[Music] 20 years ago Michael Schumaker made history by winning his seventh Formula 1 World Championship Michael schumacker is in Cruise mode he is coming through to claim his 13th win of the 2004 World Championship Michael schumacker shows everyone who's boss the Italian flags proudly proclaimed the car as being made in Italy but the driver his gift made in heaven 2004 was schumaker's most dominant title with 13 wins from just 18 Grand Prix the most victories he ever secured in a season Michael broke his own record of the most drivers titles in F1 history at the time and became the only driver to this day to win five championships in a row 204 definitely faster car in all areas and Michael as well I would say faster driver himself than 2003 the ease that he did achieve the results that he had in that year it's probably fair to say it was his best season obviously a driver is an athlete that wants to win but he never ever gave the impression that the team was not at the center of his project at the center of his [Music] mind hello hello and welcome to F1 beyond the grid with me Tom Clarkson 2024 marks the 20th anniversary of Michael Schumer's seventh and final Formula 1 World Championship in one of f1's most dominant eras schuma won five consecutive titles with Ferrari from 2000 to 2004 the last of which epitomized his sheer ruthlessness on track winning 12 of the opening 13 races the German wrapped up the title in Belgium on the 29th of August there were still four grand prix left on the calendar compare that to 2003 when schumacker clinched the championship from McLaren's Kimmy reenan by just two points at the final race and you can't help but ask why was Michael in a league of his own in 2004 in this episode some of the key people behind Michael's success share fascinating insights into why 2004 was his best ever season and how it felt to ride that wave of success with him as Michael's media and PR consultant Sabine Kim has a unique perspective on this euphoric period She reveals the self-doubt he experienced going into a new season the sacrifices he made to achieve his dreams and what he was like to work with off track Ferrari sporting director Diego yno was the team's gearbox engineer in 2004 he paints a vivid picture of Ferrari's winning mentality back then playing football with Michael in their downtime and what made Michael stand out from the other worldclass drivers that Diego's worked with but first we're going to hear from Andrea Stella today he's McLaren team principal but 20 years ago he played a key role in Ferrari's [Music] triumphs Andrea what was your role at Ferrari in the early 2000s yeah in the early 2000 I was a performance engineer uh which is um in a way still similar to the performance engineer we have nowadays whereby you fundamentally look at the data to make sure you assess and extract as much performance as possible for the car and the driver so maximizing the car from a setup point of view uh Tire utilization point of view but also the driving and how you drive it in the fastest possible way so in addition to that at the time Electronics was free so you had a free traction control free engine braking free differential uh free torque control and this meant that um we were busy like you had even the channel were meter by meter you could adapt these uh kind of um what we call strategies control strategies at the time but also meant that the driver was busy because he could adapt traction control engine braking while driving sometimes the driver would say like I'm not sure is this component of traction control or the other component of traction control so you needed to be totally in PH with the driver we used to say you need to be with the driver in the car and help him through the Telemetry because you need to zoom and see oh is this component of traction control so for Corner five this component of traction control minus one so it was busy it was very interesting and was Michael all over the data well I think in a way the fact that Electronics was free and there was so much margin to optimize what you had but also to develop beyond what you had beyond what existed that uh Michael could exploit so well even his intellectual you know ability capacity his commitment is interested in details is uh understanding of what a traction control can do combined with a softer rear anti roll bar can do and like let's not go to far with traction control because I want to make sure we get the grip from the rear axle before we cover over steer with traction control I think he was so prepared about his business that he could kind of strike this uh this balance very well and also not being overwhelmed by being you know in charge of so many options while driving so I think this was if anything a weapon at the time that played to his strengths what about the car the F2 2004 where was it better than the 2003 car because you'd been run very close by McLaren that previous season hadn't you yeah the previous season 2003 was a a very tight season in terms of uh who at the best car at uh uh various events also this was dependent on the tire bridgeston mchelen so there was a combination of factors which created quite a lot of variability in 2003 in 2004 I think the car was just better in all areas just more efficient it was a fast car in the straights a lot of grip in high speed and uh I think especially for Michael he felt very comfortable straight away in the 2004 car something that wasn't the case in 2003 where I would say there was definitely races in which Michael was on par with rubben