If there's something I say that you're not comfortable with, then I need you to tell me that. And I would do the same, okay? Okay, Mike, I need to know something here, but why don't we just sit and do that?
This is your chance, man. Do you not think you're going to feel better getting some of this off your chest as opposed to keeping it there forever? You know what I mean? I'll sit with you and do this. There's no issues with it at all.
Let me say, I have no problem sitting with you, man. Why don't we just find a starting point and we'll do it. Okay? We'll take our time. And if you want a drink of water or something else, we'll do it.
But let's sit and deal with this. Okay? Let's sit, you and I, and deal with this and talk about what's happened here. All right?
You can do it, man. You can do this. Alright? I'll sit with you.
Mike, I will sit with you. Okay? If someone, if you've been manipulated into this, I'll sit with you. Okay? But, you need to be straight with me and I'll be straight with you.
If I say something that isn't right, you need to clarify it. Okay? But let's sit and do this. Let's try. Here's what I'm going to say.
How do you figure that? Nothing is going to matter what I say. Why do you think nothing will matter, Mike?
Because it won't. Can you give me a reason why you don't think it will matter? It just won't matter. You don't think I'll believe you? I don't know about that, Mike.
How can it not make a difference? This is your chance, man. We can show, hey, we're in talking to Mike.
He was given a chance to say his side, and here's what he said. Alright, what's the downside to it? Right?
I don't see one. I really believe that. I mean, you've, uh...
You have some intimate details of what happened here, okay? And you have some intimate details of who's involved in what. Why keep them inside, okay?
There's a number of ways we can look at this, okay? Why don't we look and we do the right thing for some of the people involved? including yourself.
This is your chance, man. Alright? Because you're going to sit and stew forever. You say, no, I should have said this or shouldn't have said that, right? It's up to you.
I mean, I've got situations where I wish I had told somebody something that I didn't and I regret it my whole life, okay? And in situations with family members where you should have said your piece or you should have kept your mouth shut. But we all have those experiences. But this is your chance to say your piece.
All right? And I think you and I should take that chance. I think you and I should just sit and have that discussion.
How is it going to get worse? Right? It can't. All right? You're already sitting in here facing this situation, facing these.
These charges, how does it get worse? It doesn't. But your side is important, alright, and I'm certainly willing to listen to it. Because there's a couple things that I think that you can shed some light on.
I really do. You know, discussing your thoughts on this and how this spun out of control. Thank you. Why don't we try it? Why don't you and I have a discussion here?
Why don't you test me? Let's discuss something. See where it goes.
If you're not comfortable with it, then we won't talk about it anymore. But why don't we try it? And then I'll sit and say, well, what was the downside to that? This is your chance, Mike.
This is it. Alright, you can't, there's nothing else you can do for these people, alright? You've done all you can to save these people.
You've done all you can to help them, Thank you. right? And obviously to an extent someone's put you in this position, right? And we need to deal with that.
You want me to tell you things I didn't do so I can get locked up for the rest of my life for this? No, that's not what I'm talking about. I don't want you to tell me things you did not do. No. I want you to explain to me...
Number one, I want the truth. I want you to explain to me how this happened, how you get involved in this. How does a guy, over 28 years, Thank you.
not on the radar, how does he get involved in something like this? So that interests me. I'll say that. But I'm also interested in the role that these other people have played.
I'm very interested in that. Because to get to the truth, we have to know the other players and their involvement in an accurate form. And like I say, if you and I have something that we can talk about that, I think we should.
I think this is the time to do it. This is the only time to do it. I'm absolutely interested in what you have to say, but I'm not interested in seeing you go through something that, like you say, more experienced criminals have got you into. Where do you think we could start? What makes sense?
A lawyer would make sense. Okay, and what would that make sense in what way? Here's an idea.
I'm going to ask you a question. What's your biggest fear or your biggest concern now that you've been charged with this? What's your biggest concern here? My life. Okay.
