Transcript for:
Effective Communication Strategies for Entrepreneurs

sometimes a a mistake I see entrepreneurs make is you say so what's your business what do you do and they give you the most complicated answer I've ever heard in a million years yeah and you see people like okay cool they're not contemptuous of you they don't understand and they're contemptuous of that right so if you're introducing yourself or you're explaining something you're like gosh Vanessa I'm seeing this contempt Everywhere You Are Over complicating it you need to go for clarity over confusion people should be able to quickly understand what you do and who you are and what you want what you want from [Applause] them so obviously I love creating content WE Post like 50 pieces of it across all my platforms and if you've ever created content you know the uphill battle it can be to ideate write produce film video and then you have to edit it all so one of my favorite tools to use for this is Riverside you've probably heard about it before but I don't think people realize that it's revolutionized the podcast Space by allowing creators all over the world to do the recording in 4k regardless of internet speed but they've just released an update that I think any Creator is going to love so along with the high quality video and audio that they've kind of become known for you can have editing software so you can edit any video content directly in Riverside if your team's a little bit more bougie like mine and wants to record the video themselves and then you can upload it to Riverside so you can use their amazing AI tools afterwards it can transcribe your video add customizable caption Analyze That transcri script to cut out any dead space in the video and my favorite part they have this AI editor feature that will pull short form from clips from my content so we can squeeze all the juice of it out from the many hours it takes to create it if you think time is money like I do then Riverside has given me and my team back lots of time AKA money so I love these guys and because I love you I got you guys a deal so try Riverside for yourself with the link in this episode's description you can sign up for free using the link and discount code Cody at checkout for a discount on any paid plan welcome back to the big deal podcast I'm Cody Sanchez and this podcast is for those of you who don't just want to be rich but free and are willing to do what it takes to get there okay this week we have on somebody that I go to Every time I am struggling with how do I communicate with somebody with why isn't my team doing what I want it to do with why can't I get my husband to do what I want him to do and her name is Vanessa van Edwards you guys might know her because she has one of the most popular TED talks of all time on communication and the cues give with our body that tell people things without us even moving our mouth she runs something called science of people which is a large psychology based business on how can we use behavioral cues in order for us to get what we want out of life to live better lives to be more successful she also is a bestselling author times to frequently on Good Morning America CNBC MSNBC you guys are kind of in for a treat because she has only done two podcasts this year Mel Robbins and now mine what I love about Vanessa is she talks about things that are applicable to our everyday lives that we can take away and take real action on but all backed by science and so she is like a walking Encyclopedia of studies and experiments that you can then take and apply to your business so in this episode today we go over how do you pitch somebody something so that they will buy it we talk about how in your business do you communicate in meetings that is probably making people not like you and you to be less successful we talk about how to communicate with members of the opposite sex to actually figure out if they're into you or going to be into you and vice versa we also talk about how do you run a business or be successful in business if you're an introvert or if you don't really like people and one of my favorite ones how do you tell people no but get them to thank you so I think you guys are really going to like this episode let's Dive Right into to a story that kind of blew my mind when Vanessa started we got to start with one of my favorite stories Shark Tank ring I'll say no more okay ring billion dooll company now was a great idea video doorbell okay Jamie simov has this idea he has lots of growth lots of traction he goes on Shark Tank you think Nob brainer he enters the tank he does a pitch not a good one but does a pitch shows Revenue numbers has really promising numbers and he doesn't get a deal months later he gets an investment from Sha Richard Branson but he failed in shk tank and it is the perfect example and it was sobering for me this is back in 2012 2013 where he had a great idea a literally a million dollar idea but he didn't know how to pitch it and it failed and that is the problem is I think a lot of business owners have Amazing Ideas doesn't matter how good your idea is if you don't know how to pitch it it will not sell let's watch a second of this clip who's there it's Jamie here to pitch who it's Jamie come [Music] in sharks wouldn't it been nice to know who was behind the door before you let me in with my product you can what do you take away from this what are the learning lessons so that we can only be the ring founder after he became a billionaire not during shark take okay so here's a big mistake that people make when they're pitching pitching on stage pitching on a video call pitching to an investor is they prep their pitch and not their first impression but people decide how smart you are how trustworthy you are and if they're going to like your idea when they first see you that is even before your opening line and so what I learned in that was that his first impression was one of the worst first impressions I've ever seen wow so what he did is he was trying to be clever is he came in and he knocked on the door of the Shark Tank and they said who's there and he said it's Jamie here to pitch an idea and he asked his own name in that moment I think he lost the deal the reason for this is because an accidental question inflection when you accidentally ask your name or your number or your statement people question you and so I think in his opening line and this is a mistake people make all the time is they ask their name or they ask their number and you're begging people to negotiate with you and do tons of sales trainings right and here's what I hear all the time we'd love to have your business we'd love to work with you and the price of that will be $5,000 you ask your number you're people I don't really believe this number and neither should you those people have the lowest clothes low lowest clo rates the biggest push back and also people lack confidence in you so I think that the first impressions was the really big one there is it's before you even open your mouth or your very first line is actually going to set you up for an entire pitch fascinating so what should it sound like okay so instead you want to use What's called the downward inflection and you want to do this it's much more authoritative is when we're speaking as humans well can I share a really good study just like a juicy study okay so most people when they think about how to pitch they think about the words they use maybe the what they're wearing or their body language but actually our vocal power is a secret way that we can show confidence and here's a study they brought doctors into their recording studio and they have them record 10-second voice tone Clips like this hi my name is Dr Edwards I specialize in oncology and I work at Children's Presbyterian hospital they took these clips and they warbled the words so you could hear the pitch the volume the pace the Cadence but not the actual words being said then they asked participants to listen listen to these clips and the gobble sounded like I worked really hard on practicing nailed it nailed it yeah yes thank you so they listened to CL and they said how smart is this person do you like this person the doctors who had the lowest ratings in warmth and competence had the highest rate of malpractice lawsuits wow which means that when you first say hey my name is Vanessa how you say that is right then people are just like how smart and how trustworthy you are and so when we're talking about vocal power the biggest mistake that doctors made is they asked their names they said hi my name is Dr Edwards I specialize in oncology I work at Children's prian Hospital what would have been better is going on the downward inflection so that sounds like this hi my name is Dr Edwards I specialize in oncology I work at Children's Presbyterian Hospital oh yeah I believe you oh my gosh right even I would hire me and I'm not a doctor you know um someone who was really good at this Barack Obama Barack Obama there is a Cadence he has to his voice and I do terrible Impressions I will try it for you but I do terrible Impressions he used to go down or he still goes down at the end of his sentences which makes you sit up and listen so he this is my really bad Barack Obama impression okay right here it goes I'm going talk about nothing in our country today we really have to work on something serious if we don't work on this problem we are going to have a major challenge right like he is slinging his words down at you and as humans we think whoa if he's going that low and he's telling us what to do it might better be real interesting and so it almost doesn't even matter what the content is but we hear that vocal tone so when you're practicing your pitches practice stating your name practice stating your numbers and whatever question makes you nervous like when investor like so what's the competition in the market do not ask tell fascinating do you use this also in interpersonal relations not just pitches like what is constantly what what scenarios would you use this in is this how you communicate with your team and also how you communicate with your husband yes so uh luckily I have think about all these cues as a science and they are happening all the time I think there are about 96 cues that people choose from like they actually can pick these out and use them in interpersonal relationships and it happens down to asking your husband where he wants to go to dinner it comes down to uh telling your kids what you want them to do I notice that parents who have kids who don't listen as much are asking what they want them to do instead of saying what they want them to do so gosh you're right so this is an assertiveness issue right when we talk about assertiveness in the workplace at home and interpersonal relationships if you state your needs people are much more likely to listen to them and so it is happening all the time but it's not just vocal power right it's also um how we carry ourselves the kinds of words we use in fact the kinds of words we use change how people treat us for example there was a study I love this study they wanted to know if a single word could change the way people acted they brought them into the lab sold them into two two groups one group was told today you're going to play the Wall Street game the second group was told today you're going to play the community game the trick was the games were the same they wanted to know if that one single word switch would change how they interacted everyone who was told they were playing the Wall Street game shared an average of a third of their profits people who were told they were playing a community game shared 2third of their profits that means that when we hear words like Community we are primed to actually act more collaboratively to actually act more communally when we are primed to act in a competitive way like Wall Street we actually are less generous but more more competitive so the words you're using with your kids with your spouses with your friends on your team they are changing things the biggest mistake I see is bosses send out meeting video call one-on-one what a missed opportunity if you are doing that you are blending in I open my calendar multiple times a day call it what you want them to do in that meeting you want a strategic meeting call it strategic goal setting meeting collaboration team session accountability call that that way every single time someone opens their calendar they're literally being primed on how they should act and behave in that moment that's such good advice I'm totally going to steal that yes you know it's interesting because I was at an event the other day well I was actually a church and and what I thought was fascinating is I went to two different churches over the course of two weeks because we're looking for a church here in Austin that I want to be a part of you saw in the group text and and one of the ones I went to blew me away because of their priming so they opened it up and they talked about how at this church they were a community so they used that word one then they said and at this community the job is not for the church and the book to serve you it is for you to serve the book and the church yes that in fact if you want to become a better person and if you want to achieve more of your goals and what you want out of life that means you have to give first and so it was funny because I was listening to it I was like God these chairs are sort of uncomfortable you know