Greetings, Jumelang, Chobela, Makos. This is our story. Our story is based on a true story. This is unpopular opinion.
Welcome Makosi Ndlovu-Gazi, Punyugabampete, I'm Tautau Haramanuba and we are Bantu Soul Society. Welcome Ndlovu-Gazi. Yeah, thank you. Thank you for the lovely welcome. I've always heard about unpopular opinions in it, so I'm finally here.
Yeah. Yeah, I'm Makosi Punyugabampete Ndlovu-Gazi, so I'm excited to be here. So let's see how unpopular our opinions will be. Well, let's talk about spirituality and sexuality. People usually say they spend a whole lot of time trying to separate spirituality from sexuality.
Interesting. A lot of people avoid talking about sexuality because they think sexuality as sex, you know, a dirty thing. But there is...
big link between sexuality and spirituality sexuality is spirituality yeah is spiritual because if you are going to engage with someone sexually that's you spiritually that's you your being your whole being you know you present holistically your mind your body your soul and i don't know why people cannot understand which it's the same thing and they linked Actually, you're bringing me to this point that human beings are created sexually. So no one is vomited into existence or spoken into existence. Human beings are created sexually.
Natural origin of man is man. So human beings are sexual beings. So sexuality form part of our spirituality as human beings are spiritual beings.
So the avoidance of speaking about sexuality within the spiritual space, what do you think might be the cause? As a mother, when you have children reaching a certain age where you can talk about sex with them, one of the things you learn as a mother is that don't think umptu anawuli visualize what happens sexually. So I think that's why most people...
People fear talking about sexuality because they start visualizing everything that happens intimately and they avoid it. And they're really running away and not talking about it from a spiritual because they link spirituality as a pure thing, as a holy thing. And then if you're going to add irreligion to it, then they make it like it's a dirty thing.
If you're going to add sexuality to it. Yes. Then they'll say it's a dirty thing. So I think that's why most people don't talk about it. And we need to talk about it because this is why you find young girls, young boys engaging sexually with people, collecting the spiritual ties, these spiritually transmitted diseases, because they're engaging with people sexually who are not on the same spiritual level without understanding what you get out of that person.
Because you become one. Yes. So there is a tendency to overlook the spiritual aspect to sexuality.
Actually, it reminds me of one of the African ancestors of the ancient Nile Valley high culture, what is commonly referred to as Kemet. They evolved a very complex spiritual system. And that complex spiritual system had the human body.
as a map of the heavens. Like when you talk of Ndu, which the Greeks call Nut, is a sky goddess. They show this in the artistic depictions in the Meduneta, what they call hieroglyphics, which is a picture writing. They show this woman who's bending over the heavens. And actually they say heaven, the heavens represent the belly of a woman.
The heaven is the womb. Heaven is between the legs of the woman. Heaven is between the thighs of the woman.
Where we are incubated is heaven. So heaven, the first physical representation of heaven as a spiritual entity is the physical body of our mother. Yes, that's why I see in Zalabandu, and that's why as women we're supposed to try as much as we can not to collect these sexual partners because we need to understand what stays here.
It's a spiritual thing. And it becomes this thing. that you can't even control yourself as a woman because it's a spiritual thing.
Imprint. It's left the imprint there. It's quite profound coming to think of it.
So it's like this symbol here, the ankh. It is commonly defined as this representing the womb, the fallopian tube, the male principle. And of course, others will say, no, that can't be.
It means you are carrying sexual organs with you all the time. But sexual organs, sexual principle was never a problem. The very central to the story of resurrection in ancient Kemet is the missing penis of Osiris.
His missing thing. His brother said, killed him, cut him 14 pieces, threw them away. When ISIS went to collect them to resurrect him, and then one piece was missing, which is the falus, which then...
They made a replacement of it, which today it stands there in America, in Washington Square. That thing they call the Cleopatra's needle is basically the penis. So it's the highest symbol of the American monument.
But you take it to the Western system that is obsessed with sexuality, the shape of the bomb, the shape of the bullet, because for the European, the male is a sexual aggressor. So they have this thing that when the male again enters the woman, it's like an aggressor entering a cave and being aggressive and all of that. But it's different from African holistic sexual understanding because for the Africans it's that how do you say a man entering a cave and getting beaten by so many women in the cave that he's the sexual aggressor?
Because there are a lot of muscles there that do the beating. You know? So, so... Shying away from speaking about sexuality within the spiritual space, I think is more, not I think, but I know it is mainly influenced by colonial religions, which are mainly religions created by insecure men to oppress women.