All right. All right. And?
What, what, uh, when you say losing your life, what do you mean by that? So I don't want to speculate what that means. It means losing my life.
It means not being able to have a life anymore. It means not taking care of my mom. It means not having to do the things that I do every day. That's more than fair, but I wanted to make sure I understood that.
Um, alright. What would your mother want you to do in this situation? Did your mother ever ask if you did this? No. That's pretty important, isn't it?
What would that tell you if your own mother asked if you did this? That would be pretty scary, wouldn't it? It would be pretty bad. You spoke to a lawyer earlier.
I know you've mentioned it here now. Are you looking to negotiating something, or what is your thought that way? I think a lawyer would let me know of all my options. Okay.
And a lawyer would look out for my interest, whereas you're not looking out for my interest. Okay. And...
Okay. And a lawyer can tell me every possible scenario. How do you figure, I need you to be straight with me, how do you figure I'm not looking out for your interests? Because you work for the police.
Yeah, I do. That's true. So, I'm sorry, but you're not looking out for my interests.
Um, I could see why you'd say that. But, and let's break that down a bit. Okay, obviously I do work for the police.
But what have I said that really hasn't made any sense? Why? Okay.
And it's your job to get me to tell you things. That's your job. It can be, yeah. Like, you're not, you're not, where it's a lawyer's job, a lawyer's job is to help the scenario the best that he can.
Yes. That's not your job. No, my job is. You're getting paid for something else. I'm getting paid to find out what the truth is.
No question. I'm getting paid to, but at the same time, I'm not sitting here thinking, well, if you say something that's not in your best interest, right? Because when I sit and say, credibility is important, right? Credibility is important.
When I sit and say that telling your version now, You're the first person who will take whatever I say and use it however you want. No, I wouldn't. No, because that wouldn't be up to me. I'll take what you say and it goes on the video. But I don't sit and take it and twist it around and something's not.
I mean, if what you say is the truth and matches with what the evidence is, what's the concern? Right? And that's, like I say, here's my observation, and you feel free to correct me.
You and I have talked. As soon as I go anywhere near talking about, you know, if I want you to mention a monster or a pulverizer, you get... really mad, almost sick to your stomach about the situation.
Maybe you're even upset with me. And it's very consistent. So what's that tell me?
You're not a monster. I know that. I've told you that. But you have to understand. This situation, okay, it's a missing girl who's no longer with us, okay?
We have to deal with this, alright? We've had discussions about, you know, maybe people that are involved in this or something like that. Why would we not get that out in the open and deal with that, right?
There's no downside to that. If there's something that... We need to do, if you sit and make a comment and say, well, Tara did this or Tara said that, why would I not follow that up, right?
However, if you and I sit here and break this down piece by piece and you say, well... I have issues with this concern here because if you follow it up it's going to show this then that's fine then you and I explain it so if there's a piece of information you give me and say well I don't want you following that because here's why then I'll then I'll deal with you okay if you want something from me then you need to ask me what it is that you want and then I can explain how that fits in and what I can or can't do for you. Keeping in mind, as I do this and talk to you everything that I say and do, I'm accountable for. I can't just walk around talking to people and say whatever I feel like saying. I can't do that.
Nobody can. We don't live in a country like that. So if there's something that you're not comfortable or you put a caveat to something that you say then just... I'm just saying. I'm telling you this, but here's what you need to know to go with it.
Does that make any sense at all? I want to know what this girl Terry said. Um, okay.
She acknowledges that she grabbed Tory and brought her to your car. That it was your wishes. That you sent her there with certain things that you were looking for in a victim.
And she took her. And you guys drove on the highway. And did the Home Depot thing which I talked about. Left the Home Depot. To a secluded area, you had sexual relations with Tori, and Tori was killed.
So like I say, Mike, when I say I'm interested in your site, I think you can understand why, okay? If you're in with some bad people, this is your time, man. This is as good as it gets, unfortunately.
