my dad always had this line we would say no money no honey men when women are strong people call them a and we're men that's strong and kind of arrogant you know you go that's a strong man because there are so many kids now in my culture that are killing themselves because they're doing something they hate it's a please mum and dad visual image is cheap I can buy the clothes I can buy my shoes the thing about vocal image Cohen you have to earn them hello and welcome to unstoppable I'm your host Cohen ray and today we are back in Santa Monica beautiful la the sun is shining and today we talk all things magic communication and public speaking with Vinny GM who is a magician in fact he actually comes from a family of refugees from Vietnam that arrived in Australia in 1981 and being actually said himself that adversity poverty and scarcity other things that created a real hunger and a burning desire to lead him where he is today he's got an incredible story his family is also an incredible driver watching his family building growth businesses as a child including farms grocery stores takeaway dynastar mice's and properties instilled within him and incredible work that he and at age 13 he started his first eBay business he went on to study accounting but he left in the last six months of his degree to actually go and become a full-time at magician he actually created the encyclopedia of magic combine it with his two biggest passions teaching and magic and has over 41,000 students from all over the world he won the South Australian Young Entrepreneur of the Year award in 2013 and in 2016 he combined forces with 52 cards America's leading online magic school that is now teaching over 800,000 students worldwide his magic shows became notorious are sold out in most cases everywhere he went his keynote speaking is personal development with a magical twist where he talks about the perspective of thinking differently influence misdirection showmanship goal-setting the psychology of magic communication and anything is possible mindset now I can tell you right now from this conversation we talked we covered some really cool stuff we talked about how live on how to communicate in a way that is compelling and impactful but at the same time educate entertain and inspire in a way that leaves your audience completely bedazzled and walking out with a ton of value if for those of you who are communicators which is everybody or for those you especially that are looking to do more public speaking and get some platforms time and do some stage work this is not going to be one you're gonna want to miss check it out binge [Music] this episode is brought to you by nail it and scale it the world's leading fast growth program for businesses if you have ever wanted to grow your business faster than what you can right now if you need to make more revenue if you need more leads if you need more clients if you need to know how to plan your business in a strategic way in order to hit big goals if you need to learn how to scale your business and grow your team and your business so the add more freedom then this program is for you imagine three days immersed with me where we cover all aspects of business but we do it from an immersive but and also an execution standpoint we execute every step of the way and we are looking at five key areas we're looking at your psychology we're looking at your marketing your sales your leadership and we're looking at your planning and how we integrate these five key areas to grow your business and your brand quickly so if you'd like to find out more information coup Andrade calm so ladies and gentlemans my absolute honor and pleasure in Santa Monica to be interview another Australian then Jane it's so good to hear another Australian accent hi there I know I feel like oh yes especially we know why for so long like you've been here for two years now two years you know I've only been here for a week and I heard an Australian accent in the pool ah the biggest difference is over here in the US when you say thank you to someone they will say mmhmm yeah well is in Australia we say thank you they get ya no worries mate yeah I'm mister no worries my god it's a North American thing Canadian my wife was it my ex-wife I should say was the same when I whatever I said thank you I was like you know that's kind of rude right just like what like yeah I just felt weird yeah I get it I make great to have you on the show thank you I know you've you've gone on to do represent Australia and do some incredible things over here but for those people who perhaps don't know who minjiang years okay why don't you give us the the 30 second elevator speech on who's been right sorry I started my life studying Commerce and law of course fulfilling the Asian prophesy and I dropped out final year to pursue what I loved yeah I was magic so I loved performing magic and I loved teaching magic then built an online business teaching magic tricks yeah then won a couple of awards from that and then transitioned to what I'm doing now which is what I love even more which is speaking I love speaking and I love running workshops to teach people how to use their voice right so that's kind of a 30-second spiel yeah yeah so you're born in Australia or just born in Britain born and bred and born at the age of four yeah yeah born but you're born in Adelaide that right born in Adelaide mum and dad a refugee some Vietnam right though so they came every was refugees from Vietnam in what year roughly do you know March 31st 1981 Wow okay great and so as a result I'm gonna assume coming from a family especially you know refugees coming out of Vietnam or yeah I'm gonna assume that came over here and robably build successful businesses brothers did they all come out together yeah they did I got to tell you how they came over please so mum and dad during the war realized that they had to leave there was no way they were going to stay there in in communist Vietnam and the way they escaped is they had to find out when was the best night to leave so dad and his brothers actually became fishermen just to learn the patrol routes of the Vietnamese Vietcong right and when they realized that there was one night that people would actually leave there's one night that the Vietcong wouldn't Patrol sorry and the one night they wouldn't Patrol is the stormiest night so then they realized that's that's an opportunity for us to leave so the stormiest night they left and when they left on the stormiest night right after that they ran out of fuel and dad like this what I've got a big tattoo on my arm that represents their journey when they ran out of fuel my grandfather said we got to find smoke and if we find smoke we can find land and they finally find smoke and they got to the smoke and it was an oil rig my family I've never seen and all week before in their lives and then this Kiwi captain comes down and says look to save you we have to destroy your boat in ocean law if you're not dying we can't save you my parents thought you know we've met the white pirates they're here to kill us rah the captain stayed on the boat for two hours to describe to them that no we're here to help you they drew love hearts they drew peace signs and they saved us and will they took us to a refugee island in Malaysia and two years later we got taken in by Australia that was 1981 yeah dad and his seven brothers got in and and it's basically they came in with with no money nothing and so how did they make this start we we had an Australian family actually take our family in sonoran Kelly kind of Australian grandparent Noah and Kelly no and Kelly yeah they took our family and they taught us how to farm and Angels make angels it's why my dad has a philosophy that he has now is that Australia is heaven on earth Wow he says it's heaven on earth because with a source at a Salvation Army nowhere to go you know and took us in and taught us the way of life and gave us so our first few kind of supportive steps and from what I understand they went on to build a number of successful different businesses in a range of different industries yeah we started one of South Australia's first Asian groceries and still owner today is that right and Dad and all of his brothers down in Woodville in South Australia shout out the Woodville and yeah it's basically the Asian get oh it's lovely [Laughter] so this is the crazy story dad had seven brothers right not all seven brothers could go to university in school they didn't have enough money so six brothers said we will sacrifice education for one brother to go through education oh and it was my uncle car so all the brothers didn't go to university that worked in a grocery store or butchers and you know in the grocery so then one brother could go through university he did pharmacy which took it's a four-year degree but it took him about seven years to complete so the brother was like come on might be worth killing what's going on enjoy me a student but it's crazy because he went from no education to high school and university so the poor aren't my poor oh wow yeah that's a big gap completed the degree and then when he got his pharmacy he helped out his brothers in return you know he started an investment group and then they invested in property together and you know now they run pharmacies and have properties and groceries um what an incredible story yeah it's crazy maze just a super fast version but just just seeing them as brothers build go from nothing yeah just having what they have now it's you know I love hearing stories of you know immigrant stories refugee stories because it really kind of puts things into perspective and then whether you're American or Australian it doesn't matter where you're from one of the things I've observed especially the Australia is is is that complacency you know people are