[Music] well good morning this is jay smith on a very auspicious day why well today is june 8 2022 so you may ask so why is that important for those who have been watching fander films and have been watching david wood's youtube channel or hatton tosh's channel you will know that two years ago today on june 8th 2020 there was an infamous interview between dr yasarkari on one hand and muhammad hit job on the other who are these two individuals many of you probably don't know but those of us who have been working with islam and have been engaging with the quran and especially have been engaging with these books these are the kirat these are the different qurans you're looking at nine different qurans oh they're all qurans they all do trace their lineage back a thousand years they all claim to be from the time of muhammad they all claim to be the complete quran all 114 series and there are 114 surahs and they all more or less do agree mostly mostly but with just these through here just these two here these are the two most popular of the 30 official crowns i only have nine 30 official qurans just these two this one here is known as wash it is memorized by people from north africa and this one is known as huffs this is the official one that is memorized by oh about 93 of the muslim world population so this is by far the most popular but only because it was chosen back about a hundred years ago in 1924 as the official text these two between them have 5 000 different words which means 5 000 different verses which means 5 000 different meanings and in many cases different doctrines different beliefs and even different practices 5 000 of them if you look at all the 30 official kid that's just nine that i have here along with these two there are 30 of them if you want to see how many differences there are in those 30 manuscripts or get us there now published all over the world today hatton tosh has all 30 of them in her library she and her team have been able to come up with 93 000 differences now why is this important well for most of you are probably scratching your head and not really important so the quran disagrees with itself there are different publications maybe these are different translations no no no no no no these are not different translations these are all arabic and they all attribute themselves back to muhammad back to that 22-year period when he received revelations for all of these 114 surahs from jibidil who got it from those eternal tablets which are in heaven chapter 85 verse 22 stipulates that and remember the quran continues and says very clearly that it is preserved completely the quran itself makes these claims for it not it says in chapter 10 verse 15 in chapter 18 verse 27 that nobody no person like you or me or anybody else can change allah's word not one word not one letter can be changed dr yasir khadi one of the leading world's authority on the quran who lives here in houston united states he is very clear that not one word not one letter has can be changed he's said this for years and years and years and that's been one of his mantras so here he uh here the quran is very clear that not one word can be changed and the reason why in chapter 15 verse 9 it stipulates because allah himself will keep it preserved will not allow any changes by man not even one letter not even one word according to yasakari so this preservation of the quran is sacrosanct for all muslims everywhere including all the muslims who are watching me right now you have to preserve the quran it cannot have any interference and this has been a real problem this has been a huge problem when we back in 2016 here's a picture of us holding up 26 at that time we only had 26 qurans that hatu had managed to collect when we held them up and showed the whole world these 26 quran there was muhammad hijab take a look at this picture you can see muhammad hijab right there and he was in the crowd and he got steps outside of the crowd and he calls all the muslims to come to him and he says don't look at what they're showing you don't listen to what they're saying come here i would explain well obviously he should have explained it and evidently he didn't because back in 2016 as the crowd went to him asking him for what this all meant because they never heard this no muslim that i know anybody of the believers that i've come across has ever heard about this because you're not taught this for very very real reasons and very simple reasons however that was in 2016 2020 june 8 is when muhammad hijab decided to do something about it decided to find out how to answer this very troubling question so he had this interview and i'm going to show you snippets of this interview in sequence i'm not going to show you all 28 minutes that would take too much time i'm just going to show you about nine minutes but i'm gonna break it up into different categories and i want you to follow as muhammad hijab ask a perfectly innocent question a perfectly good question which one of these 30 official kidnaps those you see here along with these two here which one of these is the one that's in heaven which one of these is the one that was revealed by gibraltar to muhammad which one of these is the real one that is eternal that cannot be touched by a human hand because they're so different five thousand between just these two alone 93 000 between all of them when you put them together so let's go look at this interview and i'm just going to post bits and pieces pieces of it and then unpack each one as they go along so here's muhammadi job asking and beginning this interview with dr yasakari difference okay now on this point i just wanted to go to another thing which is probably the most when i put on the community page the most asked thing which is there was a video that was released by one of our brothers um some time ago uh brother imran and he released this big big video about the