Alright? This is it. I mean, I can get into more detail if you want, but in a nutshell, that's a polite way of saying what the allegations are, okay?
That's a polite way of saying what you're up against. And that's why when I sit and bring in these, you know, these other ideas and comparisons, now you know where I get it from, okay? Because I've been involved in many of these.
Who are all these other people who were arrested? Who are these other people who were arrested? Actually, I shouldn't say, I gotta be careful because the one that's detained is probably gonna get released.
Okay? Um, Terry's not getting released. Okay?
Um, there has not been... The follow-up for, um, Tara is not complete. Uh, I can say that. And Rodney's not complete either. Alright?
Um, that's not done. But the stuff that's happened today, um... That's kind of taken all the resources and focused on that right because now your car is seized.
They can get all the paperwork ready for your court dates now. And now they have to go follow up with some of the other people that have been implicated for having different amounts. So some people...
We're told about this. Terry had told some people about this stuff. So they have to be dealt with.
Actually, I've never asked you who you told. I haven't even asked you that yet. But if there's stuff, if there's other people here... Thank you. What's happening man?
What's your thoughts? Are there any other areas that you think I haven't covered? Or you think, I've got a bunch of other things I want to talk about.
Is there anything that you thought that you and I would talk about in here that we haven't? Anything at all? To all my friends.
Pardon me? What happens to all my friends? In what way? The people who I know.
The people in my life. What? What happens to them in what way?
Just what happens? Well, my thoughts are, like I said earlier, Mike, I think they think the worst until they know. That's why I'm asking you this stuff, man. People are going to think the worst. These are serious allegations.
When I talked about what Terry said, I sugar-coated it. I can sit and break it down in more intimate details. But we need to deal with that.
If there's other people involved, I'm willing to listen. But I've got to tell you, the evidence is very clear right now that this is a you and Terry show. Alright? I'm willing to listen if there's others. You just said there's other people who are implicated, other people who are being charged with this.
Did I say charged or arrested? Right, I mean you're you may be holding up hope here that there's others are gonna come in and get the same charges as you And that maybe that might be my fault and maybe I've I haven't been clear enough but as far as the abduction and Death of Tori, it's just you and Terry man that specific part I need to be maybe I should have been more clear on that. Okay, and I could say I wish I should it sugarcoat I did sugarcoat exactly what she said, but it is a lot worse when she says it, as to what happened with Tori.
That's, like I say, that's, that's, I can sit and give you, like I say, I can sit and give you the details of what she's indicated that was done to Tori. And maybe that's my job, maybe I should. But at the same time, I want to treat you with dignity and respect as well. And like I say, that's why I'm interested.
What you have to say here, because this thing's out of control, okay? Something happened here, all right? That just isn't quite right. For you to go to zero to 120 miles an hour like that, something's happened, okay?
We don't just start out here going through a car when we're 14 to be involved in the abduction and death of a young girl, okay? That's not right. So something's caused that.
And that's what I've tried to discuss with you here. But maybe I should have been more clear in relation to the disappearance and the death of Tori. It's you and Terry.
There's some outlying issues surrounding this stuff. And some drug use and stuff. But for the focus of this girl, it's you and Terry. And she said her piece.
So that's why you and I got to go through your site. So you get a chance to say yours. See I didn't, I watched when they spoke to Terri so I do know what she said.
I did watch it, but I wasn't the one that spoke to her. It was one of the other officers on the investigation. But like I said, I said I would come in. I've been involved with it from a behavioral sciences standpoint for a while.
So I said I'll come in and talk to you. Can I watch it? Want to watch what she said? Which parts? What she's, what she's implicating me.
Do you want me to cue up some other parts? Sure. Okay, what part would you like to see? Just the part where she's saying this is me.
Okay. Okay. I can do that.
