think that's true but I I think I really do think he did I think that company was going right down the drain no I think if I that board meeting would be scary well conversation should be like look this is a fiveyear plan or whatever it is you have give five years or it's on if we don't get there I and I think we have to be honest with ourselves whether you're on the border or an investor or whatever that it's not him you know no like I'm not saying he's doing like that there isn't some scenario or some other version of some other leadership and some other plan might have done something better but it's possible this was not fixable I think I still like him I know the so I here's the problem a lot of this is perception it starts with YouTubers it then becomes a stock market issue that's when the stock tanks by way when we're allowing influencers to literally influence St price of can we draw the line with that please that's ridiculous anyway what's interesting about him he's the first leader at Intel who's actually a chip engineer designer I mean he designed of Intel right wasn't he previously CTO he so so he started Intel at the age of 18 as a QC engineer he was the lead architect on the 486 in uh the youngest VP in Intel's history at 32 he was mentored by an I'm looking at his Wikipedia Andy Grove he was CTO in 2001 WiFi under him WiFi USB Intel Core Intel Z on 14 different chip Generations I will so because you mentioned Wi-Fi uh you've reminded me that I I you know I'm reading what I can about what's happening with um lunar Lake like this nxgen chipset they're working at and one of the things that Intel is requiring for this is something I have been begging for for years and years and years which is that you cannot buy one of these things without having a USBC port on both sides of the laptop you have to have at least one of both there will be three one of them has to be on the other side my Apple laptop has two on one side and none on the other I know I I have been begging for this every once in a while you'll get a laptop that does do this I have two now that are like that but this is you know Intel you know everyone makes oh they have like all these stupid stickers they have specs like Evo and like what is it even mean it's marketing nonsense and like the thing maybe a lot of people don't understand is that's part of that they're like if you want this sticker thing if you want the chip you you're going to do this so it's Thunderbolt 4 Wi-Fi 7 you know the latest Bluetooth and USBC ports where they belong and the fast USBC ports not some baloney usb2 whatever nonsense that we still see on PCS these days right so they don't do everything wrong no and I if I were on the board in Intel I would say Pat you know you're you're you you're bailing out a leaking ship and this is you know keep going cuz you got the right I think he's got the right strategy the Dual strategy he walked up to the deck of the Titanic with his little teacup and like hey what's going on guys I mean you know he he flew in in the wrong place yeah no I agree and I you know you're gonna give him more than three years you may not give him more than five years but you're gonna give more than three years I think no let's see if he can see if he can turn it around but this the situation is serious but I do think it's interesting to see that stock behaviors criticism is becoming more radical right that there it's not it's not just until it's also Boeing like there's and there's other companies where oh boing wait a minute Boeing deserves it what's going on Boeing deserves some of it yeah just like Intel deserves some of it right I think Boeing is a much worse story I don't disagree right you know I think there's should be people in prison for what happened with mcap on 737 you know a chip friy doesn't necessarily kill several hundred people right yeah right but you know when when when United has failed to do sufficient maintenance on a 777 so the wheel falls off and lands in a in a parking lot way here's here's a here's one a little closer to home so we had that crowd strike outage whole world freaks out takes days to come back there was one company that kind of stuck out there right Del stuck out there uh which was Delta Delta was down for several days after everyone else had come back and the back I said ear on like hold on a second let me get this straight every United's back uh American's back everyone's back but you're not back and you're and then they he came out and he said the CEO of this company said you never hear anything about Apple having an outage yeah because iPads don't run the world's infrastructure Jer like seriously they they apparently about a $500 million loss right like that I if I was Microsoft I would sue them for defamation right now I Crow strike came out publicly and said I I just want to be clear we want to be clear we reached out to Delta several times to help them get over this they never even responded to us they never even and then the other day Microsoft issued a statement that said the same thing we have been reaching out to Delta since the beginning of this to help get them online they have ignored our help so yeah that was Delta was not not Microsoft yeah so and look it's bad enough I mean I crowd strike a lot of people a lot of knee-jerk reactions whatever I get it but the again as with Intel you have to give them a little credit for one thing God they've been transparent God they've responded quickly they took credit for this not the right term but they took responsibility for it immed immediately right they didn't wait for the the Senate to have an investigation and figure out what like they they admitted to it they explained what happened they' provided two at least two that I could think of major updates including one just the other day or even the past 24 hours um explaining exactly went went down they worked with Microsoft they've documented what happened they've talked about fixing the industry because we shouldn't let this kind of thing happen yada yada yada and Delta's over there oh you never heard what Apple going down yeah by the way you do Cy crush is working fine that's true go down um what are you talking about I don't have infrastructure that you're running on what that anyway that's insane that's like saying you know you don't hear about charman going down like yeah they make toilet paper what why would what are you talking about actually they do go down but it's a different tube that's a different that's a different problem anyway um anyway crazy any who Welcome to our industry nice yeah and honestly I think a lot of the money that left Intel in the market went to Nidia and it's it's a little bit chasing Ai and chasing the latest fad I know that there's the wisdom of crowds and all that just got their first little bit of uh backlash you know their their nextg is not working good it's they got problems holding now people are going to start beating on them you know because that's the way we are we're awful I hope we don't pile on honestly because I don't think it's constructive and I think really to some degree that kind of short-term mentality the stock market that companies respond to it's a source of a lot of problems it's a huge problem because you're responding and sometimes to things that are not true or coming from sources you should it's Emeral yeah it's crazy yeah yep our entire planet is built on this shaky Foundation of finances it's crazy yeah and the and the internet has caused it to vibrate even more severely than it used that's Upon a Time have been news stories not YouTubers can I tell you something from the the senior edge of life okay yes you start to realize as you get older it's all a house of Cs it's yeah but it's but it's the only house we got it's the only house we got and I hesitate to consider the the title of the book you're eventually going to write something like everything sucks nothing works it it was all a lie it was all a lie was all a lie yeah keep going down this path I'm going to open the whiskey early right like it's an it's an illusion that it's all oh yeah this is a well-run company and everything's going to be it's all an illusion it's all just people it's people all the way down and you know what we're flawed and we do the best we can and that's yeah but at least we're making AI That's not flawed like we oh wait oh dear oh dear yep you are watching Windows week that's Paul thorat to my left wait a minute yeah and that's which way I to my left am I mirrored I don't anyway over that way is Richard Campbell you do you're doing great Leo you're doing great I don't know be I didn't know the whiskey segment started early exactly yes you're freaking me out man what are you doing Kevin King is running the board today thank you Kevin John Ashley started us off it's good they're all getting trained because we're closing the studio today congratulations I'm getting emails from people saying can I have your microphone no that's going to the house it's going to the house you can't my microphone no I you know it's funny uh I did a Mac world I a keynote at macw World Expo many years ago and I sat on the ball during the keynote that's awesome and then I and then um I threw it into the audience yes at the end and then I realized I feel really bad about this oh crap that's my only one and I literally had to go wait into the audience saying um Can can I have my ball back wow humiliation a little bitek I should have I should have what was I thinking let go get a new ball poor guy hey dude if you were the one who caught my ball at the ma Expo I still want it back h no no I he gave it back I'll give you one I'll give you the one I'm sitting on right now he doesn't want now all right let's talk about uh we talked about uh co-pilot plus PCS but we didn't talk about surface yes do you have anything to say this has been a kind of a busy year for surface uh unless you count making money uh so back in too soon yeah uh back in March Microsoft announced uh two new products for business right surface laptop 6 and Surface Pro 10 based on Intel Core alter chipsets right M um kind of went kind of came and went without a lot of interest from anybody I mean it sold you know only on the business side whatever but we all knew that co-pilot plus PC versions were coming and those arrived in June so we have uh surface laptop 7 and serface pro 11 right for consumers running on Snapdragon multiple configurations um the pro version came with an oldet option for the first time um there was no 5G connectivity however but they said it would come and uh surface laptop is you know two screen sizes Etc like it's been for a couple years now so uh the other day they announced uh I didn't expect it to happen this way but there's going to be a version of surface laptop 7 and Surface Pro 11 for business right through their business channels as well um they're available for pre-order now you can pre-order 5G on the pro but not the laptop that's nice um kind of limited configurations more limited colors too so there are two fun colors that you can sometimes get depending on configuration uh with surface laptop and pro for consumers best configuration was actually only black right yeah so the one I got like black was my only option but the one I really wanted was that kind of I don't know the name of it but it's a blue color it's awesome and uh there's also a saage color not available for business so it's another silver anything you know yeah so you know it's whatever it's business I guess but um very specific configurations um they still have core um sorry Snapdragon uh X plus as an option on both devices on the low-end uh SKS uh Snapdragon X not saying which one it is I'm sure it's the same one everyone ships and the same one they ship before but whatever prices don't seem to be any better or worse or whatever than the Consumer