I was like I was like gosh yeah I'm like the you know the lighting this could be like a better setup I'm I'm critiquing what's happening in church which is totally not normal and um but as I'm doing that and he says if there is something that you want differently if there is something that you think should change who should be the person to change it if not you then who who should be the person to change it and everyone is like me and I was like oh that's so good because what does that do the second you in your event in your company uh then feel like there's something that needs to change your employees will feel like they're the ones that can actually help you make the change and that was a purposeful introduction they thought and they said what purpose are we going to give everyone because we are infectious right we are emotionally contagious as humans and so you have to think if I'm emotionally contagious what contagion do I want to spread do I want to spread influence power persuasion kindness wealth happiness what are those things you have to be purposeful they were they were planning on what those words were going to be when they first got there same thing as your team meetings what is the onew goal yeah is it collaboration or is it get it done right when you are starting a team call here's my H my least favorite thing people get on a team call and they go well uh we'll get started in a few we'll let everyone log in no yeah no that is a wasted opportunity and it means you're not being purposeful no your meetings start the moment you come on if you're a boss and they start with your intention for the meeting all right everyone today we're going to do a big review and I want to get really clear on some goals but first I want to start with tell me something good every team call I do we everyone on the team because we're all remote uh two of us are in Austin we say share something good because I noticed that we were starting accidentally on the negative I think this is also if you're a leader we can do good by being good communicators yeah and so if you are starting your team calls with oh the traffic the numbers the problems so stressed so busy so hectic what a scarcity mindset that is and you are contagious y you say you're stressed you just infected your whole team with stress because moods usually go from the top down y so I would rather you be positively contagious that sets up such a good culture it sets up such good loyalty so I noticed my team calls were like negative like accidentally so so I was like no no we changing this so everyone sh something good you know what my team member told me she said every Tuesday we have our team call and on Monday I do more good things so that you have so she has something to share on Tuesdays and so I think that part of this is about being more charismatic and having more influence and pitching your ideas part of is also let's spread more good like let's be positively contagious and that means being purposeful that means no more accidental openers sorry I'm late it's been so busy never ask someone explain what an accidental opener is because that is beautiful line I think doing an accidental opener is the worst way for a leader to lead yes okay accidental openers happen when you have whatever is the top of your mind and it comes out of your mouth and youve just changed the nature of the entire communication or interaction right so it's this is the question that can we please go on a diet no more been busy is it your busy season oh man how was that bad thing that happened last month still happening right you are literally juicing bad right right so I like purposeful openers right so that's create a norm in your team where you're adding a personal purpose open that people can prepare for that also respects your introverts so I I I love my extroverted leaders but extroverted leaders sometimes can actually turn off employees and lose them if they push them out of their introvert boundaries so if you're like we're going to do a new Icebreaker every single week for an introvert they're like please no right so you have a norm on the team that we talk about something good or or we share something we've learned or we do a goal review okay next is in your interpersonal Rea relationships is level up by asking better questions you want to literally juice dopamine look dopamine does a lot of things in our body I will not over complicate it but it is the chemical of motivation when someone has dopamine coursing through their bodies they are motivated to talk open up say yes invest do new things say new things it's the chemical of excitement we can juice it with our questions and an accidental opener misses dopamine opportunities so here's my favorite dopamine opener working on anything exciting these days yeah please stop asking people what they do I think when you ask someone what do you do first of all it's a social script you just told their brain go on autopilot I'm going to ask the same boring questions as I always ask and second if someone is not defined by what they do they are answering on autopilot and then they are they have no DOP mean at all right their brain is off they're thinking about their to-do list if you ask someone working on anything exciting these days you are giving them such a beautiful contagion which is they get to think through their head exciting exciting exciting exciting that is literally juicing dopamine from excitement in their own life and gives them permission to tell you what they want to tell you it's really good yeah in a perfect worlds too then you never have somebody say oh I'm just a mom right now I'm just which is also one of my pet peeps I'm like gosh but that is my fault that I opened up the question in a way that made them go automatically to a just answer I I think it's our fault I think we're in charge of how people treat us you cue people to how you want to be treated and that's with the kinds questions you ask the kinds of words you use how you're holding your body language and how you're using your voice so if you want to be treated with more respect more liability you got to spread it let's talk about that if you want to be treated with more respect what do you do from a body language perspective okay so respect is a good one so research has shown that 80 2% of our impressions of people are based on two traits warmth and competence it's not how attractive you are it's not how tall you are it's not how rich you are it's not how successful you are it's literally how fast can you signal I'm a friend trust and you can rely on me competence and so from a body language perspective the faster you can signal those two things the moment you hop on screen the moment you get on a video the moment you into a room the more people like you and respect you interesting so it is a balance so what I like to think about is like a recipe is there are warmth non-verbal cues and there are competent non-verbal cues so warm cues these make sense right smiling authentic smiling a warmth que um you're nodding nodding is a warmth queue right when you do a triple nod research shows that I will speak 67% longer wow so when you're so just going oh I got to start adding all but not Bobble heading which is this no oh right too much well also that that's also not good right too much so if you do a slow triple n here I'll demo it for you okay the other person speaks 67% longer so this is a mhm M stop okay right that is a non-verbal dot dot dot you're telling the other person I hear you I see you tell me more now the pace of this is also important so you only want to do three and pause and you want to do them slowly so slow is engage and curious tell me more tell me more tell me more fast is impatience mhm o yeah so a little secret here is if you want someone to like wrap it up or speed it up not that you ever would you can go uhhuh it's literally a signal for them to to stop talking so warmth cues smiling nodding a head tilt so watch the difference between a a still face and a head tilt so if I were to say I have some news I have some news a head tilt immediately softens you it immediately adds more warmth that's a small warmth cue um competence cues there's there's like 15 of them but those are the easy ones the competence cues some of my favorites are like a steeple right so even this is just more wise and competent if it feels natural to you like some people look like like don't be Mr Burns you know like right so you got to kind of be careful this is on my book cover and you love it I know I do love your book cover right but I'm not so you have to be careful with this one but that's a high confidence no because your book cover you've got the crossed legs so it's like you're dainty but you're also smart dainty yeah CU you cross your ankles I feel like I always think dainty I'll take it yeah um it's a great book by the way the book's name is Q's to give you a little plug but all of this is in there so the the cover is literally a perfect balance of warmth and competence as are most of my social media posts so if you look at my Instagram grid it's warm competent warm competent maybe we'll be warm warm competent competent we'll have a study post and then a post of me being silly and then a funny meme and then a really hard-hitting study so even in your business like can I give a business example please okay so Casper mattresses is an interesting one like kind of took the mattress Market by storm and they could have had better mattresses sure but their marketing was a perfect blend of warmth and competence they on their web page they would have like kids bouncing on clouds and they would have our research scientists in the Casper lab and it was a whole science section and they would have like a quote from Vogue about like the best night sleep ever and then they would have um someone in a lab coat like like you know testing a mattress right it literally you could count the warmth and competence and that for a human when they are looking for trust reliability trust reliability is IM immediately helpful we can do the same thing with our words so for example I love to guess someone's warmth and competence based on their email sent folder so a challenge for you is oh no oh no all right we're going to look at Cody's email sent folder so you can go into their email sent folder and I count up the warm words and the competent words warm words are words that trigger oxytocin that makes us feel collaborative so they're words like best both happy together cheers collaborate team words that are competent make us want to get it done they're words like motivation efficient power through goal Mastery achieve so I can tell you how your team rates you on warmth and competence based on your email sent folder emojis are warm exclamation points are warm um data charts graphs numbers are competent and so when you're writing important emails on all the emails there should be a blend of both warmth and confidence your LinkedIn profile should be a blend of warmth and confidence your landing pages should be a blend of warmth and competence I think I over index on the competence yeah yeah although I think it's really interesting because you talked from a social perspective we've noticed that lately too that I am so high on the uh indexing for competence or what Chris Voss would call assertive too that um when people meet me to interview me we've had I had two well actually I think Khloe said it to me she met me and she was like gosh you're actually you're really nice and warm and kind and I was like yes but yeah it's a common thing that because my my content is very serious yes the same thing I was told um you're so much nicer than you look yeah I get that too why do you think I wear pink it's actually very smart it's very you have to balance and so this is this is what's really important is Oprah Winfrey is a good example of this so Oprah Winfrey has a very very high balance of warmth and competence and we like people who have both high of both right but she's as a dial right it's like a thermostat right like we like it between 68 and 72 I don't want you to dial all the way but like when Oprah Winfrey is with like a victim she is crying with them she is touching them she's leaning in those are all warmth cues when she's with like a political comment commentator she changes her cues are much more competent she's quieter she's less facially expressive she makes more eye contact she's still with her body she has less gestures those are all competent gestures so you can also dial and this is what I think the most advanced leaders do and Jamie simov learned to do this going back to ring he learned to do this I think that was a a bad pitch in Shark Tank which by the way it's not obviously bad like if you were to go watch the Pitch you would be like I don't know what happened but something happened yeah I think he learned how to pitch with both warmth and competence as anyone can look at your slide deck right in your slide deck it should not be all numbers and competence in fact the research says this is a quote competence without warmth leaves people feeling suspicious people will be suspicious of your ideas and your numbers if you do not know how to add warmth cues and that is what you are struggling with is you know instinctively if I come across as too hard or too competent people are suspicious of me and they are and that is because we have to have a balance of both yeah it goes to trustworthiness yeah a lot of our presentations we use memes because