just so complacent now there'll be more would that work harder to get money from the government they would be willing to in there do in their own job to make money for themselves and we have people like your family to come in and build empires yeah you know off the back of nothing it really is incredibly inspiring but it scares me as a father now Wow in what way because my son who's two it scares me because I worry about his level of desire his level of drive hmm because because I had nothing when I grew up I try to make sure he has everything yeah and in doing that for the last two years I'm thinking how old's your boy 2 2 & 3 my era and it freaks me out because what if I'm killing his desire by trying to give him everything you know and it just I don't know I'm navigating that as a parent right now and it's are you familiar with the Montessori method that's where he goes yes why you're setting it up setting up perfectly you know I don't know if you've read the book by Dan pink drive the surprising tree yeah the hot when you look at the motivation model you know from Maria Montessori you know it plays into chick me sent me high plays into Carol Dweck it plays into it all of that research yeah but more importantly the development of that intrinsic drive yeah the development of the ability is self managed self lead you know and I think that's you're giving your son best start by putting min Montessori just when I take him home and then we kind of give him a chance Wow and I find myself on the edge all the time as well you know and especially you know I suppose you probably the same thing you know having a bit of a profile I get sent toys oh I don't know buy toys I get sent towards know I have cupboards full of toys I haven't even give him yet and he it's like a what do you call it a treasure hunt around the house sometimes he just stumbles across stuff every time I do workshops or I speak I hear gifts for my son yeah so let's go by you okay your story so you you obviously your parents have this incredible pedigree yeah and then along comes VIN yeah and you you go to school you study hard but then you realize because you went to go to university right so right yeah but before that I move schools five times no kidding I well growing up I was never great academically right but I because of our financial hardship as a family I experienced that really young so I remember I remember a phone call of mum having to borrow money to send me to school and as a kid or super sensitive to this I I don't know maybe I had a bit more emotional intelligence when I was young but I just really was sensitive to that so I always wanted to think how can I go and make money to help mom and dad you know and how can I make money just because I remember one of the things I really wanted when I was young as a 13 year old kid was a girlfriend really wanted a girlfriend and my dad always had this line we would say no money no honey men very wise Asian point and I thought Confucius right yeah yeah or every Asian dad I thought how could I how could I make money and so after that I started to look up these things called mp3 players and in the you 2008 b3 players mp3 mp3 nobody knew what it was in the year 2000 but I could buy them on ebay from China and I thought ha I could actually download music on this thing on this program called Napster for free I did not was illegal at the time so it wasn't I thought oh I could I could sell these to my friends these mp3 players and then I could charge him for changing music on them for cheaper than what they'll pay for a CD so I was actually making good money and I bought it on eBay and you know borrowed mum and dad's credit card that knowing everything and I made a quite a bit of cash as a kid and when kids didn't pay me I didn't know what to do so I'd give the school bully 50 bucks and say get my money didn't know how to deal with the counts receivable right and the principal's would find out and I wouldn't stop doing it so I moved schools a total of five times because of this Wow over that same issue every time same issue you know I went from selling mp3 players to selling like game cards for Nintendo DS's and I did all of that Wow did all of that all throughout all throughout high school you and quite entrepreneurial yeah mate I loved it yeah I loved it yeah and then I realize I did year 13 so you 13 is adult education so I failed you 12 okay 40 60 yeah which was just failed right so I did year 13 and I realized that at an Adult School adults had more money than students and that's where I thrived as an entrepreneur I mean selling everything I sell everything you could think of you know and that was where I thrived and then but I still went to university because I was so so heavily influenced by my culture that university is very important and I was dating a partner at the time you know her family viewed the degree was everything and for me it was becoming an accountant and becoming a partner and a firm that was how I was gonna be at earn love and the respect from my culture but it was never me : you know and this is a problem for so many Asian families every time I go back to South Australia I try to speak to the schools I went to I try to speak there because there are so many kids now in my culture that are killing themselves because they're doing something they hate then please mum and dad had a friend she studied medicine seven years Karen finished her degree this was about ten years ago seven years she finished it and she goes home to her dad after she got that the grape and she goes here's your degree dad I'm gonna go study music oh and it's just so tragic wow that's so many people in my culture kids are trapped trapped by this expectation that stems out of fear our parents fear because they went from nothing to wolf having everything to having everything taken away from them to come into a country and then having this stuff from scratch so our parents out of fear go for security mm-hmm out of fear cling to security and kind of you know Carl Jung a great philosophy he's got a great line where he says the greatest burden a child must bear is the unlived life of its parents what a very profound crime and that's sort relevant to my culture yeah there that I was able to break that mold but so many of the other kids in in any ethnic culture I kind of stuck in that mold but there seems to be a very strong connection between education and the Asian culture there is because of that fear yeah you know I my dad knew I was good at magic he was you know he knew that I was good at magic even he would be like oh wow but then he'll be okay very good no no the doctor you know [Laughter] but it's out of fear that they they remain blind to their children's gifts and talents so you studied accounting for six months before you decide to pull out it no I did it for four and a half years oh you actually did boy I had six months left before a Jew eight and it was one one conversation that made me quit what was their conversation so in university when you are almost done you have to go out and do work experience so obviously I did work experience on one of the big four phones and when I did it there they liked me so they kept me on board so I do work experience and then they put me on the payroll and every day after work I perform magic for every single department in the accounting firm I loved it and one day one of the partners came out and I remember this curtain because this is this partner always had a hand in his pocket and I always thought this was super weird I'm not why keep your hand in your pocket all the time and one day it comes out and he pulls his hand out of his pocket he goes VIN before I show you my hand I have to tell you that in six months time two things will happen I'm either gonna fire you or you can quit it's up to you my dad's gonna kill me man I'm good at this I'm very good at making tax disappear for people why would you get rid of the magician magician would tax it and then he goes he goes what let me show you my hand and he pulls out his head and he had really bad arthritis and it goes vin I love piano I gave it up when I was in my late twenties to build this phone I had the opportunity to play in orchestras all over the world I gave it up to to build this I'd give this all up I'd trade you my car all my wealth to have your youth again to make the right decision I can never play piano again you need to do it you love you in the wrong career and I remember yeah just beautifully long pause and I said to him can you come home and tell my dad bloody brilliant and bless his heart he came home and had dinner with my family he did absolutely and he helped my dad see something in me that my dad was afraid to see my dad knew that I had magical talents but he was afraid to see it my dad is known so much adversity in his life that to him he clung to security whereas doing what you love is something that my dad never had the the luxury of being able to do that because of that fear and so he helped my dad see something my dad already knew I had this but that night my dad was able to put fear aside because someone else was successful in his eyes validated his son Wow and then from that day on my dad and my mom became my biggest fans and my biggest supporters and one line my dad said that I'd never forget that I share it every keynote I do it's from that day on my dad said son look you owe me one thing you know this point you actually owe me one thing you have to jump as high as you can in this life and as long as I'm alive I'll forever be your net from this point on oh yeah so maybe I hit home Wow yep so I so I tested that theory let's see how strong that net is you not Kevlar mum and dad have been there every time I felt I found a lot kun for me to be where I am now I found a lot cuz how old are you now if you don't mind me asking 32 