So therefore, and one of the things they try to suppress is the sexual, spiritual power of the woman. That is why if you go in the very dawn of our history. You always find women as goddesses. They assess feminine creative principles.
So I concur with you that there must be spiritual, sexual education within our own home. We're not creating imaginary stuff in the minds of our children, but we are, because we have left that education to the society, to the school. But the society is not doing justice to it. They just... high level they're not touching on the spirituality that is tied up to sexuality and i think that's why like i said earlier you find young girls who just throw themselves at anyone and anything without thinking of the bigger picture of how the spirituality gets linked to it and then they get to a certain stage where the adults now they want a different life for themselves to grow spiritually spiritually and it's not there because this whole area has just been you taken over by different energies and you're struggling with the spiritually transmitted diseases, which you can't easily get rid of.
And you touched on something earlier about the holistic male and female relationships. Holistically, if you break down the word holistically, that's you from head to toe. You are who you are.
As Uma Kosi Punyuga, do I understand myself from head to toe? Do I understand if I'm going to engage with someone sexually? There's nerves that work from here to there. And that's how you get to experience full spiritual sexuality.
And it ties up to why at the end of every relationship, we always say to people, break those soul ties. Do cleansing because you need to remove that energy of that person. But then if you have multiple partners, you're in trouble. Yeah.
So... Black love and black couples in a spiritual space. Sure.
I love love. I love being loved. I love loving. And. It's so unfortunate that I don't know how it started, when it started, but it's almost like black people didn't know how to express love.
As a black couple, a black man and a black woman, it's like we're not, I think we never saw it at home. We never saw our parents being affectionate to one another at home. So we only know it's good, bold and beautiful. And it's always a different race. So amongst us black people.
Black love would be what? Your parent giving you money for your father, buying your mother something, it ends there. But from the romantic side of it, we don't understand the black love. So it's a new thing that we, the youngsters, are pushing in, but are we pushing it the right way?
Because then it starts with a man, black man, understanding his responsibility, he's the head of the family, and the woman is the head of the home. You know, because that... part of promoting black love? Well, I wouldn't entirely agree with that.
Black people did not understand love until the Bold and the Beautiful and Valentine's happened. We have, within the band, we have 22 secret and sacred laws of love. So we had laws of love that distinguish between this kiss and this kiss here.
And this kiss is commonly used. You get ladies who just meet and just kiss, or a man who just meet a woman and just kiss. But if you go to our 22 secret and sacred laws of love, they are defined in a particular way. Like, for instance, we call the bed, bed where men and women sleep, we call the love mat. Now, as a love mat is one area that you're not supposed to argue there.
You don't fight there. Like you don't take your argument to the love mat. A married woman sleeps naked.
So that in that day, we see how our mat is not good. It's not good for us. It's not good for us. It's not good for us.
It's not good for us. Yeah. But Umagwoti doesn't take pajamas to bed. Interesting, I was looking at the other thing.
One lady was like, ladies. If my phone is off, you know, I saw it on TikTok two days back. She went on and on and on.
Okay, I know it was a jest of some sort and what, but there's an element of truth that comes from our culture because I'm trying to talk of it in the context of we were not completely unconscious of love. It's just that because... because we were colonized in totality, we tend to even express love in a Eurocentric way.
Hence, you hardly get some among our people, you hardly get somebody proposing a woman. You find like, no, I love you. It's like.
But that's coming back now. Yeah. That's coming back now. Yeah. That's coming back now.
Our brothers are getting. Back to the roots. Back to the roots. What you mentioned earlier is the fact that one of the 22 love...
Secret and secret... They need to be published. They need to be published.
We're tired of the love languages. That is foreign to us. Yes, so we need to hear those 22 and practice them.
And as young women, throw it out there to the young adults that are coming up so that they understand and they start practicing because we're promoting. African spirituality. And you also mentioned, Guti, they always say one of the laws was you don't fight in the bedroom.
But is it the bedroom or the bed? You fight, it's the bed because the bed is in the bedroom. But think about it, when you were a child and your parents are fighting to run away from the kids, balbele ka meren. Actually, let's put it within context. You're actually making a very important point.
on the bed because they talk about the love met like no fighting on the love met but then you can fight in the bedroom but when you fight in there when you go to the bed to the bed must be finished so it means that is why they will say take your argument to your bedroom don't fight in front of the kids yeah don't don't make your kids aware of that but one of the additional thing also is like in the hour of silence, which is midnight, which is the hour of the ancestors. No argument also at all. This thing that people will be arguing in the middle of the night and say, wake up.
