Transcript for:
FNAF Lore and

[Music] wow wow wow [Music] down up down [Music] black [Music] [Music] hey hey [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] down down down [Music] down [Music] down down [Music] [Music] wow wow wow [Music] [Music] [Music] [Music] hello internet welcome to Game Theory where today we're doing something a little bit different hello and welcome to chat we are going to be theory crafting live uh as you've all I'm sure have seen Secret of the Mimic came out last week and it has been a wild journey it has reset basically everything we feel we've known about FNAF and so as I finished uh the playthrough along with uh the wonderful Ash from GT Live yesterday night I figured it was time to finally lock in and start theorizing about this game but given the amount that has changed given the revelations that have occurred I also wondered whether it would be a good idea to bring you along for the ride at least to begin with uh we have got a lot of theory potential here and so here at theory we always want to make stuff that you guys want to see and while we have got plenty of other theorists out there who are making a bunch of stuff which is all great and wonderful to see it's going to be really fun for you guys if there are questions you want answered or if there are details that you want to point out and so this is that opportunity this is our time to work together to figure out what the heck is going on in this game it's going to be a wild wild time so uh please if you have questions if you have uh theories of your own if you have little details that you think are worth pointing out and worth theorizing about please let us know in the chat uh let's just see what we have going on right now let's start actually with what what questions do you have what are the key details that you think should be we should start with as we begin theory crafting uh I think it's also important just to you know have the open discussion of there are no wrong answers in brainstorming everything is on the table secret the mimic literally blew my expectations out of the water and me and Ash had many gobsmacked a moment trying to figure out what was going on and being confused so I don't think there's anything that's off limits here i think we can very easily uh keep our head cannons or our previous theories like in a very open hand what what I always like to do when um theorizing is making sure that I am happy to reassess what I've thought before uh there are lots of things where we like to hold on to our beliefs in our theories and sometimes it's good just to be able to go okay with this new information does that change anything what does that reset but it always starts with questions what are the questions that uh take us on a journey of intrigue and interest let's see what have you guys putting up um I'm just going to have a quick scroll through the chat there's a lot happening it's great i'm so glad there are so many of you here uh yeah all good all good i got one for you Tom if you Oh yeah please fish jump in is Edwin still alive that is a good one well first let's write that down ed Oh now you're also going to see my awful handwriting alive question mark so let's think about this so is Edwin still alive when we began um one the fact that Edwin exists yes appreciate that come on there we go that was awful i have assistance off screen and I was just bad at that so appreciate that but hopefully yeah this pen works we love that um so obviously we're all I was like so we were all surprised when Edward started to become a cannon thing in this game you don't know if you've not played Secret the Mimic or read the books Edwin Murray was a character first introduced in the books as the originator of the mimic he was the man that created it and as this game has gone on um it was Edwin Murray's costume manner we were exploring and so Edwin uh was an inventor someone who created um basically a lot of different things he had uh he created recycling was a weird thing we learned uh he also developed uh uh parade floats and a system for for that and of course costumes and mimics we're going to write so let's talk about some of the things he invented um because I think there are some details there we can grab on to so I mean we were also recycling we're just going to go there it's such a wild thing we also decided to do that he invented you know basically anything that happened in the 70s we can probably attribute to Edwin um parade floats apparently were his thing parade floats and of course many costumes and characters which is always fun uh so is he still alive though so again when you get through to I know this is like is Edward alive recycling parade floats this is great this is No honestly this looks insane and it is but this is exactly what theory crafting is about it's literally getting everything we think about on the table and trying to connect the dots where we can so Edwin Murray created all of these things and the big thing of course that he created was the mimic that was the big one and the mimic came in two forms mimic one and mimic two mimic one was his very first one that he made trying to basically create a babysitter for his son David when his wife Fiona died tragically at Foolfest and so he uh needed someone to look after David while he was working and so he made the mimic that would learn to play and be a babysitter for him when he couldn't be this mimic started to uh develop in some way again like the details are slightly fuzzy but it started to mimic what it saw from uh or how it understood Fiona to be uh his wife and so started acting as a secondary mother to David um they then uh decided to upload basically oh yeah that was it again sorry this is all very new and it's all coming in fresh uh David sadly also passes away because Edwin is just a magnet for bad luck and Fiona now as a machine is basically convincing Edwin to try again to try and uh rebuild his son putting him back together as it were and from there they take Fiona's programming make a copy of it to create Mimic 2 which is going to be David however unfortunately the vision of a robot recreating David is too much for Edwin uh and he basically beats the thing up destroying its legs it seems to imply and from there the mimic decides it learns