Meta's Roadmap and AI Strategy

this I think is is going to be the beginning of something interesting it's that the old Picasso quote all children are artists the challenges how to remain one when you grow up part of what we want to do is build the tools that allow everyone to do that what's on the meta road map in the next decade that you think has the best chance of being one of these frame breaking consumer Tech moments I think the neural wristband is going to be a pretty big deal could end up being its own platform on its own we're almost ready to start showing the Prototype version of the full holographic glasses and that's wild every person who I've shown it to their reaction it's um it's a giddy as a product Builder what else needs to be in there for billions of people to prefer using glasses over the mobile phone as like the primary Hardware device the demand for it has been so much higher than we expected ramping up production and ramping up the factory lines if you'd asked me that a year and a half ago I would have said in technology every once in a while something comes along and just unleashes all these new opportunities and you need to rethink what you're doing what are the trends that I'm seeing well in social media I'd say there's a few big ones one is the shift from Mark is honor thank you so much for doing this I'm really looking forward to it yeah happy to thanks for having me on of course all right so let's Dive Right In can you just talk about how meta is approaching AI more broadly because there's going to be thousands of creators that listen to this they know AI they know the players they've played with some of the tools but I think it' just be super helpful to hear from you what's the meta AI game plan and kind of how does it fit into the market yeah so what I'd say is that the the biggest way that our approach here is different from all the other companies is you see a lot of other companies trying to build like one main AI that you're going to interact with right whether it's um you know Gemini for Google or chat GPT for open Ai and I mean our view and we'll also have a basic assistant meta AI that people can use but but our overall view is that this isn't the type of thing where there should just be one of or we think people want to interact with lots of different people and businesses and there need to be a lot of different AIS um that get created to reflect people's different interests so a big part of the approach is is going to be enabling every Creator and then eventually also every small business on the platform to create an AI for themselves to help them interact with their community and uh their customers if they're a business and we think that that's just going to create a much more compelling experience and just be more Dynamic and useful um than just having a single thing that people use so you know obviously a part of that is going to be that we're not building these things ourselves we're building the underlying technology and we want to make it so that you know the underlying model llama that we're building is absolutely World leading right so we want to go for it and try to build full general intelligence and and build the leading models and I'm really happy with our progress there but an equally important part of this is going to be building the tools for creators um and businesses over time to be able to create AI that reflect them and what they want to have out there and also um create all kinds of different experiences as well so that that's what the AI Studio announcement um this week is it's an early test but um it's an exciting one in terms of a step towards that vision and that's that's what I want to get into cuz I think that world viw of like a network of maybe their single purpose maybe their multi-purpose agents combined together customized for each Creator in business that's exactly where I think we're headed as well it's not a controversial thing to say in 10 years I think we're going to have many many many more creators than we do today and even more of that mainstream content is going to flow through creators meta has already been a principal layer of like laying those rails today but when you think about what the future of Creator experience looks like what is that future like from a tactical use case perspective what are some things that seem interesting to you yeah so first I totally agree with what you're saying I if you look at the kind of broader Arc of human history um more people are just getting the chance to pursue uh their own creativity and their own interests and um you know not having to do as many jobs that they might find mundane or just doing to work but like but basically are getting to do things that they really enjoy and I think a lot of the Arc of technology is enabling that uh both by inreasing productivity for the other tasks um and just giving people all kinds of new tools so this is definitely going to be part of what happens here is basically we want to build more tools that um that just enable more people including people who don't consider themselves creators today because I think you know everyone is creative in some way and everyone I just look at my kids like trying to um you know it's like they they don't they're not creators but I mean they're definitely just like you know playing with their Legos creating all kinds of different stuff it's cool you know um it's the the old pic Al quote all children are artists the challenge is how to remain one when you grow up and I think part of what we want to do is build the tools that allow everyone to do that so what are the trends that I'm seeing um well in social media I'd say there's a few big ones one is the shift from feed-based media to more personal messaging interactions right if you look at Instagram DMS is one of the fastest growing parts of the of the system um that's part of what I'm excited about here with Creator studio um and AI studio is basically we're making it so that people are going to be able to um kind of craft a persona for an AI uh version of themselves that's going to help them interact with all the incoming DMS that um that that your community is is is sending you and you know it's like the classic problem of there's just not enough hours in the day right I think every Creator would want to engage with every fan who's reaching out to them but you just don't have time and of course probably more people than are even sending messages would like to engage with something that that Creator is creating but um a lot of people probably don't even send the messages because they know that the Creator is not going to get around to be able to message so um so yeah I mean I I think there's this whole question of how good are the AI agents that creators create for themselves I'm going to be and I think that that's going to be an art form by itself that kind of grows and evolves over time and it's going to get better and better but I think for a lot of people knowing that they're engaging with something that the Creator created and had a hand in doing um is going to be pretty meaningful um it it may not be as good as as interacting with the person themselves but um but for a lot of people that's not available because there's just not enough hours in the day for the Creator to respond so that's um that's one big part we can go deep on that um the other one that I'd say is growing really quickly is just reals and video short form video you know it's I mean there's just been this pretty amazing Trend where you know you go from you know movie and longer form TV shows I mean there was a time when people thought of YouTube as short form because people were comparing it to TVs and um and movie but today you know compared to real short form video I mean a lot of YouTube videos feel kind of long right you're multitasking while you're watching a YouTube video because it's it's going on for many minutes and I think that that is probably just going to continue because people are getting the tools to create really compelling content and get it to be super tight and crisp and I think that the rate of kind of development of those tools is going to continue and I I think that people are going to be able to have um use AI for creating um video and editing and there will still be a ton of creativity in that whole process because you'll have to kind of hone what you're building and shape it like a like a sculpture but I think fundamentally it's going to be accessible and the quality of the content is going to go up as as it just gets you know people can play around with a lot more different ideas so probably those two messaging and short form video I think are the two big trends that I'm seeing right now yeah I think that barbell strategy of like on one end the super raw unedited long form podcast out conversation and then on the other end exactly you're saying like the super polish short form storytelling and a bite-sized package it seems like that's where attention's flowing to both those sides I want to get into AI Studio on the on the tool side so today it's essentially the foundational building block the way I look at it is the foundational building blocks for how creators are going to interact with AI within meta's world and like today is let's say block one like just the foundational tooling can you talk about how you're stair stepping that strategy so like what came out today why are you excited about it I can share my feedback as well as a tester and then let's talk about the stair step of that in terms of the Tactical tools yeah so I'd say there's a few different Paths of the technology at the same time so one is just the development of llama the underlying model and the tuning of that as we get as we get feedback so that's kind of something that's happening underneath the hood that's kind of the core infrastructure um then on top of that there's all the product experience and tools that we're creating that uh that allow people to create these different AIS so whether it's a Creator creating um an AI agent version of themselves to to interact with their Community um at some point we're also rolling out uh people the ability for for um anyone to create ugc AI right so it doesn't necessarily need to be you it could could just be a new kind of virtual Persona that you create that you want to uh you know exist on on Instagram and and and the apps and interact with people um and then probably won't get into this as much today but but on the business side you know there are as many small businesses if if not more than as there are creators today I think that that's a huge opportunity it should be super simple for a um any business to just you know press a few buttons get an agent version of themselves that can help do customer support an e-commerce support um I think that that's going to be really powerful so what we're doing today is we're rolling out the first test right so we're you know we try to take these stages um we're launching with about 50 uh creators and we're going to start rolling it out to a small percent of people um and then as we kind of dial that in then probably over the next month or so we're going to roll it out so that you know more people can can interact with these uh AIS and you know maybe by the end of July or you know August or something we'll we'll we'll have that fully rolled out um but this is it's it's going to be a pretty interesting experience to to kind of see how people like interacting with um with these AIS that their creators create and also as big of a part of