Wake up. Now we can't be discussing mamsika at 12 o'clock midnight. Exactly. No, you can't.
Yes. So black love, black couples in a spiritual space is important because the people who... work together, pray together, live together, love together, makes it even easier than to have these office space, workspace romances that are all over the place and messing up people.
No, it does. Think about it logically in your own life. If you are connected with your person spiritually, that means ancestors are also there. Whatever you wish for yourself, you wish for your person. No one is doing any spiritual thing on their own.
You're in sync, you do everything together. And that's how you get more blessings. Because you can't have me, Ngipashella, Abba, Mingela for whatever, but leaving you out. And as we know, Ama Josie, they love love. They love promoting family, ingane and whatever.
So if you're going to be a woman, you have to be a woman. You have to be a woman. Your ancestors, as you can see, they're looking and thinking, how can I be a woman?
Because I'm not coming there with you. And as history has shown, I've grown up seeing that it's mainly those women who run and take. Whenever these things going on in Lini, they are the ones to run to seek help. But it's so beautiful to be in tune as a couple, pushing that spiritual black love. Know what's happening spiritually.
Because I can't come home and say, oh, but I feel this and that. And you'll be like, why am I feeling this? And then I'm in.
the ancestors they're watching this they're thinking hmm and whatever and my ancestors might be thinking so so that's important and I love seeing young couples that are pushing the spirituality thing together I mean the family the kids they understand we're chasing this one thing hmm because then yeah so basically we are saying um having your own uh traditional healer i have my own traditional healer as a black couples is a source of argument it is because amanya my healer don't have are not discreet abanya they will come and tell me but um one two three one two three but like part of being in a black love relationship is to promote union, build, not break anything. Actually, it's a cooperative affair. Exactly. As opposed to competitive affair. Yeah, so you get the, but they advise you together.
But in Jalutoke, this is your part of whatever you're supposed to do. This is your part. If it ends at 2, it will be fixed quicker.
So if it ends at 1, it's not going to be fixed. Yes, it's not going to be fixed. No, it's not. So the message we're actually sharing here is that Let black couples, black families, let's pray together, consult together, work together, solve the problems, particularly spiritual problems together. And then we don't find ourselves coming with two different solutions because now the other one comes from their sangoma and the other one comes from their prophet.
Exactly. And they are talking past each other, they are not talking to each other. So it created a serious conflict. And you must remember, if you're number two, that already shows that you are in unity. Because part of the plan is to do together.
It's not the plan, but at some point, you don't want that. So basically, the expected condition of each one having their own different people that they consult with. ultimately will lead to separation.
Definitely, because you don't know what I'm being told when I go on my own. I don't know what you're being told when you go on your own. And you figure like, hey, I don't know what you're being told.
You argue in the bedroom. You do all these things because whatever they told you. But you don't even know how I got to where I am. Because sometimes they tell you that that is your secret. Don't tell it to anybody.
They do that? Yeah. They do that.
And you know, it takes me back to what I was reading earlier, Oguti. Back in the days, African love and spirituality was meant for, and sexuality was meant for production. You know, having children, children who become the culture, the culture that becomes a village, which leads to why they will say that it takes a village to raise a family and children or whatever.
So everybody knew, my aim is and then there goes our village. And we never spoke about this spirituality links. In fact, other men, I think they were even advised, you don't take them everywhere you go. But now we're changing that. We're promoting black love.
We're promoting spiritual black love. Do things together, go together. Abanto and abanbon and pasano, ngebanbon, nenza, everything together. And you'll see how your marriage, your relationship changes. So basically you're saying black love and black couples is a holistic African relationship which is based on cooperative affair.
than competitive affairs based on building. It is. Yeah.
It is. No. Yeah, no, that is quite clear.
And let's talk about black holistic power couple. We are always told about power couples, you know, and then you'll be seeing them, others having matching outfits and all of that, you know. How can you explain black holistic power couple?
That is, in the context of holistic, you're explaining that It's both the holism and completeness. Complete and holy. So the interesting thing about this, when you get married, you are told as a woman, which was nigela kulendota, fully holy, who you are, what you are, was nigela kuyi. So that's part of the holistic relationship with mawialapayana and you spending time with your husband, you building this home.