versions except that if you want 5G you got to pay for it it's several hundred dollars extra yeah it's expensive um plus you have to buy one of the higher in you know they could they kind of they kind of you know Speck it out so it's not great but but it's happening and so those things are I think they're arriving in what in September probably yeah September 11th um which is maybe not the best dat of launch product but fine and yeah so you could spend as little as uh $10.99 for the laptop and or and for pro and then you know sky so limit I mean I think the 15inch Stacked out 32 gigs of RAM by of storage 202 bucks so and it's even more on the uh Pro side because you have all the keyboard choices with with a pen the flex version ET ET Etc so um you could spend three grand probably or more I'm sure on a Surface Pro if you wanted to I don't recommend that but yeah only only on the surface laptop in this is in the Canada site can I get in Black I can get a 64 gig version that's right be I bet it's $26.99 in the United States if I'm not mistaken so 36 with the 15inch 3600 bucks Canadian it's listen I'll tell you this you open that lid man it comes on every single time I'll tell you I tell you this I spent more than that on the studio too yeah but I got a but I got a RTX 460 in my my studio too I can tell because it keeps burning my hand well I mean it's probably good for visual studio yeah know it's it's PL it's a lot of horsepower but it all depends on what's used in the GPU right what gets it's the GPO yep it's it's it's warped the case on my pixel that's how hot yeah when you said that the first time I thought it you meant it warped the case on your computer thank God that wasn't the case but no warped it on the phone yeah I can see that it's hot but you can export video very quickly there you go and it's a pixel 6 like it's just encouraging me to get a new one yeah it's time you got about one week to go on that yeah before the dines come along and been that much on a phone y I don't know how fast the lid comes on or whatever but they're probably pretty good phones you know arm chips or something I don't know I I didn't do is see if I could get the 5G feature in Canada yet I wonder if that's there oh yeah yeah yeah you should go go go to surface for business and find out yeah I don't know it's a great question I think it uh you know what I'm sorry I I think I do know I think it is I think it's US and Canada first and the rest of the markets later I think I if my memory serves and don't that makes sense because our you know our carriers are pretty heavily say that uh that sounds familiar let me see September I'm not sure but any um I I I considered putting this as the top story as a joke today um we have a lot of controversies in the Microsoft space but one of the bigger ones um is the new outlook which I did an unofficial kind of PLL and 0% of people like this app um I have not found anyone who likes it I will say I don't use an email app because you know I'm normal but I tried it and it to me it seems fine but uh I but I hate all email apps so who cares but it you know it's it is the Outlook thing integrated email uh calendar contacts tasks etc etc all in one interface etc etc you know based on web technologies that seems to really rub people the wrong way um but that's what all the modern apps are doing because that's in in office in particular that's the extensibility model I mean it's it's going to be web based guys like that's that's that's where everything is so um you don't have to get it right now it doesn't you don't have to replace the thing you're using if you're a consumer you might be using mail and calendar in Windows 10 or 11 God help you if that's true but you might be um and if you're in a business or a business user you're probably using the I hate to say it this way the now Legacy office classic or whatever we're calling it um which is much more powerful and full featured and bigger and heavier and complicated and all that stuff but you know everyone a lot of people seem to like that up and I think that's part of the problem so um this is like when a really popular band gets a new lead singer and he doesn't look or sound anything like the other guy and people are freaking out like what is happening here so anyway it's it's GA which means it's not in preview you're not going to see a little pre- tag on the icon anymore but um they will not replace classic Outlook or whatever they're calling that for a couple of years at least I think it was 2029 if I'm not mistaken at the earliest yeah because I cannot stand this new outlook my God yeah I don't like I said I I've not run into anyone who's been like oh no it's okay the reaction is literally I hate it with everything in my being yeah and they always have like a list of what they need you know what is it you want to do you want to do something like what do you want to be offline like a princess I mean what what's your problem man you know like I don't know it's so weird but you know the new outlook is great unless you want to do email unless you like email yeah unless you need email exactly it's not a thing oh jeez crazy ohy um moving along I guess here we go yep so big week um biggest Anti-Trust ruling in 20 years plus since Microsoft's uh since 99 I think truly yeah Google was found guilty of abusing well a of having well not Google has a search Monopoly that is now a a legal finding a fact yeah um that's also just common sense you just have to look at their usage share numbers you get it yeah um Google was also found guilty of illegally abusing that Monopoly and what that means is they are maintaining and or growing it through means that have nothing to do with making the product better they're using their power to hurt competitors and harm partners and in effect harm consumers as well through higher prices because a monopoly one of the many things they can do is raise prices indiscriminately there's no competition which uh the judge made a really long and good point of making by comparing them to Microsoft which was kind of tough I remember James barkdale back in the old Netscape sups pointing how many people here are using interx put their hand source of so much humor in um entertainment he's like it's like I'm not a big City lawyer but you know that kind of thing like he's he has that kind of you know Midwest rube kind of thing and he's that guy the problem is it's not search that makes the money it's the ad business and they don't have a monopoly on the ad business yeah but they but they're intrinsically tied so there's there's if you look at I reporting alphabet or Google's earnings and so if you look at that part of the business U ads overall I think last quarter were 74% of their revenues of their revenue but y but if you look at the overall ad Market they're a big player but they're not the only no right but but because see but they do have a monopoly in search so this is the product tying thing in other words they're um you know they've tied these two things together and they've created kind of a virtuous cycle for themselves from a financial sense because um they've gotten really good at this right they're really good at it and they also partner with platform makers um companies like Apple and Samsung and others that make Android phones um and they partner with browser makers most notably Milla like we know about this and um to ensure that Google search is the default because um most people just don't even think about switching right no because there's only one yeah I mean just and and but this feeds on itself and so this notion that um uh they're kind of paying to play if you will um but they get the users from that that helps them improve the search which they do and search gets better more people want to use it you know that's The Virtuous cycle um the problem is that's illegal yeah when you have a monopoly and it was it this is in the documents I mean uh I think it was 2022 or 2022 I think it was last one over2 billion it's been going up every year the the rumor there was a story that the LA last year was 23 billion uh to Apple for Apple this is 23 billion and raw profit they don't have to do a thing you know there's no research and development there's no engineering there's no nothing they just take the product as it is it's great works well you know whatever everyone thinks those guys hate each other surprise yeah um I have 23 billion reasons not to hate you yep and you know um Apple would Apple's Apple they still would like to replace if they could but they look at like what would it take for us to create or M than that yep and that's that's to me the most interesting thing that comes out of this is the Microsoft connection because the Microsoft connects to this in two major ways um one is the legal precedent because this case is exactly like the doj case against Microsoft in 1998 or n or whatever year that was and because Microsoft is the only other major company that has a search engine that might compete with uh Google except that they have 6% of the market compared to 90 whatever it is I would argue that it's not a competitor in the search engine space it's a threat to Google it's replacing the search engine with a large language model well okay but that's not that was not what was in I I hear you and and I even agreee with that but the but this was about search right in other words Microsoft has the opposite effect that Google Gets In Search where they don't have enough users they can't improve it as much yeah it doesn't make sense them to spend the money they would have to spend and it's off the Microsoft Bing mentioned 500 something times in this 286 page ruling now some of them were Microsoft Bing so there's overlap there but several hundred times and it yeah I didn't count so I know I'm lazy but it's this is astonishing I'll just tell you from a legal precedent perspective 100% I yes this this the parallels here are obvious they don't even need to be discussed the fact that Microsoft went from the hunter to the hunted in such a dramatic fashion over the past 20 whatever years is really astonishing at least in this market right they are the biggest or one of the biggest companies in Earth by market cap right powerful Market power they should have owned search back in the day but the the most dramatic story in this entire ruling is the multiple times that that they went Microsoft to Apple and said hey it's in our mutual best interest to defeat Google here let's do this and there was no version of the numbers that made any sense they couldn't they they they Apple calculated that they could have given them Bing for free and then paid them 125% of whatever Revenue they would have made and it still didn't make sense and it just it was never gonna happen and it again I want to be super Fair here it's not Microsoft's fault exactly it's maybe a little bit like the Intel stuff we were talking about earlier Microsoft couldn't invest in bing over the years like Google did in search because they just weren't generating the the usage and all that kind of stuff so you know at the end of the day well and to be clear like they genuinely had a better search algorithm like Google did Google produced better results there were other search ises when they were first coming on there were I you know I I don't remember everything but you know being here and covering this for the for the duration I mean there were there were moments in time where Microsoft did something that was like okay like you know that's interesting you know they would come up with these kind of uh I guess I'll call them vertical search um things that were very interesting whether it was Windows Live search at the time or Bing eventually whatever um where they did a better job in some Capa to some capacity for certain things you know um Microsoft has the power defaults working for them