that is just building the tools for I mean I'm curious and you've been playing with this I mean I'm curious what your feedback is and you know what you think is working well what we need to work on yeah I'd love to share it I mean so for myself as a Creator and then my parents actually run a Golf Course in Ohio so they're they're like the small business use case right if they have the Instagram profile they're getting all these requests that they can't like you said we can't scale DMS and messages so the way I think of it is it's kind of like a spectrum where there's fact-based questions that come in and they come in I'm sure you get this at a scale like it's hard to fathom right thousands of these fact-based questions things like do you have a link for this or have you made video for that or like where's your shirt from these are obvious questions that can be answered you just need to clone yourself right and that's where the the preliminary use case for this is amazing every small business and Creator is going to want this and then on the other end of the Spectrum which I was playing with a lot is more of the like opinion style questions so these are things like if someone says hey if you were me how would you grow your brand right like a multifaceted question that is tough to answer just in one go and that's where I feel like it'll get interesting to watch the AI train on me in my responses and like kind of hone that in if I could scale those opinion answers then because really my goal as a Creator is one toone trust at scale that's all I care about and so I'm tapped out with my capacity so the question the question that I had for you on this as I was thinking about it is the fact-based stuff makes a ton of sense I think every fan would agree that they just they want to get that information surfaced but on the opinion side I think some fans will worry that AI assistant might dehumanize that like magical connection between the fan and the human and so the question is like how do you go about building these AI tools for creators that are infinitely useful but also maintain that authenticity and that human connection yeah so I guess the part of this that you're calling the opinion kind of zone is where I think more of the art form comes in right so the the process of how these things get trained I mean there's obviously the there's the bass llama model but then creators when they're setting up these AIS have the opportunity to pull in all kinds of information from their social media presence and whatever else they want to train into the system so um like you said for the fact-based stuff I that's relatively clearer to instrument and understand when we're getting it right and when we're not on the opinion side I think that that's going to end up being more um the the creators are going to have a lot more opinion around what they want the AI to express for them and I to your point about people knowing that they're interacting with an AI That's a core design principle for us and we're not trying to you know create these AIS and and and kind of have people think that they're interacting with the Creator themselves and we want it to be as High Fidelity to the Creator as the Creator wants but will also be very clearly labeled as an AI so that you know there shouldn't be any um any confusion around that but you know as a when you're interacting with your community you may feel comfortable taking more Liberties or risks about what you Express or you know being a little closer to the line on something that might be sort of riskier to express but um but you might want to do that as a as as a person but you may not want your AI to do that right so even though you know you you might be able to have it be trained on on um the content from your social media um you may want to train it that it should stay you know maybe a little more cautious on certain things um or not go into certain topics that you don't want it to to to engage with until you know maybe in the future you get a lot more confidence that's really going to channel you in the way that you want and I think that that's those are the types of tools that I think are really important but this is where you know like I said I think it's going to be somewhat of an art form that um you know I don't I don't think we know going into this what is going to be the most engaging and entertaining um and Trust building formula for this so we want to give people tools so that you can all experiment with this and you know see what ends up working well one of the questions I really wanted to get to is kind of like future feature ideas for AI studio so let me give you one that I think would be really cool so as you're watching this clip if someone could just tap on your shirt or my hat or this light and immediately there' be an AI layer that recognizes what the brand is what the product is they Auto add to cart it auto tracks affiliate back like that's this invisible layer that could really help Creator monetization obviously I'm I'm assuming for infrastructure reasons with millions of reels created every hour like it would be tough to support that today but maybe that's the backlog what are some other things future features of AI Studio that we haven't talked about yet that you're excited that we could get to maybe in the next three to five years well that kind of thing of just understanding what the different items are is um is something that I I I think should hopefully over time apply to all posts right so we'll we'll get there I mean we we have early versions of this with the multimodal AI um with the Rayband metag glasses where you can you can just say hey meta look and tell me what this thing is um and it can and it it you know is reasonably accurate it it kind of giving you a sense of what what you're looking at and being able to answer questions around that and that'll only get better as as the Llama models continue improving and as we you know fully roll out you know the next versions and and so on um but yeah no I think that that's I think that's a that's a big one and I think that there's a lot of things like this I think being able to automatically do translation and dubbing is something I'm pretty excited about for the future I think people who speak English often lose track of the fact that you know a lot of the world doesn't speak English and um and I think being able to automatically have all your content in um in all these different languages and accessible to way more people is going to be really powerful if that can feel authentic and like you're speaking that language I think that that's those are some really exciting ideas but um those are just different that's not really AI Studio that that's kind of different applications of um AI to content and content understanding and content trans ation and things like that for AI Studio itself I think it's going to be this continual evolution of um how do you give the Creator more tools to tune the experience so it gets to be more entertaining and Trust building like you're saying um there will also be a part of this which I think is just adding different modes right so you know starting with text I think over time you know having video um you having audio um you know eventually having it be able to be kind of 3D so that way you could be embodied um whether you know someone is wearing AI AR glasses and you can just show up as a hologram in their in their living room I think that that would be pretty neat but I mean we're all focused on um on a lot of the metaverse and um all that embodiment work too so I think that that's a natural path for us to try to you know enable creators to to just um have a more natural interaction with people I really like this the thing you mentioned at the beginning around this like network of Agents CU I was thinking as I was playing with it I was thinking like all right let's take myself this is level one level two what would be cool and one example would be like a market research agent where I'm trying to come up with either what video to make or what product or course to offer to the to the community if I could have an agent that goes out and polls like actually has onetoone conversations with 5% of my audience to try to mine for pain points and it does that automatically I mean that's amazing right so you take like those little use cases and stack them up all of a sudden there's like this Suite of you know agents or AIS or Bots or whatever that it becomes really valuable for the Creator yeah that's a good point I mean in the business context it's a little clearer to think about you know businesses want customer support but then kind of the next level up from that is being able to aggregate the analytics around okay well what are all the things that people need support around and how do I just improve them and I think there is a Creator version of that too which is like all right how do how does my community like engaging with my stuff what's the different feedback on this how do I want to factor that into my creative process or um my business model so I think that that makes a lot of sense I love to I talk about the future all these future use cases forever I think one of the like you and I share we're Tech optimists and I think almost all of this Tech if not all of it ends up being a net benefit for Humanity in the long term but I think one of the big questions that I get I'm sure you get this from friends from Family I get it in my comments all the time is basically there's a lot of fear and uncertainty around AI mostly because creatives and artists are afraid that AI may replace them and take their jobs and I think about my brother is this fantastic motion graphic designer but he's super scared he's worried that is all the schooling and the training and the Reps is that going to end up having been for nothing and so I think for that group and there's millions of people out there what would be really beneficial is just to hear raw thoughts from Someone Like You on like what is this AI powered future what could this look like for that group and just share kind of some some mindset or framing around that for them I I agree with you that in the future there going to be way more creative jobs than there are today right and I I think you can just look at the Arc of humanity and the fact that it's like we all you know most people used to be farmers and you now we don't have to do that um you know it's like people can pursue more creative things so you know as technology evolves the um the tools that we use will evolve to um and and part of just being a you know a you know a talented person on the on the edge with all this is um is just staying up to dat with the tools but but fundamentally I think that there're going to be a lot more creative opportunities in the future with more powerful tools that allow people to do that I I guess taking a step back from that I I do think that one thing that that kind of confuses me about the narrative that some people in the industry push is it goes back to what we're were talking about earlier this idea that you know some people are saying that there's going to be like the one true big AI that can do everything and I just don't think that that's the way that things tend to go and I get why if you're like in some AI lab and you know you want to feel like what you're doing is super important right then it's okay yeah it's like we're building the one true thing for the future but I just think like realistically that's not that's not how stuff works right it's not like there