sometimes rubben was even faster in qualifying in 2003 but 2004 uh definitely faster car in all areas and Michael as well I would say faster driver himself than 2003 in 2003 like there was too tight a competition we need to raise our game I want to win easier than I won in 2003 so I'm pretty sure that over the winter he raised his own bar in terms of I need to be more prepared and I saw that in testing straight away isn't that amazing he'd been in Formula 1 for a decade and yet you're saying he was still able to improve his performance that much over a winter what we're talking about is if anything one of the key features that makes Michael so unique just raising your own bar which immediately means I'm making myself uncomfortable because I raise the bar and then from the moment after I need to chase it and I need to chase it at physical level I need to chase it at um developing my driving I need to chase it by working closer with my engineers and I make an example like he kept saying I'm feeling that the car is going at the rear but I'm too slow to control it because like you feel it but with your hands and with your throttle you just have a you know two of a second one ten of a second but I'm feeling it so you should be able in the data to see it and to do something with traction control and he kept repeating it and I myself and the group I was working with we were like where is the answer where is the answer but it pushed so much that we found the answer and we found a specific combination of Channel we increased the speed of our software routines and we created something that he said like I'm feeling the traction control before I can actually do anything with my own controls we would have not achieved it without Michael pushing so much and it was uncomfortable it was uncomfortable for him to keep pushing the team and it was uncomfortable for us to say I'm not sure we have a solution but then we raised the bar and we achieved it so this is just an example I think working with Michael this happened in many other aspects from uh the formula one team overall and that's why he led the team to getting stronger and stronger over the years let's talk about Ferrari at the time you'd won four consecutive World titles at this point what was the team's greatest strength that's an interesting question and it's interesting because it stimulates a reflection as to the success factors and I think it's interesting also because I think the success factors are multiple U there's an interest in point of view I think to that team clearly there was um a very strong and United leadership you know team principal technical director the president uh chief designer like it was a United Team everyone feeling like we are part of a team you know with a clear objective trust was a fundamental element of keeping the team together this um strong leadership United uh uh leadership I think this helped then create a better and better team by constantly putting the good people in the right place in a process that uh carries on over the years and then uh the culture like there were maybe at the time culture wasn't as a you know frequent uh word as it is at the moment in in conversations in understanding why teams are successful but definitely you could feel it and looking at that team uh from my position now and from like you know having gone through a certain uh Journey myself I think uh culture was um established and was a strong element now Michael won 72% of the races that year his most successful season were there any hiccups along the way do you remember any any dramatic moments in reality the first part of the season was extremely successful because we won 12 out of 13 races and the one that we didn't win is the one in which we crashed with Montoya in the tunnel in Monaco behind the safety car behind the safety C while Montoya was I think one lap down so it was like I think a big hiccup in terms of like oh what an opportunity to have a full you know a full uh streak of Victories In fairness I think that weekend and Renault were very strong so I'm not sure even without the crash under the tunnel in these weird circumstances I'm not sure we could have been actually in condition to win the trace because uh Michael would have needed to put together a sequence of incredible labs to open a full piss stop on the Rena that that ped already if anything that was a bit of a hiccup uh but after that we won the next seven races in a row again and then when he was the time to win the championship in Spa we didn't win the race where you know in one of the tracks in which we thought oh it's Michael's truck uh our car should be good but I remember that day the tires the working range was such that at every safety car restart we were losing positions and there were many safety car restarts so we were kind of not in the right place with the tires for um the race in 2004 in Spa after that think we only won Japan was Span in China in the qualifying lab and I remember that there's a a little bit of a story cuz I was a little depressed because it wasn't a good race and um Michael looked at me like are you okay said yeah that wasn't a good weekend Michael was it he said don't worry Japan is our ground and then we went to Japan and like dominated even though there was I think that was the year of the typhoon yes and we had qualifying on Sunday morning so huge pressure yeah but we were I remember that like the feeling we were so confident great season amazing possibly in the final four five races um yeah we had a couple of eups that um affected us