in windows with Edge right it's this default there it's now being used by co-pilot of course and and to your point Richard I think there's a a coming battle over whatever we call this thing but I I I look at it as a combination of AI and search and whether it's AI making search better or search making AI better or both right I mean there's other angles you could have gone at this on like look I don't search on Google for products anymore I go to Amazon yeah right like they that there is a fragmentation of the search Market but only if you look at it in the ways that people actually use it so that being said like I don't have a problem with declaring those guys a mon Monopoly like they kind of earned it and they have been distinctly anti-competitive they have done everything they can to suppress competition in their primary space the the way that people um kind of react to these stories like a dominant big tech companies is very interesting to me right um some companies get a a pass by a very large percentage of the audience like apple this is happens to Apple at a time it's like I what are you talking about like dude they they love the environment they are you know good people they you know they you know Google it's like oh yeah screw them like they're horrible you know but the thing is like they're they are they're all companies guys like I mean come on and they all follow a very familiar pattern of abuse once they're dominant and that dominant that abuse is what makes their dominance persist and what makes their dominance grow right and there's a real fear now with AI that this will keep happening and it will I mean we're not going to prevent it there's no doubt about it but the but the thing I try to I finally I I call it I think of this as a Paradox this is probably not not the right word but people have trouble with things that they believe are mutually exclusive right right like I could say something negative about Google and I could say something positive about Google they can both be true right like Google objectively has the best search engine on the internet I think most people would agree with that probably pretty strongly but whatever Google also has behaved in extremely anti-competitive uh ways to undermine their Partners their competitors and they've harmed consumers in doing it those things can both be true yes um they both are true by the way but you know and that's true of Apple was true of Microsoft back in the day you know we integrated Internet Explorer into windows and it benefited cons it benefits consumers here's the list of ways in which it benefits them they're like yeah okay I mean we can kind of go back and forth and whatever but you also integrated into windows in such a way that it disadvantages competitors because they can't be integrated with Windows to the degree that you are right and the default experience is you and you're not offering a way to switch and you're using your Market power with Windows to gain entry into this market and then your defense is well it's so heavily integrated now we can't remove it which you know didn't make the story better this is where Google and Microsoft everge and where apple and Microsoft Connect because Microsoft during that trial was the judge said hey you guys should sell a version of Windows that doesn't have Internet Explorer it and Bill Gates was like yeah let's do it rip it out and then they shipped this version of Windows it didn't work and he's like what are you doing and he's like I I didn't ask you to ship a broken product he's like you told us to take it out that's what happens because you artificially engineered it in such a way right and that's what Google's doing in the EU right now right it's the same thing it's like well you told this we're just meeting the let we did what you said it's called malicious compliance yeah this is how children behave like that's ridiculous so Google didn't do that Google didn't release a version of the search engine that brought you to the wrong page or give you the answers to the wrong question or whatever but you know the tactics are all basically the same uh the reason they are there the reasons they there basically the same right so yeah you know fun for me it's like deja vu you know yeah it's uh we're back again we're doing it well in the same time it's like how did you let yourself get here well is this I don't how do you not fall into this trap as a i you can't there's no version of no we don't just keep reaching for more money yeah every tech company sucks when they lead yep they as long as they're chasing their fine but the moment they lead problems this was this is uh Richard knows this better than anybody but one of the big myths in the Microsoft space is that once Microsoft obtained a monopoly I guess we'll call it a dominance in the web browser ver Market they stopped working on the product yeah and they let it sit there and that's when Mozilla first came in with Firefox or you know eventually Phoenix Firefox whatever and then eventually Chrome of course and by the time they kind of got their mojo back and started working on IE again it was too late and then they switched to Edge and it was too late and then they changed that to something new and it's still too late basically although they don't the question you the real reason Rich you know what what were they doing they were working on net no they weren't they they moved on to WPF didn't they they work on WPF remember WPF wasn't supposed to be in net that happened later oh okay and and let's get crazier and really talk about what we're talking what what it what it became WPF yep what they were actually doing was re re-engineering HTML right entirely because the window shell was going to be based on something like HT and they and they and I think Bill had in his mind that he wanted to come up with a better web but this was the be first will'll make it work on Windows then we'll make it work everywhere it would be just like the web but there'd be like a start button in the corner there you go and it had a little Microsoft logo on it yeah and it and a dollar goes to bill every time you click on yeah exactly that is there a cash register in here sound they literally kept that team together and and the kicker was that bill was Chief Architect then he just stepped down as CEO as all that went on so yeah arguably had entirely too much time to work on that this was the presentation part of what would have been a big bigger strategy around you know database file systems and you know intera Comm and Inter I guess computer interet whatever Communications ETA Etc so well and and the code name was Avalon for a re reason right it was the paradise right it still is baby I was just playing around in it today I love WPF it's still Paradise it's not perfect but yeah um what else is happening in our world oh and this this is only sort of related but this is going to start impacting people so Google's been threaten threatening to roll out man manifest uh V3 for several years um which isn't actually the problem the problem is when they obsolete manifest V2 which is the Manifest that um extension makers use to block ads and trackers in Chrome and also chromium based browsers right well in other browsers too that chromium uh sorry Safari and uh Mozilla as well so this past month they quietly slipped into some release notes somewh they're actually they have a schedule for this now they're doing it and uh one day week go something like that uh if you went to the Chrome web store and you look for what are the best security products they have a little section up there for Chrome number one you block origin Google loves it but then you click on it and there's a warning at the top of the page that says uh this doesn't conform to our security princip anymore we're getting rid of this this is going to stop working soon and the problem is that this thing of course uses manifest V2 and they're switching to V3 so what uh the ublock folks did was they created a a different version called I think it's called ublock light that will work with V3 they claim it's dramatically less effective I've talked to a few people I guess maybe that's not too many but who said this works exactly the same it's fine and over the past few years uh a lot of these companies like the guys from ghoster have come out a lot to talk about this um uh I think the eff which I believe makes a privacy Badger has talked about this it's actually possible to this is a lot like the kernel access stuff in Windows that cross card strike you know like we it's possible in V3 to actually do pretty effective blocking it's okay um but it's this is happening so for the short term um unless you're Microsoft if you're using Edge you're screwed but if you're on any other chromium based browser they going to keep the the V2 stuff going as long as they can you know they're already forking chromium as it is but um they'll keep that stuff working um uh it will continue working in Firefox they're on their own thing um I don't know anything about Safari but I assume they're doing something similar so if you like and use you block origin and you're on a different browser you're going to be okay at least for some amount of time but if you're using it on Chrome I mean that's sending some mixed messages is it it's like I would have used the worst possible browser with the best possible like what are you doing like he was Brave for crying out loud it doesn't even need this thing MH um but anyway that's happening so just be aware of that because I think a lot of these other extensions are going to start running into some issues soon as well it's not going to be just when you wonder if the fork will be long term right that you know Forks often happen just to maintain compatibility at some point you know we could see a firef or somebody just never come back to take on bifs 3 well even so um even something like uh like Brave right so brave said yeah we're going to keep maintaining this as long as we can but they can't promise forever right so no be important features they have to have yeah like chromium will itself evolve to the point where the B2 stuff work that they've kept going is not going to work anymore so somewhere down the RO there things there's going to be things in chromium you now need to have probably security related and the only way to get them is to merge the line again and that means you're getting anifest three yeah which is why you should use brave because you don't need this thing anyway who cares if they support V2 it doesn't need it yeah it's built rid um but yeah anyway that's happening and then Microsoft I think you know in the same way that Microsoft releases uh updates for Windows 11 all the time I feel like now they're on a little cycle where like they they spin a wheel and it's like all right three days from now we're gonna talk about security again yeah and they just keeps I don't want anyone to forget that uh we're really serious about security I know I know we say that a lot but we're really serious about security we they were making their uh security the top priority of the company uh back in November I think it was with that new SDI or whatever the thing is called uh they announced in May right tied the builds there was a big push in um Windows 11 yep security is our top priority that uh CL crowd strike thing happened just want to remind everybody we're super serious about security and to prove that we're GNA fix this problem with the industry because we love you guys we don't want this to happen anymore and a memo leaked from uh Microsoft internally Microsoft by the way has a chief people officer course and kind of that's just the new that's the new age name for HR that's all okay okay the guy who yeah it's thep he literally walks around wearing a Darth Vader costume just to make itar what his job he's a people