memes are an easy way to transfer somebody else's warmth to you you know I'm not the greatest joke teller of all time you're good you're funny oh thanks but then when I can add somebody else's meme in there then it softens up sort of the hard blows of business that are realities okay like let's get practical right so like in your presentation I like to switch a warmth something into your presentation like every 2 minutes yeah so this is very practical so competence in a presentation data charts graphs research science study warmth memes gifts demos fuzzy wuzzy social proof personal stories quotes quotes good love qu qu because they make you feel something immediately and you don't have to come up with it it's warm right right so you're if you can take that list and you can just make it so that they're even your presentations will be so much stronger same thing on your social media same thing in your promos same thing in your ads yeah it's a great Point yeah I always wondered you know one of the fun things I like to do is go into Facebook ad library and you can watch in my spare time okay you so you can go into Facebook library and you can see all the ads that somebody's running okay of any business okay what okay and so if you want to try to understand the psychology of selling of business it's really easy to see in Facebook and if the ads have been running for a long period of time you know that the ad has been working so if you look at the brand new ads I don't know maybe they work maybe they don't but if they've been running for a few months okay this ad is working and then I like to go into the ad and see well why is it working and oftentimes it's not what you expect it's like oh this had something catchy in it and it was some sort of warmth and entertainment and then finally it got to the content it finally it got to the close so this is the curse of smart people this is why we have so many failed entrepreneurs and failed businesses is because they're super smart and that is actually a problem in communication super smart people have great ideas they have data to back it up they have the whole plan but if you do not know how to PR pitch your idea or package your idea with warmth people will not believe it and so smart people rely very heavily on I want to put an ad and say you know 50% returns or 20% cheaper than the competitor but people don't buy from just competi alone they have to trust you first yeah that's such a good point you know speaking of of trust it also reminds me that as the bigger you get the bigger the Target that you have and you know we love David until he becomes Goliath and one thing that we've talked about before that I thought was genius is thinking about how somebody like Taylor Swift stays so high on the warmth scale when she is a billionaire she is highly competent gor and she gets you know her tickets are 5x more expensive than anybody else and yet people love her can you talk a little bit about what you see in t- Swift so you're you're so generous because actually I was totally making fun of T Swift okay I love her but I was making fun of her because she does a specific non-verbal cue that just kills me because it is I I here's what it is whenever she walks into a room you watch her documentary half of the documentary is her doing what I call the humble Q which is this it's true and so she's in a stadium a soldout stadium with a like whatever 50,000 people and she's like how did you all get here oh my gosh for me that we love it we love it we love it because she's we're like she's so successful she's so knows her stuff but look at how humble she is right this is why these documentaries are working this is why so many people are doing them is because what do you see you like oh there he's so successful he's on stage but then you see him like making his own coffee yeah oh he makes his own Cofe he spills a little oh like there's studies on this where Dr Richard wisman had a a model triy to sell a blender in a mall okay a blender and he did two trials of this experiment one where she did a demo of the blender hi good morning folks we're going to demo this blender for you strawberry banana here's the blender smoothies for all okay a perfect presentation then she had the second version of this same words same smoothie same everything but she spills the smoothie hi everyone so happy to sell you this blender strawberry man oh no here's that smoothie for you so sorry the blender when she made the mistake she sold so many more of that blender when she made the mistake because I think people were like real vulnerable it's okay and so when I talk about warmth it's also vulnerability it's also admitting the problem or the mistake or making a mistake or not having a perfect pitch which for smart people they are allergic to okay yeah it's true allergic I have so much respect for Mel Robbins yes because she's so good at showing her vulnerabilities and being honest about some of the stuff that's going on in the world yes and I think that people see that and go okay if she's willing to share that she must be real can I tell you how she does it also so she does it verbally but here's a non-verbal cue that Mel uses and I should make fun of mail for this she's the only other interview I did this year other than you so this is her non-verbal queue ready guys guys can I just tell you this one tip she self- touches her face yeah probably just like totally messed up you look great so thees okay so self-touching your face is a cue of anxiety or nervousness it is also a vulnerability so you will notice that I think Mel Robbins touches her face far more than any other influencer and you know what we love it interesting we love it because we know instinctively I think Cornell found that were four behaviors nonverbal behaviors that trigger untrustworthiness like make you not want to trust a person touching the face or the hair is one of them uh touching the stomach uh rubbing your arms and I believe lack of eye contact they just signal distrust so when Mel gets on video and she self- touches it immediately makes you think oh is she nervous oh me too ah wait but how does that work so this usually makes you not like somebody or I said signals untrustworthiness because we think of make they're nervous but if she's giving us really comp competent advice we're like oh she's nervous but she's giving us good advice interesting I want to be very clear all these cues do not have to do with your actual trust yeah yeah yeah right like we're talking about perceptions of trust and competence which are just as important as your actual trust and competence and that's what I think a lot of smart people get wrong is they think I have the best system I have the best business and I'm trustworthy of course people will buy and then they're shocked why no one buys or they don't understand why their sales teams cannot close it is because I listen in on these Sal calls and I can tell you down to the cue why they are not closing and it is because they can have the best pitch in the world the best script but if they are giving away their competence people will not believe them interesting yeah and I think often when people try to sell in business they try to maybe promise what they actually can deliver which is like a good night's sleep cast for a mattress and people go that's too hard there's no way you could possibly deliver to me and so they almost oversell the thing that they actually do but they'd be better off saying a pretty good night sleep yeah a little bit better than your last night's sleep masteress and people go actually that's probably doable and I think that's a great yeah that's a great point in marketing and sales too I think that their tagline was something like um reliable prices with uh science-backed engineering like even their tagline was the Perfect Blend of warmth and conf competence words and they they were very honest with like here are how our Engineers have tested this mattress and so you could kind of see the process so another way you can add warmth is you can show behind the scenes like I think that like when you're showing behind the scenes people are like oh she's real totally and so like that's the other way the other element you can add there is like real behind the scenes as well yeah I don't think enough people we talk about this a lot here too which is document don't create and it's and it's really hard to do actually because you're in it you're working and but if you can actually document okay we're going to save a business to today okay we just closed on a deal right here then people actually can see you doing it in a world with the lowest trust levels since before the age of the internet yes um it's necessary yes so it's smart now I want to talk a little bit about um like I think a lot of times in first inter our actions we're scared we're scared to pitch we're scared for an interview we're scared to sell can you hide fear does it matter can other people feel that you're not going to like this answer very much but uh our emotions are contagious and so if you're afraid people will pick up on it so there's a study that changed the way I think about this which is they brought people into their lab and they sold them up to two different groups one group they wore sweat suits and ran on a treadmill so that they got sweat into this suit and they collected the sweat second group they said you're going to skydive for the first time put them in sweatsuits and push them out of a plane they took the two samples of sweat this is where it gets kind of gross they asked unsuspecting participants to smell both of the sweat they had no idea what they were smelling in an fmri machine everyone who smelled the fear sweat the skydiving sweat caught the fear they had no idea what they were smelling but their amydala lit up where they were afraid what this shows us is that when you are afraid you are sending off all kinds of signals that you don't even realize not only your face not only your voice but also even your chemical physiology and so this is why I think it's really critically important for my introverted entrepreneurs my introverted business owners is you got to get yourself right before you walk into a room and you got to know your stuff right like no one can fake warmth and competence we can I can give you the cues to help but if you are truly afraid that you don't know your numbers or you don't know your stuff people are going to pick up on it that I think is the definition of inauthenticity right it's like you're faking a number or you're faking warmth with someone now I will say that I think that we can convert our fear into different kinds of social energy so it's very important for people to understand are you an introvert Ambert or extrovert most people think of just introvert and extrovert there's actually a third category and most people are ambiverts and you have to be very precise about what causes you fear or drains your battery and what gives you energy for example I am an ambt I can kind of switch between the two I know who gives me energy like I leave being like yes like when we hang out with AO girlfriends I feel energized after I don't feel drained whereas I have certain people where I'm like in a coma afterwards right we've all that right so you got to know who are the people what are the places who are the teammates or the tasks that drain you the fastest and then you should divide your energy like a social battery that helps conquer the fear because being a little bit afraid because you're nervous is not a bad thing but being drained and afraid that's a deal breaker that's a great point so basically you could even if you're scared you could at least be prepared to be scared exactly and you can know okay I'm bringing my favorite team member I'm bring my favorite wing woman I love my deck I just redesigned my slides it's gorgeous I have warmth and competence that's going to make me feel good so even though you're a little bit afraid pitching out there you know your stuff you know your deck you have your wing woman and you're doing it at an ideal time for you right like you can begin to we can game our energy in that way and that's really important on teams as well like you should know your team members who's introverted who's extroverted on your team who's everted on your team your introverts never put them on the spot for collaboration yeah that's an insult to them right if you want them to collaborate or share their idea send them an email ahead of time and say hey tomorrow we're doing a strategy session I'm going be talking about some big ideas for X in the fall I would love your ideas on how we can do things differently interesting that gives them 24 hours to prepare for that to prepare for it as opposed to bum you know in the room they're going to trigger fear right you're going to say what are your ideas next for the fall they're going to be like H not because they're not smart but because they're in a situation that makes them feel uncomfortable what personality tests you use for your team in order to tell who is what okay so I highly recommend if you're going to going to hire do behavioral interviewing so that's less like skill and strength based and that's more Behavior based um and my favorite practice for hiring is doing alphabet work so this is basically figuring out what is your ABCD work and what is their ABCD work very simply this is your awor is work that you are better at than most people like what are you better at than most