There's no doubts about anything. you they're fully present from head to toe spiritually you present your mind your soul everything and that's why even the sexuality that's high on spirituality is different because you connect on a different spiritual level with your person because you're both present and um i'm loving what i'm seeing now with the young couples they start with matching up you outfits you know the romance starts there I'm like okay you're wearing you dress the same as me we go together and it encourages me to start saying okay let's exercise spirituality so let's do this and there won't be this thing of when we have to be um sexually intimate because I'm feeling like because I get you we're spiritually inclined I even know what you're thinking I feel what you're feeling before you even say it Because between your ancestors and mine, some of the things that you might do, you know, this is the thing because we connected from head to toe holistically. Now it's the same thing. You know, when I'm, I don't have to tell you today, I'm not in the mood.
I don't feel like it. You see in the way I look at you, my energy. And that's where people don't understand. Spirituality is energies. And romance starts just looking at each other.
Black men, black women, black power couple, let's tie their shoes when they are untied. Let's open a door for them. Let's hold my hand back while I'm holding other things. Hold the hand back too. Are we not pushing it now?
No, you're not. And when we forget to hold the hand back, are we not getting reprimanded? No.
That you're not romantic. It must just flow. It must just flow. You know, all these things must flow.
I don't have to. I'm holding the handbag. I'm holding Mdwana. I'm trying to do this. You know, do something.
And it's effortless. And when you have that link of spirituality. Yeah. Everything is effortless. You won't even see, you won't even notice yourself with your hand back.
You won't even notice. You remind me of in 1994, after the 1991 Beijing conference. Remember the feminist and the women's rights and the 50-50 narrative when it started.
There was a big conference in Beijing, women's conference. So when the women were starting to say something, they were like, oh, Beijing. It is Beijing conference. But then there was this post about gender equality. They have a black man there with his walking stick and the woman carrying a big thing on the head and a baby in the back.
And then written, hurry up my wife, you know. So they've written that inequality ends with you. So they make it look like inequality has characterized the black life. That the black life had all this. unromantic, unequal, and all of this.
But I say it's a result of apartheid. You know apartheid was a cruel system. Our fathers get slapped at work there. They come home, they slap the mother. The mother slaps the children.
So they're creating this vicious circle of slapping around. Because holistically, in African holistic relationship, we were not even beating the children. This thing of corporal punishment being banned is not... a result of a democratic system. I'll tell you with the evolution of the society, when Africa was ruled by the great mothers of the nation, that is women above the age of 40, who were all spiritualists and so forth.
One of the things that was forbidden in this continent was corporal punishment. Because then they say corporal punishment, it hardens you. It makes you stubborn, you know. So they had a way, of course, to...
to mete out punishment like for instance imitated our loss of abantu they were having consequences like oscar kupa let's go next door what's going to happen and then they sweep on on your feet what's going to happen you're not going to marry so there was a consequences although the consequences were magical Like something magical will happen. It will rain in your wedding day. Forgetting what it's a raining season.
So basically what we had is there was a way to regulate good behavior. And that way was not corporal punishment. It was not all of this thing. And we had a balanced society.
I mean, the Nguni talk about man is the head of the homestead. And the woman is the head of the family. Yeah. In order. In order.
So this inequality as they portrayed was a result that happened with this harshness, was a result of apartheid colonialism, was a result of the mistreatment that the fathers were getting from the workplaces. See, you touch on that. That's why I don't understand the 50-50 thing. Because if I'm bringing 50-50 percent What happened to my other 50%? Where is it going?
I don't think it was thought through because now women are taking it literally. I'm definitely on and it's almost like women are counting the 50%. My issue is what happens to the other 50%?
Because women don't understand their role as wives going back to that black love, that holistic relationship, black relationship. The only way they can punish men with the other 50% is by depriving them of that holistic black relationship. Yeah. Because they can't deprive men financially because most of the time, men are the ones that provide financially.
So I'm not sexually tolerant by not doing my other female duties. Duties. That's where my 50% is. Yes, okay.
You're withholding your 50%. I'm withholding. And the only way I can do it as a woman is by...
depriving you of that black love i'm not gonna give you the full experience of black love instead i will be always bashing you with see our ends in this and that and that but as a woman you're supposed to help your men with that black love because some of these black men our brothers don't know what it's like to be loved so 50 is being weaponized it is and um it's sad that it's our sisters that are weaponizing weaponizing it okay So it's very interesting because it brings the concept of Indodamast. tell us about that Indodamast is having an element of one expectations an element of entitlement the transactional relationships becomes that so let's talk about transactional relationship versus transformational relationship again it's women that do the transactional you Because they are the ones that will come and enter into a relationship with, this is what I want. It's clear, these are my expectations. So indota, must.