was one app on people's phones that people use there's not kind of one creator that people want all their um all their content from um there's not one app that people want all their content from there's not one business that people want to buy everything from um people value diversity and I think that that's a lot of what what um creates sort of richness and the feeling that we're learning and progressing in life is getting to experience different kinds of things so I just believe really deeply that the future is not going to be one AI it's going to be a lot of AIS with a lot of different people being able to create different things that's partially why I believe so much an open source right because I don't think that AI technology is a thing that should be kind of hoarded and and kind of kept that that like one company gets to use it to to build whatever Central single product that they're building I think if you believe that this that like the best experience of this in the best future is going to be a lot of different AIS and a lot of different experiences then you want to get it out there in all these ways so part of that is building tools for creators and um for users of the platform to be able to um create their own almost like a ugc type AI situation all the business stuff but you know part of that is the open source thing too so that way other companies out there can create different things and people can just hack on it themselves and mess around with it so I guess that's a pretty deep worldview that I have and I don't know I find it a pretty big turnoff when people in the um in the tech industry kind of talk about building this one true AI it's like it's almost as if they they kind of think they're creating God or something and it's it's like it's just that's not that's not what we're doing that's I don't think that's how this plays out um but yeah I mean obviously you know we're going to be using different tools like creative people we're going to be using different Tools in 10 years than we are today just like we're using different tools today than we were 10 years ago but um but I don't know I I I I think it gets back to your main point from before that there's going to be a lot more creative jobs in the future than there are today yeah I mean I think about like the digital camera right there were all these photographers then the digital camera came out the taste of Photography still mattered right they just got a better tool potentially for different use cases and so I think I I I really agree with the sentiment of it turns me off as well that a lot of companies are trying to build this closed one winsall platform because I I just think that that's more disruptive than good well just not going to create as much value in the world I I think it's it's a little bit of a of a weird ideology from my perspective but but also I just think that's not how you create the best experiences for people I mean you you you want to unlock and kind of unleash as many people as possible trying out different things and I mean that's what culture is right it's not like one group of people getting to dictate everything for people it's like you want the richness of just like all these different ideas out there yeah 100% I want to shift back to the Rayband metas you mentioned it earlier was blown away when I used it like the the audio the camera quality with the multimodal it's incredible how good it is relative to what I thought it would be when I got it and I've heard you share this framework around you think something like smart glasses could be the phone of the Next Generation and something like you know Quest 3 VR could be the computer or TV of the Next Generation and that makes a lot of sense to me I I want to talk about the mobile side as a product Builder I'm really curious what else you think needs to be in the Rayband metas or the smart glass whatever the iteration is what else needs to be in there for billions of people to prefer using glasses over the mobile phone as like the primary Hardware device yeah I mean it's an interesting question if you'd asked me that a few years ago or even maybe a year and a half ago I would have said that we needed to get to the point where we had full holographic AR before this would be the main platform that people would use and we're working on that right we we kind of attacked the problem from two different directions with the Rayband metas we looked at it and said okay what's the if you just take the best form factor for glasses today how much technology can we pack in there without compromising the form factor the weight things like that and that's what we got with Ray band meta but then we were also coming at it from the other perspective and saying okay we want to create full holographic AR um it still needs to be glasses right it's not a headset it's glasses but you know maybe it's like a little thicker frames because there's a lot more technology you're packing in there um and it's not like the the the Prototype version that we have um that that I'm I'm really excited that we're getting closer to showing it's not like the most stylish thing but it's good it like I mean it's it's unmistakably glasses right it's not a headset um so I think over time these two paths will just sort of converge and I guess I would have thought previously that we needed the full holograms for presence but AI has made such big leaps that I think that that is making it to that um even something that's a simpler product will have more appeal sooner right and and the Rayband meta product um the demand for it has been so much higher than we expected which on the one hand you know you love to see it on the other hand it's sort of a bummer that we haven't made enough of them right and it's sold out in most of the Styles um and you can still get like the the the kind of basic black ones but there are a lot of other ones that um that people want that are that are sold out we're ramping up production and ramping up the factory lines and all that to be able to make more um but I guess now my view you is that I think that there are going to be a lot of those right I actually think you can create a great experience with cameras and a microphone and speakers and the ability to do multimodal AI um even before you have any kind of display in the glasses and I actually think there's this funny thing which is um the display itself may not actually be for everyone immediately because it adds some weight to the glasses it makes them a lot more expensive right you can get Rayband metas for $300 um but you know but if you're adding all this like full holographic display in that's going to cost significantly more um even when it's possible and it's and it's a and we can kind of get into a form factor that we want so um I don't know I I still think for probably for people who can can afford a more expensive device and don't mind that it's going to be like slightly heavier um then you know they might want the full holographic thing um in 10 years from now I think we'll get really small holographic things so I think that's going to be great but I think for the near- term I would actually guess that a lot of people will prefer something like the rayb band metas um and we'll of course continue to get the form factor on that to be smaller and smaller over time too so I think that's um that's it's a pretty exciting Evolution I think that there are basically going to be three different products there's going to be kind of the displays glasses that just do Ai and can capture content and you can you know listen to audiobooks and music and take phone calls and all that then I think that there's going to be another step up where it may not be it's not going to be full holographic graic display in the sense that it's not going to be like your full field of view as a hologram um but I think you'll get maybe like a little bit of a heads up display and I that that's going to create a bunch of interesting use cases too you'll be able to get notifications you'll be able to message with people you'll be able to um message with with AI um answer any questions and not just have it speak to you but also be able to kind of see which is is higher bandwidth so that's going to be exciting um a lot of uses for a small screen even even if it's just a kind of a small heads up display and then I think there's going to be the most premium version which is kind of the full field of VI which is you know we're having this conversation in the future and like I'm a hologram sitting on your Liv on your living room couch or you're here with me and um and it's not just a video call it's not just like there's a screen and you're there as a hologram I mean we can we'd be able to interact right so like you want to play cards it's like okay here we we got a deck of cards it's a hologram we're interacting um we can we can kind of mess around with the same thing you know you want to create art together create content together or like you draw on a whiteboard you can just do all that stuff um I think that's G to be pretty wild and that that still is where I think it's all going but I'm just more optimistic now that it's actually going to be a big thing even before we get there that's like the the Tony Stark glasses is that that last use case I've heard you talk about the potential for like a wrist strap that can pick up oh yeah subdermal neural which which I think is really cool too right yeah know that's coming yeah what's that look like yeah the neural wristband yeah neural interface wristband you know when people hear neural interface they um I think that the first instinct is like oh it it must like it wired into your brain or something but I I think most people are not going to want something wired into their brain um agreed but your brain sends signals to your body through your nervous system right that's like how you fire all your muscles and it turns out that there's a lot of different Pathways that aren't used um in normal operation of your your body so you can have a wristband that basically gets trained to pick up different signals and Pathways of your brain communicating to move your hand in different ways than you would normally do and eventually you get to the point where you can basically communicate with this neural interface without even really moving your hand very much in a visible way to other people so it'll start off with kind of some simpler motions but you know over the coming years you're you're going to be able to type with it do all kinds of stuff um you know control a cursor I I think it's it's that's that's going to be wild right so I think that coupled with the glasses um is going to enable a bunch of pretty amazing use cases I mean you're going to be able even with the heads up display version um or even without a display you'll basically be able to sit there and um like no matter where you are you'll be able to send a message to a person um or to an AI um and again I mean this won't just work with meta AI it'll work over time with all of the different AIS all the Creator AIS whoever whoever you want to interact with um you can just sit there and like silently and discreetly send a message to to someone and then they either have it um you know answer it in your ear or kind of pop up if you have the display version like the little text there I I think it's going to be wild I mean for me one of the best things and I prefer you know meeting with people in person but to me one of the best parts about kind of group conversations over Zoom is you can