when you've won both championships you win the constructor's championship in Hungary as you say Michael wins the driver's championship in Sp yeah so effectively there's nothing more to fight for in that era of Ferrari did any one take their foot off the gas or is it flat out until the end well I don't know if it's coincidence that uh actually we kind of um dropped a little bit our um results not necessarily the commitment after winning the championship so I'm not sure if this is coincidence or not I think the EOS in that team was uh is never enough obviously 2004 uh came after a long period of pushing and pushing because this started in effectively 96 when Michael joined Ferrari I wasn't there I joined in 2000 so I was uh really benefiting for an incredible work that people before me had done at Ferrari and I had the luck to join a team that was um uh just um already in 2000 possibly already the best team but then kept growing over time then 2005 is difficult to judge because there were significant changes of Regulation from a aerodynamic point of view and also the tire regulation change which just with a single tire for the race where uh I think bridgeson was um put in a difficult position it's a change that came late in 2004 if I don't remember uh wrongly so 2005 was a difficult um season but we responded we reacted in 2006 we were in condition to win the championship again one more question about 2004 it was the era of one La qualifying was Michael good at that it was also the era where you had the uh single engine for a weekend I think and um often in P1 we would go out and do a single lap P1 you go out you do a single lap just Michael was incredible you know like he would do lap times that people can only do after they've done four five laps they found their references okay now I put it together so it definitely had this capacity to push at the limit potentially even slightly Beyond because of his uh unique ability to control the car but then when he was the single lap in qualifying not necessarily it would materialize as good as the single lap in P1 because uh he was also attacking all the time you know and by then everyone will found their references and by then the lab counted a little bit more and especially in 2003 one of the reason why we struggled is that uh I do remember I was a performance engineer so for me was a reason of um certainly discontent often we had too much over steer like it was attacking even in the single lap and sometimes going too far beyond the limit and paying a bit of a price one of those were if you have a second attt or a second set and you use this information then you would do a much faster lap so I don't think it was a benefit for Michael to have a single lap in qualifying so in conclusion Andrea you spent a decade and a half at Ferrari can we say the 2004 season was your most enjoyable it is um definitely in terms of uh results and achievements one of the most enjoyable one thing I enjoy very much in 2004 is the winter testing there's a winter testing in Imola in which we went with the 2003 and the 2004 car things that you cannot do nowadays anymore and they were so instructive for a team and even for the engineers because you have you know two different cars at the same time with the same tires you learn so much and what we were learning at the time is that the 2003 could be like maybe 2/10 off the 200 4 on a single lap but then the 2004 was so consistent just repeating the same lap time while the 2003 was degrading massively I think there was um in general like big smiles in the garage and then this gave us a great feeling and sometimes I think I would like to feel the same in a winter testing like I felt in 2004 in Imola uh when we uh were comparing with the previous year's car being able to backto back the old and the new cars at IMA must have been so useful but what great Insight from Andrea about the car about Michael and how he consistently raised the bar and of course about Ferrari it seemed Andrea really enjoyed remembering this period [Music] too this episode is sponsored by Harry's winning in sports comes down to having that extra Edge and the same goes for shaving Harry's gives you that sharp unbeatable Edge every time I've been using Harry's for a while now and I haven't looked back the weighted handle feels solid the packaging is Sleek and it's a standout in my bathroom the shave smooth precise and exactly what I need to keep my facial hair in check when I know I'm going to be on camera and with their customizable delivery options and a risk-free trial trying harri's is a total no-brainer get your starter set for just $3 at harris.com grid you'll get a five blade razor superb weighted handle foaming shave gel plus a handy little travel 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promo code grid liquid [Music] i.com Sabine Kem was a 29-year-old journalist when she first interviewed schumacker at the 1994 German Grand Prix 6 years later she was at the center of his inner circle after accepting an offer to become his media and PR consultant I asked Sabine what Michael was like to work with when he was dominating F1 in the early 2000s actually surprisingly very easy he was very easy to deal with because he was very straight and very straightforward he was always very calm kind and understanding that does not mean that he wasn't demanding and knew exactly what he wanted and what he asked for but he was really very easy to deal with and I think part of the feelings that many people who worked with him still have for him is because he was