Are there thoughts or anything else you'd like? Which parts do you want to hear? Do you want to hear right from the time that the... Well, I can show it right on the video, right from the time that Tori's grabbed to the time you get to Home Depot, or do you want to hear after that? Obviously she said it, I can't make that shit up, man.
I wasn't in the car with you guys. Alright, so obviously she said it. Alright, and like I say, as we go along, video corroborates it.
I need a lawyer. No, you spoke to one. I need a lawyer. There's no issue with that. No, that wasn't my lawyer.
That was just somebody who gave me advice. Do you have a lawyer? I don't have one yet.
Okay. Do you know anybody who does? No.
Do you have somebody in mind? No. Okay. I have to talk to my family. Not your biggest concern is what your family's gonna think?
I'm very concerned about what my family's gonna think. Personal question, does your family know anything about any Oxycontin use? By you? I don't know. So just the Oxycontin thing's gonna be a bit of a shock?
He has some pretty difficult stuff to explain. Are you comfortable telling me how long you've been on oxys? I've been taking pain killers for years.
Am I even on the right track saying that Oxy's caused this or did you find that offensive and that it was just something that was maybe going to happen anyways? I'm willing to listen to you, I'm willing to talk to you because, you know, we've had a couple of times in our discussions here where you've thrown out other names and stuff. Maybe to test me to see where I'll go, but I'm willing to listen to anything that you have to say. We can all just simply walk away and you're the one stuck with the problem, right? But I got to admit, I'm surprised that when we get involved in this, that someone who's had really no issues their whole life with the police is involved in this.
So, I mean that's reality. The guy I told you about in Toronto had no problems with the police either in the past. They went and got involved in something like this.
It happens all the time. However, I'm not going to lie to you, I was a little surprised. I gotta tell you when you start digging around with stuff on Mike, there's not a whole hell of a lot out there, to be quite honest. From a law enforcement standpoint, you don't have very many skeletons in your closet.
I gotta tell you that. Because if you did, I'd probably bring them up, right? And you don't. But the evidence is the evidence. It's very clear.
We need to deal with it. If you did something because you thought it was the right thing to do... because you're on auxies then that's that's what we move from there but what's this process what happens what happens next After you and I are done talking, you go back to your cells. Tomorrow morning you'll have what's called a...
You'll be brought in the court and the charges will be read to you again. There'll be a discussion if you get out of custody for bail. And then they may schedule a bail hearing to determine that.
And then from there it's a matter of where it goes from the court. The investigation will go on for a little while yet. There's a couple of things, as I told you, that need to be done. And then in the... The big picture, you're facing these charges.
And you're the one who has to explain the allegations, right? I'll explain what it is that the evidence is showing. Like I said, I've sugar-coated it. I haven't even got down into all of it.
I'm just doing it as an opportunity for you and I to discuss it. The less evidence that you and I talk about, the more credibility you have. Nothing you can say to make it worse. There isn't.
It is what it is, man. It's true. What can you say to make this worse? Nothing. Unless you're going to tell me there's more victims.
Other than that, there's nothing you can say to make this any worse. Again, because I've sugar coated it. Where do I go after court tomorrow?
Um, well you'll be in the, uh, in the jail. You won't be here, you'll be in the, in the, in the jail. And then from there you, uh, you'll be out of your court.
I'm not trying to be a smartass when I say this, but really the facts are the facts. The evidence is the evidence. I'm not trying to be a smartass when I say there's nothing you can say to make this worse. There really isn't nothing that you can say that's going to knock me off my chair with surprise.
Man, I would be amazed if you said something that wasn't supported by the case facts. It's all investigations there. Like I say, it's... And the worst part is, I mean, there are steps you've taken to kind of cover your tracks a bit. But as we mentioned earlier, you're not...
An experienced criminal, and that lends to errors being made and evidence being gathered that implicates you, so it's nothing, don't be offended by that, that's reality. An experienced criminal, and that goes to some of the other things that we've talked about. It's reality, like I said, I've just sat with you and gone over. Some of the highlights, but I can discuss some of the other issues. There's no issue that way.