have this whole back channel right where like while you're having the main meeting or conversation you can also just be chatting with subsets of people in a way that actually you know nor like sometimes I'm in a meeting and I'll I'll be um you know there's a question I want to ask someone but I don't want to ask in front of everyone in the meeting so I just have to wait until after the meeting is done but you know when you're doing it digitally you can um you know you you can basically just you know text someone like text them on WhatsApp or whatever while the meeting is going on I think like the ability to do that with glasses while you're having actual physical inperson interactions it's like okay you're interacting with people but you can pull in you can get information during the conversation um use it to to make things more productive I think that that's going to be super powerful the thing that I really undervalued is the phone it just it shatters your presence right like when you're in the phone you're in the phone you're not in the but as soon as you put the glasses on espe I mean even without the heads up display but I think with it it won't take away your you're so present like you can be in the world but also like you said getting information in a hybrid way I think that's it's such an It'll be such an interesting balance with the strap like something with the strap and the glasses yeah and and like you said I me you're asking you know when is this going to replace phones I mean I don't think in the history of Technology the new platform it usually doesn't completely make it so that people stop using the old thing it's just that you use it less right so a lot of people I think you do tasks on their phone today that they would have used to have done on their computer because it's more convenient right so you just don't open your computer as much you don't go to your desk you just do it and I actually find even when I'm sitting at my desk I do a lot of stuff on my phone that I would have used to have done on my computer like 10 or 15 years ago and I think that's going to happen with glasses too it's not like we're gonna stop having a phone it's just that it's G to stay in your pocket more right and you'll take it out when you really need to do stuff with it but more and more I think people will just start saying hey I can I can I can take this photo with my glasses I can ask this question to AI or I can send someone a message and it's just a lot easier with um with glasses and I wouldn't be surprised if you know 10 years from now you know we'll probably still have phones but um but it's probably going to be much more intentional usage as opposed to just reflexively reaching for it and grabbing it for any technological thing that you want to do yeah all right I've got I've got three more quick questions for you and then we'll we'll get you out of here more like fun questions the first one is I think every few years Society comes across these like frame-breaking consumer Tech moments so I think about like the first time I searched on Google or the first friend request on Facebook or like the first time I called in Uber and people can almost remember when they had these first experiences and these these shifts in their life I think one of the coolest Parts about your job is that you get to live like 5 to 10 years years in the future and play with these disruptive Technologies we talked about the glasses as one but I'm curious what's on the meta road map in the next decade that you think has the best chance other than the glasses of being like one of these frame breaking consumer Tech moments yeah well well first time I really agree with you I think this is one of the this is like the awesome part of technology is that you know it's I think in a lot of other fields you can be doing the same thing for a long period of time whereas in technology every once in a while something comes along and just unleashes all these new opportunities and you need to rethink what you're doing and but it's exciting um I don't know I mean I think we've talked about a lot of the stuff I think the the um the glasses are are I think it'd be a big deal we're going to we're we're almost ready to start showing the Prototype version of the full holographic glasses um we're not going to be selling it broadly we're focused on building the the full consumer version of it rather than selling the Prototype but we're gonna start demonstrating the prototype to people and and that's wild I mean every person who I've shown it to so far is just like their reaction it's um it's a giddy um it's yeah um I'm I'm really looking forward to showing that to more people so I think that's cool um the neural wristband thing is wild I mean the fact that you can kind of input something with these subtle motions of your hand just by kind of thinking about how you want to move your hand um that is wild and it'll get richer over time I think often it takes until the V2 or V3 of a lot of these things before it really gets tuned and you know people people kind of understand it we saw that with the rayan metas to was really the second version that that that kind of took off massively um but but I think the neural wristband is going to be a pretty big deal um and depending on how that goes it could be that it's mostly the input for glasses and for mixed reality headsets and things like that or it could end up being its own platform on its own right that that basically um you know you you could see a world where you use your your neural wristband to control like everything in your house right or your computer or things like that over time so um that I think could be could be pretty pretty neat and then on the AI side I think the rate of progress is just it's really staggering I mean the fact that we went from you know llama 2 um last summer to llama 3 um now that's that like I mean llama 2 was not at the state of art llama 3 is is um you know pretty close to caught up with the best models that are out there so I'm and and the fact that that's open source and is available to so many people just is unlocking you know so much awesome stuff um we're starting to work on llama 4 um I'm I'm excited about that I think that that's you you just add more modalities into each version so you know llama 3 got you know more of the the kind of image modality and and and some of the the voice and things like that um Lama 4 will get a lot more into that um as well as just the ability to do a little more reasoning so that way when you're if you know if you're a Creator and you're editing something you don't need to be kind of so literal in describing what you're doing you can kind of go back and forth and ask the AI to um you know try some different things and it'll come back with with different ideas I think that that's um that's going to be really compelling so uh as as it moves from being kind of this turn-based chatbot to more of an agent that you can kind of give an intent of what you're trying to do and it can go away and do more complex things for for you um that is going to be really cool so I don't know that but I but I do think the journey that we're starting here with the Creator AIS it's a this I think is is going to be the beginning of something interesting because I mean right now and this has been a theme of the conversation but I do think right now the way that a lot of people experience these AIS is through kind of the one main AI that that a handful of companies has built and I think Creator AI and as we roll out some more of the business AI stuff um that's going to start shifting to people are going to start just interacting with a much broader diversity of experiences and I that that's going to add a real richness to the to the whole ecosystem that's going to be great I totally agree I think sometimes it's just as simple as a new application or like just packaging it in a different way and so like like we've talked about the theme is like the single to the multi here's here's an interesting question for you on the Creator side and I don't think I've ever heard you answer this I consider you a very prolific Creator right you're you're designing your own clothes you're making music I've heard about marks meets like I've heard about all the hobbies and one question that a lot of creators get asked I get asked a lot is like if I had to start from scratch building a brand online or building a brand around a hobby how do I do it I'm curious for you to answer this so like let's say you were you were just Mark the guitarist or Mark the founder of Mark's meets and you you got to know everything you know about World building fandom psychology but we took away all the resources how would you think about like that challenge like going about trying to build kind of a a meaningful brand online as an entrepreneur yeah I mean it's interesting I um I think we're almost sort of reflexively trained to think about this stuff these days I mean I'm not for for the marks meets example I mean I'm not trying to create a business around it but I but I sort of reflexively think about it in terms of kind of what's the story behind this right we're not just trying to you know raise some cattle we're trying to raise really high quality cattle and you know because we're doing it in Hawaii where we're feeding the the cattle a this unique blend of macadamia nut meal um and we're brewing beer and and feeding them beer and we're vertically integrating and we're growing the macademia trees and we're growing the beer and Brew brewing the beer um and I find that that's that's part of what's fun about it right is like is everyone kind of does stuff in in a unique way and I think the kind of Celebration and expression of the story about the uniqueness of what you're doing um is is part of what is cool um so I don't know I mean maybe one day when I when I retire Mark's meets will will be a commercial operation but um but in the you know for now it's I I just you know it's like just trying to do this awesome thing and I think part of what makes it awesome is having kind of a narrative and a and a story around it and um and social media and all these other tools online help people tell that story but I think it's also trained Us in some way to think about things in terms of what is the narrative and and um and what's the story around what you're doing so I don't know it's it's an interesting question yeah it'll be the next venture I I really appreciate you doing this Mark I I've loved it could ask questions forever thank you so much for sitting down yeah no happy to do it good chatting