person I'm a people person like who does he who does he like respond like who who Who's his direct report like what I do not believe yeah Al the deal again so he sent out an email uh to everybody at Microsoft and said look you know just want to remind everybody we're super serious about security and uh we are going to um base your future earnings as an employee on how well you conform to this this never ends well Google did this with social whicha created Google Plus um I think meta did it with uh the metaverse right look how well that's gone yep I hope Microsoft's sincere about this right after the crowd strike thing the guys in the AI division are all like hey um are we actually gonna do this and they're like no that doesn't about that yeah it is interesting how it they essentially have to do internal memos in public right like that's the only way to make it real yeah that's right it's this is the perfect way that's a good point because you you really want PE we have said we are serious about security several times in the past few months and no one seems to believe it we anyone think of a more effective way to Comm why don't they believe it I wonder why yeah here's an idea threaten every employee and then they'll believe it so that's what they did well the you know your pay package is going to be affected by your role in security maybe that's the thing that's how you do it this is the new stack ranking right it's security ranking well you still have your they still have their okrs right I deal with this sort of thing all the time interacting with Microsoft employees where it's like this isn't TI of my okr then I'm not doing it and so if that really so are they saying that's part of your okrs now yeah I hope it is because they do have to take security seriously and they do have to be able to pull the andon core to stop production to say we have a serious security problem rather than wave asked it to to put him you know they saw you talk about the big SFI kickoff that was finding a bunch of Dev resources on Azure that were not pro that didn't follow security process well which by the way was the net cause of that late 2023 security vulnerability that no one's talking about anymore thanks to crowd strike thank you crowd strike yeah um you know you know right we're not talking about that anymore no and there is a fix to crowd strike right there is API calls they can now have and arguably Microsoft should be saying if there isn't we'll make you one right we'll push it out in 22 H2 for you yeah the thing they're almost certainly doing right now is well first of all they've they kind of did fix this already it's just that no one really knew it happened so now you can just kind of just kind of reomotors so they can Implement these new out of the kernel apis and blah blah blah this stuff's been around for yeah five years but you know what don't worry about it we're just going to we're going to make the other side of this is Crow shrike has to look at how many Dev cycles that represents versus the feature set their customers are demanding like all you're doing is fixing something that nobody can tell if you fixed it correctly only tell SC and we don't actually understand the benefit to it to the approach you took right almost guaranteed will be slower because transist transitioning through a security boundary takes time Yep this is sure this was but this you still put lock on doors right like the the N architecture you remember they moved the um the graphics into the kernel and it was like what are you doing and like it's faster like of course it's faster you know like it's but that was a big debate at the time you know NT was pretty top and the argument was be as soon as you don't allow third party drivers in ring zero and the answer after Vista was forget it we'll just write the drivers yes right which you know like everything else in the world the hardware vendors hate that kind of thing but that's part of the story where they said hey here's an idea if I'm responsible for 20,000 machines in my office y I'm going to run reference drivers I don't care about features I care about reliability oh that's okay that's a very that's an interesting and appropriate kind of um customer facing view of it but from Microsoft's persective they're we just start they get blamed for everything right yep we're perspec use PSS we're gonna we're gonna fix printers we don't even make a printer we've never made a printer but we're still going to fix this because apparently you guys can't St writing crappy drivers so we're going to fix it and because we are the ones who get blamed we're the ones who get called you know and we are the ones who get threatened because they're going to move to some other platform and it was your fault so yeah I mean this this is a pretty common pattern unfortunately yeah no it's a tough problem because part of Microsoft's whole play is having a broad ecosystem with many vendors so that you have lots of choice but then they have to do things they're not good at double-edged sword and every one of those companies has a different strategy for success that is counter to what everyone else is doing you know that's that this is the reality I mean so yeah it's good and bad no there if there were simple answers we would have used them it's weird because there isn't really Nuance anywhere else in life and it's funny we've never encountered this before Nuance with that I don't know what you're talking about I'm I'm just really amazed that I still haven't opened this bottle of whiskey I don't I know okay so that's what I'm about to say still to come still to come we've got earnings there are some still some earnings on the table uh we've got Xbox and Richard has said that this is a really good I'm very happy what I found liquor coming up so all of that ahead you're watching Windows weekly Richard Campbell with Run As radio and netr at runas radio.com Paul thot thot.com me I'm the little old wine maker me no I uh I'm just sitting in the middle you remember those ads yeah the little wine maker me I can't I don't remember what the wine was it was around the same time as Bartles and James I was going to say it's got to be like reuni or something or something yeah I think it was like it was some horrible wine back in the old days people didn't know wine and they were drinking you know used to do like a wine ad for some little Wine Drinker Me is a Dean Martin's song oh all right yeah but that makes sense I would use it in a yeah matus Ros uh let's continue on Paul all you got some earnings for us you do Swiss Colony Swiss Colony thank you okay that's Little Colony there's a cut so kids won't remember this but there was a time when people didn't really know anything about wine and they drank the worst wine possible they Boon Farm the first thing I ever got drunk Boon Farm there was Bartles and James which was like a a a drink of some kind there was matuse and there was Swiss Colony and it was all terrible wine but we didn't we didn't know what did we know yeah anyway I don't know I don't know if it's better Nows yeah the kids still Drinker throat I know yeah yeah there it is Italian Swiss Colony well they're still R aren't they I think they are I think they're just up the road a piece sorry for the digression but they're not like outside of Detroit what York State wine is the wine the Ottawa wine region so it could exist I don't know uh global warming you never know um last week we talked about Microsoft's earnings obviously Blockbuster we mentioned Intel uh kind of lightning round this one because we got some big Tech and then just some chipmaker stuff so arm Holdings right almost a billion in revenues uh up 39% by the way in revenues um gross margins that's up to 96.5 5% you thought it couldn't get any higher um they did not rise or raise their annual earnings forecast and actually that Wall Street punished them for that they expect you know crazy growth they're looking for some sort of AI play but um yeah so here's what's amusing to me you folks may remember that arum is suing Qualcomm for its nuvia based Snapdragon EXT chps that we keep talking about because it wants them to pay both royalties right not just the Qualcomm royalties but the new royalties and clc's argument is we pay you more royalties than anybody we what are you talking about we have a set of royalties we don't this is covered by our royalties uh arm disagrees so that's kind of hanging over Snapdragon X but it didn't stop arm from promoting Snapdragon X in their earnings announcement without mentioning Qualcomm once which is awesome awesome so they said during the quarter Microsoft announced its first generation co-pilot plus PCS on arm double the about your life of the closest PC competitor and on par with Mac OS every major software app and developer tool now runs natively on Windows on arm including office Chrome slack and GitHub blah blah blah nope no qual qualcom played no role in that so well done wellie nice piece of writing I love that kind of stuff that's good um and then we uh and speaking of Qualcomm Qualcomm is also doing really well although they they're they've got a smart phone like problem that like Intel has uh with PC or I guess with everything um they keep pushing back like when smartphones are going to come back um the interesting little Side Story for this company is that the architecture they created or you know modified or whatever for snap dragon X is what they're going to use for the Next Generation phone chips and they're going to announce those in October at their annual Snapdragon event so maybe this was their way of saying yeah you know snap that's the the sales of that stuff is fairly flat although honestly that part of the business Rose 12% just like Intel's PC part of the business rad 9% right so actually um that's still doing well but the next big jump in Revenue gains is going to happen um with these next gen chips presumably that's not going to happen in time for the holidays so Wall Street not too happy with them either um Apple made what I'm going to call I'm using this is like a financial term a bajillion dollars I think was the term um bajillions you know 85.8 billion on uh 21.4 billion in net income profit right yeah um these are single digit gains but come on this is it's like the biggest comp it's like a humongous yeah um iPhone revenues roughly flat they actually fell a little bit but still 93 point something billion compared to 9 I'm sorry yeah 39 something billion compared to 90 jez like can't read to 39 billion something last year so basically same 45% of their revenues um the big news here is that for the past I'm going to say two years is Services has been their second biggest business right Follow by in shifting order Mac and iPad right and then the other devices they make but this quarter this is I I didn't realize this until after I written my story Services was bigger than everything else that Apple makes combined except for iPhone so when you add up the revenues from Mac iPad and then the other part which is wearables home and accessories Services made more than all of those yeah servic should always been the biggest business well they got into it late right um this and I don't think they've grown it particularly well either I think they they have a tough time they're really a hardware company services business is a different mindset yeah it's a diff right and apple strength was never software they're they're doing better um I and and part of that ecosystem uh Manifesto I guess I was delivering earlier is that one of the interesting things about their services that is that most of them not all of them but most of them work like everywhere you have an Apple device right so as well that's be in the Walled Garden it should be absolutely symmetrical yep yeah so that's kind of you know it's so it's getting there but but it's