never mean and he was just always very kind to people and within Ferrari did he see his role as more than just a I think officially not because he understood obviously the role of Jean Todd and and the roles of uh of obviously of Luka Deon simolo of Ross and Rory and all the other guys but because he had this attitude of how he wanted to work and how he wanted to Mark or leave his Mark probably not officially but subconsciously he had that understanding of leading and guiding the team and if there's one thing that you think was the key to his success I mean 91 wins 68 polls 155 podiums what was the key to it all that's probably a miracle question in a way and it's I remember Michael has been asked that very often and he always kind of struggled to answer that and he always said there's more to it because it's like a recipe you need certain ingredients which come together all in all I'd say hey he was just mentally strong he poured out the confidence that gave security to the team but at the same time they kind of had the feelings they can collect behind his back if something didn't go right he took the blame very often he never really blamed the team and all that kind of led into a natural Authority that he poured out which kind of made him the leader and gave the team the feeling that he will always give it 100% and that was giving them that safety to to just go for it every time he never kind of let them down well let's talk about the start of that 2004 season because the previous year had gone down to the wire down to the last race it had been a stressful time can you remember how he was at the end of 03 and how did he recover if that's the right word over the winter yeah I I really remember the the 2003 season was really drowning and stressful and and going into that winter everybody was really exhausted but at the same time and I think that's also uh part of why Michael is so successful he had this intrinsic motivation that he could just not go somewhere and not feel 100 50% prepared and that never eased off even after that many you know with victories and and titles and that was the same in this 2003 season of course he he could feel he was extremely tired and then as he would do that in most of the years um he would really disappear and completely unplug and I remember you know usually when you are a world champion you have hundreds of requests to come to awardwinning or Galas or whatever appreciation things and he would always decline to go and a lot of people hated him for that or like hated is maybe too strong but were disappointed but he felt that he needed that to be able to completely unplug and at the same time completely recharge and that's what he did over the winter every winter and and he kind of sacrificed this a lot of trophies have not been given to him because you were not coming a lot of times I was listening yeah if he's not coming we have to give that to somebody else and then Michael would say okay then they should give it to somebody else because it's more important and he clearly always set the priorities right and they were always in favor of the job in a way and um right for Ferrari and that was also one of his strength I'd say hindsight he knew exactly the priority and he would go 100% along that priority what do you think drove him was it a a fear of failure or The Lure of success The Lure of that next title I think definitely not the lure of success but the lure of perfection and of quality he wanted to he was kind of really on the hunt on the of this feeling that this satisfaction that you have when you put the perfect thing together and I think actually really the love for the sport and you know to make it the perfect lab and I think a lot of drivers are the same it's not it's really not the title or the victory as a number it's more that perfect lap the perfect race the great duel I think really what was driving him was the passion for the sport can we talk about the perfect season though because 2004 was as close as he got really in terms of the number of wins and winning the title early and the car was so dominant he was so dominant I mean can you remember how confident he felt going to Melbourne for the first race of 2004 I remember that every year again at the start of every year he was extremely unsecure he was extremely doubtful if a if he still had it in him and B obviously if the car would make it and if the team would still be hot so he was really doubting himself a lot is it true that he used to ask Jean Todd just for a day testing at Fano just to almost ReDiscover his talent is is that true he used to do that in the winter yeah he he did that sometimes he had this self-doubts a lot and he was always kind of having that feeling maybe I'm not good enough anymore maybe I've lost it and so when he when he kind of all that winter preseason testing it was really also for himself to find out you know am I still good enough and then obviously the obvious question is the car what you know what about the car is that a winning and he would he would have a very straight feeling of the car and he knew exactly that's going to be a year I can fight for the title or not and in 2004 um the first tests were just very encouraging he would immediately have the feeling we can fight again for the title and I if I remember that correctly I think he even said that straight away you know that's a win winning Contender that's a title Contender these feelings were really good you know it's it was always kind of you know is is the thumb going up or down when he came out of