this I think is is going to be the beginning of something interesting it&#39;s that the old Picasso quote all children are artists the challenges how to remain one when you grow up part of what we want to do is build the tools that allow everyone to do that what&#39;s on the meta road map in the next decade that you think has the best chance of being one of these frame breaking consumer Tech moments I think the neural wristband is going to be a pretty big deal could end up being its own platform on its own we&#39;re almost ready to start showing the Prototype version of the full holographic glasses and that&#39;s wild every person who I&#39;ve shown it to their reaction it&#39;s um it&#39;s a giddy as a product Builder what else needs to be in there for billions of people to prefer using glasses over the mobile phone as like the primary Hardware device the demand for it has been so much higher than we expected ramping up production and ramping up the factory lines if you&#39;d asked me that a year and a half ago I would have said in technology every once in a while something comes along and just unleashes all these new opportunities and you need to rethink what you&#39;re doing what are the trends that I&#39;m seeing well in social media I&#39;d say there&#39;s a few big ones one is the shift from Mark is honor thank you so much for doing this I&#39;m really looking forward to it yeah happy to thanks for having me on of course all right so let&#39;s Dive Right In can you just talk about how meta is approaching AI more broadly because there&#39;s going to be thousands of creators that listen to this they know AI they know the players they&#39;ve played with some of the tools but I think it&#39; just be super helpful to hear from you what&#39;s the meta AI game plan and kind of how does it fit into the market yeah so what I&#39;d say is that the the biggest way that our approach here is different from all the other companies is you see a lot of other companies trying to build like one main AI that you&#39;re going to interact with right whether it&#39;s um you know Gemini for Google or chat GPT for open Ai and I mean our view and we&#39;ll also have a basic assistant meta AI that people can use but but our overall view is that this isn&#39;t the type of thing where there should just be one of or we think people want to interact with lots of different people and businesses and there need to be a lot of different AIS um that get created to reflect people&#39;s different interests so a big part of the approach is is going to be enabling every Creator and then eventually also every small business on the platform to create an AI for themselves to help them interact with their community and uh their customers if they&#39;re a business and we think that that&#39;s just going to create a much more compelling experience and just be more Dynamic and useful um than just having a single thing that people use so you know obviously a part of that is going to be that we&#39;re not building these things ourselves we&#39;re building the underlying technology and we want to make it so that you know the underlying model llama that we&#39;re building is absolutely World leading right so we want to go for it and try to build full general intelligence and and build the leading models and I&#39;m really happy with our progress there but an equally important part of this is going to be building the tools for creators um and businesses over time to be able to create AI that reflect them and what they want to have out there and also um create all kinds of different experiences as well so that that&#39;s what the AI Studio announcement um this week is it&#39;s an early test but um it&#39;s an exciting one in terms of a step towards that vision and that&#39;s that&#39;s what I want to get into cuz I think that world viw of like a network of maybe their single purpose maybe their multi-purpose agents combined together customized for each Creator in business that&#39;s exactly where I think we&#39;re headed as well it&#39;s not a controversial thing to say in 10 years I think we&#39;re going to have many many many more creators than we do today and even more of that mainstream content is going to flow through creators meta has already been a principal layer of like laying those rails today but when you think about what the future of Creator experience looks like what is that future like from a tactical use case perspective what are some things that seem interesting to you yeah so first I totally agree with what you&#39;re saying I if you look at the kind of broader Arc of human history um more people are just getting the chance to pursue uh their own creativity and their own interests and um you know not having to do as many jobs that they might find mundane or just doing to work but like but basically are getting to do things that they really enjoy and I think a lot of the Arc of technology is enabling that uh both by inreasing productivity for the other tasks um and just giving people all kinds of new tools so this is definitely going to be part of what happens here is basically we want to build more tools that um that just enable more people including people who don&#39;t consider themselves creators today because I think you know everyone is creative in some way and everyone I just look at my kids like trying to um you know it&#39;s like they they don&#39;t they&#39;re not creators but I mean they&#39;re definitely just like you know playing with their Legos creating all kinds of different stuff it&#39;s cool you know um it&#39;s the the old pic Al quote all children are artists the challenge is how to remain one when you grow up and I think part of what we want to do is build the tools that allow everyone to do that so what are the trends that I&#39;m seeing um well in social media I&#39;d say there&#39;s a few big ones one is the shift from feed-based media to more personal messaging interactions right if you look at Instagram DMS is one of the fastest growing parts of the of the system um that&#39;s part of what I&#39;m excited about here with Creator studio um and AI studio is basically we&#39;re making it so that people are going to be able to um kind of craft a persona for an AI uh version of themselves that&#39;s going to help them interact with all the incoming DMS that um that that your community is is is sending you and you know it&#39;s like the classic problem of there&#39;s just not enough hours in the day right I think every Creator would want to engage with every fan who&#39;s reaching out to them but you just don&#39;t have time and of course probably more people than are even sending messages would like to engage with something that that Creator is creating but um a lot of people probably don&#39;t even send the messages because they know that the Creator is not going to get around to be able to message so um so yeah I mean I I think there&#39;s this whole question of how good are the AI agents that creators create for themselves I&#39;m going to be and I think that that&#39;s going to be an art form by itself that kind of grows and evolves over time and it&#39;s going to get better and better but I think for a lot of people knowing that they&#39;re engaging with something that the Creator created and had a hand in doing um is going to be pretty meaningful um it it may not be as good as as interacting with the person themselves but um but for a lot of people that&#39;s not available because there&#39;s just not enough hours in the day for the Creator to respond so that&#39;s um that&#39;s one big part we can go deep on that um the other one that I&#39;d say is growing really quickly is just reals and video short form video you know it&#39;s I mean there&#39;s just been this pretty amazing Trend where you know you go from you know movie and longer form TV shows I mean there was a time when people thought of YouTube as short form because people were comparing it to TVs and um and movie but today you know compared to real short form video I mean a lot of YouTube videos feel kind of long right you&#39;re multitasking while you&#39;re watching a YouTube video because it&#39;s it&#39;s going on for many minutes and I think that that is probably just going to continue because people are getting the tools to create really compelling content and get it to be super tight and crisp and I think that the rate of kind of development of those tools is going to continue and I I think that people are going to be able to have um use AI for creating um video and editing and there will still be a ton of creativity in that whole process because you&#39;ll have to kind of hone what you&#39;re building and shape it like a like a sculpture but I think fundamentally it&#39;s going to be accessible and the quality of the content is going to go up as as it just gets you know people can play around with a lot more different ideas so probably those two messaging and short form video I think are the two big trends that I&#39;m seeing right now yeah I think that barbell strategy of like on one end the super raw unedited long form podcast out conversation and then on the other end exactly you&#39;re saying like the super polish short form storytelling and a bite-sized package it seems like that&#39;s where attention&#39;s flowing to both those sides I want to get into AI Studio on the on the tool side so today it&#39;s essentially the foundational building block the way I look at it is the foundational building blocks for how creators are going to interact with AI within meta&#39;s world and like today is let&#39;s say block one like just the foundational tooling can you talk about how you&#39;re stair stepping that strategy so like what came out today why are you excited about it I can share my feedback as well as a tester and then let&#39;s talk about the stair step of that in terms of the Tactical tools yeah so I&#39;d say there&#39;s a few different Paths of the technology at the same time so one is just the development of llama the underlying model and the tuning of that as we get as we get feedback so that&#39;s kind of something that&#39;s happening underneath the hood that&#39;s kind of the core infrastructure um then on top of that there&#39;s all the product experience and tools that we&#39;re creating that uh that allow people to create these different AIS so whether it&#39;s a Creator creating um an AI agent version of themselves to to interact with their Community um at some point we&#39;re also rolling out uh people the ability for for um anyone to create ugc AI right so it doesn&#39;t necessarily need to be you it could could just be a new kind of virtual Persona that you create that you want to uh you know exist on on Instagram and and and the apps and interact with people um and then probably won&#39;t get into this as much today but but on the business side you know there are as many small businesses if if not more than as there are creators today I think that that&#39;s a huge opportunity it should be super simple for a um any business to just you know press a few buttons get an agent version of themselves that can help do customer support an e-commerce support um I think that that&#39;s going to be really powerful so what we&#39;re doing today is we&#39;re rolling out the first test right so we&#39;re you know we try to take these stages um we&#39;re launching with about 50 uh creators and we&#39;re going to start rolling it out to a small percent of people um and then as we kind of dial that in then probably over the next month or so we&#39;re going to roll it out so that you know more people can can interact with these uh AIS and you know maybe by the end of July or you know August or something we&#39;ll we&#39;ll we&#39;ll have that fully rolled out um but this is it&#39;s it&#39;s going to be a pretty interesting experience to to kind of see how people like interacting with um with these AIS that their creators create and also as big of a part of that is just building the tools for I mean I&#39;m curious and you&#39;ve been playing with this I mean I&#39;m curious what your feedback is and you know what you think is working well what we need to work on yeah I&#39;d love to share it I mean so for myself as a Creator and then my parents actually run a Golf Course in Ohio so they&#39;re they&#39;re like the small business use case right if they have the Instagram profile they&#39;re getting all these requests that they can&#39;t like you said we can&#39;t scale DMS and messages so