getting there you know we'll see what it looks like when Apple or when Google's $23 billion and revenues goes away because uh that's about 25% of that business's revenues so that's going to be interesting the question mark for me is Apple intelligence doesn't show up in this earnings report yet because grant grant they have not shipped it but you think the Believers would just buy but I think and I'm I'm I'm one among them like I would consider an iPhone if Apple intelligence really is great yeah so I'm trying to think what I'm going to see you next um that that's an interesting conversation it's gonna be a lot more interesting when there's more to see but ignite in Chicago yeah Chicago be November so by then we'll actually have something to look at so hopefully um the I would say the big difference between and say Microsoft and another platform and actually Google right the the two platform makers that are also kind of all in on uh Ai and our cap Xing the hell out of you know AI infrastructure costs apple is not doing that right no Apple's in an interesting position where they can go to like open Ai and say we'd like to partner with you yeah and uh we're not giving you anything you just want access to our customer base just like Google does right I mean so it's they you know this is a virtuous cycle thing for them this may work out for them because they don't really have to I mean they will I think and they're being the slow mover side of things is pretty great you know I said a line on a different call not a show related call where I said listen we all know people are screaming about a gold rush and there's lots of shovels and jeans being made I'm just still looking for the goals and well and but and from Apple's perspective the slow approach is almost always paid off and in this case it's it's particularly good because the costs are so astronomic High early in the cycle um it makes yeah it's just it's so they we are talking about companies that are paying for the stuff with cash right yes you know there's only a couple that can what's the difference between what they would normally do in this fewer stock BuyBacks but only fewer like that's all that's happening is oh we have something to do with this Cash There's different ways that companies can invest the money they got uh you know from investors and grow the value of that stock Apple's pretty good they're pretty good at making money I mean say what you will but uh they're pretty good at that um really good at that maybe is the right way to say that so and then Amazon of course I don't know what's what's north of a bajillion but they made 148 billion in uh revenues and a net income of 13.5 billion um they're you know they're interesting because the vast majority of their revenues comes from retail operations as I would call like online stores physical stores most warehousing comp stores right right they're a logistics company you know in some ways right um but their most I'm going to call it profitable uh business by percentage anyway is of course AWS right so 22.1 billion in revenues 5.4 billion in net income yeah um those are normal tech company numbers back to the whole you look at that part of the company and you see Tech yeah exactly you look at the rest of it what is you know what is this yeah if you're an investor you're like these companies need to be split apart I'll take shares in both yeah so right yep yeah there's an argument to be made that um Amazon is had did anyway and because they're starting to be profitable overall that was not the case for a while um that they were able to leverage the um the profits from AWS to voice yeah new businesses onto the world which may lead them down an anti trust path right where that's what I mean yeah like that may yeah yep because it's not it's not just that you got we always talk we usually talk about you got a monopoly you deserved it you made a great product God love you but there's also that version where you got a monopoly through illicit um means and that is also illegal you don't have to well because yeah if you are into Amazon from a retail company their their margins are predatory like mean huge money and if you're in it because they're a tech company their margins are garbage because because the margin should be 20 30 plus percent right and they're not they can't do that because they have these two combined businesses that really don't get along all that well yep yeah I mean they're not even related in any way really right I mean one the retail operation is a customer of the cloud business yeah I didn't get into the with the Intel stuff but they Intel reports their Fab business as if it were a a second business separate from them right it's not but you know because they're trying to show that this thing can be profitable on its own and will be a you know a grow a profit Center at some point or whatever but um Intel I AMD could do jeez Amazon could do that with AWS in a way and actually honestly you can see what it would be because they are very transparent about the numbers so yeah you kind of get a a look into that if you wanted to all right okay uh Xbox so excited there's some stuff going on um I'm just trying to I don't have any like super bad news about Xbox this week so that's kind of fun but um it's the news we're still missing of course cross your fingers I mean it's it's the day is young but um there are two Big Industry events coming up in the next 30 days or so and both of them are in Germany just like what was the last time you ever said that that's when all the Xbox stuff happens is in Germany gamerscom is happening uh end of August in colog I always struggle with that cologne colone colone yeah um and then in very very end of August I think beginning of September is IFA which is in Berlin so opposite sides of the country opposite sides of the business whatever but uh Microsoft is not just going to Gamescom but they are going to show off over 50 as they said it playable games and the how many unplayable games are they going to show off that's what I want well no that that that's what they did when they showed off that red shift game or whatever was that vampire game that piece of crap so unplayable um which is not the thing you want to see in the the title of the review um no what that means is they're not going to just show videos they're going to put games out on a floor people can walk up and play them so uh Star Wars games India Jones games all kinds of stuff so still sounds funny uh good that's good and I have this is one I've not looked at but there is a free uh firstperson shooter called valerant which is on Xbox series xns and Playstation it's supposed to be pretty fantastic and um it's on PC so I have no excuse but right I'm going to take a look at this looks It looks interesting supposed to be really good yeah yeah it looks like a NextGen uh OverWatch maybe that kind of game kind of slightly graic yeah supposed to be fast more down the realism path than than OverWatch but yeah yeah right little yeah um not much more not much no but yeah like like we're not quite Pixar you know but better than cartoon I guess so this one I might need a little bit help on cuz I've been um complaining proba didn't notice about the lack of Activision Blizzard games on game pass but if I'm not mistaken uh there's something called Cash Crash Bandicoot and insane Edition Trilogy isn't that an activis Blizzard game um not originally no I mean they may have ended up buying it is it Sega who made who made crash P yeah I think it was I think it was originally a Sony game oh jeez okay built by Naughty Dog never mind this is yet another no games godamn these people so um all right well that's coming to Game Pass in the second half of this month the uh Mafia Definitive Edition um this is a good month because I actually recognize some of these games so that's pretty us names you can recognize yep and plus you know the the recent um Call of Duty right is there now as well never heard it's a little indie game they're trying to make it work um you know they'll get there so uh Sony and Microsoft uh Sony and Nintendo I'm really losing my ability to speak here uh also announced their earnings these guys are both at the tail end of their cycle for the current gen console so things are you know they do no real sign about the next gen console looks yeah there's been not not a lot of rumor on the Sony side so the PlayStation 5 only sold 2.4 million consoles most recent quarter it was 3.3 a year ago yeah over 60 million overall they're on track to have the worst selling PlayStation console of all time like this is probably going to be the slowest selling of all of them right it's expensive um it's not their fault in many ways they and Microsoft both chose to launch these things for better or worse right in the middle of the pandemic um lots of component shortage problems remember Sony did a better job with it uh with that than Microsoft and they are outselling the Xbox probably a pretty wide margin but you know um their game business which is is called game and Network Services um lots and lots of money they're doing great actually it's their I think it's their biggest yes it's their biggest business overall Sony um you have to all the math idea with Sony it's like what it looks like if you don't include their financial services business which is a huge part of the company um but they've they sold uh 53.6 million software units um they had a game hell divers 2 that sold 12 million units in the qu really really great game it's incredible yeah so they're you know given where they are good they have 160 million monthly active users on PlayStation Network that's up 7% plus over year so yeah good um Nintendo had been doing great but their latest uh report wasn't great and they declined to update on whether the nextg switch was coming um remember they had said they didn't say they'd release it they said they'd announce it before the end of their fiscal year which is ending at the end of June U March rather and they did not they had nothing to add to that they didn't lower their forecast for the rest of the fiscal year which is good I guess but like Sony did that last year and that didn't work out so um they only sold 2.1 million switch consoles in the quarter that was down 46% from last year they sold they did very well last year yeah they're doing they're doing bad right now so software sales same thing 41.3% down the the the little asterisk here is that last year Nintendo benefited from something that makes no sense to anyone who has a brand in their head because they don't why would you think this but Nintendo is starting starting to get into movies again and they had a Mario movie last year that really helped sales of their games and that was the bump they got you know the other part of this is you're doing year-over year measures and they don't make new machines every year yeah they barely there hasn't been a REV y they're still all Le still the best one but I do like the idea that there is things they could do like making movies and things that engender enthusiasm for certain and they actually did say that they're working on a sequel to that movie and they're hoping to get a little bump from that whenever it comes out you can't crank out a movie year either like it takes see it depends on who you are Richard so I don't know if you know how Netflix makes movies but give me if all you need is like Ryan Reynolds in a green screen and you could get a there you go crap out a movie in like 10 minutes yeah um they do a bunch of those more of a John Fabro thing but yeah yeah yeah right right it make a start we have yet another Star Wars series yet another Star Wars series um switch has sold over 143 million units overall um they will probably beat their own record meaning that that device will probably become their bestselling console of