people where do you hit flow what are you most productive in a work tasks and communication B work B work is the trick BW work is what trick RS up my smart people BW work you're pretty good at but you're not great at it you're not better than everyone at it and you can get away with it but you kind of dread it cwork you're average you do it just like everyone else it kind of clunky it kind of takes you a while and you can get by dwor is work you are terrible at you're worse than most people and it's going to look terrible the mistake that people make when they hire is they hire people who have their awor and then they hire the person then you both want the awor you are better off hiring someone who is opposite to you their DW work is your a work your a work is their DW work or if you really really want to be efficient hire someone who's you can give away your B work to B work I think slows most people down we were talking about this earlier is if you can give away your B work to give give more time for awor you're so much more efficient and so you want to think very strategically about what's the behavior of how people are thinking yeah that's really good you know in that vein I think a lot of times in our businesses it's not just are they competent and can this person come in and do the task C or D but it's also who are they as a human and I think I I think about this in a way like you know what is better to have in your business with as a co-worker is it better to have a toxic coworker or is it better to have sort of a fake coworker that you're a little ambiv ambivalent with like what's the what's the difference between the two a very strong opinion on this which is I prefer a toxic cooworker to a friend of me I prefer a toxic worker to to to a fake friend here's why when we know someone is toxic or difficult we are very clear in our head we don't go to lunch with them we don't need to catch up on the weekend we know their strength and their skills and that's what we go to them for and then we create parameters around their difficulty when you're fake with someone or you're ambivalent and I call this like a fake friend when you're like do I like them yeah are they doing a good job do they do they like me right like this is people also with friends who you're like was that a neg like was that passive aggressive or are they actually supporting me that actually drains you far faster than a toxic person there's a study about this so they did it with police officers and they categorized everyone's relationships in this Precinct and they found that the officers who had more ambivalent relationships like relationships with the co-workers where they were like do I want to go to lunch with them or would I rather eat a sandwich alone ambivalent the more ambivalent relationships they had the worse their happiness was the more sick days they took the lower their workplace satisfaction actually police officers who had more toxic co-workers were totally okay because they knew that's not my person yeah so I think that a lot of this especially as adults is like who are my people great that's my person and that's my person and that's not my person that's not my person when you are very clear on that that actually helps you streamline your social energy if you are not sure if someone likes you if you are not sure that someone's not doing a good job it's time to make a change that's so interesting have you ever thought that it wasn't uh working with somebody or that they weren't the right person made a decision made a change let them go moved on and regretted it no I know neither isn't that crazy it's actually fascinating because I've asked every leader every time that question never have I had a leader go dang it I wish I hadn't let that person go dang it I wish I still hung out with that person same with friends why do we wait so long and like beat ourselves up so much about it cuz we're human the answer I mean we're human we feel bad you know and also like we're hopeful like I feel I'm fundamentally a believer in the good of human beings and so we really want to make it work like we really try and we hope that they're going to change or we're going to change but you know what you're doing them a disservice yeah I've realized the exact same thing and often you don't like you don't need to have a God complex if it's not working out for them with you they are probably perfectly suited for something else and somebody else and you're holding them back by keeping them with you we just did something really cool if you've ever thought about buying a business or want to understand what the word seller financing man you've got to try this so basically you fill out this application right here and we sort every single human who comes through this list to the right tool and resource for them when it comes to buying a business when it comes to finding financing for buying a business and when it comes to building a business so you get directed to Our member of experience or one of our members of experience and they find the right tools and resources for you some of the stuff is just free like oh hey you don't understand seller financing here's an article for you some of it is wow you really are ready for the 303 level you should do the workshop some of it is like you know what start here with our first little entry guide I want to make sure that I get every single human only what they need when they need it to become an owner you might like this hit the link in the description below and we will sort you to figure out what kind of business buyer are you so let's say you are hiring and you want to figure out if somebody's lying to you or not how do you do that okay my favorite topic so I love Li detection research in fact we've done a lot of research in our lab on we've had people submit videos of themselves lying we have a whole process for doing it and then we analyze them for cues looking for patterns and there is no Pinocchio's NOS there's no one cue that says someone's lying but there are statistical cues to deceit there are cues that we saw over and over again in the lying answers so here are a couple of those lie detection cues so um the first most obvious one is um when something's in congruent so someone says something but their body shows another so I'll give you a really good example one of the challenges we have them do is two truths and a lie where they say two truths about themselves and a lie on the LIE so many people shook their head no whoa so if you'll see this if you're like so like what do you think of the new girl you know she's she's great yeah yeah so a nod not in India Pakistan and Bulgaria so there that's a cultural note on that one I try to be careful with my universality but for nodding if someone says yes they should be shaking their head yes or neutral if someone says no they should be shaking their head no and you will often catch a lie when someone is in congruent when they're like like my daughter I'll be like did you take an extra cookie [Music] um no right and she'll shake her head yes and I'm like are you sure right like I know another one is another in congruent is people will flash a micro expression that is counter to what they're saying like a big one with lying is disgust lying makes us feel dirty we do not like to lie we know it can get us into trouble and so often times when people lie they flash a disgust micro cres here's what a disgust micro looks like when we crinkle our nose up and Flash the upper whites of our teeth like this so you'll see it's very unnatural if you try it feel you don't do this naturally but here's what it looks like when someone's lying so what do you think about the new girl yeah you know um she's great yeah and they're holding that disgust expression which means not really not really and that's your opportunity so when you see something in congruent you say you know it's totally fine if like you're not ding like I know it takes a little bit of time do you have any concerns usually just one question that clarifies gives them permission to tell you the truth and so you want to look for incongruent nods you want to look for incongruent facial expressions or like the big obvious one is a fake smile when someone says they're happy this is important for sales and important for H right so if someone says yeah I would be so happy to work here and their smile is on the bottom half of their face the only true indicator of a smile is when these upper cheek muscles are activated so anyone can fake smile right I can do this all day long and not actually feel happy but only one in 10 people can consciously activate these muscles up here what if we get BOTOX hard she might never be able to tell don't go to California although I L expression right now you got a lot of expression I'm overdue so like I don't think you can actually Botox your entire cheek no well I bet you could but I don't think you should any activation up here is is good is a good indicator of of of happiness because so if someone this is important I think also for like looking for authenticity so right if someone's like yeah you know I just I love your company and I've just been following you for years and I just think this is like a dream job do a real one okay do a real one for me I love your company I just I think it's so amazing I've been following you for years yeah interesting right like that hit my upper cheek muscles I can consciously activate muscles because I've trained them but a lot of people cannot and so you're looking for like why did she say she was happy but she wasn't actually happy same thing with contempt so I think this is the most powerful of the micro Expressions it's one of my favorite cues it's a one-sided mouth raise so this smirk uh first of all make sure you don't have it in your profile pictures uh that is a micro expression of contempt whoa so negativity disdain scorn so if you're with someone and you say you know the the the benefits package actually only includes about seven vacation days are you okay with that yeah yeah that's fine not not okay not fine not fine you're going to get pushed back on that that's going to create resentment contempt is a beast of an emotion because it is the seed of disrespect so Dr John gotman marriage and family counselor he did a huge research experiment on married couples he wanted to know if he could predict divorce he filmed these couples he did in-depth history of these couples he followed them for years years he found there was one single indicator of which couple would get divorced and it was in the initial intake interview one member of the couple showed contempt towards the other so I can watch a silent video of a couple and tell you with pretty good accuracy if they're going to get divorced he can watch a video a silent video of a couple and predict with 93.7% accuracy if that couple will get divorced within 30 years and that is because contempt when it comes up it's a better than it's scorn if it's not addressed it festers and it grows and that's how you get at the end of a marriage people will can't even look at each other and so if you have an employee or a friend or a partner who is showing contempt at you or something you say immediately pause and address it what can we do here how are you really feeling about this is there anything you want to tell me that is an opportunity for you to find out what is really going on brilliant so you know you notice that somebody in your company has contempt yes because they're doing something like this they're doing a fake smile we fake smile one-sided mouth raise y MH and then the next thing that you is you note it and without going direct at it you don't say you look you say you can try that but not going great say what okay so you have two options here right so you can just note it as a leader especially if it's like in a team meeting you just noted it right and also what it's about sometimes people show contempt because they had a bad day yeah right like maybe you mentioned the weekend and they don't like what they have planned for the weekends so it's only if it's relevant to something that you can actually do or change also you might not be able to change something you should just note okay they're GNA not feel good about that then you have the choice of how are you going to pursue I personally like just information gathering right so hey I just want to follow up with you on the meeting either by email or in person whichever you prefer how are you feeling about this change how are you feeling about the update I just want to check in with you and see how everything's going just do you have any questions for me right like that open ended is step one step two is what do they usually say at that point do they us oh my gosh usually they're like oh thank goodness you asked me because let me tell you I am not happy about this new roll out and yeah right um so that's that's option one and almost always that works the second option is you can try again so you can be like you can break up the option again just want to go over it make sure it all makes sense sometimes people are contemptuous when they're confused you get some people who are like why don't I understand this they're contemptuous about it so sometimes just re-explaining it again you don't see the contempt good right so often times it can even be a Clarity issue like um sometimes a mistake I see Entre make is you say so what's your business what do you do and they give you the most complicated answer I've ever