the way I think of it is it&#39;s kind of like a spectrum where there&#39;s fact-based questions that come in and they come in I&#39;m sure you get this at a scale like it&#39;s hard to fathom right thousands of these fact-based questions things like do you have a link for this or have you made video for that or like where&#39;s your shirt from these are obvious questions that can be answered you just need to clone yourself right and that&#39;s where the the preliminary use case for this is amazing every small business and Creator is going to want this and then on the other end of the Spectrum which I was playing with a lot is more of the like opinion style questions so these are things like if someone says hey if you were me how would you grow your brand right like a multifaceted question that is tough to answer just in one go and that&#39;s where I feel like it&#39;ll get interesting to watch the AI train on me in my responses and like kind of hone that in if I could scale those opinion answers then because really my goal as a Creator is one toone trust at scale that&#39;s all I care about and so I&#39;m tapped out with my capacity so the question the question that I had for you on this as I was thinking about it is the fact-based stuff makes a ton of sense I think every fan would agree that they just they want to get that information surfaced but on the opinion side I think some fans will worry that AI assistant might dehumanize that like magical connection between the fan and the human and so the question is like how do you go about building these AI tools for creators that are infinitely useful but also maintain that authenticity and that human connection yeah so I guess the part of this that you&#39;re calling the opinion kind of zone is where I think more of the art form comes in right so the the process of how these things get trained I mean there&#39;s obviously the there&#39;s the bass llama model but then creators when they&#39;re setting up these AIS have the opportunity to pull in all kinds of information from their social media presence and whatever else they want to train into the system so um like you said for the fact-based stuff I that&#39;s relatively clearer to instrument and understand when we&#39;re getting it right and when we&#39;re not on the opinion side I think that that&#39;s going to end up being more um the the creators are going to have a lot more opinion around what they want the AI to express for them and I to your point about people knowing that they&#39;re interacting with an AI That&#39;s a core design principle for us and we&#39;re not trying to you know create these AIS and and and kind of have people think that they&#39;re interacting with the Creator themselves and we want it to be as High Fidelity to the Creator as the Creator wants but will also be very clearly labeled as an AI so that you know there shouldn&#39;t be any um any confusion around that but you know as a when you&#39;re interacting with your community you may feel comfortable taking more Liberties or risks about what you Express or you know being a little closer to the line on something that might be sort of riskier to express but um but you might want to do that as a as as a person but you may not want your AI to do that right so even though you know you you might be able to have it be trained on on um the content from your social media um you may want to train it that it should stay you know maybe a little more cautious on certain things um or not go into certain topics that you don&#39;t want it to to to engage with until you know maybe in the future you get a lot more confidence that&#39;s really going to channel you in the way that you want and I think that that&#39;s those are the types of tools that I think are really important but this is where you know like I said I think it&#39;s going to be somewhat of an art form that um you know I don&#39;t I don&#39;t think we know going into this what is going to be the most engaging and entertaining um and Trust building formula for this so we want to give people tools so that you can all experiment with this and you know see what ends up working well one of the questions I really wanted to get to is kind of like future feature ideas for AI studio so let me give you one that I think would be really cool so as you&#39;re watching this clip if someone could just tap on your shirt or my hat or this light and immediately there&#39; be an AI layer that recognizes what the brand is what the product is they Auto add to cart it auto tracks affiliate back like that&#39;s this invisible layer that could really help Creator monetization obviously I&#39;m I&#39;m assuming for infrastructure reasons with millions of reels created every hour like it would be tough to support that today but maybe that&#39;s the backlog what are some other things future features of AI Studio that we haven&#39;t talked about yet that you&#39;re excited that we could get to maybe in the next three to five years well that kind of thing of just understanding what the different items are is um is something that I I I think should hopefully over time apply to all posts right so we&#39;ll we&#39;ll get there I mean we we have early versions of this with the multimodal AI um with the Rayband metag glasses where you can you can just say hey meta look and tell me what this thing is um and it can and it it you know is reasonably accurate it it kind of giving you a sense of what what you&#39;re looking at and being able to answer questions around that and that&#39;ll only get better as as the Llama models continue improving and as we you know fully roll out you know the next versions and and so on um but yeah no I think that that&#39;s I think that&#39;s a that&#39;s a big one and I think that there&#39;s a lot of things like this I think being able to automatically do translation and dubbing is something I&#39;m pretty excited about for the future I think people who speak English often lose track of the fact that you know a lot of the world doesn&#39;t speak English and um and I think being able to automatically have all your content in um in all these different languages and accessible to way more people is going to be really powerful if that can feel authentic and like you&#39;re speaking that language I think that that&#39;s those are some really exciting ideas but um those are just different that&#39;s not really AI Studio that that&#39;s kind of different applications of um AI to content and content understanding and content trans ation and things like that for AI Studio itself I think it&#39;s going to be this continual evolution of um how do you give the Creator more tools to tune the experience so it gets to be more entertaining and Trust building like you&#39;re saying um there will also be a part of this which I think is just adding different modes right so you know starting with text I think over time you know having video um you having audio um you know eventually having it be able to be kind of 3D so that way you could be embodied um whether you know someone is wearing AI AR glasses and you can just show up as a hologram in their in their living room I think that that would be pretty neat but I mean we&#39;re all focused on um on a lot of the metaverse and um all that embodiment work too so I think that that&#39;s a natural path for us to try to you know enable creators to to just um have a more natural interaction with people I really like this the thing you mentioned at the beginning around this like network of Agents CU I was thinking as I was playing with it I was thinking like all right let&#39;s take myself this is level one level two what would be cool and one example would be like a market research agent where I&#39;m trying to come up with either what video to make or what product or course to offer to the to the community if I could have an agent that goes out and polls like actually has onetoone conversations with 5% of my audience to try to mine for pain points and it does that automatically I mean that&#39;s amazing right so you take like those little use cases and stack them up all of a sudden there&#39;s like this Suite of you know agents or AIS or Bots or whatever that it becomes really valuable for the Creator yeah that&#39;s a good point I mean in the business context it&#39;s a little clearer to think about you know businesses want customer support but then kind of the next level up from that is being able to aggregate the analytics around okay well what are all the things that people need support around and how do I just improve them and I think there is a Creator version of that too which is like all right how do how does my community like engaging with my stuff what&#39;s the different feedback on this how do I want to factor that into my creative process or um my business model so I think that that makes a lot of sense I love to I talk about the future all these future use cases forever I think one of the like you and I share we&#39;re Tech optimists and I think almost all of this Tech if not all of it ends up being a net benefit for Humanity in the long term but I think one of the big questions that I get I&#39;m sure you get this from friends from Family I get it in my comments all the time is basically there&#39;s a lot of fear and uncertainty around AI mostly because creatives and artists are afraid that AI may replace them and take their jobs and I think about my brother is this fantastic motion graphic designer but he&#39;s super scared he&#39;s worried that is all the schooling and the training and the Reps is that going to end up having been for nothing and so I think for that group and there&#39;s millions of people out there what would be really beneficial is just to hear raw thoughts from Someone Like You on like what is this AI powered future what could this look like for that group and just share kind of some some mindset or framing around that for them I I agree with you that in the future there going to be way more creative jobs than there are today right and I I think you can just look at the Arc of humanity and the fact that it&#39;s like we all you know most people used to be farmers and you now we don&#39;t have to do that um you know it&#39;s like people can pursue more creative things so you know as technology evolves the um the tools that we use will evolve to um and and part of just being a you know a you know a talented person on the on the edge with all this is um is just staying up to dat with the tools but but fundamentally I think that there&#39;re going to be a lot more creative opportunities in the future with more powerful tools that allow people to do that I I guess taking a step back from that I I do think that one thing that that kind of confuses me about the narrative that some people in the industry push is it goes back to what we&#39;re were talking about earlier this idea that you know some people are saying that there&#39;s going to be like the one true big AI that can do everything and I just don&#39;t think that that&#39;s the way that things tend to go and I get why if you&#39;re like in some AI lab and you know you want to feel like what you&#39;re doing is super important right then it&#39;s okay yeah it&#39;s like we&#39;re building the one true thing for the future but I just think like realistically that&#39;s not that&#39;s not how stuff works right it&#39;s not like there was one app on people&#39;s phones that people use there&#39;s not kind of one creator that people want all their um all their content from um there&#39;s not one app