32 now oK you've been in the US for hours to you in two years and at this point when you're you you're on your final six months you're doing the internship in the accounting firm how old you at this point early 20s early 20s and then you get the support of your family to leave yeah what do you do then so I've made a bit of money I currently entrepreneur pursuits and you'd saved it well I I asked my dad for his life savings when I was about 19 and I said dad I know you've got about 50 K you should give it to me I'll fly to China one's out there's a thing called the Canton Fair where it's got the latest electronics in the world I'm gonna go there and buy half a container of electronics bring her back to Australia and sell cuz I'm not doing this thing for eBay anymore that the middlemen they're making way too much money off me I'm gonna go direct to the source my dad gives it to me so by this point I had this little business going where I was selling electronics and I was selling it at the bloody sunday markets the flea market because the ethnics would walk around looking for bargains they actually had rows of 50s in their pockets so I was making 10 1112 ko a day on Sundays no - hash money right so by this time I had a bit of money but again my culture doesn't view just money as success yeah it's the status of a degree yeah but I had all this money so at that point ok when I said you know what stuff it I'm gonna start a career as a magician so I started performing at the air led Fringe and I thought stuff I want to start this online business of mine that I've always wanted to do is this while doing the electronics in parallel yeah right why I never did it because I needed to build my nest first right so I had my nest and I don't mind if you got your nest that I didn't have permission though but once I had my nest and then I got the permission I'm like let's go it's time to go so I started the magic career and I started the online business it went nowhere it was a dismal both were a dismal failure until I learned one lesson because Cohen I was brilliant technically as a magician made I've spent thousands of hours learning sleight of hand thousands of hours and I thought this is the key to success this is what the education system has taught me become technically brilliant and you will achieve success so I applied it toward the world of magic no success hugely frustrating until I learnt the lesson that as a magician you will not achieve success until you have one other skill you need technical brilliance plus one other ingredient and it's what magicians call showmanship and showmanship is just the fancy word for communication skills because this is what this was the the kind of theory you can be this good technically right but if your ability to communicate is here do you think people perceive you to be this good or this good and for the auditory people who are listening if you're a 10 out of 10 technically and a 2 out of 10 communication wise do you think people perceive you to be a 10 out of 10 or a 2 out of 10 you are only as good as you can communicate so I always hear technically but people only saw this yeah so the moment I improved my showmanship I amplified the best part of who I was and I was able to show people how brilliant I actually want and this relates to all the listeners who are listening runner you're a doctor you're a financial planner you're an electrician doesn't matter what you do if you don't communicate well people don't see you for your brilliance and people are a lot of time are raking the brains go why am I not more successful well it's because you can't you're not showing people how good you are even in parenting the same thing yeah but isn't it funny yeah so there was this one book the book of there was a book of on showmanship for magicians there's thousands of book written for technical skills five written on showmanship Wow started reading them on showmanship the moment I improved my showmanship make more taken away top reviewed show top voted for show at the Adelaide Fringe and and we started packing out theaters of six seven hundred and nine did 27 shows a month made quarter of a million bucks in a month well then the online business started succeed because as a teacher I improved as I improved my instrument my voice showmanship communication skills changed my life and that's when I went I want to teach this I think we tend to teach the things that have had the most profound impact on true yeah so I am now where I am because because I believe of showmanship and communication skills so you know and I started a career in speaking as a result of winning a few little entrepreneurial awards and was won the Young Entrepreneur the year yeah yeah yeah yeah it's pretty cool and after that they made me speak they get old now you've got to speak perfect I didn't know I liked it other talk alright yeah I thought well I'm gonna talk about for 15 minutes now he can't shut me up so much I just I love it so much it's true the wife says after Lynne have you been listening I get it but um but I'm paid to speak exactly so I did a couple of free talks and then I realized this is it I've made money is this like mid to late 20s now yeah this was kind of 26 now okay I did my first few speaking events and I went wow I've never felt such fulfillment I I've always kind of been conscious of topping up the financial bank yeah feeling that up but I've never thought about my fulfillment bank mmm and nothing has brought me more fulfillment than speaking and when I spoke I just went you can even get paid for this what it's fulfilling and I get paid for this my first talk is 400 bucks right and I just went oh this is crazy my wife's a pharmacist she's started four years she gets paid for 300 bucks a day I got paid 400 bucks an hour I'm in oh I'm in fulfilling fulfilling it's great but he also got my entrepreneurial brain on fire and then I realized that speakers can get paid a lot more and again just a long story short for you made like I'm a kid that grew up in the northern suburbs in South Australia you know me now that's as big isn't it as it gets it's pretty rough and I went from building all this stuff to I was paid 400 bucks and fast forward to today I'm 25 27 and a half grand makino now you know and going for 400 bucks - that to me is just ridiculous and I often struggle with impostor syndrome because of this and I remember one of my managers sitting me down and just saying hey look let me tell you why you get paid this you get paid this because speaking communicating is one of the most highly valued skill sets in the world that's why you get paid that and I've got speaking friends over here like no Robins been one of them who helped me my career tremendous Holly she's amazing love her I'm where I am because with my speaking because of her as well she gets paid like seventy five thousand oh yeah you know and it's just again because being able to communicate effectively is one of the most highly valued skill sets in the world and so now this is what you do yeah yeah you now each is yeah but I guess you bring a little bit of an element that's quite unique because of the magic I'm imagining yeah well the magic my wife says it's a way for you to make the medicine taste good right yeah I love that's what we said before yeah and I think that's my point of difference my point of difference is that I use magic as a metaphor so I think it's you know to have a successful keynote speaking career I've mapped out that the speaking blueprint and understood the business now you need three things you've you've you've got it educate you've got her inspire but you also have to entertain mmm it's so critical and that's the three ingredients and I think if you have that you can can build a pretty cool speaking career so when you work with someone like what are the things that you work on in order to help them educate inspire and entertain at a higher level well look when it comes to communication specifically yep when it comes to communication specifically I've kind of distilled the five core foundations of brilliant communication right and it's actually quite simple it's actually not that complex and then this is what I do so I'll give you an example so I I do a trick on stage where I get five people on stage and I give them a packet of cards and everyone looks at a different card it ever looks at a different card and then after that somehow I'm able to read out the five cards that the five cards people on stage were thinking and they go offstage wow how did you know we just look we looked at any single card we wanted and then I asked the audience after I do that trick I go who here in this room can come on stage and do this trick right now not one hand is raised there wasn't no I must have taken you years of practice I'm like no you see this is why we call magic and illusion I learned that trick in five minutes I'm gonna teach you all how to do it now and I show them how the trick is done and then I show them that every single every single card in the pack is exactly the same I said I named five cards but every single card in the pack was the same card so I just said to or heart 700 clubs jacker clubs queen of diamonds ace of spades but all the cards are to a heart they just didn't realize and then they go oh that's how you did it it's an illusion it breaks the illusion right yeah and I go now who on who and the audience can come on and do this now every hand goes up and I go something that was impossible two minutes ago has now come possible because you learned the method and it's simple it's simple yet you thought it was so complex you thought I had to learn body language I thought I did all these crazy nonsense there is an illusion for public speaking too when you see a great public speaker you go wow I must have taken them 50 years to learn this or