heard in a million years yeah and you see people like okay cool right they're not contemptuous of you they don't understand and they're contemptuous of that right so if you're introducing yourself or you're explaining something you're like gosh Vanessa I'm seen this contempt Everywhere You Are Over complicating it you need to go for clarity over confusion people should be able to very quickly understand what you do and who you are and what you want what you want from them now I find myself smirking because you've done it so many times you're mirroring me de okay so that's the funny thing is also like mirror neurons are absolutely unconscious and now you probably want to smirk because you can see I'm activating these muscles right and you're even doing the same side which is kind of funny so that is a very human response so mirror neurons activate when we see someone make an emotion this is another reason why emotions are contagious if you show up and you were excited about your business excited about whatever you're pitching that you're you're showing so many cues of excitement and then you can't help but smile with me if you are fake smiling you are less contagious Dr Barbara wild found this she showed people two pictures one of people authentically smiling and one of people fake smiling everyone who saw the happy the real smile caught it their mood got better everyone who saw the fake smile even though they didn't know it was a fake smile had no Behavior change no mood change so when we are truly happy we are literally more infectious so yes I think our Mir are a big part of like getting yourself right and also like love your business love your people because it's real hard to fake it yeah let's talk about the difference between men and women okay like is there a difference in men and women and what you need to do to be attractive and likable oh my goodness okay so two there two questions here so there is Big differences between men and women um and that is because men and women send off inherently different cues and different signals typically not always women have higher voice tones right typically not always women use the question inflection more and that's cultural right A lot of the times women have been taught be liked so they're as parents not always but they're warmth warmth warmth whereas boys are taught get ahead be respected so they're often taught competence competence competence so in the research by the way that this is doct Susan fisk's research from Prince University she found she calls it The Stereotype content model which is that women by default are seen as higher in warmth and lower in competence Men by default are seen as has higher in competence and lower in warmth now I say great to know like I would rather know that that is why I dial up my competence in my presentations when I'm corporate speaking the name of my business is science of people right like that is the most competent name that you could possibly have because I know I'm fighting a default that's high and warmth but I also use that to my advantage sometimes as well so it's just important to know that default for you and then you can purposefully dial up as you wish you know you have a high a higher incompetence and you have to work towards warmth right like we got to get you some pink we got to get you some lace right we got to work doing the make you're not you know like but that's that puts us in control so I'm like yes let's know these biases because we are then in control of being able to dial up as we wish yeah what how do you see women do it wrong cuz I've seen in the workplace at least there was a generation where uh you know they had to be tougher right they had to show super high levels of competence otherwise they wouldn't get ahead and then in my opinion something went a little sideways there for a while where because we had to do that for so long then we kind of overcorrected and we went too hard and so do you ever see common mistakes women make on the the level of moving from warmth to competence yes and it is two words vocal fry I don't know why but there is an epidemic for women more specifically where they'll say a really great idea but they don't deliver it well because they're a little bit nervous about it and so they deliver it with a little bit of like vocal fry so they change their voice tone so like it's more like here where you hear that kind of sizzling Factor well it's really hard to like believe an idea when it's delivered like this it makes me want to cry for some reason I feel like uncomfortable for you like getting watery it's horrible that's awful and so I hear this all the time and I think it's like a a fear or a lack of assertiveness and so that is one of the biggest things that women can do to immediately take back their vocal competence is speak louder if you have vocal fry and you're like how do I get rid of this just speak a little bit louder it immediately gets rid of it that is because the moment you add more breath it gets vocal fry gross is your vocal cord rubbing together like crickets that's what it is so the moment you add more breath it gets rid of it if you hear someone underserving themselves like an employee or someone is pitching and they're using vocal fry say hey would you mind speaking up it will immediately get rid of their vocal fry wow so that that's a really big cue that I see um and women don't understand why they're not being taken seriously or they're being interrupted yeah or they're being underestimated or they're being passed over interesting it's because they're accidentally giving it away what about men men it's so hard to make universals with men ah no I know it I know it h this strives me crazy men think that to be powerful ful is to be stoic and unreadable so recently especially I see men who are like oh Vanessa I don't I don't need cues I have no cu's and they will be these leaders who are they've gotten rid of all facial expressions they've literally learned to keep their face completely still they have no movement no nodding no head tilting they literally sit and listen to ideas completely still with no give back the problem with that is no cues is a cue in itself we understand muting like muting as a problem with Charisma so when you are mute or you underexpress it immediately gets rid of your warmth and your competence so I see these leaders who have trained themselves to go completely still typically male and they're like why doesn't my team open up to me why is everyone quitting why can't I close these deals I'm like it's because you are so still faed and this is something called the still face experiment when you were with someone and I am completely still face and completely still body it is so physically hard for you to open up to me like if you were making no movement and no encouragement and no facial CRS it would be physically hard for me to talk Y and so a mistake that I see men make is they mute and they don't realize that they are losing it's costing them loyalty oh yeah I've been you've been in there yeah you're also you're married to to some a man yes you know CU a lot of military men are taught that to survive oh for sure so I have so many amazing vets we we love our vets and the problem they have is they've they've gotten rid of all their cues because it was risky for them and so they used no cues to survive literally and now they have to relearn what cues am I going to pick to do this one of the first cues I teach Men by the way if this is you if you're like oh man I totally I totally under remote like no one can read my face people are going to tell you you're cold intimidating hard to talk to that's how you know that's you one of the first cues I'm going to teach you is uh visible hands so this works also in the military so a lot of folks that we have in the military they'll use this Cu uh visible hands is an immediate trust signal it immediately warms you up especially in your first impression the moment you hop on a video call morning good to see everyone that one cue it wasn't a lot of movement but it's very easy to do it's a greeting it's warmth right when you're when you're talking the more you can have your P Palms out Palms visible we love to see a palm it's an immediate warmth cute interesting and it's much easier typically for men than like howdy you know like like they're not going to do that with their face so like you know even like let me tell you about an idea that we have coming up just that just that one Palm flash a palm flash is really nice for like I'm open I'm open to your ideas I'm not concealing anything it actually goes back to like a very Primal part of our brain we love to see a palm um we at our lab I analyze thousands of hours of TED talks with my team looking for patterns and um what we found was the difference between the viral TED talks and the least viral TED Talks were the most viral Ted speakers used an average of over 400 hand gestures in 18 minutes whereas the least viewed TED Talks used about 270 gestures in 18 18 minutes What's Happening Here the best head talks all start the same way like this today I want to talk to you about a big idea we're going to talk about three different ways that can change your life right that is true they're all like it's also the Ted Talk voice right like there is a TED Talk voice and like for some reason like I can be like I'm gonna say something and it's going to be so important and you just know that because of the words that I'm using and that voice tone tells you that this is something that we have to remember because you know what 30% of people believe that right like I'm not saying anything but like my vocal tone is queing you so there's a voice tone for Ted and there's a handj for Ted first of all the best Ted talkers they greet everyone on stage with an open gesture right big open gestures and they typically align their gestures with their words the most competent charismatic speakers are explaining their Concepts to you with their visual gestures and their words so if I were to say to you Cody I have a really big idea it's huge you're like it's not Vanessa I can see how small it is it's really small and that is because your brain believes my gesture more than my word they've actually shown that gestures carry more weight than words because it's hard to lie with our gestures like let's try an experiment I want you to say three but hold up five okay ready three horribly hard hard hard to do hard you can try that it's so hard I thought you gave me a little time I pictured it in my head and I can do it it's your brain does not like lying with gestures so very charismatic speakers they get on Ted stage they have visible gestures this is for all my stoic men right you have a visible gesture and then you're going to align so if you have three big ideas just hold three big Ideas right if we have phase one and phase two we have those two phases it's very easy for to picture that politically you'll notice that very good political speakers they are literally outlining their talk for you with their gestures if they have a really small idea they're like this is no big deal look how small it is right if they're like this is a big problem you're like who it's Beach big it's big huge right right if they're like and you'll notice some will be like you know the other guys over here and every time they talk about those other guys they show disgust and like it's smelly that hand and you begin to associate that hand with those bad guys and then he or she doesn't even have to say about those guys you just know those horrible guys interesting so like that makes it easier for our brains to grock very complicated Concepts I'm getting ahead of myself but I think that that's it's important for to think about both how many views did your Ted talk yet over 4 million girl yeah you were like one of the most viewed TED talks of all time all time all time but that research got me my TED Talk that's wild so that the research on Ted and how we're contagious from stage is what got me that so one other thing that I want to talk about is Do You Feel Like We nailed the how you got tricked into a bad hire the ABCD I thought we did too I did it with a different question I liked it um what about the biggest mistakes that people can make in communic ating their ideas internally to their company not just externally so we talked about how to open up meetings we talked about how to do pitches but you and I obsess all day when we're talking about how do we build bigger companies and how do we sell internally and I don't think a lot of people think about that so what do bad leaders do or what mistakes do we make when we communicate internally what people don't realize is that your internal marketing to your team is just as important as your external marketing you've got to get your team on board on an idea and how you want I think the mistake that you will make is they frame ideas or initiatives or phases as like vitamins as like this is good for the team so like a vitamin idea would be like guys our software is really out of date and we got to switch to that new LMS we got to switch to that new you know CRM software it's going to be good for the team I know it's going to be painful but we got to do it what team member is going to be like yeah whoa you as a business owner can do vitamin things for your business you can do things that are good for the business that have long-term short-term pain but long-term game your team members aren't thinking that way you're