a car for the first time I remember also L monolo was there often and it was really everybody kind of waiting for Michael's reaction when he came out of the car saine he won 12 of the opening 13 races That season did he ever take winning for granted no definitely not and I think if you do that that's becoming very dangerous because then you kind of let loose and Michael NE never did that as as much as he was questioning himself prior to a season he was also questioning himself during a season and even after that many victories he would still go into a race and but well we have to be careful and maybe not and we have to take care of that he was he hated the feeling to be not 100% prepared and so he was working the same amount and the same deepness if I can say that like this into every race The Testament to that is if you look at him celebrating on the podiums I think you never had the feeling that he kind of wasn't exactly enjoying the win number s 5 as he did number three I always felt how can you say that man is a machine which at the time a lot of people were because he was just constantly delivering and I always thought look at him just look at him at the podium you see he's full of emotions it's funny we're talking about the podium because he wins the title at Spar but he doesn't actually win that race cuz Kimmy reenan won that do you think that irked him in any way way that he didn't win the race in which he won the title definitely that definitely irked him he was he was coming up and he was really if I may say pissed is maybe too strong a word but he was because it was the winning title and because it was in Spa he would have wanted it to be the perfect uh you know moment and having not won the race and having come second it was it was like you know he wasn't really happy about that what do you think title number seven meant to him I don't think it had a specific meaning more than title number six for him it was just the confirmation of that group of friends sticking together and in a way it was the confirmation that when you work well together as a group of friends that this is more successful as fighting against each other and maybe you know trying to beat out performance of somebody by bad treatment or whatever he always felt it's nice that the Harmony in the group brings the better results and I think for many years that was the case in in that specific group that they had because they were kind of so trustful to each other they were really working All in One Direction and I think they enjoyed it a lot because it was really a a Harmony they weren't kind of working against each other and Michael enjoyed that spirit in the team massively and did he enjoy a good party with the people in the team I mean like let's talk about the Sunday night of Spar he's just won the title I imagine the celebrations were big the celebrations were always big and there were always a lot of Celebration even during the season and um I have I mean Michael is he's born in Ken which is close to cologne and cologne in Germany the people from there they really know how to party is probably too weak a word for what they do so and and Michael was you know from that area and he he could party and he partied hard and he loved to party hard and it was uh I have a lot of very very good memories of heavy parties and that was really nice and Michael was kind of as much as he liked to take them with him on the success he also liked to make people drunk and you know draw them into a party and let them go loose and because Italians I remember after the 2000 title when it was the the big party it was not so easy to get them to you know to get them to make them drunk he loves he has such an infectious character doesn't he that's that's what I remember of that era but there were also other highlights in 04 and I did want to ask you about Japan when he and brother Ralph were first and second did a result like that mean a lot to Michael yes of course I mean it was kind of his little brother and of course there were rivals on the track and both were representing that teams and so on so they had to fight against and they they did fight against each other as they were in their childhood but still it's your kind of your little brother and when when R was carding when he was a kid and carding Michael was his mechanic so Michael was just really proud you know yeah that meant well these few podiums there were more than than just one when they were together on the podiums Michael was really proud about about R's achievements so sine final one for me is do you think 2004 was Michael's best season clearly statistically it was his best season and I think from the ease that he kind of did achieve the results that he that he had in that year it's probably fair to say it was his best season sometimes these winds are sweeter when they are really very very difficult and some of the wins were maybe a bit easier in that year but at the same time time it was I always had the feeling in all the years there were more more and more puzzle parts coming together and in 2004 it was just the Pinnacle of that group what they were able to achieve and it was a display of quality and the display of sporting class which was also beautiful I I felt and a lot of people blamed him for being too dominant and making it uh boring and I always felt that's just sporting extra class and that's also very beautiful yes it was the Pinnacle of what that group was able to achieve Peak Ferrari I also love what sine said about Michael the man at the beginning he was calm