violence and takes its revenge beating up Edwin and blowing up the house uh and it's at that point we learn about that during the parachute ending and it's through that point so I'm just going to write some stuff down mimic two and then beat up beat up legs and that goes to the death question goes back in a circle back to death um so at the end of that tape Edwin feels very uh he's out of breath there's clearly a fire going on he's struggling to breathe he's asking M2 for help and to call uh an ambulance call uh the emergency services and Mimik does not wish to do that and so with Mimik uh obviously not wanting to do that he's like "Oh," he teases him using lines like "Oh I'm busy now go play by yourself i'll I'll play with you later i'll do that stuff later." So um it's a whole thing that they are uh but it is then left ambiguous whether Edwin is dead at that point we have uh Fiona is unaware of Edwin's status there are no cameras there's no way for her mimic one to see in and know whether Edwin is still alive she talks to him as if he is but he's clearly not there but there is no sign of him the room's blown up there's clearly fire damage and some things around that would link to the call but is he alive this is one of those moments that I worry it is purposely left ambiguous it is purposely left in a state where he could come back we've got DLC likely on the way steel World has done DLC for every single game um that they've ever created for FNAF and so I could see a world where they are purposely leaving it open for DLC to uh fill in some of that gap either it's similar to the books uh cuz in the books Edwin comes back to Fazbear Entertainment 40 years later and that's when they're installing the mimic into the pizza place and that causes a bunch of problems and he tries to stop it and dies in the process they could quite easily be reddoing that storyline where 40 years after the fact or whenever security breach is is starting up and taking place uh which actually happens in the DLC of Help Wanted one we could easily they could decide we're going to bring Edwin back and he's going to try and stop it but it will ultimately fail regardless because um the mimic still wants revenge on Edwin still doesn't like the dude for beating him up all those years ago and so that could easily be where they're going to answer some of that is through the DLC potentially as a the next step before we get to uh the sequel to Security Breach and Ruin i could see that happening but at the same time it depends on what purpose that would serve the story because Edwin being alive or dead at this point doesn't really matter to the long story i don't feel like it does because you think about where the story has gone since like because Secret of the Mimic is the prequel of prequels to all of FNAF so since then we've explored the Aftons we've explored Henry a bit we've then gotten into Vanessa and Gregory and Cassie and uh the mimic of course and so there are all these new characters and new stories to focus on there is a world where Ed Edwin comes back and like saves the day but does would that rob something from our new characters would that rob a a really triumphant ending for Cassie or if Gregory and Vanessa are truly free of the mimic's influence would that rob them of a satisfying conclusion so because that's so that's the other thing we have to bear in mind you've got these new characters now who are important to the story now which these things are feeding into and if for Ed like it's one of those questions where sadly there's just not a lot of evidence one way or the other they've left it ambiguous so he could come back if they need him to i'm not sure but he could also just die and then it wouldn't change anything going forward other than we as an audience would understand how to defeat the mimic going forward because even Edwin didn't know how to stop it at the point of the story where he he passes away or potentially disappears so would Edwin know how to stop it or would he just fall victim like he does in the books it's one of those question it's one of those questions it's an interesting one i'm not sure whether there's enough to answer it but what do you guys think is there stuff that you guys uh think is there other evidence that I'm missing to talk about uh Edwin's being alive or dead i think it could go either way and there's some strong stuff for potentially either but I want to know if there's any specific details that you uh can pull from cuz this is the point this is the great thing we can be collaborative here we can work together into the spring yeah okay so a lot a lot of other questions edwin is Oh oh I see that Gibby Holler's Homestead edwin is old man consequences hello Gibby great for you to join us this thought actually occurred to me today is Edwin actually old man consequences so I think that opens a can of worms but it's an interesting thought um where do we go old man consequences cuz I mean he is the original consequence thank you more pens more colors hurrah he is the original man of consequence he literally created his own he literally created his own demise um and with that he you know face the consequence of election and potentially passes away or at least is destroyed in some factor he is he would fit old man consequences now Old Man Consequences only appears very deep in the code of these games of FNAF World and in Ultimate Custom Knights so that would and it's all 8bit it's all that very very um destroyed uh not destroyed what's the word I'm looking for very deep in things and so I guess it would make sense because and this opens up it opens up a bigger can of worms here which actually I'm going to I'm going to flip for because there's a bigger can of worms here which I thought about earlier and I think it is important for us to talk about if we want to talk about Edwin being old man consequences is was there ever possession And apologies if I spell things wrong cuz I am not very good at it oh I have lost all signal to chat chat has disappeared from me appreciate you um so was there a possession or was it all mimic was it oops all mimic the entire time because that game Ultimate Custom Knight UCN is all about the This game is all about the vengeful spirit taking its revenge whoever you believe that