lucky if they're thinking 6 months to a year at your company so you want to try to emphasize what is the painkiller why is this going to help us immediately that's going to help them get over that short-term pain so the difference between a vitamin pain vitamin is like this is good for us it's going to be really you know we should do it a painkiller is like you know how you're having lower close rates because we lose contact cards that problem will be gone next week literally gone now we're going to have to set up some stuff we're going to have to do the back end but that will no longer be a complaint for you it fixes the problem in day one now that's one feature of the new CRM or the new software but if you know that is a complaint of your sales team that's how you're going to your sales team that pain point you've been coming to me about for the last six months it's going to fix it done I prioritize that for you now there's 15 other things that has to be done but boy oh boy don't you want to get rid of that headache and maybe for the HR team it's like hey you know how we've been it's been a nightmare tracking all the all the contact with people no more this totally fixes all of it it puts it all in one place brilliant so it's it's painkillers not vitamins even internally yeah um we talk a lot about issues with uh communicating with our spouses because we're actually buddies in real life yes and we also have a friend who's like sort of a relationship Guru person so I know you and I typically don't love to talk about our relationships publicly so let's do it like externally but like uh these days man I mean we have people getting married later than ever we have people having less sex we have people being in less committed relationships divorce is up I think it's hard for young people finding somebody what what advice do you have or what research do you have to show how to better connect with a member of the opposite sex if you're single okay so I want to actually answer this in two ways I want to ask answer it for single PE single people and I want to answer it for couped people do it okay so this is amazing research it changed my relationship with my husband and actually some close family members which is Dr Dan McAdams found that we connect through three different levels when we're with someone we're trying to pass through first level one General traits What do you do where you're from what's your value system very very Basics level two personal concerns what worries you what are your motivations what are your goals level three the hardest one we're not there with most people in our life self-narrative what is the story you tell yourself about yourself and so in single people I think what's really important is understanding those three levels and knowing how to break through from level one to level three you can do this with 15 questions so we've actually been diving in this research and I found five questions for each level that you can actually use to break through so for example in the very first level I want you to ask about so this is not just what do you do it's what excites you what's been the highlight of your week what are you learning right now those are questions that are like not just like where do you vacation like not just like oh what do you do for fun right like their questions that are actually beginning to untangle some deeper connective tissue then you want to try to graduate like you want to actually move to level two questions level two questions are you know you're on level two with someone if you know what do they worry about when they fall asleep at night what do they think about what when they get up in the morning if you don't know the answer to those questions you're not close enough right like I think I probably know what keeps you up at night and we'll gets you up in the morning I think you know that about me too right so you should also be doing this with your friend your friends but literally asking like what worries you what's the thing that keeps you up at night what motivates you what are you driving towards what's your biggest goal this year so those are value-based personality questions and the last level and this is the hardest one is what's the story they tell themselves about themselves I think what's really important is you want to know what their narrative is and in our research and this is new research I'm finding there are basically three different self- narratives and you want to know what you're getting into the first one is my favorite it's a hero self- narrative you want a hero if you can in a relationship a hero self- narrative is something like this I have challenges and problems but with hard work and grit and determination I overcome them and that is their narrative for everything their childhood their work their workout routine like you have choosed your heart like that is a self that perfect example of a hero self-narrative you'll find something conquer it and then be done with it have success with it you like that CU in a relationship that sets you up for Success they know it's not easy right like they they know it might take a little bit of hard work but they want the success the second self-narrative I call a Healer self-narrative this is typically someone who their entire life is giving like they're always trying to fix and heal they're typically in Social Work teaching the medical profession they are givers and that can be a problem it's not a bad thing but it can be a problem because they typically are people Pleasers they typically don't sign up for themselves they're also the friend who says yes to everything and then cancels last minute right like you know cuz they they cannot say no in in the moment because they really want to but they are so overextended but you should know that going into a relationship that you might have to stand up for them and they will probably over extend themselves right or you might be in a relationship where you want a Healer the last one is the one you want to watch out for which is a victim self-narrative a victim self- narrative starts like the hero challenges mistakes problems but they couldn't overcome that no matter how hard they worked they weren't able to change anything they typically are the ones who feel they have very bad luck and over and over again these are the friends where it's like nothing's ever fixed you give them advice they can't figure it out woe is me everyone's against me you want to watch out for that because they will never be able to get out of that if that's how they see their whole life that's literally their narrative about how their life goes so as a single person if you can try to answer those questions go through them I'm happy to give them away they're on my website ask those questions early send them to your group chats ask the first three and then the second three and then right like ask them on different dates because then you're purposely connecting and you're moving up the levels if you're in a relationship I highly recommend do all 15 questions once a year yeah it's brilliant the answers change it is amazing when I ask my husband some of these questions how his answers have changed I've been with my husband for 18 years and it is amazing how much his answers and my answers have changed and so every year on our anniversary we we ask and answer all 15 questions and that has been a GameChanger I'll give you one example with a friend so one of the level three questions is what book movie or TV character is most like you and why it's a value based question so it's not like who looks like you it's like what character really has values like you I had a really good friend I known for years I thought we were super close I was like oh yeah we're on level three mom of three stay-at-home mom funny smart I was like oh yeah her self- narrative is probably like a funny TV mom like that's her I asked her this question immediately she's like oh catniss ever Dean from The Hunger Games I was like what she's like oh yeah I feel like I'm surviving every day wow we had the best conversation that we had ever had she was living a life that I had no idea true hero self-narrative which I knew but I had no idea how much struggle she was having and so these questions unlock aspects of people that truly can change and level up your connections it's so beautiful too because all anyone anybody really wants is somebody to listen to them and somebody to show them a little love and someone to understand them yeah you want to be listened to but you also want to be understood yeah that's true these questions are seeking to understand that's yeah that's right because it's not enough to just listen yeah I hear you I don't really understand I don't care exactly so these questions are not just like what do you do for fun oh that's cool I don't like that yeah right these are like questions that are specifically geared toward like what is the narrative in their head yeah and if you're going to be with someone in a marriage or a friendship you want to know how they're talking to themselves because you know what that's going to be how they talk to you yeah it's brilliant yeah and and also I think on top of that how much more interesting are you if your conversations go that way I mean could you imagine a first dat you have those 15 questions prepped you weave them in don't be a psychopath and like you know interrogate them through the through the questions I mean don't do it I mean I feel like but if you weave that in with like the you know you can't start with and the level one questions are actually like that you can't what you excited about right now your deepest fear date one no that's level two and actually that's a mistake that people make in dating is they are trying to speed up they're like trying to speed up connection so they ask a level two question the person is like totally freaked out no level one questions are like sneakers they're like sneaky questions like they're getting to a little bit of depth they don't sound really bad so yeah you want to weave them in I also am like a big fan of like listen like I watch this great podcast with Cody and Vanessa and they had these 15 questions for new couples like would you be willing to try the first three cute right like transparent warm vulnerable like you're competent you're listening to Cody's podcast yeah you're a warm and you really want to ask them yeah right like I am full I am for IAL transparency like you know if I don't want to do something I'm like no I'm not doing it right like I am for it and so like I'm like you want to ask them 15 questions because you like them tell them I like you so much that I want to go to level three with you but we're on date one so can we start with the first three questions right like your face looks bad are you contemptuous of me please tell me like I'm for it yeah I'm for it and so that's by the way like you asked about likable and attractive and that's what makes us likable and attractive is we're asking like really really intentional questions that are opening up the lines of connection in a totally different way hey y'all I don't know about you guys but this podcast is killing me she is so good so if you are loving this podcast like I am like a little possum digging in trash just looking for buried treasure I think you should make sure to give this a review we are obsessing on this one idea which is can we get a bunch of humans to tell us what you really think about this podcast what you want what you don't I read every single one of the reviews on there so put your little mths on those five stars if you feel like it and give us some feedback I appreciate every single one of you let's go back to Vanessa I want to talk really quickly about introverts in business cuz you sort of specialize as being a self-prescribed recovering awkward person I'm a recovering awkward person and uh and you talk a lot about how you can be awkward and introverted in business and it can be okay it's totally okay so I know this is a huge topic that you speak a lot about at science of people but if you had to leave somebody with a little sprinkling as somebody in business who really want want to be successful but is introverted what typical advice do you give okay so first things first is you have to find your recipe for Charisma I think that I used to believe as an awkward person this is what unlocked my awkwardness is there was only one type of Charisma that to be liked to be successful in business because I've been running my business for 15 years right like I put my first video on YouTube in 2007 and I thought to be successful on YouTube I'm so old I know I'm aging myself the two of us I know so in 2007 I thought the only way to be popular on YouTube was to be a bubbly extrovert yeah I literally thought that was the only type of Charisma but actually there are different flavors of Charisma you can absolutely be the quiet powerful introvert you can be the empathetic healer you can be the wise question asker and I think once I was so awkward because I was faking being an extrovert I am not an extrovert so the key is stop pretending to be an extrovert yeah you do not have to be an extrovert to be successful in business but you do have to find your flavor so the question is what is your social strength is it storytelling is it being funny and humble right like I think Taylor Swift has a great a great social strength of of being grateful in a stadium full of 50,000 people that is hard like Usher when he walks