must be so complex it's not true that is also an illusion you just have to learn the core salvations and then i simplified so that's how I use magic I love it I show complexity is simplicity and I'm able to break it down with something fun and then I take them through their core foundations of great communication he said there were five five yeah that's what I believe anyone yeah no I'd love to hear well just to give you context to I to become a speaker I did years of theater years of vocal training to learn how to be a speaker all right my only mentor he was a magician he he I remember him telling me he goes look if you want to speak do the water favor and learn how to use your voice learn how to use your body because right now you're quite at it appreciate his brutal honesty but I was really bad yeah and I've got video footage of me being awful but you learn theater because this is an instrument your body and your voice is an instrument and I did years of that which has helped me distill five core things right the first thing is your right of speech a lot of people put no thought behind their rate of speech but if again for those listening to this if I get stuck in a consistent rate of speech now and I stick to this read of speech and I don't vary from this rate of speech what happens to you as a listener yeah I guess that's to get boring right so we have to modulate it we have to vary our rate of speech and if I sometimes go quickly and when I'm going quickly it shows passion but then when I slow down : I'm saying nothing important here but it seems so profound nothing important has been said yet it's so right a speech it's its own beast mmm the second thing is volume the volume shows confidence Authority that you believe in what you're saying so if I switch off my volume let's say I speak like this now and I come in but I'm truly an expert in what I'm talking about doesn't seem like I believe in what I'm saying doesn't seem like I'm confident in what I'm saying it's a shame most people speak at a volume that is a bit too quiet and then when you tell them to writing from 1 to 10 they usually speak about a 3 you told them to speak at a 5 they go oh I think I'm being too loud you know each year I coach three CEOs right now I'm coaching the CEO of Orangetheory fitness Dave long massive shout out to Dave awesome human being but he speaks at a level 3 Volume I tell him to speak at a level five what we're doing now he goes oh then I think I'm being too loud okay Dave that's crazy you're not you're losing out on a huge amount of authority a charisma energy confidence and authority because you don't speak in a level five volume third one is pitch pitch is fascinating because for the listeners who are listening right now think to a book you've read maybe you can even think to a book you've read Cohen a book you've read more than ten times right have you got one that you've you've read a lot yes maybe not tens well let's say you know I'm good like many yeah if I asked you to recite for me a page in that book word for word could you do it no good otherwise you'd be a freak now let me ask you another question is there a song that you've seen quite often that you enjoy ooh there's a song that my son loves to play row over and over again Yeah right but if I ask you to recite for me word for word that song could you recite the song oh and there's not one song in the world that I know the lyrics to okay so you're a terrible example for this but for the listeners totally ruined my example thank you coming this is surely you could think of a song that you love right yeah and generally most people can wax up and take it one song that I actually know the words of okay you never close your eyes anymore when you're the Top Gun Yeah right yeah of course ya know why KITT okay so our song has a roughly 280 words right I paid you the book has roughly 200 words yeah why can you recite a song yet not a page in the book that's so interesting music has melody so if you speak with more melody what you say becomes more memorable what you say becomes more memorable whereas most people use two notes when they speak you know whereas I use the philosophy and I use the mindset of each person every one of you that's listening to this right now you've got it you've got a piano of 88 keys right and most people speak with a couple of keys and my remember my first singing teacher when I met her and I didn't do this to become a singer I did this to become a more effective communicator when I walked into a room I remember this she didn't even look at me and she'd play one key over and over and over again for three minutes it was like something out of the Exorcist and they should stop and should go how do you feel young men I thought say I don't know this is kind of scary awkward nothing and then she played this beautiful song called romance three minutes unless you turn around she gets how do you feel young man I said actually quite sad to be honest it was quite a sad song she goes VIN most people go through life speaking like this one key I'll teach you how to speak like this Wow melody sir melody right so again melody third foundation because because here's the thing let me give you this example too you could hear a piano song and through sad you could hear a piano song and feel happy you could hear a piano song and if you inspired you could hear a piano song and feel scared there's no words how do you know how to feel so there's a backing track underneath every voice there's a backing track under every voice when people say oh well this person walks into the room lifts the energy of the room what is that that's the backing track of their voice there's people here walk into a room and you feel incredibly heavy like I come in and I talk I go in it's it's Monday can't believe it's five days till Friday and there's a backing track behind that so melody that's melody that's pitch the fourth one is tonality and tonality is the emotion that lives underneath fear words wither up without realizing and this is where the 'the world of theatre in the world of singing come together but body language your face is the remote control for the emotion that lives underneath your words and most people without knowing are walking around with what is otherwise known as a resting and if you've got a resting you've got a tone so if you just slightly smile it brings more melody into your voice because I smile controls the emotion underneath your words and again if I make a disgusted face for no reason I'm not talking about anything disgusted but I sound disgusted the six core human emotions you got happy sad disgust fearful angry and surprised you've got to be able to show those six tonality is at least if you want to be an effective communicator mmm most people don't most men don't most men neutral face and as a result neutral tone most people are afraid of a monotone voice yet do not know that a monotone voice comes from my moment in monotone body mmm and your face is a part of your body so this is a huge one in my classes when I teach just to get men and women in the corporate world who are so stoic in their facial expressions just to break out of their mold and show me some emotion damn it and when they do they come alive and authenticity is now radiating through them so that's that's the big one and the fifth one is pausing just this and for the listeners who listen to this just as we pause it's so powerful it gives them time to comprehend what we're saying it gives us as communicators time to listen and to process and these are important foundations when you're playing your instrument and if you listen back to this podcast or any great speaker these are the five things they're modulating and any speaker who you deemed to not be a great communicator they're just not modulating one of these things and they've stuck they get stuck in a default volume stuck in the default right stuck in the default pitch stuck in the default tonality you modulate these five things you master these five things now you play beautifully with your instrument yeah it's just these five things made that you've nailed it like in terms of method structure you mentioned before though there's clearly a subtle difference between training men and training women yeah what do you find are the biggest differences if an women are typically more open to shaping their tool more expressively yeah they're more expressive they have better tonality men tend to have terrible turn ality because we've been taught you know in society don't show your emotions you know don't don't don't you know typically as men as well don't show what you're feeling be strong you're always strong so so we tend to always have a strong face and then as a result we miss out on all these other one for emotions that portrayed with tonality like I remember when I was bet when I used to be really bad at this I only had one face in the face of you know being an entrepreneur working really hard and even when I used to tell my wife that I loved her I'd be like I love you so much I was always so intense and she goes gosh I feel like gosh can you just I didn't understand what she was talking about but it was my tonality I had one year I was always so intense and I didn't modulate my tonality but now that I do I can take people on an emotional roller coaster and then suffer with this you should see how hard it is for me to get men to show the tonality of like love it's so it's like that like what gear is that I don't know what do you mean and it's so crazy because again just to get them to show sadness when I teach men to show sadness I get them a guy show me a sad face I don't know just go like this like I am I'm like what it's bizarre but the moment they're now able to access a sad face they access they can they can they can take me places that they've never been able