all time by the time it winds down so the the best one so far is the uh Nintendo DS which is sold 154 million units So based on their if they hit their numbers PS2 is like 155 million like we were talking about the outer reaches of the most successful video game consoles of all time yeah I mean I think the PlayStation 4 was up there 120 million something like that it's like it's somewhere up there yeah um even like the the the the worst gen for them to date was the PS3 and I I don't remember the exact where it landed but it was somewhere around 90 I would be shocked 90 yes yeah I would be shocked if they hit that with the well but look you know yeah if you're if you're over 150 million on anything in this scenario you're magic like that's crazy crazy C there's only what a handful of devices that made 100 and let's not forget Nintendo made the Wii U so you know not they're not always perfect not everything is they don't always win yeah that's fine well and I don't know which I don't know how you follow the switch I don't know you call it the switch 2 yeah the switch Ultra the switcheroo the switch 4K I well it's coming out next year can't wait I'll be on online buy it curious I love my switch all right well uh let's take a little break and when we come back we are going to go to the back of the book that means tips that means apps that means Brown booze baby and a and a good one Accord Richard this week a surprise a delightful it's always a it's always a good one but this one's a delightful surprise delightful this one I was looking at the site earlier yeah no this one this one blindsided me don't get ahead of it oh it's exciting but first I want to put in a plug for our great club members 12,484 strong wow we love you I know is that you know on the one hand you know we were hoping for maybe 5% of our audience which would be more than twice that but that's you know that's a lot 12,000 people is mindboggling really that's fantastic yeah um it's it's Let's see we have I think 750,000 uh uniques every month so you know it's it's a little more than 1% of the total I would like to see more than one in 100 people in the club could we make it two or three I'll tell you the thing uh right now with the 12,000 members that pays half our payroll that's fantastic doesn't include any of the other expenses but it pays half the payroll people are expensive they're the most expensive part of any business sure they're also what makes things work yeah I I tried it all by myself not the same no no so if we made it if we doubled that if we got to two two or 3% would cover our entire payroll if we got to 5% we would have so much extra money that I would move to Bermuda no I wouldn't what we would do is we'd expand we'd pay people more we'd expand we'd add shows so the club to us is really that's where we can grow the the ad revenue is pretty flat it's gone down a little bit it's kind of gone up now but it's it's pretty flat it's just normal and that covers the other half of the right now the other half of the salaries and didn't cover the studio that's why we're moving out um I would love to see us be just completely listener supported we do exactly what you want we could do a lot more because you know there's content that we could make for instance me just coming on an hour a day shooting the breeze that no Advertiser is going to buy but if the club members wanted it we could do it that kind of thing so that's why we really keep I don't I'm not I don't like begging I'm not a I don't want to do pledge breaks and all that uh I just want to give you an opportunity to participate if you want if you like what you hear on this show and the other shows if you want more of that if you want to encourage us it's kind of a way of casting a vote for what we do join the club twit.tv Club twit there yes there benefits you know there add free versions of all the shows there's additional content there's video where there isn't video in the public things like that but really that's the it's the feeling that you're supporting something you like and you want to see more of if that matches you know your goals and you can afford seven bucks a month I understand believe me if you're outside the US and it's a hardship or because of the exchange rates and all that or if you're inside the US and you know times are tight and I know a lot of us that's the case fine that's great because we still make most of our stuff available for free but if you can't afford it I would love it if you would go to twit.tv Club twit uh and join the club we'd like to have you the Discord is great it's a place where club members hang out um it's I just want to put in a plug for that let you know how much it means to us uh we're doing our part you know we're cutting back uh but what we would like to do is is do more so twit.tv Club twit that's all that's all I have to say now to the back of the book and our tip of the week Mr Paul thorat and believe it or not it involves word star yep that's crazy I know it's it's overdue frankly but it's a bad timeall this is the story I've been waiting for yeah so a an award-winning science fiction author who has been using word star since the late 1970s and has never stopped using word star and by the way word star for Doss uh has released a complete Archive of this software that includes thousands of pages of documentation the complete Archives of the comp you serve forums for word star from back in the day uh what his own little custom configurations the emulators you need to run this thing and uh he like um what's the guy who writes uh Game of Thrones um Martin yeah uses word star to this day that's so funny um and when if you go to this guy's site it's it's actually kind of fascinating he kind of looks like he uses word star he kind of has that I use word star kind of look you a little bit nuts you have to be a little bit nuts um he's good I like his stuff this is fascinating I just as a treasure Trove of historical you know data I mean this is amazing um the number of famous authors who have used this over time now granted most of these guys were back in the day like Arthur C Clark right um and rice who uh obviously today uses a modern computer in Microsoft Word or uh actually George RR Martin still uses this thing um uh what's it guys uh Michael Kon right the guy uh not Michael K sorry different author but um have used this software and a couple I guess still do so I looked at it today I got to tell you it's completely unusable I I have no idea what he's talking about but he makes an impassion plea for why this thing is still Superior my fingers still do control KS I mean I A lot of people do yeah yeah I could see so I you have to run in Doss so which means you have to run a Dos emulator I mean I use a markdown editor so I'm like I could probably do this but I I didn't really get into this stuff until Word Perfect probably maybe 3 point something but um I used Microsoft Word on in Doss you know obv this thing runs like a hot Dam on a Raspberry oh yeah oh yeah it oh on anything yeah but just the keyboard shortcut the problem with this to me would be the keyboard shortcuts because a I never did use this and B we're talking now 40ish years of common keyboard shortcuts that work everywhere and it's like I don't know but but you know what it's fascinating so consider it if it ran emac key key keyboard yeah well it's it probably could be configured to do whatever I'm sure it's F names wow this is so cool file names yeah it's really neat I it's worth is it open source how did he so this this company was sold was sold was sold was sold was split and sold and different so it's abandoned wear which is not like a legal term but it's there is no owner of this software the the companies that ended up with some of the assets of some of the companies that used to have something to do with this are companies like MC some tiny part of McMillan publishing or I can't remember the other company they they don't they don't have any no caring or oversight of this they don't word star is like a lost chair in a back closet right like it's just an orph and nobody knows about it nobody nobody yep nobody cares um so it's yeah it's there is no answer to this no one I don't believe I my guess is that nobody owns it actually illegally that the it's just been abandoned so I don't think he about you know from that perspective what was the name of that book Jeff Travis is always recommending it's a history of word processors that he talks a lot about word star and micro proo and oh I found it I I couldn't find it now but I follow I found an old quote from Ann rice on Facebook not the one that everyone references were like you know Microsoft Word is a hot Mass whatever but she was saying this is kind of interesting with any technology in the late 70s her friends who are authors would complain to her because she would use a word pressor they couldn't believe it and and she said you don't understand this is a direct connection between me and my brain this is a this is me being the best writer I can be and if you don't accept that technology can help you be a better writer then you should not be a writer something to that nature and it was like nice like you know you could apply that to anything like over the years right Steve Steve Martin who was a Windows big Windows fan um was telling me that when he wrote that's why he went gray early by the way yes I think so when he wrote The Three Amigos yeah he wrote it in a word processor which is very early for uh Hollywood yeah right and I don't remember if he told me which word processor I feel like it was it was Word Perfect probably Word Perfect back then he said he would move a paragraph and he would have to get up go have a cup of coffee yeah it was re reassembling luy he wasn't you I I used to try to write in like Geo write on a com 64 and you literally had to go it was like rendering a 3D graphic you know like cut and paste was like you also got into that reflex save too because sometimes it would fail yeah oh all the time it's funny though because it doesn't feel like the Three Amigos is that old of a movie right it came out it was computer terms 1986 was prehistory right and that's the day that's when that movie published when was he playing with the screenplay could have been it was probably right the yeah yeah it definitely dos I mean it first screenplay I think so yeah yeah great story yeah awesome yeah yeah lucky day is it really the good of all mankind I don't even know it's not bad all mankind I love it uh and then just a couple of web browser updates for apps um new Firefox is out this one there's several improvements to the reader mode which I have to say honestly awesome it's really I really like the way Firefox rers text it's really nice looking and if you were burned uh when Arc came out of Windows that it was not available on Windows 10 it is now they released a new version and you can get it I try and on one of these wind 10 machines I love arc on Mac but I on on Mac next no it's it's getting better but it's yeah you're right it's next it's next level this is our and one of the reasons I use it on the shows is because it has no Chrome and has no user interface so it's great for screenshots you know and then when I want to go back to the show notes I just you know I have a little over here I can can do that I just I love that I love the clean look and the little uh you know when I open a window you see it does this little mini window on top of the window I don't know what they call that but the I love that yeah I love that yeah and you can make it a full screen if you want but but you can also just hit Escape I just really I really like that anyway uh I don't is it getting more like the Mac version on Windows I mean yeah sure it is um I'm sorry what do you use these days as your daily so I go back and forth right so I've been