out he's like what yeah I deserve you being here right like that's his Vibe and that totally works for Usher but that does not work for Taylor Swift and if she tried to do that people wouldn't like it comment if you remember who Usher is if you're old like us cuz I feel like you're all dating us like the thing is back when bog was playing in moart was season oh no Mozart my friend Mozart but you're right so she can have a totally different vibe than a rapper yes and so I think like find your Vibe like social skills come small like it's not just like presenting it's storytelling it's using memes it's being funny it's telling sharing a case study it's one to one like for example as a leader I know one to one I do really well like I I prioritize those meetings cuz I just do better in them than like the big All Hands kind of meetings but you're such a good presenter that surprises me on like a big stage for sure but like on our team of like 10 you know what I mean I'm like are you okay are you okay are you okay are you okay is everyone okay like it's it's actually like very hard so we have one big call week that's it yeah otherwise it's one-on ones with me so like understand what your strength is like what down to the specific skill is it presenting are Keynotes being funny right so like understand your specific strength and don't be afraid to be vulnerable like I think a little story is I was at a really an invite only Mucky muck event here in Austin with a lot of VIPs a lot of really important people who live in Austin like the most important people in Austin like they were there right it was in this huge mansion and so I get invited and I'm like why was I invited I do not deserve to be here and like I walk in like awkward penguin you know and they go they put us all in a circle there was 30 of us 25 of us they put us all in a circle and they go one by one we're going to introduce ourselves and I'm not joking okay someone's like well I founded insert huge company that you definitely know and um I'm like a billionaire and I own the world the next person was like I cured cancer and um I'm curing future cancers that don't exist and I am an amazing doctor and then like it was like insane okay and they're going around the circle and I'm just like like it's getting me I'm like I'm YouTuber I write books about people like you know what I mean like just so it gets to me and I'm like I'm a recovering awkward person and the whole circle was like and starts to laugh like everyone's like oh yeah me too me too me too and I was like and I help awkward smart people connect if you're awkward and you don't have anyone to talk to later just come find me I have a YouTube channel and a couple books I will tell you every single almost every single person after me referenced me they were like I'm awkward like her laugh again C laughter and after the circle broke up everyone in the circle came to talk to me including like the important mcky mucks over here right because they were also very awkward and so it just it made me realize like don't pretend don't fake it don't show off let people impress you stop trying to impress them Y and be a little vulnerable it's okay to say that you wish you were home watching Netflix yeah like it's okay to say you know what I have a uh uh at night I do my passion project and during the day I drive Uber right like stop flexing like I think it's okay to be vulnerable and be like my passion I'm doing this and we're we're getting to the next level but we're having some trouble with Staffing if you know anyone like that's how we actually impress people you know what's interesting though is you do it in a way where you don't give up your competence and so I think that's the really hard part like I know when I was first getting on the Internet after being in finance for a long time and I didn't really want to explain that I ran a media company and I had this holding company I would say like I make Tik toks and I was with friends with you when you used to say that I'd be like girl yeah and I think at that point it was because I didn't want to explain more and it was like an out it was a little bit of an out but it's not a great out because when you're in rooms with those important people you don't want them to go oh well she's got an only fans you know like think I bet they did they're like oh that bit you know a slider a bill later yeah going to look you up how do you spell your name c d i capital D anyway so um the I think the point is you really have to think about how can you be vulnerable yeah without losing your competence do you have um do you have opinions or advice on how to do that because yours is perfect you're like I'm recovering AKA I'm not all the way awkward lots of people who are smart consider themselves awkward I do X thing which shows competence followed by two really impressive things author and I have a big Media company but like it's perfectly crafted I you would not be watching this if you don't have a good business idea yeah right and so I think like being vulnerable is being true and sharing your good idea I also think if you can add a credibility marker it helps like for example I noticed that when I added Wall Street journal's bestselling book it immediately upped my perceived credibility because anyone can have a bestselling book on Amazon in like the category of like awkward people people right like no so that was like okay so is there a way in your like for example if I say I'm a recovering awkward person I have a TED talk about being awkward right like that's a a credibility marker that I can very quickly say or like I have best-selling books yeah through penguin random house right like so in the beginning of my career I was saying Ted Talk I was saying penguin random house I was saying like the big credibility markers like I just got asked to teach a Harvard class you can bet I'll be adding that into my bio so the more that you can add them sprinkle them in credibility markers are good right and it can it can be the counterbalance to your warmth yeah it's brilliant yeah I also think you can find one that's not so serious if you're not perfectly skilled like Vanessa is you could say like I am a ravenous pickle ball player that's it totally like why could that work because pickle ball nobody looks cool playing pickle ball right and if you add nobody looks cool no it's not it's now the internet hates me for this but but and then saying a word Love You by saying a word like I am a top tier pickle baller I am a ravenous pickle it's an immediate chuckle yes like even like by night I do you know or like my my day job is this but like my passion project is this like we like words like that passion project ravenous amateur like you can say those things like recovering in its own way or like I also love I teach my students to do like blank turned blank so I have a lot of um like pivoter I have a lot of students who are like I was a lawyer and now I want to be a nonprofit Runner whatever nonprofit Runner a non owner of a nonprofit like I don't even know yeah I have lot of students who like have pivoted and they're like how do I say like I was legit a lawyer and I've chosen this I'm like Turned so like I'm a lawyer turned nonprofit I'm a student but my passion project is that I'm build I'm coding my own software blank so you that is a narrative by the way like I think people are afraid to in an elevator pitch or like I teach my students it's called a log line like a log line is like one sentence phrase that gets people hooked and every movie in Hollywood comes the log line and so you should have a log line it should be a one sentence hook to what you do and it should be a story and it can you can do it in one sentence like me saying I'm a recovering awkward person person turned YouTuber that's a story that's an interest you're like what yeah like I want to hear so it's like I'm a I'm a a scuba dive instructor turned family law lawyer like we like a story like that and so I think that if you can do not a BL yeah know it's the hero's journey totally and you can do that in one sentence you know former nerd turned Spider-Man there you go exactly I think on my book they put in reformed Wall Street investor turned small business owner by the way her book is so good well well you know why I did get an early copy and I edited the [ __ ] out of it yeah had the best feedback also so good guys you know what's really fun is when you when you know your friends Finding ones who their love language is some portion of what you need like you I remember you said explicitly to me I want to be the best editing help of anybody of all of our friend group I'm highly competitive and I wanted to be I wanted to give the best advice I'm highly competitive and like it was fun it was fun for me to do it and I said am I the best oh you were the best Fernando we have a friend we have one friend who competed with me on the editing but it is so good like if you have not ordered it yet it is so so good the edits I had were small in comparison to the book no they were really important you know the edits I think what the couple of the things that you taught me the most about Communication in general is one that story is more me more memorable than stat and so like make sure if you're going to tell some statistics wrap it in a story so people can remember and then you also mentioned a lot about how this is about the reader so you know we had a lot of diagrams and data and stuff in there beautiful diagrams and you're like get to the point and why do they care yeah and we so we did that really tight up front because I wanted to make sure that people lasted through that first chapter to get into the meet and that was really helpful I also think like this is for anyone whether you're writing a book or starting a business is like you want to compliment the person who is reading it you want to compliment the person who is buying it you want to compliment the person who visited who dained to visit your page you want to compliment the person who opened your email like I've been writing an email newsletter for literally 14 years like it took me one year to get my huge it's newsletter is huge I personally write every single word because I know that I should be letting them impress me I should be overd delivering I should be aggressive ly helpful and so I think it's the same thing is like how can you compliment your person like how can you ask the right questions or set them up for Success like that is a way we spread goodness it's so good okay I want to close out with something a little bit different that I don't think you talk about very much which is you are one of the categorically happiest business people I know and you have the best balance in your business while running a business with quite a lot of zeros and so I know you're private about a lot of this but what do you think the key has been to moving from somebody who did 452 vide all of the different businesses every speaking spot to two podcasts this year that you've done you know taken an entire summer off really a sabatical yeah I take summer sabatical yeah oh yeah you've taken now multiple and um you have two wonderful kids and a beautiful husband like what's what's your what's your secret just because you can doesn't mean you should yeah it's it's an annoying State how often do I say that to you a lot a lot every other day I don't have a podcast I can do a podcast should I do a podcast no because I should go on everyone else's that is better I have a newsletter and I put everything into that because I should be doing that because I was a direct line of communication with my people Tik Tok don't care I'm on there because my team has forced me but like I shouldn't do it I shouldn't be making reals for and you don't post it yourself that's all done third party now it doesn't it doesn't convert and so I think like it's very important for a business owner to focus relentlessly on what is actually converting to your business and I mean dollars right like I have a tight team like we want to keep overhead as low as possible like if it is not converting if a job roll is not converting is not a role and so it's all the things you could do making a big list that every year we make a big list of all the things we could do and then we play stop start continue and this is my favorite game to play and we do it all the time it's like okay what should we stop doing is this actually converting this role this task this person down to I realized checking my inbox was not converting into actual work and so I figured out how to Outsource it to my assistant who is amazing shout out Carolyn so that she can actually go through my inbox and do everything that needs to be done with a very precise system so that I'm spending now 10 minutes every other day on email as opposed to three hours a day that was really painful it took six months to get rid of my inbox but it was not converting so that went on the stop list right what what is actually converting that's continue that's the shortest list right like what you're actually continuing and then stop is if it's not converting or it's draining your soul it has to stop it takes a while to un to undo things yeah it's so true totally selfish question for me you get a lot of asks Vanessa come on the show come speak here come do that here how do you respond to things and teach your team to respond to things so that the person who gets your nose feels like it's lovely thinks so highly of you everybody always