to take me before and Men so so first thing it's tonality our oh that's crazy it's so hard for women it's volume its volume mmm and pitch women are really afraid of and I feel for women as well because when women are strong people call them a all right and we're men that's strong and kind of arrogant you know do you go oh that's a strong man it's kind of well no not really sometimes if a man's been too arrogant you get bit of a wanker and it's a bit of a whereas for women it's a for men it's the wanker the cockpit a woman it's the right but I tell women the only reason why you come across as a is just the way a is just a certain rhythm and a certain way you use your soundtrack it's a soundtrack yeah so a soundtrack if I talk like this I'm a bit of a and I because I'm coming across as a and I'm telling you it's a soundtrack it's a Mel of it so I'm saying all you have to do is change the melody add more melody so for say for example universally if I just increase my volume like this I come across as a bit of an arrogant wanker don't I but but that's because I've increased the volume without increasing the amount of melody in there so all of a sudden if I told you like this and IIIi use more melody while I'm talking to you it's I'm not coming across as a wanker anymore there's a bit more melody in there now so all women have to do is add more melody as they're trying to be more assertive and you won't come across as that's it do you about this is kind of crazy you ever find that when you're getting people to express emotions sometimes these are emotions that are repressed suppress I don't want to know that I wanted to you know society or whatever their own you know a limiting beliefs are but I'm curious to know at any point I'm gonna assume this is can be quite cathartic for some people yeah because all of a sudden they start straight do you ever have the situation where you're getting a man or a woman to start showing an emotion and then all of a sudden the emotion takes over and they might just start sobbing for no reason it's happened multiple times in the workshop mm-hmm and it's because they've every practice they've just bottled it up for too long they've had a soundtrack in there that's been wanting to get out and I just haven't allowed to play and people have so many beautiful songs in them that if they played for the people around them that they loved the most you could build such deep connections with the people around you stories storytelling it's so the other thing I teach and storytelling is how we build deeper connections with people and the reason why is when I told you a story stories are designed in a way does take up memory space and you'll remember the stories that I told you right you know you remember that I was the accountant people will remember that I quit six months before I left and you remember these things because stories embed themselves in people's minds so the more stories I told you the deeper of a connection we share because the more memory space I take up in your head and one of my friends who is a detective he he told me that when he was infiltrating gangs to try to find the connection between people he used storytelling meaning he would listen up for people who are sharing stories with one another and if they're sharing stories they're close but if they're just sharing directions be there on the street at 7:00 p.m. on the corner of this street in Maastricht they're not close there's no real strong connection there's no bond so to find the deep bonds between people he'd listen for who's sharing stories so his storytelling is a very powerful way to connect with people and the way the reason I got on this topic Irwin is that we'll have so many beautiful songs that are trapped inside them that if they dare to be vulnerable to share them with the people they loved you deepen the connection with the people around you the whole reason I decided to teach communication skills is I see so many people now live lives where they're not connected with people hmm and it's because they're not sharing any stories you know they're just sitting around talking about how the day went and why they pissed off at their boss or their manager and that's not deepening connection you know stories are so rich stories have great logic to them that satisfies the brain it has characters that are rich that accesses the emotion and when you've got a strong point to your story hits you in the gut and that's the inspiration component and you mentioned those three components inspiration education and entertainment yeah one of the things that I see a lot of speakers really struggle to do is balance the inspiration and the education component you know because like me you've seen probably thousands of speakers right research yeah right and and studied them as well and there seems to be a couple of buckets that some speakers fall into that I've observed and I'm being quite general here and this is not an exhaustive list I'm gonna keep it very basic in the to list yeah yeah maybe three you've got what the one type of speaker that is incredibly good at sharing inspirational stories and they'll inspire a room but the room will leave inspired but they won't leave with anything that they can use pragmatic yeah yeah nothing practical nothing a methodology Luxur no order and then on the other side sometimes you get these speakers who they really lack the ability to share stories but they have great frameworks they have great content but great structures great content yeah and then they're every now and then you know you have these unicorns that come along you know that have this ability to be able to share stories that inspire but also provide a level of structure okay and method and process yeah that allows the education to really take hold within those stories so that they remember the story but they also remember that the five steps yeah how do you find that balance when you're working with the communicators because this isn't just for speaking this is communication yeah yeah how do I find the balance of how do you tell someone find that balance well IIIi have a third ingredient and it's entertainment oh yes I believe in that too mm-hmm so to me it's a beautiful even distribution of 33.33% I genuinely yeah right I guess when I first started and I thought entertainment was really powerful so I had 80% entertainment 80% magic and 20% education and it sucked I remember the first client that believed in me in Australia Building Association in Sydney after I finished my talk he came out and he said to me the CEO came out and he said to me have you done this before in a really derogative way and I was like oh um yes but obviously I suck and that's when I started to learn and started to build sensitivity that you can't be 80% entertainment and 20% education as a keynote speaker hmm and that's when I started to look for this ingredient and then after that I went full the other way 80% education 20% magic people were yawning or getting bored attention spans are getting reduced I thought what the hell is going on then I realized oh I also I'm missing inspiration as well so then I started to play around with it and I I everywhere I go I bring Craig who's my videographer shout out to Craig best videographer ever not to love you Craig yeah love you Craig and also yours as well so love you too Mattias but but again I started to realize that I needed to watch all my videos back and I literally would watch your back and this is the methodical magician part of my brain that I don't know I need to work out how many minutes my spending on entertainment how many minutes my spending on storytelling to inspire how many minutes my spending on giving people pragmatic advice so now I need a third of everything has to be a third mmm can't be any more and do you weave those estia so I talk is three modules yeah there's an introduction there's a conclusion and then within this three modules every module requires inspiration entertainment and education hmm and that is the perfect cocktail that keeps you inspired keeps you on the edge of your seat and keeps you educated and then you walk away go wow cool I've got tools I feel good and I had a great time and I got that formula because I started speaking on conference calls to my clients going and asked them the same question can I what would you like your people to take away they say the same thing every single time even until today going they say VIN would like our people to have some key takeaways we like them to feel inspired and we like them to have fun education inspiration and entertainment every client tells me the same thing so again why guess just put together what they want you know and and then that's that's the perfect combination and a lot of people won't go or win but I'm not a magician no you don't have to be a magician your form of entertainment could just be humor mmm storytelling is a form of entertainment inspiration though is how you use your voice it's part storytelling but it's also how you use your voice because I could tell you that I could tell you the most inspiring story like this you won't feel inspired trust me you won't and if I speak like this my story better be damn dramatic otherwise it won't be inspiring so inspiration is the soundtrack that lives on any of your voice the greatest inspirational speakers have really harnessed that you have to thank you I've watched you know Thank You Man appreciate that yeah so you seem to be having it have a level of awareness of very few people do in this industry this industry is wrought with not just people who suffer from impostor syndrome which seems to be very common yeah it's also very it's full of people that are essentially how do I put this politely the some people would have the view that they haven't been at the right for the stage because in many