And because it's a transactional, I'll do enough to get what I want. I want a Gucci handbag. I know I just have to do one, two, three, and you buy me the handbag.
And then after that, what happens? This is what I want. Something, yeah.
So that's transactional and it's clear and I can't go back to you as my man who doesn't understand black love and you can't even talk to me as a black man convincing me as a black woman how to love you because some of our black women are still angry at some of you know our black brothers for not loving them enough but you teach people how to love you but not you because we're dealing with our own issues. Naleh 50 50 we're thinking if you don't do this I also want to do this. So it ends up being that.
Yeah. So basically these other 50%, these 50s are not so balanced. The other 50 is full of expectations, entitlement, and then the other 50 is expecting that these 50 must meet the demands and they call them standards. Somebody who is born in a family where there is no car and then she said, if you don't need a motor, what a guy with a car.
Instead of getting it for yourself. For yourself. Yeah.
So basically they expect you to get them what they can't get themselves. Yeah. It's like, get me what I can't get.
Yeah. Welcome to Africa where you have to be rich to date a broke woman. But you see, and then you get the other relationship, the transformational.
The transformational. Yeah. Those are the best relationships. And I think that's why back in the days you'd get people that met at school.
Those were transformational marriages because there were no expectations. We had no expectations. We planned the future together. Everything we did together. And now let's throw in spirituality into it.
Let's blend in sexuality. And you get this best thing. But now, who's our slave queens and whoever else who believes in transactional?
they don't believe in that black love they don't believe in the forever after anymore they don't believe in that they can just love you just for you and you as a woman can just love your men for who they are there's always but they always think there's strings attached somewhere yeah actually is is the basis of create of commodifying the woman is making the woman commodity because then uh you know you become one of the things that i own you know like i own a car own a house i own you and your gucci's and your everything and there's always this thing that I'll have to remind you that okay I want to go to but that's what women forget it works for them limited time which is transactional works for them when the man flips it and treats you like a transaction it's like hey remember who you are So it becomes a twist. So I think with everything you decide to do and what you want to be labeled as in the relationship, always know the side effects, always know the consequences because you can't be in a transactional relationship and think it's going to bliss, you're going to grow old together. One day that man will find, in fact, it's a big thing now where you've been in a relationship with someone for 15 years, Angak Shadi or whatever, because I think it's in a transactional relationship.
And boom, after three months, the money was gone. And you're thinking, how? But you forget what you were in the transaction. So you were busy chowing your ball out there. Yes.
Now, you're I've got this and that. When I bring this and that, boom, it's complete. It's not a piece of cake. It's not a piece of cake. Actually, that is how Abba Ndibak Dalabiba shared it.
They were not making emphasis on love. They're making emphasis on, come, let's build together. But then you fall in love while you're building.
Exactly. I mean, love is always there. It's because how do you build with someone you don't love?
Love is the emphasis wasn't love. Like you see the Eurocentric system is so mad. You know, at one time it emphasized love.
Yeah. And now they're no more emphasizing love. People are telling that love is not enough.
Yeah. You know, love doesn't pay bills. Love doesn't pay bills.
So we keep on adjusting to these dysfunctional European psychological tendencies of love. But Maupaga, all those things moving about loveness, it's moving us further away from where we're supposed to be. Because once you go back to that mindset, your love is not enough.
You'll never get yourself back and actually love and experience love for what it is. Uwotumuntu can just love you. and want to grow old with you. And it's got nothing to do with what's in there for me.
What are you giving? We're growing together. So we set up preconditions for love.
Yeah. And then we sell it. A European philosopher by the name of Karl Marx, in analyzing the European society, what they call modes of production in Marxism and all of that, which is basically the evolution of society.
One of the things he talked about marriage is that Marriage is illegal prostitution. That any transaction that involves marriage with expectation, that involves sex with expectation, is prostitution. Now, it reminds me of this. There is this saying, they always say that, you know, in order to eat my women, but how do you miss me when it's cold, it's empty, what, And then it doesn't matter if it's a phone, it's a cheek, it's a massage. Yeah, let's take the stress out.