that people want all their content from there&#39;s not one business that people want to buy everything from um people value diversity and I think that that&#39;s a lot of what what um creates sort of richness and the feeling that we&#39;re learning and progressing in life is getting to experience different kinds of things so I just believe really deeply that the future is not going to be one AI it&#39;s going to be a lot of AIS with a lot of different people being able to create different things that&#39;s partially why I believe so much an open source right because I don&#39;t think that AI technology is a thing that should be kind of hoarded and and kind of kept that that like one company gets to use it to to build whatever Central single product that they&#39;re building I think if you believe that this that like the best experience of this in the best future is going to be a lot of different AIS and a lot of different experiences then you want to get it out there in all these ways so part of that is building tools for creators and um for users of the platform to be able to um create their own almost like a ugc type AI situation all the business stuff but you know part of that is the open source thing too so that way other companies out there can create different things and people can just hack on it themselves and mess around with it so I guess that&#39;s a pretty deep worldview that I have and I don&#39;t know I find it a pretty big turnoff when people in the um in the tech industry kind of talk about building this one true AI it&#39;s like it&#39;s almost as if they they kind of think they&#39;re creating God or something and it&#39;s it&#39;s like it&#39;s just that&#39;s not that&#39;s not what we&#39;re doing that&#39;s I don&#39;t think that&#39;s how this plays out um but yeah I mean obviously you know we&#39;re going to be using different tools like creative people we&#39;re going to be using different Tools in 10 years than we are today just like we&#39;re using different tools today than we were 10 years ago but um but I don&#39;t know I I I I think it gets back to your main point from before that there&#39;s going to be a lot more creative jobs in the future than there are today yeah I mean I think about like the digital camera right there were all these photographers then the digital camera came out the taste of Photography still mattered right they just got a better tool potentially for different use cases and so I think I I I really agree with the sentiment of it turns me off as well that a lot of companies are trying to build this closed one winsall platform because I I just think that that&#39;s more disruptive than good well just not going to create as much value in the world I I think it&#39;s it&#39;s a little bit of a of a weird ideology from my perspective but but also I just think that&#39;s not how you create the best experiences for people I mean you you you want to unlock and kind of unleash as many people as possible trying out different things and I mean that&#39;s what culture is right it&#39;s not like one group of people getting to dictate everything for people it&#39;s like you want the richness of just like all these different ideas out there yeah 100% I want to shift back to the Rayband metas you mentioned it earlier was blown away when I used it like the the audio the camera quality with the multimodal it&#39;s incredible how good it is relative to what I thought it would be when I got it and I&#39;ve heard you share this framework around you think something like smart glasses could be the phone of the Next Generation and something like you know Quest 3 VR could be the computer or TV of the Next Generation and that makes a lot of sense to me I I want to talk about the mobile side as a product Builder I&#39;m really curious what else you think needs to be in the Rayband metas or the smart glass whatever the iteration is what else needs to be in there for billions of people to prefer using glasses over the mobile phone as like the primary Hardware device yeah I mean it&#39;s an interesting question if you&#39;d asked me that a few years ago or even maybe a year and a half ago I would have said that we needed to get to the point where we had full holographic AR before this would be the main platform that people would use and we&#39;re working on that right we we kind of attacked the problem from two different directions with the Rayband metas we looked at it and said okay what&#39;s the if you just take the best form factor for glasses today how much technology can we pack in there without compromising the form factor the weight things like that and that&#39;s what we got with Ray band meta but then we were also coming at it from the other perspective and saying okay we want to create full holographic AR um it still needs to be glasses right it&#39;s not a headset it&#39;s glasses but you know maybe it&#39;s like a little thicker frames because there&#39;s a lot more technology you&#39;re packing in there um and it&#39;s not like the the the Prototype version that we have um that that I&#39;m I&#39;m really excited that we&#39;re getting closer to showing it&#39;s not like the most stylish thing but it&#39;s good it like I mean it&#39;s it&#39;s unmistakably glasses right it&#39;s not a headset um so I think over time these two paths will just sort of converge and I guess I would have thought previously that we needed the full holograms for presence but AI has made such big leaps that I think that that is making it to that um even something that&#39;s a simpler product will have more appeal sooner right and and the Rayband meta product um the demand for it has been so much higher than we expected which on the one hand you know you love to see it on the other hand it&#39;s sort of a bummer that we haven&#39;t made enough of them right and it&#39;s sold out in most of the Styles um and you can still get like the the the kind of basic black ones but there are a lot of other ones that um that people want that are that are sold out we&#39;re ramping up production and ramping up the factory lines and all that to be able to make more um but I guess now my view you is that I think that there are going to be a lot of those right I actually think you can create a great experience with cameras and a microphone and speakers and the ability to do multimodal AI um even before you have any kind of display in the glasses and I actually think there&#39;s this funny thing which is um the display itself may not actually be for everyone immediately because it adds some weight to the glasses it makes them a lot more expensive right you can get Rayband metas for $300 um but you know but if you&#39;re adding all this like full holographic display in that&#39;s going to cost significantly more um even when it&#39;s possible and it&#39;s and it&#39;s a and we can kind of get into a form factor that we want so um I don&#39;t know I I still think for probably for people who can can afford a more expensive device and don&#39;t mind that it&#39;s going to be like slightly heavier um then you know they might want the full holographic thing um in 10 years from now I think we&#39;ll get really small holographic things so I think that&#39;s going to be great but I think for the near- term I would actually guess that a lot of people will prefer something like the rayb band metas um and we&#39;ll of course continue to get the form factor on that to be smaller and smaller over time too so I think that&#39;s um that&#39;s it&#39;s a pretty exciting Evolution I think that there are basically going to be three different products there&#39;s going to be kind of the displays glasses that just do Ai and can capture content and you can you know listen to audiobooks and music and take phone calls and all that then I think that there&#39;s going to be another step up where it may not be it&#39;s not going to be full holographic graic display in the sense that it&#39;s not going to be like your full field of view as a hologram um but I think you&#39;ll get maybe like a little bit of a heads up display and I that that&#39;s going to create a bunch of interesting use cases too you&#39;ll be able to get notifications you&#39;ll be able to message with people you&#39;ll be able to um message with with AI um answer any questions and not just have it speak to you but also be able to kind of see which is is higher bandwidth so that&#39;s going to be exciting um a lot of uses for a small screen even even if it&#39;s just a kind of a small heads up display and then I think there&#39;s going to be the most premium version which is kind of the full field of VI which is you know we&#39;re having this conversation in the future and like I&#39;m a hologram sitting on your Liv on your living room couch or you&#39;re here with me and um and it&#39;s not just a video call it&#39;s not just like there&#39;s a screen and you&#39;re there as a hologram I mean we can we&#39;d be able to interact right so like you want to play cards it&#39;s like okay here we we got a deck of cards it&#39;s a hologram we&#39;re interacting um we can we can kind of mess around with the same thing you know you want to create art together create content together or like you draw on a whiteboard you can just do all that stuff um I think that&#39;s G to be pretty wild and that that still is where I think it&#39;s all going but I&#39;m just more optimistic now that it&#39;s actually going to be a big thing even before we get there that&#39;s like the the Tony Stark glasses is that that last use case I&#39;ve heard you talk about the potential for like a wrist strap that can pick up oh yeah subdermal neural which which I think is really cool too right yeah know that&#39;s coming yeah what&#39;s that look like yeah the neural wristband yeah neural interface wristband you know when people hear neural interface they um I think that the first instinct is like oh it it must like it wired into your brain or something but I I think most people are not going to want something wired into their brain um agreed but your brain sends signals to your body through your nervous system right that&#39;s like how you fire all your muscles and it turns out that there&#39;s a lot of different Pathways that aren&#39;t used um in normal operation of your your body so you can have a wristband that basically gets trained to pick up different signals and Pathways of your brain communicating to move your hand in different ways than you would normally do and eventually you get to the point where you can basically communicate with this neural interface without even really moving your hand very much in a visible way to other people so it&#39;ll start off with kind of some simpler motions but you know over the coming years you&#39;re you&#39;re going to be able to type with it do all kinds of stuff um you know control a cursor I I think it&#39;s it&#39;s that&#39;s that&#39;s going to be wild right so I think that coupled with the glasses um is going to enable a bunch of pretty amazing use cases I mean you&#39;re going to be able even with the heads up display version um or even without a display you&#39;ll basically be able to sit there and um like no matter where you are you&#39;ll be able to send a message to a person um or to an AI um and again I mean this won&#39;t just work with meta AI it&#39;ll work over time with all of the different AIS all the Creator AIS whoever whoever you want to interact with um you can just sit there and like silently and discreetly send a message to to someone and then they