If you and I are going to talk about it, we'll just sit and talk about it. If you question me, you ask it. If I have a clarifying question of you, I ask it.
And if you have an issue with it, you say, no, I've got an issue with that one. And I explain, okay, here's why I can't answer that. I have no issue with any of that.
You see, you're not going to offend me. You make me mad or anything like that. I have no issues that way. At least I can all day long.
No issues. I'm sitting here with you. We can discuss with other cases I've seen her being involved in as well. I have no issue that way. I don't know anything about that.
It's fine. I'd like to sit with you and do it if you want to go, Mike. The reality of it is we can just sit and deal with the issue here just as easy.
I'd rather deal with this issue in court. Hey, Seth. How are you? I understand Mike here wanted to see what Terry Lynn had to say.
Mike, Terry Lynn's still speaking to my partner, okay? This is the girl you killed, all right? She's not missing anymore.
She's dead. Terry Lynn was asked today if she wanted to call a lawyer four times. She said no, all four times. She went through two boxes of Kleenex.
Alright? She says on the 8th of April, Wednesday the 8th of April 2009, at 3.30 in the afternoon, you drop her off at P.A.V. South of Fife, South of the public school, where Tori walks out of. You tell her to get a girl, and you want her young. She walks out.
walks up the street, you drive up to the old age home where you park your car. Thank She walks up to Tori. Tori is nice to her. She trusts her. She holds her hand for a little bit.
She walks up the street with her. Terry Lynn tells her about her little dog, gets her across the street to your car, opens the back door. Tori doesn't like it anymore.
She pushes her in the car. You start driving. She said she's freaking out. you.
She said she's worried about you. She's scared about what you're going to do. Thank you.
She said you guys hit the 401, you start driving to Guelph, you park outside of house, you go in for a little while, you come out with some drugs she thinks. And you drive to the Home Depot. You park at the end of the parking lot. You tell her it's her turn to get out of the car.
You tell her to go in there, you give her some cash because you don't want to use your debit card so you don't track it. She goes in there, she gets garbage bags like she's told to do, and she comes back out. And you go driving. And you pull into a farmer's field, right across from a house, to the point where you're even asking her if anybody can see you.
And what does she do? She says she goes for a walk. Thank you.
Because she doesn't want to see what happens. And then she goes back. And you're not sitting in the front seat anymore, Mike. You're sitting in the back seat.
And she's not liking what she sees. So she walks away again. Then she comes back and you make her hold one of those garbage bags while you put some of your clothes, her jacket, and a hammer in the garbage bag. Then you drive to a gas station.
She never sees Tori again. You drive to that gas station, you get out, you wash up, you dump the bag. You drive back to Woodstock. That's Terry Lynn's story, Mike.
That's Terry Lynn's story while she balls her eyes out through two boxes of Kleenex. And I ask her four times, Thank you. hey, you want to call a lawyer?
She says, I don't need to call a lawyer. I feel so bad about what happened. I just want to tell you all about it. That's what you're up against. Terry, that's a liar.
Well, you're the only person that can tell us that, buddy. I just did. You've got to be careful, Mike, because some of the shit she said is backed by not just video but other evidence, but also some of the explanations that she gave as well are verified.
That's a little more graphic than I said it, but... Yeah, there is some stuff that she says that is true. Thank you. No question, I'm not going to say it's not. How old are you, Mike?
28 years old? You want to tell us your side of the story? Get rid of your fucking security blanket and start being a man.
Because it's not going to be her semen that we find on her body. When we look at the areas underneath the parts of the seat that you cut out, we're going to find her blood. Do you know how blood works?
Do you know about red blood cells, white blood cells? White blood cells are thinner. Thank you. They look like spit when they're separated from red blood cells.