loves you what's the secret I'm like yes every yes they do no um radical transparency R and vulnerability so it sounds like this thank you so much for this podcast offer you know Vanessa is on a podcast sabatical because she hates them I did you and did Mel because I like you both and this is fun yeah otherwise I don't like it yeah right like like s like seriously or like uh my favorite one is like if it's personal like like someone texts me and they're like can you can you speak at my conf I want to speak at your conference that that was easy one like I don't want to speak at someone and I say you know what I would love to I'm so honored you thought of me but my plate is as full as I like right now yeah my plate is as full as I like right now I also love the word sabatical like I am on a podcast sabatical I'm not doing new podcasts when I'm in summer sabatical I am on summer sabatical I maybe maybe work five hours a week in Summers because I want to spend time with my kids and so like it's very it's people understand it's not personal to you I am literally on a summer IAL I'm not doing calls I'm video calls I'm not doing pctures email I schedle all my content out I'm off I'm out and that makes people not feel like it's personal to them so radical transparency and blaming a system blaming a system works so well sabatical Vanessa is not doing any speaking events in the fall sorry oh you know Vanessa's uh recovering from her book tour she'll pick back up in December yeah that's a system people cannot fight against a system but that means you got to have system well that's a really good point so that's basically the structure is if you want want to respond a thing but have the other person almost thank you for the response it's first profusely thank them gratitude appreciation because that's honest yes second is have a system in place where you say because of X system y action will or will not work yes because of EX system it will not work and it's nothing personal to you but it's you can't find it because it's a system or a very real and vulnerable thing that if I say I hate people you don't want me to come like for example Nick Ray love love Nick Ray he invites me to some things and I go and I love it but some things I'm like I don't like people same and I literally WR back and I'm like I don't like people enough to go to that I'm awkward he goes I know right and like that is a very real and vulnerable share or like sometimes people invite me to things and I'm like it's after 9:00 p.m. I don't do after 900 p.m. that's a personal system it's like oh she doesn't do after 9:00 p.m. and you know what you wouldn't want me after 9:00 p.m. oh a th% you would not want me same and so I think like if it's a vulnerable share that like people wouldn't want that yeah then it's easy to say no yeah vulnerable share and maybe even a little humor I've tried to be funny you know I try to be funny yeah well it makes a huge difference if you're like you know and I think trying to teach your team too it's one thing we're working on in my team right now is like teaching your team how to say no super graciously with boundaries and even a little bit of sense of humor and I think that thing that you talked about which is like a shadow influence B uh blame so it's like I can't do this because system I can't do this because Promises to the business I can't do this because whatever yes then you're never the blame they're not the blame this other third party is the blame yes and one more thing I'll add there is we found a lot of success with like you know what Vanessa's on podcast sabatical we're going to add your podcast to a list so that if and when she decides to pick it back up or she has a book launch coming up we can reach out to you yeah and by the way that happens you know like when I have a launch I'm like you know what time for some podcast and then I like it because I actually have things to talk about right I have new research I have new things so adding a list really helps like even like I'll have people who are like I'm in Austin for the week do you want to hang out and I'm like no cuz like it's a it's a hard week and so I'll be like I'm so sorry I'm in a low People season right now but next time you come please reach out like it's the next time so you can like create a list and like you have to be genuine about it but like I think that that also really helps people feel like it's not just no love end so if you have speaking event requests or pocket requ like let me add you to a list when and if Cody can do it or I can do it I would love to but right now I am focusing 100% on the book or 100% all my people or like I've also had friends who are like you know I this literally happened to me last week I have a little girls dinner that I do and I picked an expensive restaurant and that was shame on me I should have done that and my friend said I'm so sorry I can't afford to eat out right now it's been hard for the business I was like I am so sorry like how did I do that and so like she was super honest with me and it was really transparent and I was like oh my gosh let's go to like let's go somewhere super easy let's do a picnic and like then we had a really great deep discussion so like even that like being like hey I'm like I'm pinching pennies for the business I can't go to Costa Rica right now with you yeah like don't make an excuse like say the truth yep that's so beautiful okay it's tough out there in the world right now we're getting communicated negatively everywhere what not my Instagram we're very positive you are very positive on your Instagram and YouTube but I think the newsletter like if you're going to sign up for one thing it should be like science of people the newsl I'm very proud of my artisanal organic handcrafted newsletter it's really good that's how it feels like um so you should definitely go to science of people um but what would you want to leave people with to leave them on that little bit of a high note in a world that's a little negative can I share a story I would love a story so um this fundamentally changed how I interact and it was about being likable and one of the fears I have about awkwardness is that I'm deeply unlikable like that is something that I really fight with and so I found this study and what these researchers did is they wanted to figure out what makes someone like so he followed thousands of high school students across a variety of high schools and he C categorized them based on popularity and then he looked at every variable he could think of athleticism GPA humor attractiveness like everything he could think of and there was one predictor across all the grades and all the high schools yes there were popular kids who were athletic or smart but there was one that all the popular kids across all the schools had they had the longest list of people that they liked oh meaning that if you want to be likable all you have to do is go around aggressively liking people oh that's wild that's so good it totally reframed for me like all I need to do is stop worrying about being likable or being impressive or being funny or being whatever actually what I have to do is find ways to aggressively like the people that I'm with asking better questions searching for good assuming good expecting good and so what I would leave you with is if you want to be more likable you need to be hunting for good in others in every conversation in every email in every discussion it's like how can I like this person more that is such a better way to be internally but it's also like a beautiful way to be externally that's so pretty I ask you sort of a personal question of course why why were you worried about being profoundly dislikable where do you think that comes from I don't know I think I think I'm Different you know I think I'm a little different even you will say to me like Vanessa like you dress so weird I'm like I know you do and do you have two of the same dresses in 42 colors that's it that's it it's my Steve Jobs moment okay like you know I just am a little weird like I do weird things I have weird Hobbies I don't dress like other people I never did you know I was like always the girl in school who like I had like the bow cut and like the Plaid vest and all the other girls were wearing juicy aging myself you know what I mean like I was listening to like gar Gar Simon Garfunkle while the girls were listening to like back you know like I just like which means now you're cool yeah back then and so I think like I'm just a little odd like I even do things differently than our friends do you know and so I think like that's wise because for a long time like that was a bad thing and now I have people who love me for it like when I text you you're like what are you doing and I know that you love me even though I'm like let's go do weird activity insert weird activity that's saying so at one point that made you really scared and nervous and it literally turned people off cuz I was like not with the right people when you're young it's hard you know like 14y old girl that was a nightmare so now if I have a friend that's like you do what for fun I'm like oh we're not okay like we're not going to be friends that's cool whereas like in a group of friends where they're like well good for you for doing that I'm like you know you know what the other thing is too is now you doing that I think has allowed our group of girlfriends to all bring weird things that we each do never would have done that now you're actually kind of normal you're a little basic now people have brought out we it brings out the weirdness in people totally yeah which is a beautiful thing to think about like if that thing inside of you is so weird different nobody's on board with it yeah what sort of magic do you shake out if you share it because I bet there's people that are even weirder than you yeah I'm waiting for you to be weirder yeah me I know all I do is business I know business business business I need some Hobbies I'm in the market for a hobby yeah we got to get some hobbies for you but like not like shooting I know you know what I mean like it's so hardcore like something like Pottery yeah I know you always the worst Hobbies like you're like make a what was the last wreath one you wanted me to do yeah succulent wreath oh that that that awful Harry Potter thing we went to for 4 hours that was fun and I brought chocolate fro you did not think it was fun you're Slytherin yeah I must be although I I you know you are or is Gryffindor no I think you're a secret Slytherin no I'm not I'm a Ravenclaw anybody who makes thisw Slytherin I'm a raven claw was that one of those flash flash yeah we did go to Harry Potter Symphony Orchestra God we I did make us dress up although you wouldn't do it on the internet right now I did it you didn't dress up yes I did I don't remember you wore one you wore like a sock and I was like okay it's under a boot I was like in a cape like I had like spell earrings on you did have spell earrings brought everyone gifts but it's kind of endarian because how many scientists are like a Harry po Harry Potter fan I know I'm actually a huge Harry Potter fan I just don't project keep it deep inside that's I'm saying we got to be we got to be weirder okay fine I'll bring it on the internet tell me if anybody else on here is Harry Potter fans and what your house is oh yeah and what your house is and you think you know that Cody's okay you can guess what do you guys think I am am I Slither in my Gryffindor I think we've actually found the real culprit here and that's why we'll leave you on this podcast today thanks for coming me that's quite a close I can't believe I shared all of that on the internet I guess you guys could tell me in the comments which Harry Potter house you think I am I have a clear house so I hope you guys get this right I think Vanessa was trying to dissuade you from what is the obvious choice so maybe you can tell me what Harry Potter house you guys are on the comments and you can tell me which one you think I am the second thing I was thinking about with the clothes here is when it comes to communication there's some correlation between the better you speak the more money is in your bank account and I wish I had understood this earlier it's actually not my biggest strong suit I'm pretty good at one to many AKA content Vanessa talks about how she's really good one to one and I think one of the keys in success in your bank account is how good are you like 1 to 5 10 15 20 and your small teams and so if you want to learn more about how to communicate well to small teams let me know in the comments too because I think we should put together a guide for how do we run comedians so that they don't suck and people actually want to attend them how do you communicate with your team even when things are scary and get them to do the things that you want them to do Vanessa hit on a bunch of it today I think we should go deeper so hit me in the comments if you think so too and in the meantime I guess I'll end with this you know Maya Angelou has the famous saying that people won't remember the things that you said but they will remember the way you made them feel and if you remember nothing else I think this is an opportunity for you to look yourself in the mirror and say am I making people feel a certain way that they will will remember and want to positively associate their next interaction with me maybe ask yourself that question I'm going to do the same all right see you guys next time