using Firefox past couple of days because of the new release um I don't know I I'm getting to you know when you if you think about it when you we've been talking about password advantages a lot lately that's one of the things that kind of helps you not have to use the same browser everywhere right so like right Firefox may not be super great on like iOS or something but you could just use Safari there and it was you know as long as your stuff can get where you could actually kind of use the best browser on whatever device you're on right doesn't always have to be the same yeah maybe so you just basically didn't answer I use I use an extension for the homepage which is my bookmark I don't use bookmarks right so that's taken care of and then I passwords obviously the big one all the autofill stuff and so what else is there like what I mean just you know you sign in you get your themes and whatever and what do you what browser you looking at right now right now on desktop I'm using Firefox okay um interesting I didn't even know you still used that wow I go well I go back and forth I use a lot of different things so I've been using Safari lately I've been using the beta version of iPad and iOS 18 whatever 181 so you know the a summaries of Articles and whatever I kind of need to stay with the same browser only cuz like all the bookmarks and you know that's what I use for the shows so that's why it's Arc now but uh yeah bonjour with two 's at the end you know the traditionals if if you stutter in French that's and uh but it that it has multiple pages of links and stuff it's it works well for me as a for bookmarks or whatever Mr Richard Campbell you have a fabulous Run As radio coming up think we missed no no you did it you did I did it yep yeah published today uh episode 944 with uh Natalie Sarah Bova uh we picked this show up while we were together in Oslo at a conference and uh we're talk she had a great angle on approaching Disaster Recovery reducing cost by using Cloud uh if you were on Prem just looking at the different models that are available because a a lot of that techs advance and people don't scrutinize it much and B in general when you walk through your infrastructure uh in the sense of how You' recreate it based on the scenario we talk through scenarios like oh I've corrupted a server or this drive volume's gotten messed up through to the one referred to which was there's a smoking hole in the ground where the office used to be uh which happened to me once and if you think about things a little differently uh and just a study of infrastructure uh often turns up inefficiencies like why are we doing this why does that still exist all those things were supposed to be turned off years ago so it's one of those maybe quarterly reviews you do uh obst to reduce cost so the CFO loves that you can spend a few days on that or even bring in a specialist but in the process you'll usually come back with some other optimizations that lower that cost and improve uh overall performance so it was a strategy for doing the preventative stuff because when the cloud gets involved it turns into an immediate monthly [Music] return there you go yeah and there's nothing better in the world than an immediate monthly return you know I do this once a year I do a show uh that's sort of like my thoughts on what it's going to be like to be a system in this year and I I think a couple I like that just good that's a good idea like a is it ever like a congol line party kind of a situation or it usually you know a lot of lot of discussion about degrees of St you're if you're are you someone who doesn't like to do things proactively oh you're gonna love this job what is it gonna be like to be a podcaster this year I might start doing that every what you do in December you should um you should like start a tweet storm about it yeah yeah I and I I definitely recommended them snuggle up to their CFO you know back when and when we were really concerned about the downturns like this is is the year to delay replacing Hardware by the extended warranties and you know do the numbers on that and the number of emails I got back from listeners saying dude I have lunch with my CFO every other month now because he for the first time ever I I touched him in a a meth that made sense to him I care about how how we're spending money it's like now you get to ask for your spend if you produce Roi did he buy lunch though because that would kind of put it over CF your recommendation is to to snuggle up to your CFO and touch them in that special place so that's it I know I I feel like that's a paraphrasing that perhaps have to take HR yes yes I do oh wait they're closing the office who do I bring it to now the person in Char what is it the people the people in person what are they what is the new the new HR term oh head a chief people off no was it that people officer what a terrible what do you officer of people yeah you're making what's that stuff the uh you know the uh the science fiction movie where the food's made of people um soent green green I'm like Chief soent green officer there you go ladies and gentlemen I think you have sat through this long enough you deserve you're all here for the whiskey we know fine brown liquor oh I have to my birthday I we have to talk a little bit about how I select whiskies for this sometimes a listener sends me to one or sends me one uh sometimes get given to me by a friend like just's lots of different things this was not one of these occasion this is one of these occasions where on Monday I'm like huh what am I going to do I've been home for a while what am I going to do right and uh I literally went to my local whiskey store and I looked on the wall and I was thinking American bourbon because I hadn't done a bourbon in a while you know so time to go they there some Classics you know i' always check which ones I've already done what have I missed I should do a Willet or any any any number that Dean Williams and Happy Van Winkle I already did already done you did py that's right yeah not that I can find that on a shelf anywhere and then I also had a hankering for oh you know I've only done a couple of Japanese maybe I should Japanese Whistle Pig have you done Whistle Pig this I saw this it turns out it's it's both it's it's American and Japanese oh combined that's what I was W this is a partnership heck yeah well and it's by partnership I mean an ownership right like to be clear yes well in the Microsoft a partnership you would partner now but what's interesting about this is that it is a coll you know Jim Beam yes owned by Sor but it is a collaboration between Jim Beam and santori uh now obviously I'll do a quick run on down on the two companies Sor we've talked about a number of times now from the original Japanese whiskey show way back when that this is shinjiro Tori who you know first started selling imported wine in 1899 and then there's masaka takuru who was the ser whiskey guy who had been trained in Scotland and so they collaborated uh built the first uh Scottish style whiskey distillery in Japan The yamazaki Distillery in 1923 uh took him a few years to make a whiskey it was terrible um uh takuru you know went back to Scotland did everything could to try and make it better finally got frustrated with Tori and left in 1934 went had made his own Distillery the Nik Distillery which is up in Hokkaido in the northern park as it was more like Scotland uh meantime you know son Shiro Tori continued on in 1937 he finally got a hit with his son Tori whiskey which the Japanese soldiers really liked uh fast forward over the good years and bad years of whiskey and of course we all hear about santor with uh 2003 when Lost in Translation comes out right make make it Sor time and also the same year that the amazaki 12 was the very first Japanese whiskey to ever win an international contest they got the gold medal uh that transformed santor I've never really dug into this part because by 2009 santor is now reorganized into this monster multi- uh entity there's a holding company the beverage of food company there's a thing called products limited there's Wellness there's Liquors there's beer and Spirits there's the wine International Group and they start buying entities lots of different companies uh to the point that by the time they acquire beam in 2014 they're the Third largest producer of distilled beverages after diio and perau rard now if you go to the beam story which I've never talked about before because we generally don't talk about Beam whiskies for better or worse and there's a ton of them you know today besides Jim Beam that's also basil hay and Knob Creek and Bookers and Bakers and little book and old tub and Old Crow an old Granddad and old Overholt whatever that is in Harden Creek like they own a lot of whiskies which is some of them which they made and some of them which they acquired the company goes all the way back to to a man named James beam selling whiskey in 1795 uh the company's officially called the James beam Distilling Company in 1935 although they ultimately sell it to a guy named Harry Blum who's a spirit Merchant out of Chicago and then it becomes that horrible story about products where it just shifts from one brand company another all through the 60s and 70s uh one of them was American brands which was originally a tobacco company but it was also in insurance and and Home Hardware uh and while they're under that Banner 85 American brands bought National distillers which is where Old Crow comes from and they become the Jim Beam Brands company so they're now going down that horrible path as well uh until the parent company American brands becomes Fortune Brands because that's not weird or creepy at all and uh buys 20 more whiskey related brands from Alli Dominique in 2005 and this is when they ended up with many Scottish distillers and others as well and so uh by that point it's now called beam Global spirits and wine it's 2006 which they actually split off from Fortune Brands uh to become a separately publicly traded company because I guess they decided they need more money but at the moment they were public they were a candidate for acquisition by 2014 that's santor so santor ends up owning it and renames santor to beam santori largely because they were concerned that Sor was not well known in the the US market but Jim Beam is and so the name was really important so they thought they don't think that anymore as of May of this year this parent company is now called santor Global Spirits so there's the origin of the two companies that collaborate over this whiskey even though they've basically been the same company for 10 plus years but you know Sor being one of the good guys I think like diio where they've really done a lot of work to protect Brands and arguably enhance those brand SAR is also the guys who facilitated maker Mark making their seller additions some very good whiskey they wouldn't have been able to make without the money available to them that santori has to be able to expand what which otherwise was a very small operation so the actual collaboration part of this whiskey is between two people Fred no and Shinju Fuko so Fred no is a Seventh Generation Master Diller he is literally the great grandson of Jim Beam so this is the family heritage of Jim Beam which is still involved and the core of this whiskey is a gim Jim Beam Mash bill so 76% corn 12% Rye 10% barley and then it goes into American Oak for five years which is super normal that to me is an American bourbon right except it's not because after that they take a portion of the batch and they put it into to Californian red wine Oak casks for about a year and another portion goes into Sherry casks for a couple of years and then the separate what they call Parcels these products are Blended by Shinji so Fred know is responsible for making the