leaks of some kind of email chat that you're involved in about preservation of quran okay and uh what is your position in relation to preservation of quran is for example do you see it as preserved from allah subhanahu wa time or do you not see that as much as so what he's doing he's asking a very simple question it's a very good question and he's saying [Music] this book here this is the official one this is the huffs what does that mean well that's the stable that he comes from the man who is assam is from kufa which is in iraq and he died in 745. his one of his two students that took on his mantle was known as huffs and huffs died in 796 796 is the late 8th century so both of them were from kufa they neither of them knew muhammad personally because they were not even from the same city muhammad lived in and they were over a hundred years later awesome died in 745 a good house who is the one that was chosen as the official one his student died in 796. that's 140 144 years after muhammad died so you can see this is a real problem and that's why muhammad hijab is asking this question can we assume that this is the official one that this is the one that's in heaven this is the one that muhammad received since it was written uh a good 144 years after muhammad certainly that should be an easy uh question to answer that's the beginning of this interview let's see what happens next [Music] our good friend uh dr yasir khari now remember he is the world authority and that's why muhammad hijab has asked him this question and he just jumps and says no no wait wait wait wait changing listen listen listen it is a matter of theology everybody knows theologically speaking that the quran is preserved absolutely he didn't say word for word letter for letter he said that many many other times but that's what he's implying because everybody knows that's what he stands for he is always referred to the quran as being preserved completely absolutely so that's he just almost backing off he says and almost what he's saying this is not a good question to be asked we all know by a matter of principle theological principle that it is preserved so what does uh yasakari then do how does he say next let's re watch as for the issue itself every single student of knowledge knows who studies that the most difficult topics are and the concept of the reality of and the relationship of the arithmetic muslim and the preservation of the ah visit one is it three is it seven and the relationship of the two this is a topic that when you're the beginning beginning student of knowledge you're like what is all of this going on here when you go a little bit more you learn to simply memorize what your teachers say and regurgitate it out and you don't fully comprehend when you do a deep dive is when things get very very awkward and difficult and this isn't new this is from the time of the sahaba and this is not a joke brothers and sisters the issue of cause confusion to somebody whom the prophet said if you want to listen to the quran directly listen to obey obey is not some even average sahabi he is the of the quran he is the master he is who he is and he goes like what is all of this stuff oh so you can see it's very clear that this is a problem because what does he say well he categorizes the different students that he has and he categorizes it into three different groups the first group are those who are the new converts you don't even talk about it you don't even bring this up don't bother them with this this would be too much of a difficulty for them and it's interesting it's mostly the converts who are the ones who are coming to the fore and are demanding an answer to this because they're hearing about it because you cannot shut it down because of youtube and all that happens on youtube so the first group don't even talk about it don't bring it up the intermediate muslims who've been muslim for two or three years at this time you just tell them to memorize it and regurgitate it don't think about it don't critique it don't criticize it just memorize it be a good muslim obey submit that's what islam means and that's what muslims someone who submits and obeys that's for the intermediate students as for the advanced students then he does a deep dive a deep dive what does he mean by that well we're going to hear about that a little bit later let's go before that though look and see what else he then says again this is the few you're asking it's a very honest question it's the first time i'm saying these things many people are aware who listen to my lectures that i've mentioned the crises that happened to me at yale my first year at yale it wasn't a crisis of faith by the way so it was very clear about this people misinterpreted it was a crisis of my understanding of knowledge it was a crisis of what my teachers taught me alhamdulillah as somebody who remembers the quran as a teenager alhamdulillah in my entire life i have never doubted that the quran is divine you cannot doubt that any you listen to it you recite it you just cannot doubt that it's never been initiated this was the issue that the issue of preservation and relationships between them these are very very difficult issues and the most advanced of our scholars they're not quite fully certain how to solve all of the unanswered questions in there these issues should only be discussed amongst people who know what are and who understand some of these questions so he's saying that this has been the most difficult problem for the last thousand years and he is correct this has been a difficult i'm surprised he says the most difficult you would if you think there'd be a lot of more difficult moral problems and and political problems but no this is the most difficult theological problem if you start from the premise that the quran is completely preserved every word every letter it would be the most difficult problem