respects they're standing up there and they're sharing things that aren't authentic that aren't their stories they just essentially they've developed a character right do you draw the line when it comes to you know the way you work with your clients between okay is that all is it really at its essence about tapping into that level of purity so there's an absolute authentic presence coming through or is there a level of character development as well or is it a combination of both I think it's a combination of both you know it's because it's funny and the reason and I'll get you to elaborate on that yeah because when I my very first cat's my very first company was a security company and I had a 45 direct field direct sales field agents would go out and in the in the field everyday and self security alarm systems door-to-door and we all had a script and the script itself to go through the sale script was a 60 minute script 60 60 minute script it was a change with a flip chart yeah and this is by the way selling to someone who's never even considered by so we would basically have vans full of guys would go and drop them into different suburbs at 9:00 a.m. they go door knocking from 9:00 a.m. until 4:30 then you do a 60 minute presentation in my house when I get there we do not block all day long and do security surveys from from 9:30 to 4:30 and whilst doing those surveys the other survey would say I'll look if you'd like us to come back and give you a free home in home security assessment we'll come back and we'll show you how you can secure a home and if you allow us to do that we'll give you a personal attack alarm a fire blanket a fire extinguisher yeah and you know the to uptake was normally pretty high so normally at 6:30 that night would be sitting down as typically they're having dinner and the husband's getting home and you do that of these people and we'd be sitting there with our flipchart doing our 60 minute presentation and you know I had an 80% close rate where I'd be selling it at $2,800 alarm system to a family 80% closed rate yeah who had never even considered buying an alarm system before but when I was training guys to do it one of the things I noticed was you're given the script and they were just yes so one of the things we've so what I used to do is I used to get scripts from the library of different movies and download scripts off the internet and bring them in and I'd get them to do character transformation and I'd actually get them to read the script of the movies and embody the character less and the reason I'd said it is and they'll go why are you getting you know some of the guys would give that you they go why getting is to you know read these movie scripts and I said because the character you are right now can't sell for the person you are right now can't do the job that's required in order to maintain a job here who you are right the other character that you're taking into the into that into that into that home yeah it's not the character that's selling we need to develop a character yes it is influential a character yes okay that has Authority and a character that people will want to buy from so if we can get you to embody these things if I can get you to learn how to play play Mary Poppins if I can just didn't learn to play me oh then learning how to play a better version of yourself is gonna be actually a lot easier but one of the things that I found is you'd have some people would just take it way too far bra and now develop this counts like okay dude come back to it okay but how do you find that balance when you're working with someone who is perhaps real placid you know a real real subservience I'm real quiet-like oh we need to develop a character within there yes to bring out the authenticity without you know drowning who you really are with this make-believe character well the first thing is understand that everybody has a internal list of what they believe is a great communicator mmm let me explain to you so so we've sat at conferences and when a great speaker goes on stage you go oh I like that I like this I like this and I don't like that I don't like that yeah everyone's got a list of what they beamers being a great communicator that they would like to see in themselves yes everyone's got that list but the problem is no one's ever applied that list to themselves mmm because you've never seen yourself so to me first of all is bringing awareness to people that you know how you want to be as a communicator you have an internal list but you've just never applied that list to yourself and you're unaware of what that list is so we need to bring awareness to what that list is so what I do with a lot of my students I say I say I'm gonna record a video of you speaking and I'm gonna play it back to you so you have an opportunity to see yourself they hate this process and I do this with a lot of the executive leaders and I make them watch your back and I sit there and I watch your back with them and you see them just going ah they're cringing right and I go what didn't you like about it and then now write a list oh I never knew I spoke so quietly gosh I never knew how monotone I would so they start writing this list and this list now is an authentic list of what they would like to see in themselves as opposed to coming to me and I'm going oh I'll give you a list of this is what you should be and that means everybody I trained them Cohen will be a cookie cutter of each other I don't want that for my students you have a different list of what you believe as being a great communicator everybody has so first I'll give them be awareness and I go then this is the character you want to become then this is what we need to move towards this is what we need to move towards so again that's how I balance and as opposed to giving them a character that I believe every great communicator should be and that's how I used to teach which was bloody awful so sorry - my first three classes of students much love to you all come do the workshop again sometime but then now I realize is about getting them sofa we're building that self-awareness and then going what would you like because to improve yourself as a communicator it's such a daunting list but all of a sudden now as you've got this list now you got our cool now you now you also give yourself that permission that I'm not being fake or phony and here's the biggest thing going the biggest thing when I get my students to play with their voice to play with the piano per se is they go are VIN you made me do that and and the character thing you did Coen brilliant wisdom because when you tell people to play with their voice they're like now feels weird told them to play a character everyone does it just fine so I told them to play the character and they go oh but I feel fake and phony I feel like I'm being fake and okay no this is the big mind so she give shift you have to make it's not fake you're just unfamiliar because you've always played with these five keys you play with these five keys all your life I'm just getting you to play with these keys over here still your damn voice still your instrument nothing fake about it just unfamiliar so that it is and then when you become comfortable with the uncomfortable they go oh I'm being inauthentic no no authenticity is when you can play all eighty-eight Keys beautifully you only playing these twelve Keys here that's inauthentic that's inauthentic learn how to play the damage the whole instrument now you're fully authentic so you're exploring your voices a must so there is a balance hmm and the only way to play with the balance is some of my students will go too far I had a student that just sent me an email saying VIN I just went into an interview and the feedback I got was I was overconfident and I go see that's how we learn my friend but that's how we actually learn you have to go too far to know you've gone to I went on stage when I just started my speaking career pretending to be like Anthony Robbins it was gross because I'm not Anthony Roberts right and I went off and I just you know I was like I watched the video back and I was like whoa vomiting in the back of my throat as I'm watching that but it was because I had to go too far you have to go too far you have to hit the walls he had finally ceiling and that's okay that's a part of learning and we all go through it I went through the same thing myself I still remember to this day exactly where I was I was I was the chameleon I was the ultimate stage chameleon I could get on stage and adopted to any personality that was required to connect Wow that's powerful it was yeah but it wasn't necessarily the authentic me yeah yeah yeah and I had a mentor of mine pulled me aside and he just it was in Perth in 2003 pulled me aside and he just flogged me as a son I don't even know who you are anymore I don't even know when the real Cohen is here well yeah this other character and I went for a walk and I was walking through Perth at the time and I walked up I just went I did these little quantum walk sometimes where I just want yeah I'll walk out the front of a hotel in a some random city around the world I go right where do I feel drawn and I'll just literally navigate the city based on instinct and just go where I feel drawn mad he's actually and and I and all these incredible things happen and up until having a filmmaker I never had someone following me to capture the magic that would happen yes but this one time I didn't have a filmmaker but I got drawn up this little alleyway which is like this medieval alleyway and then right in front of me as I was walking up this alleyway this lady just falls over and just stops breathing turns purple and so I start performing CPR on her and all these other people are you know rambling around and you know performing CPR on her and performing sleeping