They're the ones that seep through into the foam. That's what we get the DNA from. Skin cells from her rubbing up and down against your seats in your car. Tori Stafford is all over your car. All over it.
And Terry Lynn explains everything that she knows we're gonna find. You're explaining nothing. So I don't give a fuck if you say one more word or tell you the truth. Alright, we're done then.
Well, I'm done with you anyway. This officer here is trying to understand what the hell you're going through. I don't care. Who are you?
I'm the lead investigator here. Okay. Okay?
Terry Lynn's full of shit. Well... That's going to be a funny thing for you to say in court, isn't it?
Because how's the DNA going to be full of shit, Mike? How's the biologist from the Center for Science going to be full of shit? How's the pathologist that examines her body going to be full of shit?
Explain that to me. That's a dangerous road to go up. If there's something you and I can clarify with what you said, then let's clarify it. But we can't just sit here with a blank statement that she's full of shit, because there is some things that's truthful. And by you saying that, it takes away your credibility.
So we've got to be very careful with that. I'm done with him. This officer's got a job to do, Mike. He's got a different job than I do. For my investigation, you keeping your mouth shut is the best thing that can happen.
So keep on keeping it shut. Okay. Well, genuine.
This is, these people have been working on this stuff for over a month, right? So, some of these people have been working from 6 in the morning to 1 in the morning ever since then. Some of them have one day off, so there's a little bit of concern and emotion, but... But I gotta tell you, like you said, just sitting and saying a blanket thing about Ted Terrell, you're not doing yourself any good.
At the same time, what he's saying is right. I did watch what she was saying, and she was very emotional, there's no question. And she did go through Kleenex, there's no question about it.
She was upset and there's stuff that she said that I mean was clearly known ahead of time by the investigators and there's stuff that was said that by her saying it later proved out to be confirmed other ways so don't, I can't say don't, you can do whatever the hell you want but just be careful going up that road. I mean if you're going to do that you're going to have to try and back it and like I said there's no magical cleanser out there that cleans the DNA out of a car. Just you and I sitting in here, Mike.
Your DNA's in this room, my DNA's in this room. That's reality, right? Could be saliva, perspiration.
We may have shed skin here or whatever. So you just can't wipe it out. And I can tell you over the years that things that people have tried, different types of fuels, oils, people have set fires to their cars, likely to try and get rid of stuff.
But yeah, if that stuff gets soaked right in, which it will, you've got an issue. And there's even actually a couple more things that actually he didn't say, whether he did, why he didn't or whatever, that's fine. But he did talk to Terry today. Anyways, but like I said, I have no issues with that.
That doesn't change my opinion of our discussion, to be quite honest. I mean, they've got their opinions, and obviously they're getting sick of listening to me, so they've come in and said their opinions. Peace, but like I say, I've got no, I'm not best with this. But like I say, this is your chance. This is your chance to say your peace.
And I'm sitting here willing to listen to it. Like I say, I've already told you my opinion, right? I've told you my role. My role is, in behavioral sciences, my role is to assess threat.
And I've already told you I don't think you're going to go and kill somebody else. I've already told you. I've given you my side. Like I say, it's up to you. Like I said, I have no issues sitting here discussing this stuff.
But you need to understand what you're up against. He just told me not to say anything more. That's up to you. You don't have to say anything. That's what he said, though.
He doesn't want you to talk to him. That's fine. I'm still interested in listening to you. But I have no issue with it, like I say. If there's a way we can explain it, then I'll sit and listen to it.
If it's oxys is the problem here, then we might as well start up that road. All right? If that's what's happened, and you've taken too many oxys and then went and grabbed her up, then let's deal with that now.
All right? Because, like I say, some of the stuff she said is already being confirmed. And some of this you know is confirmed anyways, because you already knew some of the evidence was out there.
So you know that that's already reality. But you also have to understand, I talked earlier about the other cases where the people sat in here, acknowledge what they did and apologize. You can't even, you've never even heard of those cases, because the whole thing just flew right out of the radar after that.