why well because of the fact that these 30 different qurans nine that i have here were introduced at a much later date and were only chosen by ibn mutha mujahid uh in 936 that's the first seven the next 14 were then chosen in 1194 by al-shatabhi and then the next the last six were then chosen by al-jazadi in 1429 in 1429 is the 15th century that's 800 years after muhammad you can then see why this is a huge problem an enormous problem so that's why he's saying this then he goes and he talks about his himself isn't this interesting he mentions that this is this was not a crisis of faith uh muhammad hijab asked him it was just the crisis of faith that we've heard about and he he bulks at that and he recoils at it and he says no no no this was not a crisis of faith this is a crisis of knowledge or of understanding he corrects himself even on that that he didn't know how to understand this knowledge that he was being introduced to here in yale university when he got his degree in 1995 his phd and that's why it was difficult for him to come to some type of conclusion a very real i said well this guy is being honest and then but he then he says but he does not doubt it even though he couldn't understand it even though he could not really come with any type of logic of as to what's going on here he just knew that he had to believe i cannot doubt it i'd listen to it and i recite the quran and then he says in fact it's such a big problem that only the scholar should be discussing this this is something only that should be in the realm of scholarship not amongst you and me we should be discussing is what he's really saying so what's he do and what you say next traditional understandings cannot answer some of these pressing questions that are now being poked by our uh people outside of by our academics not out by their academics outside of the faith tradition you see in a muslim environment there's always some respect that we have for the quran we should in a muslim environment will press a little bit and then we'll say okay and that's great alhamdulillah when you go to academia they don't have that red line and they're going to just you know the the famous story of the emperor with no clothes [Laughter] so here's fascinating we he's talking about muslims now we give a respect to the quran right so we set the quran up and and there are certain questions we don't ask of this quran we just say stay away from asking we give a respect to this book here and because of that there's a red line beyond which we don't go that red line no we don't go beyond that red line but in yale university there are no red lines and you can ask any question you want to you can go in any direction ask any question at yellow university and that's what caused his crisis of knowledge notice he says he could not understand how to answer it he could not understand what they were saying well obviously because no one had bothered to to tell him how to deal with this problem because for a thousand years no one's talked about it and if they had talked about it it was been sublimated because of this respect they have for the quran thank god we in the west allow you to ask any question you want including every question you want about the bible there are no red lines on the bible we don't have anything beyond what you censor that we censor about the bible you can ask any questions of the bible you can ask any questions of jesus christ you can ask any questions about our theology because jesus and the bible and our theology stand every test proving how strong our bible is and how strong jesus is and how strong our theology is if you have a red line that should tell you pretty clear clearly that there is a problem uh that if you cannot ask certain questions and you sublimate discussion and debate and criticism then what you're saying is that i item in this case the quran cannot answer these questions for you that automatically admits guilt that's what he's saying the quran cannot answer these questions these are unanswerable therefore just submit just read it enjoy it and then follow it please don't ask questions my mind's already made up let's see what he says next they're gonna just point out no that doesn't make any sense well that's not true and this and that and they'll bring issues which i'm not going to mention explicitly that you know are true because they're in your own books they're not inventing anything new they'll bring you the way y'at and they'll bring you a thal and then you add to that very well-known issues of i don't even want to be explicit and then you bring on top of that and then and then and it's very clear to you and to every single very advanced student and specialist that the standard narrative has holes in it that's what i'm gonna say the standard narrative does not answer some very pressing questions so here he comes to his signature piece he turns to mom and his job and he says you he's talking about you you in the east and he's talking about he in the west he has to live in a i haven't shown that part of it but he says i have to live in the west i have to live in places like yale university where these questions are asked to be all the time you in the east however you he's living in london that's interesting that he calls that the east but you who are not in academia is what he's really saying you who are on the popular level you are on youtube you are the ones who are living on the streets but you're not in academia in the hallowed halls of academia where these kind of questions are wholesale you're not coming up with this kind of stuff but you you who are living in that world that popular world on youtube and all the rest your narrative which is the standard narrative has holes in it the standard islamic narrative s i n where do you think we got sin from it's from yasal khadi he is the one that created it in that interview he called it the standard