like literally three minutes of CPR than the Ambo show up they cut a dress off they put the paddles on her they defib her three times she comes back and then she she dies it dies again they D fibber again they pull out the gurney they throw on the gurney and I'm I'm in the middle of this right and then we're wheeling the gurney down to the to the main street we put at the back of the ambulance a door shut and the ambulance takes off and I'm there by myself it was just me and then I looked down there was a plaque that said October 1974 which was the year at the year in the month that I was born and I was at that and I was walking the streets contemplating this identity dilemma and then I experienced the death and it was almost like in that moment I experienced the death of the character Wow she was just too met she was an external representation of a character that had died and in that moment when she when she pulled away I remember think to myself okay I'm gonna find out who I am because I'd actually lost who I was I'd forgotten who I was you know and it took me a lot of number of years after that of work this is back in 2003 to disco okay well Who am I really because I played so many different characters in so many different situations in order to connect because I was so insecure right yeah and for me that was mica stop mom there was my mind where I was my vomiting in the back of the throat you know I don't me it really wasn't you saved a life well I actually don't know because I ran the hospital later on in our asks are you a family I was like no I'm not feeling so old sorry can't actually give out the details and it was this just this unknown it was like yeah I wanted to know what happened and and the voice my head kept telling said it wasn't about her was about you that's powerful it was it was pretty intense it was pretty special moment for me and I'll never forget I'm very grateful thanks for sharing that oh you're welcome well let me ask you this - yeah I mean the the interesting thing about this stage if we talk about the stage yeah is that there's nothing natural about standing on stage in front of 5,000 people so to ask someone to be completely natural in their authentic selves you know such an extremely inauthentic situation is a big ask mmm you know so I think it the pursuit of trying to be yourself on stage isn't an easy pursuit but I think you nailed it by saying the authentic self is a t2k yes it's not 88 keys sorry there's no clearly not a pianist yeah not five and I think that's the distinction the distinction is learning how to not so much create a character but develop ourselves yes that's very exploration exactly and there's a concept that I teach called neutral ears so people go well how do i how do I learn all these things how do I start applying it you need to find neutral ears because if I if I spoke like this the entire time and my wife has known me like this to be this version of me for the last say eighteen years of our marriage and I come home and I say hello wife this is the new version of vim you'd freak the out of her should freak out so you can't immediately do these to the people around you who know you as being you who who know you as these five keys you'd do anything radically outside of that you'll freak your environment out and the moment your wife gives you that weird look of like what do you normally what happens when people come home from Tony Robbins yes what happens is that that slight resistance from the people you love that slight spatial expression that they do who actually make put you back in your shell no I should never do that again so the thing is you have to find neutral years neutral ears are people who have no preconceived idea of who you are and I learnt this because I move school five times the first school I was at I was a typical Asian nerd you know really wanted desperate for a girlfriend really desperate and super nerdy and just there no no one give me your attention and I remember the I so remember this one of my best friends super funny in school Lenny and he's really funny I've got all the ladies so I thought you know what I'm gonna crack a joke and I cracked a joke in class super lame don't remember what it was but I remember this one girl I will never forget her Stacy she turns around and she goes stop trying to be like Lenny and she just put me back in my my mold I had this mole everyone had this preconceived idea of who VIN was but the one I moved schools Cohen I realized these kids don't know who I am I could be anyone I wanted to be so sick of being bullied so I decided to be the bully so when I went to this new school I remember the first the kids were throwing little rubber bits in your hair I just went I kind of went apeshit and I turn around I scream stop it and then I took a chair and I threatened to throw out of him and everyone's like oh damn this new kid skits he's crazy immediately they perceived me to be the bully there was no mold for me this new mold was you are the bully and what the hell I'm not a bully this is crazy walked around the school for the next few months like this it's kind of godlike kid move schools again and realized that had the opportunity where I had no mold I could be anyone I wanted to be so I recreated myself five times as a teenager Wow so as an adult I realized the value of a neutral year the value of an environment where there's no mold so I told people don't bring that self home straight away don't try to play with the 88 88 keys straight away where you try it is down at the servo with a person at the cash register has no idea who you are so if you're naturally quiet like this go in that night and give it a crack number seven please and do you have any Snickers here don't be like what the hell they will have no preconceived idea of who you are they won't give you that weird look and when you try a new behavior with no negative reaction that mean behavior sticks just a little bit more because the first time you play a damn saxophone I bet you're gonna sound awful so you need to practice on neutral ears so you can iron out the kinks so it won't be so unnatural and again that's one of the most powerful ways I've discovered for my students I told them neutral ears you have opportunities for that every day everywhere play with it play with your instrument strangers that you'll never ever see again so if you do a bad job doesn't matter they're never gonna see you again and I honestly I urge every single person who listens to this play with your instrument more you've been given this beautiful instrument such a shame if you don't start to learn how to play it beautifully wonderful quote by Oliver Wendell Holmes who who says that I Bob butcher it but most people will go to their deathbeds with so much so many beautiful songs left in them and they'll die before they get the opportunity to play them hmm so tragic so you know live fully play all the songs and die with no music left I think that's the key then this has been an enlightening conversation I have got so much more value than I anticipated move it out oh but just to see I love models I love methods I love frame rise but I love communicators I love people who can communicate really embody everything that you're talking about here this is just in the spirit of trying to add value to it please write they know the five foundations now you've got your rate of speech you've got your volume you've got your pitch tonality in the pause there's a really cool strategy that magicians use that you can use as a communicator and trust me if you're in the Roma business doesn't matter what you do this would be official for you so again you record yourself for five minutes of you talking we all have phones you can do it there's no excuse record yourself just speaking about what you're passionate about for five minutes but then leave it for a day because you're too damn self-critical if you watch it straight away leave it for a day then when you watch it the next day watch it in a very specific way you watch it twice let's keep it simple the first time you watch it turn the sound all the way up and then turn your phone over so you can't see yourself isolate more natori and then listen to yourself Koen take notes about the five foundations how is your rate of speech how is my my volume how is my pitch for right how's my tonality the emotion behind the words am i pausing take notes on what you can do to improve then you've got a page your notes now turn it around turn the sound down mute it now press play just watch yourself body language rise what things do you like what things don't you'd like make notes you do ten iterations of this it will transform the way you come across to another human being wow that's very practical yeah very practical very straight very simple but ten iterations of this I've had students do it for ten weeks once every week yeah the moment we become self-aware people talk so much about self-awareness in today's world yet very few people tell us how do we build that self-awareness so as a communication teacher I really focus that well how can I give my students this self-awareness this is how you do it ten iterations of this if you were a liberal to command a liberal to communicator out of ten take you to a six or seven and you can do this by yourself hmm by yourself on your own with your phone hugely pragmatic and hugely valuable for anybody listening who wants to improve the way they come across very because here's the thing most people in the world we live in today most people only focus on visual image how they come across visually right but here's the thing visual image is cheap I can buy the clothes I can buy my shoes I can buy my watch the thing about vocal image con you have to earn that mmm and no one talks about vocal image yet via the way I speak people are making assumptions