All right? So that's up to you. But I think there's a couple things that we should probably discuss while I'm here. You know the risks that are attached to having her in your car going up that highway, right? So you know there's a good chance that there's witnesses for that.
So there's certain things that you can explain, and some of it might be a little more difficult. But I have no issue sitting in here going through it with you. Do you want to talk about the part of the school where she's grabbed?
We can discuss that and see what your thoughts are there. Why I ever started talking to trashy people, I don't know. Everybody seems smarter than this. Something happened. Right?
You've heard me say it fifty times, probably. Something happened here, man. You don't fly on the radar for twenty-eight years. So what happened? What part's hard?
Is it hard just to even get talking about it? I'm not saying anything. Why?
Because of the officer, because of what the lawyer said, and Alex, everything. I just don't... I'm not saying anything.
What's your concern about saying something I know? Like at this point? I'm not saying anymore. What do you think is going to happen next? I'm not sure.
I don't know. Someone runs in here and starts barking. Well, the problem with that is, like I say, that's frustration with people that haven't smiled for eight, for days, right? They've all missed family engagements during that time, right?
Maybe then he should have a coconut smile and try to talk to me later. I don't think he will. I don't think those guys will.
And I'm not just saying that because I'm here, but, like I say, it's, uh, my role's a little bit different. And I don't think you'll have to worry about those guys coming around seeing you. And again, it all goes back to, there's emotion over stuff like this, alright?
It's a, I can't sugarcoat it, like I've sugarcoated some, but it's a serious situation. You can't sit and... I know it's a very serious.
It's, like I said, we've only talked about it before. If that's what it was, that you used some oxys and did this, then that's fine. Like I say, we'll deal with it. But nobody's going to get you. No one's going to care two years from now.
That's what you say, right? Because you've had two years to think about it and say, oh, well, this is the best way to go. It's not going to come across as believable. Like I say, it wasn't that. Terry committed some of the stuff she said and some of what she said.
Terry is an incredible person. Well, and the problem with that is when she starts saying stuff that can be verified, it becomes very compelling, right? And that's what's important. It would be different if she said stuff and it was full of lies, but that's not what happened.
They say what she says is compelling because it can be matched. And I see a lot of what's going to solve this case is video because video is so prominent now than it was a few years ago. And technology's better.
And again, there's some compelling things, as she has said. But the fact that your car was on that video long before and it hadn't been released, yeah, there's a lot of stuff to verify, and that's before they go and analyze your car. Which is going to, well there's no way there's nothing in that car. She spent too much time in there. And there's no, you're not gonna be able to explain, yeah, she was eight years old, she was hitchhiking or something.
You're not gonna explain how you don't have the relationship with that kid to have her in your car prior to this. You understand what I'm saying? I hear what you're saying. Okay, alright. Do you understand where I'm coming from?
Do you know why I want to get this out? You just want me to say whatever... You just want me to say things. So...
It's open and closed. No. So it's over and done with. That's it.
This is how it is. Nothing more to talk about. No, actually because, you know, actually that's not, that's fair. That's a very fair statement actually. But I gotta tell you, in this case it's not, it doesn't matter.
If you and I never meet, if the police don't even interview about this, it doesn't change what the evidence is, right? But the reality of it is, it is an unusual case. It's an unusual circumstance for someone like yourself who has no previous real criminal experience, has no Real past in relation to any type of sex offending, has no bizarre behavior, right?
You're not out torturing kids or doing anything. There's no bizarre behavior. Let's be realistic.
There's no bizarre behavior really documented on there. To be involved and have a role like this in this situation is unusual. So yeah, I'm compelled and I'm interested to listen to what you have to say.
But does it open and shut this case? No. Because as you can tell, they really don't care. been here talking to you, right?