either have it um you know answer it in your ear or kind of pop up if you have the display version like the little text there I I think it&#39;s going to be wild I mean for me one of the best things and I prefer you know meeting with people in person but to me one of the best parts about kind of group conversations over Zoom is you can have this whole back channel right where like while you&#39;re having the main meeting or conversation you can also just be chatting with subsets of people in a way that actually you know nor like sometimes I&#39;m in a meeting and I&#39;ll I&#39;ll be um you know there&#39;s a question I want to ask someone but I don&#39;t want to ask in front of everyone in the meeting so I just have to wait until after the meeting is done but you know when you&#39;re doing it digitally you can um you know you you can basically just you know text someone like text them on WhatsApp or whatever while the meeting is going on I think like the ability to do that with glasses while you&#39;re having actual physical inperson interactions it&#39;s like okay you&#39;re interacting with people but you can pull in you can get information during the conversation um use it to to make things more productive I think that that&#39;s going to be super powerful the thing that I really undervalued is the phone it just it shatters your presence right like when you&#39;re in the phone you&#39;re in the phone you&#39;re not in the but as soon as you put the glasses on espe I mean even without the heads up display but I think with it it won&#39;t take away your you&#39;re so present like you can be in the world but also like you said getting information in a hybrid way I think that&#39;s it&#39;s such an It&#39;ll be such an interesting balance with the strap like something with the strap and the glasses yeah and and like you said I me you&#39;re asking you know when is this going to replace phones I mean I don&#39;t think in the history of Technology the new platform it usually doesn&#39;t completely make it so that people stop using the old thing it&#39;s just that you use it less right so a lot of people I think you do tasks on their phone today that they would have used to have done on their computer because it&#39;s more convenient right so you just don&#39;t open your computer as much you don&#39;t go to your desk you just do it and I actually find even when I&#39;m sitting at my desk I do a lot of stuff on my phone that I would have used to have done on my computer like 10 or 15 years ago and I think that&#39;s going to happen with glasses too it&#39;s not like we&#39;re gonna stop having a phone it&#39;s just that it&#39;s G to stay in your pocket more right and you&#39;ll take it out when you really need to do stuff with it but more and more I think people will just start saying hey I can I can I can take this photo with my glasses I can ask this question to AI or I can send someone a message and it&#39;s just a lot easier with um with glasses and I wouldn&#39;t be surprised if you know 10 years from now you know we&#39;ll probably still have phones but um but it&#39;s probably going to be much more intentional usage as opposed to just reflexively reaching for it and grabbing it for any technological thing that you want to do yeah all right I&#39;ve got I&#39;ve got three more quick questions for you and then we&#39;ll we&#39;ll get you out of here more like fun questions the first one is I think every few years Society comes across these like frame-breaking consumer Tech moments so I think about like the first time I searched on Google or the first friend request on Facebook or like the first time I called in Uber and people can almost remember when they had these first experiences and these these shifts in their life I think one of the coolest Parts about your job is that you get to live like 5 to 10 years years in the future and play with these disruptive Technologies we talked about the glasses as one but I&#39;m curious what&#39;s on the meta road map in the next decade that you think has the best chance other than the glasses of being like one of these frame breaking consumer Tech moments yeah well well first time I really agree with you I think this is one of the this is like the awesome part of technology is that you know it&#39;s I think in a lot of other fields you can be doing the same thing for a long period of time whereas in technology every once in a while something comes along and just unleashes all these new opportunities and you need to rethink what you&#39;re doing and but it&#39;s exciting um I don&#39;t know I mean I think we&#39;ve talked about a lot of the stuff I think the the um the glasses are are I think it&#39;d be a big deal we&#39;re going to we&#39;re we&#39;re almost ready to start showing the Prototype version of the full holographic glasses um we&#39;re not going to be selling it broadly we&#39;re focused on building the the full consumer version of it rather than selling the Prototype but we&#39;re gonna start demonstrating the prototype to people and and that&#39;s wild I mean every person who I&#39;ve shown it to so far is just like their reaction it&#39;s um it&#39;s a giddy um it&#39;s yeah um I&#39;m I&#39;m really looking forward to showing that to more people so I think that&#39;s cool um the neural wristband thing is wild I mean the fact that you can kind of input something with these subtle motions of your hand just by kind of thinking about how you want to move your hand um that is wild and it&#39;ll get richer over time I think often it takes until the V2 or V3 of a lot of these things before it really gets tuned and you know people people kind of understand it we saw that with the rayan metas to was really the second version that that that kind of took off massively um but but I think the neural wristband is going to be a pretty big deal um and depending on how that goes it could be that it&#39;s mostly the input for glasses and for mixed reality headsets and things like that or it could end up being its own platform on its own right that that basically um you know you you could see a world where you use your your neural wristband to control like everything in your house right or your computer or things like that over time so um that I think could be could be pretty pretty neat and then on the AI side I think the rate of progress is just it&#39;s really staggering I mean the fact that we went from you know llama 2 um last summer to llama 3 um now that&#39;s that like I mean llama 2 was not at the state of art llama 3 is is um you know pretty close to caught up with the best models that are out there so I&#39;m and and the fact that that&#39;s open source and is available to so many people just is unlocking you know so much awesome stuff um we&#39;re starting to work on llama 4 um I&#39;m I&#39;m excited about that I think that that&#39;s you you just add more modalities into each version so you know llama 3 got you know more of the the kind of image modality and and and some of the the voice and things like that um Lama 4 will get a lot more into that um as well as just the ability to do a little more reasoning so that way when you&#39;re if you know if you&#39;re a Creator and you&#39;re editing something you don&#39;t need to be kind of so literal in describing what you&#39;re doing you can kind of go back and forth and ask the AI to um you know try some different things and it&#39;ll come back with with different ideas I think that that&#39;s um that&#39;s going to be really compelling so uh as as it moves from being kind of this turn-based chatbot to more of an agent that you can kind of give an intent of what you&#39;re trying to do and it can go away and do more complex things for for you um that is going to be really cool so I don&#39;t know that but I but I do think the journey that we&#39;re starting here with the Creator AIS it&#39;s a this I think is is going to be the beginning of something interesting because I mean right now and this has been a theme of the conversation but I do think right now the way that a lot of people experience these AIS is through kind of the one main AI that that a handful of companies has built and I think Creator AI and as we roll out some more of the business AI stuff um that&#39;s going to start shifting to people are going to start just interacting with a much broader diversity of experiences and I that that&#39;s going to add a real richness to the to the whole ecosystem that&#39;s going to be great I totally agree I think sometimes it&#39;s just as simple as a new application or like just packaging it in a different way and so like like we&#39;ve talked about the theme is like the single to the multi here&#39;s here&#39;s an interesting question for you on the Creator side and I don&#39;t think I&#39;ve ever heard you answer this I consider you a very prolific Creator right you&#39;re you&#39;re designing your own clothes you&#39;re making music I&#39;ve heard about marks meets like I&#39;ve heard about all the hobbies and one question that a lot of creators get asked I get asked a lot is like if I had to start from scratch building a brand online or building a brand around a hobby how do I do it I&#39;m curious for you to answer this so like let&#39;s say you were you were just Mark the guitarist or Mark the founder of Mark&#39;s meets and you you got to know everything you know about World building fandom psychology but we took away all the resources how would you think about like that challenge like going about trying to build kind of a a meaningful brand online as an entrepreneur yeah I mean it&#39;s interesting I um I think we&#39;re almost sort of reflexively trained to think about this stuff these days I mean I&#39;m not for for the marks meets example I mean I&#39;m not trying to create a business around it but I but I sort of reflexively think about it in terms of kind of what&#39;s the story behind this right we&#39;re not just trying to you know raise some cattle we&#39;re trying to raise really high quality cattle and you know because we&#39;re doing it in Hawaii where we&#39;re feeding the the cattle a this unique blend of macadamia nut meal um and we&#39;re brewing beer and and feeding them beer and we&#39;re vertically integrating and we&#39;re growing the macademia trees and we&#39;re growing the beer and Brew brewing the beer um and I find that that&#39;s that&#39;s part of what&#39;s fun about it right is like is everyone kind of does stuff in in a unique way and I think the kind of Celebration and expression of the story about the uniqueness of what you&#39;re doing um is is part of what is cool um so I don&#39;t know I mean maybe one day when I when I retire Mark&#39;s meets will will be a commercial operation but um but in the you know for now it&#39;s I I just you know it&#39;s like just trying to do this awesome thing and I think part of what makes it awesome is having kind of a narrative and a and a story around it and um and social media and all these other tools online help people tell that story but I think it&#39;s also trained Us in some way to think about things in terms of what is the narrative and and um and what&#39;s the story around what you&#39;re doing so I don&#39;t know it&#39;s it&#39;s an interesting question yeah it&#39;ll be the next venture I I really appreciate you doing this Mark I I&#39;ve loved it could ask questions forever thank you so much for sitting down yeah no happy to do it good chatting

Transcript for:Meta's Roadmap and AI Strategy

Transcript for:
Meta's Roadmap and AI Strategy