he was kind and 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for me that was not joining a team or starting a working experience was putting the first step in a dream because when I started my study in engineering I was dreaming one day to have the chance to enter in Ferrari and starting with Ferrari for me whatever I was going to find was fantastic but actually I found out that the team itself was fantastic because was plenty of super talented people there was Ross Bron Rory burn Stefano domali Nicholas tomazi Salo Costa and then a young student joining could also try to give a contribution but more than everything was just admiring this uh group of fantastic technician and two amazing drivers because at that time straight away I realized walking into the company how big was the junction the love the combination between the people working Michael and also Ruben at that time so by 2004 what job were you doing inside the team by 2004 I was uh a bit older four years at that time four years were looking like 40 years because everything was happening in such an intense way that my experience especially life experience was growing at the level to be part of the racing team so I started like a a lab engineer and 2004 I was the gearbox engineer for the racing team looking after the gear shift gearbox assembly gearbox relability clutch uh power steering system so I was traveling all the races with the team dealing with the drivers dealing with the others engineer learning and trying to give a contribution and tell us a little bit more about the contribution in terms of the gearbox how many kilometers would they do how many gearboxes did you get through in a season that was a completely different age compared to to now there were basically no limitation one of the thing that was more amazing was the number of Gears you had to choose now you have eight gears and are those eight for all the year no at that time the gear B Ferrari gear BOS had seven gears but you had 72 gears pair to be picked up and decided session by session I I remember that we were very used to change uh ratios cross sessions we were are also sometime forced to change uh ratios for instance I remember very well in 2003 between qualifying War map that it was in 2003 and and the qu itself so that was challenging was a lot related to driving style what the driver wants to do but then there was the power steering that was a bit of a nightmare there there was the differential control the start there was quite a lot to do it's not that the gearbox engineer was doing everything by itself but was a let's say was the expert the hardware expert the control expert and then there were the performance engineer for Michael was Andreas Stella that I think you know quite well as well that we giving the Target and together we were trying to make the driver and the car happy and there had been a rule change going into 2004 as well there was a ban on fully automatic gearboxes how did that change what you had to do well at the beginning was a bit of a a scary change because we had the feeling that could have been much more complicated but it ended up that was manageable and drivers were talented enough good enough to learn how to handle without doing damages is like when the traction control was B all over a sudden you find yourself saying a the driver will not be able to handle it instead is not it's a different game we have seen plenty of them honestly on the gearbox the big step change was with the fast shift gear boxes that were introduced a couple of year later the the 2004 situation was more a a fear that didn't really turn out to be a real danger so how confident were you going into the season you've done a lot of testing with the F2 2004 did you know that you had a good car we have just to remember that we were coming from a year where we won but struggling a lot I mean winning last race as in 2003 after all the struggles we had and so on was for sure giving us pressure over winter and at that time the simulation level the level of preparation you could have carried out off the track was not at the level of today so till the first running day we were I'm not saying scared but we had doubts but I will never forget the face of Michael when jumped out from the car after the first lap in Fano and the smiley head and at that time we realized that the car was good now this is a sport where everyone is very competitive and there are plenty of drivers that can do a good a good product so you do not erase one but already testing was uh quite a positive push and from first race onwards we were just waiting to the time in which the mathematics would have told that the championship well you're right it was an amazing season Michael won 12 of the opening 13 races what what was it like to ride that wave of success with Michael I it was unbelievable is quite obvious to say that that is in my memory the best Formula 1 year I lived because of the success because of the team because of Michael leading the team and because of the pleasure of starting for a race weekend knowing that you can win you will win how you will win is the real question mark and then how you will enjoy the win is the next step no after some races one of the main focus of the weekend was where are we going to play soccer on Thursday night really yeah because it was part of being the team that we no enjoying what we were doing and Michael Stefan Ross Todd were all part of this fantastic atmosphere and Michael used to play in those football matches with you Michael used to play Michael