Their feelings is more important to them and getting their side out and raising their voice at you is more important to them than having me sit in here with you. I mean, they've made that pretty clear. So, like I said, I'm interested because of the why.
Because it's different. I've got to tell you, it's different. But at the same time, I'm going to say this again. Your credibility is important, and you have to understand where I'm coming from. And I don't know if you believe me or not, but I need you to think about it at least.
When I say people think the worst without knowing the facts, that's reality. Whether you've chose to do that or ever done that in your life, you know, we all have. I think the worst thing we see, what happens is people start making up their own reasons as to why things happen.
Right? And start their own stories and their own rumors. So, you and I sitting here explaining, holy shit this is, and maybe you can't.
I mean, maybe you decided that you were going to try this with a kid and there's no real logical explanation, that's why you can't tell me. Maybe that's reality. Or maybe you're embarrassed about a drug habit that got away from you.
But... I'm telling you, I know it sure is. I'm sitting here like, people think, and you know that, you've heard me say it, but if you stop and think, people think the worst.
All right. Let them think what they're gonna think. What's that? Then let them think what they're gonna think.
Then they may. I mean, see, they're gonna think the worst. There's no question about that. Alright? People will think the worst until they know the truth.
So, um, that's why I'm sitting with you. So, if this is an oxy thing that got out of hand, that's why I was prepared to listen to it. Like, if it's not, then that's fine too. Right?
It's something else, it's an uncontrollable sexual urge that people have against us. That's as real as I can put it. Why? I've already told you why. Just because of all the different angles and all that?
I'm just, I just don't feel comfortable talking about it. So you're prepared then to just leave it like this and you're gonna ride it out from here, see where it goes? Yep. Do you think that's the best way to do it? I don't know.
I've never been in this chair before. I don't know. Any questions of me? Need something to eat? Yeah, but you don't care if I need something to eat.
Why would you say that? Because you don't. I wouldn't ask if I didn't care. Are you here for your job?
Nope. I could have walked out on a tasky because you got a job right here. But the reality of it is, I know that you're going to go back and sit and sleep or do whatever for a while and you'd be better to do it on a full stomach.
That's all it is to it, man. I don't have to ask you if you want food, but I am prepared to get you food. I can eat and then you can say, well, look, he had an appetite. This is how he must have been feeling.
Oh, he drank his tea. This is how he must be feeling. Forget the fact he's just starving.
You're reading too much into it, man. That's not what it is at all. I offered you something to eat because I thought if you're hungry you can eat it. I don't care if you eat it or not, right?
I mean, it's up to you. It doesn't matter to me if you eat it or you don't eat it. And that doesn't go anywhere in any of your reports.
What's that? That I ate or not ate. No, because it's on the video.
It doesn't matter if you eat it or not. You don't have to write any report. My report doesn't say if you ate it or not. My report says what we talked about. That's all.
No, that's reality, man. I ask people that. No, I don't, like I say, it's, uh, your appetite at this point doesn't matter. Really. I come in here, I sob, to explain to you what the evidence was.
Had a discussion. Actually, I don't think there's any animosity between us. So we had a discussion about what the case facts are, and that was it. So it doesn't matter to me if you eat it or not, but it was a legitimate offer. If you want something, I'll arrange for you to get it.
There's no issues that way. You're eating too much of that, man. Do you want something to eat? I need something to eat, yes.
Alright, we'll get you something to eat. I need something simple and plain. What were you thinking?
Something, anything plain. Soup or something? Alright. I'm allergic to mushrooms and onions.
I think it's some type of allergy, is it? What type of allergies make you go into a throw up or anything? The mushrooms make me pretty ill. And the other ones just make me nauseous.
All right, look at me. Take it easy. Hey Mike, remember me?
Hey? Gord? We sat down for about half an hour the other day on a Friday and sat down at your kitchen table.
Okay, and we got to know each other a little bit. I got to know a little bit about you, about your family situation. You know, talking about how long you've been around here for, what you've been going through.