bourbon and setting up the barrings and then all of those Parcels of the product and different barrels goes over to Shinji who is only the fifth ever blender for santor and remember the santor made their money on blended whiskey their single malts are an anomaly but their famous yellow Label suntor whiskey it's always been a blend their Blends have always been their business the challenge here is that Japanese whiskey has always been made in the Scottish style they only work in barley so for for shinchi this is kind of a shock that here you have this Mash Bill concept as well as this array of barrels so he's trying to assemble different flavors together and does this unique blending and they did the first version of this back in 2019 so it's been around a few years I just finally ran into it the crazy part is what do you even call this because it breaks the rules for American Bourbon and it breaks the rules for Japanese whiskey nominally it is an American blended whiskey but that has a very bad reputation like generally speaking Blended whiskies are found on in the American Market uh they will don't mind buying a Scottish blooded whiskey like a sh or a famous grous and they certainly don't mind buying Japanese whiskies that way but when it comes to American that's kind of a problem although I would point out that Jim Beam makes a blended whiskey too called little book and coincidentally the master distiller in charge of little book is Fred no's son Freddy so All in the Family on the other hand the other part about this is okay so I like a blend because somebody did this intentionally they put the pieces together they were looking for a flavor profile uh Shinji goes into the idea of like the fuess I find too sweet when it's just bourbon too much caramel I want a little more fruit I want a little more tannins and so he gets that from the wine and from the Cherry uh but the other part is they don't do chill filtration and they don't do coloring so one of the complaints from some of the reviewers is that depending on the bottle of this you buy different colors different shades because not every barrel behaves the same way and they're not trying to compensate for that they're focused on a consistent flavor and they get it well as far as I know I've only had one bottle of this so far so up front of the nose this is only 47% so not a lot of burn but it's not pathetic either like you definitely know there's alcohol in there it's got that burnt caramel butterscotch kind of I think I'm drinking bourbon like here it comes and then then a weird fruit note hits you like that's not what happen happens with bourbon normally this is much more like a ported SC Scotch like that's strange but then it's got a sort of uh tightness coming off your mouth after that more of the leather and the Smokey not there's any Pete in this and lots and lots of warming so good evening drink although I'm drinking in the afternoon but I drink in the afternoon every Wednesday uh what's brilliant about it 44 bucks from Total Wine H you know because it's not a single malt because they're not being pretentious about it what they did was they made the best whiskey they could using a different set of skills and a sort of typical production so it's reasonably priced for an unusual whiskey uh without um without being awful right when we talked about JD I'm like I'm impressed with how good JD is for $2 bottle of wine I'm looking for a whiskey that's not awful that seems like I care less honestly but uh about about awfulness or about leather off through your mouth about lawfulness but you know a couple of the themes that have come out with doing this on a routine basis is like I'm learning not to hate the conglomerates because they seem to be doing good things yeah uh and I'm learning to getto you know resist the not that I've ever ACT people consider be pretentious about whiskey just because I'm knowledgeable although when every ask you what my favorite is it's like the one sitting in front of me I'm not that idealistic I like that that's a good that's a good motto yeah uh you know this I got a little Glen gar in the in the um in the decanter behind me and it's still fantastic we talked about it a while ago and I put it in the caner um this is a big Rich Jammy it's a surprise you don't expect this much from from a $44 bottle of American bourbon that even can't be called American bourbon even though it says the label here Kentucky Straight Bourbon whiskey artily finished in wine and Sherry cast so they're being honest but not by according to the FDA rules it's not really a bourbon right right so they've definitely tinkered with it but they've tinkered with it in a lovely way legent with a T at the end apparently it's legent legent I had to look it up I am legent yes once again I'm at work and I'm drinking it must be Wednesday that's a good job must be Wednesday sometimes that becomes my whole afternoon that's Richard Campbell he is runas radio.com and.net rocks also run hisradio.com always a pleasure our whiskey expert and afficionado but not snob and I like that Paul thod he's a snob and he admits it yes [Laughter] he's at thot.com T hu roug good.com make sure you become a prim a premium member Kevin you've got to pay for your premium membership and log in so that you get all the special goodness all the best stuff from thot.com and also his books join the crowd with the love of tech is real did you make that up Paul it's great line I love it that's a that's a pre owning the uh business tagline that you just reminded me I should probably update but I mean I'm sure I okayed it yeah but it makes me angry at some point you just kind of said we're just gonna listen to what the marketing people say for a little while we uh when I was at zif Davis television later tech TV Z Davis's slogan was believe in technology MH nice which I always thought maybe was a little too uh was there a cross and then exactly a little too uncritical so we always at the end of every screen savers not in your God Kate and I would always believe in technology but you know back up your hard drive and things like that which I thought was kind of a nice way of spinning it yeah anyway uh the tech loveisrael at thot.com you can also get his books uh Windows everywhere which is a really cool history of Windows through its programming languages and and and models and then of course the field guide to Windows 11 with Windows 10 builtin uh at leanpub doccom choose your own price and of course uh Paul and Richard and I gather together every Wednesday to do the show 11: a.m. Pacific that's 2 pm Eastern Time 1800 UTC and there are now not one not two but seven count them ways you can watch us do the show live at that hour uh and I mentioned them all earlier and I'm not going to do it all again but uh if you're in the club of course you get a special access permit at DIS at our Discord uh after the fact on demand versions of the show with or without ads depending on your Club Status available at twit.tv duub duub there's the web page you'll see also link on the web page to the YouTube channel for Windows weekly and to a couple of podcast players but any podcast player you can subscribe and get the show automatically when it's available soon as Kevin finishes polishing up this masterpiece right Kevin by the way the uh you know they make a Windows weekly whiskey playlist what yeah did you do that Kevin you did that on YouTube right yeah Sor I'm a little you I thought you meant music I was like what music to listen to window's weekly buy and get drunk but originally we talked about just doing that Scottish whiskey Series right the eight parts but it's also good he's kept going clonic Hilty one just got published and I went back and watch it cuz I was with you love that clonic kilty you were right here and we left Paul completely out of the conversation it was fantastic really so good I have a slightly different memory of that [Music] day I have no memory of that day so you got me we got into the clonic kilty I'm afraid in a very good way but you had to go on and work more that day I felt for you man yeah uh so we do uh This Is It the last chance to uh wow rape and pillage I guess people have been coming in and taking stuff and I've been getting emails what are you going to do with that uh that desk if this is done correctly when we come back next week it's going to look pretty much the same no well uh yes in the sense that you guys will look exactly the same right and I will be in the middle here but my backdrop will not be the same new back so you're innovating yeah well I'm sure a few more pieces will have fallen out of our for Paul and I still have an empty shelf or two here I got to put stuff I don't feel good about R2 I'm feeling like I need to go buy a bigger R2-D2 put it on my basically Richard I'm doing a shelf behind me with the twit logo and a bunch of podcast Awards that's about it um it's fun you know I'll do at some point I'll do a tour of what we're doing because we we kind of overbuilt it not that we've never done that before I can't imagine no it's me it's me all by myself in the attic and I have one two three four five six cameras wow wow are you able to control them like you have an A10 something so there's a single there's a two shot there's a camera if a guest is with me there is and over the you know Top Shot so I can show you stuff on the desk that's got a dedicated camera uh there is a GoPro behind me so you get the big the big picture and I'm taking home a PTZ I mean I I we have all these cameras so I'm taking home a PTZ so that I can you know zoom in and out and all that stuff so you know I tried to add a second webcam to one episode of Hands-On windows and the entire thing melted down I was like under the table in a fetal position keep I keep my view cam around for you all the time man just I love your view cam if I had a view I'd have a view cim I don't have a view I'm in an addict see if I had that view I don't think I'd be doing the show but you're going to be Ghost Hunters one day you're gonna be doing the show and some weird shape's gonna go by in the background dude it happens all the time it's usually humpbacks I'd be out there in a if in the Attic like a ghost oh in the Attic God knows what what kind of things you're gonna see yeah goodness knows it's uh it's an interesting space I always meant to rig up my old office with a camera for the dog just so you could always get cut to a show Jason Snell has a dog cam he has a dog sitting in a bed have a balcony cam in Mexico does that count yeah yeah that's all I got so you could have the balcony cam uh yeah it's fun I mean I have it a eight Port switcher yeah you might as well take advantage of it you know you really should put a cam out there because you could also it could also be a riot cam for you too Paul like once in a while you have the never or at least those parades that go by in the early early hours of morning our neighbor texted us a video 2 o'clock in the morning exact same thing happened another parade yes and they do it once a year I guess there you go the theory is that is police Cadets yeah marching from the school to the station take over the it could be a running shootout between drug dealers and stuff but it's it's a parade no there's there's music it's really cool so it happened again but it happens in the we hours of the morning happened it's like 2:30 in the morning that's because the only time it's cool there yeah maybe that's it no maybe that's it so Paul you're gonna stay in Muni for next week uh I will be here next week yes okay and Richard you're going to stay in madira park for next week okay two more weeks here and then Copenhagen oh I got to get go oh we'll let you go it's that's it for the show thank you everybody we'll see you next time right here on Windows weekly bye [Applause] [Music] [Applause] [Music]