narrative what narrative the islamic narrative not the christian narrative not the buddhist narrative not my narrative nor not even his narrative the standard islamic narrative has holes in it and this is what started the huge anger that we are going to see that came out afterwards nonetheless that's where he coined it june 8th 2020 we're now june 8th 2022 and we want to remind you that that standard islamic narrative doesn't just have one hole the kid on it has holes after holes after holes after holes and holes when you start and you take away these red lines not just of the koran the red lines of muhammad or whether or not even existed the red lines of islam and whether or not they even existed at this time whether there was a city called mecca at this time you talk taking away those red lines and there's lots of holes oh not just one or two tens or twenty there's hundreds probably thousands of holes and that's why we are sin sifting we are doing and we're looking and we're putting every one of those s-i-n those standard islamic narrative directive and we're seeing oh look at the thousands of holes right here all the holes that we're finding and it's just seeping through one after another one after another one after another it's made my job so easy but he didn't stop there let's see what he said next the standard narrative does not answer some very pressing questions these are now well known within the western academy that they're bringing forth issues their level of now knowledge is leaps and bounds above what it used to be you know 100 years ago you know and by and large our ulama in the eastern world are not aware by and large of what's going on in the western side of things and they're not answering those questions in a manner that it needs to be answered and this is something all of us that are in academia fully acknowledge we actually this issue uh has troubled from the very beginning of times nothing new and there are 15 opinions about this none of them fully answer all of the ques questions that are raised the western academics he says that's us in the west that's where he lives now and that's where he has to engage the western academics have come leaps and bounds leaps and bounds means they have come enormously quick in what they now know about the quran he does mention later on dr shadi nassar as one of them dr shari nasser has probably done the best work on the giraffe and on the achroven he is from harvard university he got he got his phd at harvard university he does refer to him by name but he doesn't even respond to nasa's claims or what he comes up with he just gives out the name like it's a dirty name in other words don't even go there don't listen to him and yet this is from harvard university that's the top school in the world it's the number one school university in the world and yet uh we're not to respond to it muslims if you're not going to respond to that then you're not going to be held you're not going to be looked at with much authority in fact he does remember he gave her the claim earlier that it's like looking at an emperor with no clothes for you who don't know that story that's a story from scandinavia uh where the emperor wanted to get beautiful clothes and so he brought this dressmaker in to give him the most gorgeous clothes that he could find but every time he looked at he didn't like this he didn't like that so finally the dressmaker had an idea and he came and he just pretended that he was putting things on to the emperor and doing this and sewing that and mumming and eye and finally he said now you're finished and the emperor looked and he was in his underwear and says where are my clothes he says ah and the dressmaker said only those who are true subjects only those who really love you as their king will see the clothes those who hate you those who don't understand who you are or don't have any respect for you they will see you in your underwear but that will show you who are the true subjects of your kingdom and they are the ones that will see you have the most beautiful clothes well of course the emperor did not admit that he couldn't see that because that means he's not a good trump subject and it means that he is something's wrong with him so oh yes i see it now yes they're beautiful gorgeous i want to show the whole world so he goes and has a parade and he walks right through the parade and of course everybody knows that they're supposed to ooh and aw and clap and applaud because they don't want to be seen as not as hating their king and they don't want to be seen as traitors so as the king is going through the streets and everybody's applying going ooh and on what a beautiful clothing he has on there's a little boy who's looking at this and he turns to his mummy he says but the emperor has no clothes on and that's what yasakari is saying the rest of the world is saying about us we think we have everything down we think that we can get away with this preserved quran we think that we know what we're talking about the rest of the world has caught up and realized that we have no clothes on the standard narrative has holes in it okay so that's at least admitting that we're doing something right here in the west and that we actually know what we're talking about he's pretty much acquiesced on that point let's see what else he says next this issue uh has troubled the umber from the very beginning of times nothing new and there are 15 opinions about this none of them fully answer all of the ques questions that are raised so the issues of the relationship of the origins of the ichthyolaf and all of this should only be discussed amongst those who are familiar with this site right so because this is such a problem because the west is looking at muslims with as a the emperor with no clothes he then makes this injunction that this should only be brought up by scholars it should only be brought