about my level of education they make assumptions about my level of success they make assumptions about how trustworthy I am all of that is communicated via the vocal image people make assumptions when they look at you but the moment you open your mouth they solidify their assumptions about you so if you look smart but you sound dumb you will be perceived as being dumb but if you sound smarter than you sound if you look smart in your cell smart they'll solidify that assumption now and turn into a belief I now believe you're smart I believe you were educated yet again someone can be dressed in a suit and again you can see them and go wow this person seems professional trustworthy but the moment they talk you can seem sly you can sling not trustworthy and all of that comes through with voice so again most people only focus on visual image well I believe we're living in an era now where you know vocal images everything because now people know just see you they hear you so what's your vocal image doing what vocal image are you portraying and with this videoing technique you now can not only style the way you look visually you can style yourself vocally most people are not thinking about how this being starred vocally there's a podcasting course in this as well by the way right because obviously with podcast blowing are becoming so vocal image it's your vocal brand right it's your vocal brand and when you consider how many podcasters are so when and that's the only dimension that they're working in they were working with their voice with their vocals and it's not their fault it's because it's not their fault no one's been trained who's been trained you've been given one of the most damn complex instruments in the bloody world and no one's trained you on it mmm I cannot believe in tertiary education and in high school there's not a month dedicated there's not even there's not even a day and here's the sad part the presentation is that you have to do in tertiary education guess what happens when it comes the day to do it you pretend to be sick the one day you have to practice with your voice people pretend to be sick or dead this scared shitless and I don't they don't rock up because then they got so much anxiety yet this is the voice and if you my philosophy is that and this is gonna I'm giving you so many kind of metaphors now but hopefully you can run with me but I see everybody as being a lighthouse on an island by yourself you're a lighthouse and your ability to communicate is metaphorically speaking how bright your light is that you're shining out into the rest of the world and when you don't radiate and you don't be mad right light no one can see your brilliance no one will ever come to your Island for your business or your service you'll just be this brilliant person there's brilliant thing with gifts and talents and just with a really dim light going hey guys I'm here this is me I'm here and the reason I use that analogy is because we live now in a world where look at us we look a little couple of five cameras here if you improve your visual image and your vocal image you now have the opportunity to radiate that worldwide hmm worldwide for once now we are in control of that and we don't have to write for a radio station for us to come in we can just go Facebook live and you boost it up to enough people if your communication skills are great that beam of light reaches the entire world I have a speaking career here in the US because people in the u.s. saw a video that I posted when I was in Adelaide South Australian living in the northern suburbs different world no brother and you out of all people know that Wow Ben I gotta say man you're doing Australia proud I don't think you're doing Vietnam proud Australian proud I was born in Australia are you are babies home for me so you may even pressed the out of me and I'll tell you right now it's not an easy face by any stretch of the imagination but I am curious they're like what what's next for VIN teaching mm can I look speaking is is great and I think a lot of people are drawn to speaking because it's incredibly fulfilling but let's not deny the incredible lucrative nature of speaking as well a lot of people are drawn to that reason and as a result the wrong reason yeah don't build great speaking careers but for me while speaking has been incredibly fulfilling both from a emotional standpoint and financially speaking for an hour doesn't quite cut it for me anymore I I realized that I can be momentary motivating like momentary motivation is what I can offer in an hour we're coming in three days I can change you I see myself as being the piano fixer come in and I'll help you tune the piano you already have all the keys you anything you don't have i'm just hoping you tune it so you play it beautifully the kind of rewards i get from that far outweigh anything I've ever experienced in my life I want to dedicate my life to teaching people how to use their voice because it's something that's changed my life I got an email just last week from a gentleman who did my course and he said then I realized him that I go to work and I do play my instrument quite well so you've helped me but what you've made me realize is that but then I come home and then I switch off my mastery with my voice so I go to work and I give people this and then I come home and my wife and my children asked me how's your day dead and I say yeah it's been around scraps and he goes and I give them nothing I play them the most awful songs because I switch off and he goes and just last week for an entire week I came home playing it beautifully and my wife cried and just said where has this version of you been for the last 15 years oh and he goes it broke my heart because I now realize the most important audience is my family not my work so glad you said that and I just thought wow that's so powerful because again this is such a beautiful I can yeah again I just think again like it's emails like that that make me go wow this is this is where I need to be going this is where this is where my hands and again people who come in who are technically brilliant I teach a lot of tech people technically saw amazing cowan but to the world they were invisible they're invisible yet the moment they learned how to play their instrument like I've had the I've had a couple of women come in who were technically so brilliant geniuses and then now that they've learned how to use their voice Wow well the career progression has been unbelievable and it's just that's just an unlock and again it's not their fault they just have never been taught so to me what's next is I want to help tune as many instruments as I can in my time that I have here you know and I'm very aware of you know maybe if I can get to 83 you know maybe just under nineteen thousand days I do want to spend the majority of that fixing and tuning instruments I feel that's what I was I was here to do can be written the book yet yeah I have written I've written more than eighty thousand words on a Cohen III I'll coin this I'll say this now but the book when I do write it I know what the taro is gonna be it's going to be called the most fraudulent book ever written because everything I've learnt is from everybody else everybody else everything I've learned is from somebody else not there's nothing original here and I'm fully aware of that and what's stopping me from getting this book out is this overwhelming fear of there's nothing original here and I feel it needs to be in the oven this book for another few years because I'm 32 Karen and I don't want to write a book for the sake of writing a book because when I started my speaking career everyone said to me without a book you will not be able to be a speaker you will not be able to believe in me yeah got a speaking career forty-four I can write my name I do have the Asian no need to glows no one likes a show-off but but I I don't feel it's ready because I think when it's very all known i sense and and i am a bit of a perfectionist and when I write this book I want I want it to be awesome and I've read a lot of books my friend that when I've read it I go this person didn't wasn't like again it just it felt like it was got taken out of the oven a bit too early and I just want to make sure that it's it's ready you know and and yeah I love that title the most fortunate book ever written written one day yeah it's in the process but it's not yet so Ben where can people find out more about you about your courses your services your coaching yeah look if they if they're just google vin j VI m h GI AMG they'll find me but if they want to specifically come to my workshops just go to stage workshop dot live and you'll be able to come spend three days with me and junior been this has been one has a value packed podcast we've done in in a while so I know there's an enormous amount of value here for everyone listening so from my heart to yours thank you so much from the bottom of my heart and I sense this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship my my friend thank you thanks man thank you man this episode was brought to you by nail at the scale at the world's leading fast growth program for business guys thanks for tuning into unstoppable with me your host Cowan ray and please do not forget to subscribe to our YouTube channel where you get to see all of these interviews in their flesh share this podcast with your friends and drop me a review on iTunes I would love to hear what you guys think and also let you know your comments help make sure that we keep producing killer content just like this and if you'd like to stay up to date with all of my movements upcoming podcasts events and much more please jump onto the website Kirwan rate comment also check us out on all social media on the handle at Kirwan ray thanks for joining us [Music]