Let's take the stress out. So, Oma Ma has replaced the love and the intimacy with all the expectations. So, it becomes, you can only talk about unkhalele sexually today, munkam or mundoam, after you've paid school fees, the fridge is full, and all of that. Otherwise, you don't have the right to be turned off. Yeah, you don't.
I mean, you don't. Wow. And that's also wrong. And that's where the women use the other 50%.
Ban bamba la po, which is empty. School fees is not paid. And you figure like, hi, if you want bamba, bamba, how low? Yeah. Yeah.
Wow. Okay. So this European man was quite correct when he said marriage is a legal prostitution. Because I thought it was correct in a Western context of a marriage. But now because of Africans, we are also practicing Western marriage.
It becomes now our new reality within that context. And I think this is where we are missing the point. The more we are adopting things where we say it's a huwa, it's civilization, it's modernity.
And we go on to say our elders did not know love. Our ancestors did not know love. They were not even allowed to do this or that to express love and all.
And we have extreme definitions and extreme. our views of our things which is informed by psychology of self-hate that sometimes we even say things that were not there because when you start to realize that I had a grandmother and grandfather who were always like this yeah yeah even when they argue they're always like this half of the time they argue but you see them doing everything together walking together drinking gum kombucha together I never even heard them talking about church or going to church or anything they'll be doing their everything and even their role were very clear because yeah When it comes to Okpacha, the grandmother was just taking a lead. We all know that.
When it comes to inoculation, Okawa, the roles were clearly defined. So it was not all dark and gloom in our African past. But you see, it goes back to what I was saying.
As a woman, you had to understand your role. As much as Ubabasekaya leads, allow yourself to be led. But understand, you can't be submissive for what to what and you're able to be led without questioning anything.
Everything is effortless. But you know, you can't deprive that. You know, because you can't decide just because you you're not going to cope.
You know, and... You don't use your natural responsibility as a weapon. No, and that's where women go wrong. And that's...
affects the black love because now our black brothers don't see that because you know we use it more as a weapon we use the power in Zalabantuye as a weapon I mean extension of that is how about baby mama treat their baby daddies with the transactional baby daily thing if you don't pay for maintenance if you don't do this you can't see your child exactly so that's yeah they weaponizing they weaponize everything so it's quite interesting um this distinction of transformation a transactional relationship versus transformational relationship and you remind me of um a fundamental relationship between the mother and the daughter-in-law. Their relationship is that the mother-in-law says, this is my son, I give birth to him. And then the daughter-in-law says, this is my husband, I give birth to him. So they are all connected by birth. The role of birth, that I birth him and you birth for him.
So is that cooperative, foundational? African holistic love, that we need to understand that part. And as a result, we will not have a conflict between the mother-in-law and the daughter-in-law because each one will understand their role in the life of this man, that I gave birth to him and then you give birth for him. So together, we are connected by birth. And it's so true because it's a fine, but it's that.
If umamang understand the role they play and where it ends. They give the daughter-in-law a hard time in their marriage. Yeah.
And you as a daughter-in-law, you retaliate all the time because you're thinking, and then it becomes that, and then it affects the black love again. Yeah. Yeah.
You know, it comes to what you're saying, weaponizing the 50%. Because even here, we still have the 50%. You know, the mother's 50, the daughter-in-law 50. He's got 100. He's got 100. Yeah. That he's receiving from the mother and the daughter. the daughter-in-law, the wife.
But now it's a question of the usage of that 50. Whether you use it positively, then it becomes transformational. Whether you use it negatively, it becomes transactional. This is when you come in and then you come in to visit the in-laws.
When Mama Zala opened the door, they look what is behind you, you know. Yes, I'm coming empty-handed. Are you coming with a bandana bit?
Or was I wet? And then when you're coming alone, they're asking, can't you hum a nobile? You know.
because now they don't see their offspring. So they can't just welcome you like that. They can't just say, oh, I'm going to Varashi. I'm going to Hamanobat.
And expecting to be you being followed by the children behind. But now I have to ask you, as a black man, what role do you play in grooming the young black men, teaching them about black love? What would you say is important?
Well, now you're asking me, right? So from Bandu Soul Society, which is the Institute of Africanity and the community of African spirituality. As you are well aware that every Sunday we have an African spirituality Sunday on TikTok Live. Whereby from 8 o'clock to 1 o'clock, we're focusing on rebuilding.
repairing, rejuvenating ourselves. This last Sunday, we were focusing on unconditional black love, that we need to instill the unconditional black love that has no such attachments, that has no such expectations, that has no such transaction, that does not carry with it that. And talking within the context of the 22 secret and sacred laws of love, that...