was crazy for this football matches I'm not joking on Thursday after the preparation that was needed the focus was where do we play how do we do the teams who is going to stay with Michael and against Michael how is going to be the match what do we do after the match but was not because we didn't care was part of the atmosphere Michael won 72% of the races that year do you have a standout memory a highlight to be honest that year has been a calade of fantastic memories so I would put on top of everything the last now B when we finally had the mathematical confirmation and we could have won that was something like okay we have enjoyed so far now we can enjoy even more and go so the beginning with the Shakedown in Fano that to be honest having a driver coming off a driver like Michael so not a driver that is the first time he drives a car now a driver that knows what he says when he comes down coming down in that way and winning uh immediately after the summer break that was not even a summer break at the time is a a good picture of how pleas was that season can you remember how you celebrated I can remember but I don't know if I can tell you no no we did the joking Ferrari and Michael we took all the hotel and we did a super party Among Us I still have pictures of the party hidden in my in my desk was a good one Diego you've worked with many great drivers during your time at Ferrari Fernando Alonzo's been here Sebastian vettel's been here charl and Carlos now kimy Kimmy of course but what stood out about Michael schuma what made him different I think Michael is a fantastic team player what makes uh Michael of another level compared to everyone else in my experience is how genuine and how real is attitude to be part of a team obviously a driver is an athlete that wants to win but he never ever gave the impression that the team was not at the same center of his project at the center of his mind team being everyone mechanics Engineers he was having always award for everyone always be interested to everyone always correct with everyone and with the team as well I think you cannot recollect a single interview or a single Declaration of Michael against the team in whatever situation stress no stress winning or losing never I still remember when we failed the the engine in 2006 and he came into the radio and said sorry guys he said sorry guys he didn't say what sorry guys I think we failed the engine no and that is something you feel and all the team was feeling I'm not saying that the others have not the skill but at that moment in time for me that I was young and so on that was uh the most evident I suppose last one from me Diego you you've been at the team throughout how does the Ferrari of today compared to the Ferrari of 2004 what are the biggest differences first of all we need to put everything in the right place what do I mean is a different Formula 1 Formula 1 now is a completely different business is much more complicated there are much more constraints Ferrari at the early 2000 was really the place where you whatever you think you needed whatever you think may have been helpful to win you had to do no limits because nobody could have given us limits we wanted to win we had the resources to win and we had no constraints now rules are strict Financial regulation uh limiting running at the track limitting and you you have to pick up uh your right targets and to follow and this is changing the approach of everyone no and Ferrari is different most of everything because of that in my opinion but one thing is still the same if you go inside Ferrari factory you can breathe the atmosphere of family the atmosphere of commitment whatever you need there will be someone in Ferrari that will work day and night for weeks to achieve [Music] it the commitment of everyone in Ferrari still sounds very much the same today as it was back in 2004 although I like what Diego says about the soccer matches on Thursdays being Central to the team's race weekend plans in 2004 I remember watching some of those matches they were intense affairs with Michael fr and Center Diego thanks for your insights and my thanks as well to Andrea and Sabine and as we head to Monza for the Italian Grand Prix it's interesting to take a moment to Remember That season in 2004 which was dominated by Ferrari and Michael schea I hope you enjoyed the show and as ever please let me know what you think through all the usual means I'm at Tom Clarkson F1 or you can use the #f1 beyond the grid and thank you for what you sent in about last week's show with Charla Clair charl is a popular driver with you we got hundreds of messages including this from meline baroom charl is such an awesome and modest person I was really happy for him to finally win in Monaco I really hope he will win some drivers championships because he deserves it fza Charles thanks for that message meline well that's almost it for this week remember if you want to hear interviews with people who raced with and against Michael schumacker scroll through our previous episodes you'll find Ross brwn ruin barello Kimmy reenan Fernando Alonzo and many more and don't forget F1 nation's review of The Dutch Grand Prix is out now I'm joined by Red Bull Sim racing driver Yano opir and f1.com editor Greg Stewart to discuss Lando Norris's statement victory in xanor that's it from me I'll be back next week with another great guest from the world of Formula 1 thanks very much for listening F1 Beyond The Grid is produced by Formula 1 and Audi boom Studios until next time keep it flat out [Music]