up by those who are knowledgeable those who have covered this subject what does he mean by that let's look and see where he goes with this let me ask you one question to try and make this as specific as possible i think if i were to give you a blank must-have yeah and uh and tell you to write what is the verbatim from allah into that must-have with no human interference would you write something which corresponds it's not an easy answer it's not an easy yes or no it is enough for the muslim to believe that i think this should be an easy yes or no though yes okay very very well so yeah muhammad after we get off this phone call me and you let's have a number of discussions no problem i'm very open with advanced students but these issues should not look it is kanam allah what is going to be written it is what would you write let's not let's you're pushing me and i'm saying it's not hikmah to listen i have a condition like i said everything i say is going to be fine the quran is the uncreated speech of allah the quran is preserved the quran is known the quran well fascinating so muhammad hijab who thinks he's one of those who is a scholar of course and he's one of those that should be knowledgeable uh he then asks the million dollar question the question that he came to this whole interview with and that is what are you gonna do if i give you a blank sheet of pa a piece of paper if i just give you this piece of paper he puts his hand up to symbolize that blank sheet of paper and i ask you what which one of these get out are you going to write will it be huffs or would it be watershore would it be qasim or would it be kaloon which one of these 30. how did yasakari answer he said this is not easy wait i don't want to in a 20-minute sound bite how can i explain this to you this is to be something that you must take a deep dive talk to me afterwards i'll explain when there are no cameras on us is what he's saying and then he said despite these problems he was so sure absolutely sure that the quran was uncreated and completely preserved and then he went into a mantra he was sure that this this was the quran was a speech of allah he was absolutely sure that the quran was preserved he was absolutely sure that the quran was known he was absolutely sure that the quran was mutawatya that means it has been served one without any letter or word that has been changed throughout its whole transmission for the last 1400 years absolutely sure this mantra that he had memorized that he had been told since he was hey hi to a grasshopper he is now repeating right there on camera almost trying to persuade not only muhammad mijab and those of us who are watching but himself and this is what you see with a lot of muslims they don't know what to do with this material they just do not have never been questioned before they have never critiqued the quran at this level and so they just go into this little mantra this little memorized speech they have been told since they were young kids and that's why he did it right there on camera what comes next issues of the relationship of the origins of the ichthyolaf and all of this should only be discussed amongst those who are familiar with this science it takes a while i can't answer this question in a 20-minute interview nor is it wise to do so which is why i never brought this topic up myself you will not find one lecture of mine about this issue it should never be brought up in public and i don't like these idiots and they are idiots this is not something you discuss amongst the masses it's not wise you don't understand cannot let it be it's wise that's why i never did it 20 21 so it's been 25 years 26 years that i have been thinking about especially over the last 10 years i have been doing a deep deep deep dive into this issue going back to the original sources getting consulting experts and i have a workable theory insha'allah when the time is right i will publish books and papers so for 25 years since 1995 since he was um at yale university and got his doctorate there for 25 years he has never lectured on this subject and he's proud of that he's proud of that he's saying it not humbly he's saying very with almost righteous indignancy because you cannot lecture on this i would never lecture on this why well for a thousand years no one has been able to come up with some type of response listen mujahid could not come up with a response or shah to be could not come from upper response we know that al-jazadi who died in 1429 so that's the 15th century wrote 80 books on this subject and was not able to come up with any type of response if he could not come up with a response back in the 15th century how can this dear fellow yasakani in the 21st century come up with any so he's proud that he's not lectured on it that is not very convincing and that's not very stabilizing if this is the best that islam has and dr yasakari is the best they have and he's not dared to lecture on this for 25 years why is he turning to muhammad hijab and say take my class take my class he's already admitted he's not going to talk about it he has it for 25 years so why take his class why do a deep dive if there's nothing there even for the deep divers then i would suggest that the deep divers are have a dilemma on their hands including muhammad hijab including all of us so you can see this is a real dilemma for him what's next if i if i could push back here just a little bit and i know this is i don't want to make it uncomfortable but it's just just to make things clearer like if if someone gave you a quran which is empty in terms of there's no there's nothing on it and give you a pen obviously a half of the quran but the question is would what you write in that must have correspond with any i'm not saying it's a mutual i'm saying would it would be sahih authentic would it correspond with anything that we have in terms of the quran who's