As a black people, we are hated by almost everyone. And therefore, we have ourselves to ourselves. There is no European solution to African problems. There's only African solution to African problems. And that comes in a sense of what do we do to create that space that offer us a love that no one can give to us, whether on the basis of racism, class, religion.
creed or whatever and now this is where we're creating these spaces like bandu soul society we are having our retreat in september up to so far now in our band social society whatsapp group we have about 30 people confirmed 20 something 30 people 20 something and you're promoting black lovely yes and we'll be focusing on black love unconditional love that we need to give to one another Because you see, it can be corrected that we are found to be a statistics of everything. When people talk about... street we are number one you never hear why do we been talking about you don't find us we can't be number one in self-hate yeah we can't be number one in self-rejection we can't be number one in new conflicts among ourselves most people we're complaining about the world run by selected families and we complain about south africa being run by nine families or whatever that form part of the ruling class that control the ruling party or the ruling political parties that are in this country. So now we need to understand that blood-black love is our responsibility to nourish it, to advocate it, to practice it, albeit that it's not easy because we are conditioned into individualism and selfishness, you know. But we need to instill it among our people if we are going to go anywhere else.
Makas Gavi have a saying that we must have a love of the race, but that we must be willing to do for ourselves what others have done for themselves. You know, when the Europeans come to colonize us here and take our resources, it is out of the undying love of their people. You see, America is taking all the oil around the world, the bombing countries and taking their oil and going to sell it cheap to their own people in their own country. You have one American soldier or American citizen get killed here or two of them get killed here or arrested, America will come and bomb this whole place. It's their undying love for their own people.
But do we have the same for our own people? You see? So in answering what you are saying is that it's a work in progress.
It's not an easy thing, but it's something that we are working on to put in some institution in place. uh activities in place because one of the things we need to do is also family-based activities somebody was asking about that spiritual retreat that is children allowed to come through yes of course they should be allowed because we can't just talk about the love that is only the love of adults and don't have it manifested in the children you said it very well that um holistic relationship produce technology which is the children that produce culture you know so if anything is not being able to pass on to the next generation it is bound to die no that's true that's true well good luck to you on the black love grooming the young black men yes um and i really do hope we need more black men understanding black love how to love their black woman and we need our black woman to loosen up a bit you know yeah stop holding grudges stop they must just loosen up Yeah, there's a lot of grudges. There's a lot of keeping record of wrongs, keeping of record of wrongs. We spend a lot of time in saying, what you did to me, instead of what are you doing to me?
And even understanding how do we keep on building that? Like I was saying that traditionally, when Abantube wa Shela, it was come. You come to cover.
our our deformities yes you're coming to beautify our ugliness you are not coming that is why there will be a saying or if the in-laws by a by a papa if so papa now if by lawyer lawyer now you ask what time do we fly yeah you're asking mama are we still flying today you know yeah so it's it's it's a metaphor it's not necessarily talking about literally flying but it's just saying that you know when you come into this family that you are brought in to help build it, you build it unconditionally with love. And then in return, you will also get yours, unless if your contribution and your love is rejected, something else. But there's still a lot to be done towards Black love. And it starts with families and addressing our mental states, our emotional wounds. Spirituality, because all those three things are aligned.
You know, I find a lot of black people are still in denial about one's mental state. You know, what happened in the past and whatever. We're still bleeding and wounded from it.
So we need to learn to talk about it. And I'll have women saying that men cannot express how they feel. And that's where it blocks them from loving.
Actually, one of the cultures that is a tradition that is guilty of that is my Bapedi tradition. Like you internalize, you bottle your emotions, but then it creates a problem when you start to have emotional outbursts because you are wounded and you are covering your wound, and you are keeping on this straight face. But also it's created by a situation that also if you're getting men's conference or men's spaces where...
Is there a men's conference? A men's conference is what we created to run away from Valentine's Day. Sure. I mean, I'm still waiting for my... You see, I advocate for men so much.
And they keep telling me, you invited to the men's conference. No, no, no. Last, this year, men's conference, the only people who were invited, they were polygamists and men with beards.
They were the ones who were invited to speak. You can't speak if you don't have a beard and you're not polygamist. It was the theme of this year by Mzee Kipo. of Kenya. Okay.
Secret location. Then last year there was a different theme and then I think it's got about four years it started. Okay. So it does exist.
It's a virtual, it started virtually, like online. It was a Facebook men's conference when men were running away to comply with the Eurocentric concept of love called Valentine's Day. Then they came up with men's conference. It started on the 13th, it's finished on the 15th. Wow.
Yeah, it's like Saúl, a summer baby, you know. Every month end, you know. And then I tried to study the phenomenon of Sawe.
Is it real? And then I find that it happened every month end. Weekend year month end. And then this mama decided in the middle of the month, Friday.
But mama, from today, nobody... So it's a social construct. It's a social, yeah. Yeah, so it's like a men's conference.
But men's conference is step-by-step graduating into a real conference. Because this is men... crying out for a space where they can vent out or heal or whatever, be vulnerable. But it is still not so safe space because some men, you become vulnerable with them, you share your weaknesses, and they go and talk about them out there in a most insensitive way.
But remember, men compete still, eh? Yeah. Men do compete, and men do gossip too. Oh, yeah.
As a woman, I think men gossip more than us. I used to frequent Northwest. One time, I realized that it's just men everywhere.
I've got some places around in my casino. Get some men who are seated under the tree there. They gossip about everything.
So gossiping is a human nature and it's destructive. It's not only a male or female thing. It's a destructive tendency that we need to live it.
If you are going to have spaces where we call them men conference, where men are supposed to heal and become better husbands. Because this is the question we have in that there's too much over-empowerment of women. Today that the women are saying I'm empowered and therefore it's hard for me to get the relationship because men are intimidated by me and my empowerment.
So they take your girl child to school concept to work, take a girl child to work. But nobody's taking the boy child to work. You're talking about over-empowering of women. Nobody's empowering men for these women.
So then you have a large supply of empowered women with less men who will be able to match, to equal their empowerment. And a strange phenomenon, you'll find it among ourselves, that we are the only race. I have never had the white women, the Chinese women, or the Arabs, or any women of another race, talking about...
I'm independent, I'm single, I'm what? What is it there, the third one? Independent, single, and empowered.
Empowered, yeah. Something around empowerment. You find it's a strange phenomenon, but you only find it within our race. You don't get white women talking about that, who are single, who are independent, who are whatever. But you get to the white feminists, who are in the feminist movement, who brought us feminism.
The white feminist, when she go home, she go to sleep. with her husband and the black feminists go home to sleep alone yeah or the benten or but remember we as women Those, again, who are not content with their feminism and understanding their role in society, those are the ones who are quick to have this thing, I don't need a man. They forget what the man may not provide, the things that you are independently doing for yourself.
But there's other things that the man does. You know, there's a reason why there's feminism and there's masculinity. Some women get exhausted of being masculine.
They want to be feminine, but they need a man that's going to allow them to be feminine. But where are those men? They are busy saying, oh, we can't accommodate you because you are too masculine.
But they forget, if they had to just take two steps forward, I'll lower my masculinity and allow you to be. I mean, if we're going wherever, no one needs to know, we're living in my house. driving my car, whatever. I know as your woman, Oguti, you are the one that's buying groceries. You are the one that's doing this.
And that's where I have the issue with the 50-50. I might be in the position where I can buy a house, but it's our house because I've created a home for us, for our children. It's our car, but I was able to get the car.
But there's still so many things that we as women won't talk about that men do. Because we put everything, we put the price tag to everything we put, you know. And price in terms of material. Of material. Yeah, because there can be a spiritual role that man is playing in your life that is priceless.
Exactly. And that you can't put a tag on it. And you know, here's what I have, when we spoke earlier about sexuality and spirituality.
As Isangoma, I understand the importance of having a husband that supports my spirituality. But you don't get those a lot. You don't get those a lot.
You don't get those a lot. You don't get those a lot. You don't get those a lot. It's so beautiful and sexy to have a partner as a female who has male patients who are not male.
And back then, now you're actively driving the car for me. I was like, I don't know. And then what do you do?
So you eat and drink and eat non-stop and people are angry. Exactly. But if I have you and you're not, Isangoma, I'm not angry. You're there, I'm not angry.
I'm not angry at you, you're there carrying that bucket. I'm not angry at these things. I'm not angry at you, you're the one that's driving the bike.
But you're not angry, but you support what I support. Now I'm not angry at whatever, I'm there. That's promoting black love.
That's that holistic black love we're talking about, you know. it extends to that thank you thank you so much Makos talking about black love on unpopular opinion this is our unpopular opinions about love and we agree with it we agree with it we agree with ourselves thank you so much