going to bring a new quran we're going to have the quran there but which will it be in it'll be probably a mixture right it's not going to be necessarily yeah okay so let's leave it at that it's going to it's not going to be the exact half san also this is something that is coming at a later stage okay okay the codification of the is coming in the second third century of the of the history but you would have something which you could say is fully recognizable by the average muslim obviously so when you write so yes so just to be clear if you write down it might not be a standard is recognizable and you believe and you believe that everything within that is subhanallah 100 as allah is my witness 100 that is the belief well now we come to the concluding our part and here this is actually the second time he's asked us he asked that at the very beginning i didn't have that in the clip but he puts out his hands and he says listen one more time i'm going to ask you i'm going to ask you again which quran which one are you going to write on this blank muslif which one is it that you're going to give me you got to give me an answer on that and what did yasakari answer did you all see what he answered they're all the quran all of them all of them including all of these nine right up here all of these are the crop they're all the crud take a little bit of house take a little bit of wash take a little bit of kaloon take a little bit of kasai awesome you're taking all of them and just mix them up mix them up and that is your quran all 93 000 differences i remember when i was watching i just started clapping i said does he know what he's saying does he know the dilemma he's putting all the muslims into is he even aware i don't think yasakari is even aware that there are 93 000 differences between those qurans he may not even be aware that the waters in the house have 5 000 differences because no muslim has done this work that i know of they won't do this work because this is the red line you don't go beyond if you don't go beyond the red line and you don't ask these questions and you don't have any answers if there are no answers then you can see the dilemma for those muslims who are in the real world like the muhammad hijabs he is in the east he is in britain he is there where they are asking these questions they're also asking it here in the west jason cotti did make that miss that uh he did uh did i did agree to that i mean he did acquiesce on that uh he did admit that even at yale university he was asked these questions he was shown this problem and he didn't know what to do with it it was a crisis of knowledge for him so you can see this is a real problem it is such a problem for muslims because they have to say the quran is preserved they have to say that allah protects it they have to say that not one word not one letter has been changed because the quran makes that claim and if the quran makes that claim they have to make that claim and as long as they keep making that claim we're gonna can shut down that claim we're gonna confront it because we know that the quran has not been preserved you know that the quran has not been preserved it's very easy just to open its pages and look at it al fadi and i are doing that i'll be putting up some more in a few in the next few days al fadi and i have already put up looking at verse by verse going through there are we're just looking at warsan huffs huffs and wash uh the two most popular qurans and we're just looking at the 5 000 differences we've done about five that i put up we'll be putting up more just to show you how they change the theology how they change the doctrine even at times they change the practice proving that these are different qurans with different meanings obviously you cannot have different qurans with different meanings if the quran is eternal and has always existed on eternal tablets can you see then what this interview did this interview two years ago on today or two years ago today because of this interview this costs such a few rory that on both of their channels they both put it up on their channels immediately it was live streamed on both of their channels after two weeks they had to shut down the comments why well i was reading those comments and i'll tell you why they had to shut them down there was comment after comment after comment hundreds of comments of muslims that were saying i am now leaving islam because of that interview because of what you have finally admitted because you're the ones that are telling us that it's been preserved you're the ones that have said that there's not one word not one letter and now you're admitting that there is no preservation that there are many different qurans that they do have changes and that we just mix them all up to get the quran we have today you're completely going back on everything you've been teaching us i'm now leaving islam and my blood will be on your shoulders is what they were saying and that's why yasakari and mohammed hijab finally had to delete that interview from their youtube channels two months later two months later you will not see that interview on either muhammad hijab's or yasad khadi's channel it has been deleted because they finally admit it in public that the quran is not preserved [Music] you muslims your narrative has holds in it your standard islamic narrative has holes in it it's not me that's saying it it's ya sarkari that said it and you've got to deal with it this is jay two years later on the day that that infamous interview came out we'll be doing it a yearly reprisal going back and unpacking it for all of you every year we will do it again on june the 8th remembering what happened on june the 8th 2020 muslims your quran is not preserved no it has not just tense it has tens of thousands of differences how about 93 000 differences god bless you this is jay over and out [Music] [Music] you