to be uh I typically tend to believe it is Cassidy and that is who um Ultimate Custom Knight is about which meeting old man consequences you go doesn't strictly make sense for Cassidy but at the same time it's meant to be a mysterious figure just an old wise man who's kind of been there done that you know leave the demon to his demons edwin also has beef with Afton i'm trying to figure out how I break this up and write this down in a way that makes some kind of sense um we'll go back to green for Edwin so Edwin we know has beef with Afton i know those things don't mean that but it does for me edwin is not Afton but he also has beef with Afton and so the whole line about leave his demons to leave the demon to his demons makes a lot of sense coming from Edwin if it's in the code if he's deep in the code then Edwin because Edwin built everything and most people when they're like hacking or hijacking will leave a digital signature so even sometimes we saw it with GGY ggy literally left a signature um for the uh for people to read reading GGY literally in uh the animatronic code so it wouldn't be surprising for Edwin to have put some kind of digital signature in for him himself into the animatronics and into his code and his creations that may because it is Edwin and he was messing with the mimic and messing with like bringing Fiona and David back could have been something that's a little more than just like haha I left my initials in there that could be really interesting as an idea yeah and so Old Man Consequences is literally lying in the code waiting for people to uh waiting for spirits or people or potentially the mimic to come in and say "Hey leave the demon to his demons let AM rot it's fine let's just be at peace it's kind of his last chance." And it raises the interesting question of was there ever was the ventral spirit in the ultimate customer about spirits or is it different facets of the mimic was the mimic again its program splitting in and the possession we see is actually more to do with uh the mimic learning different facets learning about different children in the p in the pizzeras and copying people's perspective and maybe mimicking Afton in the early murders or maybe we saw the mimic putting uh animatronics into oh not animatronics sorry putting people into costumes because it saw people climbing coming into costume so is it just an extension of that that would make a lot of sense for Edwin to then be in the depths of Ultimate Custom Knight as like part of the code and now I've just had a thought cuz Ultimate Custom Knight and welcome to my brain ultimate Custom Knight is a game all of the first five the first seven games are games uh we know that for sure for FNAF 1 to four because of the story Help Wanted in the books help Wanted the game tells us that like oh the previous like games we've seen are are about games uh Peter Simulator is actually mentioned I forget is it the Monty within i think it's the Monty within one of the stories it is specific Peter Reim is specifically mentioned as a game which I think is really interesting they show the fun times when they're talking about the games in uh Help Wanted the game so I think there's and so if it is a an in universe game if Ultimate Custom Night is part of that as an in universe game there would be code buried in it which maybe uses mimic technology and has and so therefore would have Edwin's signature coming through and therefore Old Man Consequences sits at the bottom of Ultimate Custom Night so Edwin might be physically dead but there's an element there might be an element of him that lives on that's really interesting really really interesting okay that's really good that's fascinating i'm seeing a lot of people Oh my customer is Aftton is it not it is it is Aftton's torture but again we're talking about the we're talking about like in universe they talk about the games prior to Help Wanted as being games uh they tape girl tells us that they are um trying to make light of what happened which means that some of them might be canon some of them might be less cannon or at least not not cannon that's probably the wrong word because that's going to cause a lot of confusion what I mean is that some of these stories might be one for one exactly as the stories are being told in games but there also could be some differences some changes that are to fictionalize the story i.e like the idea of spirits versus uh machine uh for the murders at Freddy's or things like that these are the kinds of open issues that are really interesting to talk about and so Ultimate Custom Night yes is about Afton and his eternal torture but if it's a game it's about the it's in the universe it's the fictionalized version of like what they kind of expect the hell that Afton is living in versus actually being the hell that actual Afton lived in it's just something that I think is interesting to to weigh up and something I will definitely think more about that's fascinating right what other questions are there oh we got some questions going on oh there's an Ash hi Ash oh hey y'all hope y'all are doing well um I've been reading the chat and I've seen a plethora of things appreciate it my my first one that I have here in a subtle nod to God David which has appeared quite a few i've seen God David what is God David about so instead of instead of going into that head first that's fair let us let us funnel our way into it um and let's talk about I think a lot of people are curious about the possible connections similarities or even you know misunderstandings about the identities of David as he relates to the crying child and even potentially Gregory what can we talk about about that oh you went for a big one that's a big one chat of course of course uh actually it's it's interesting this one has been going around my head all day basically since we found the purple telephone in um for the Moon.exe game and it actually kind of relates to this what we've already been talking about which is interesting that idea of the FNAF 1 to6 or FNAF 1 to 7 even being games in the universe and so and I I'm trying to rally my thoughts here because the question I would have is it kind of comes down to what ending we think is canon which let's let's go and do that let's talk about these endings because trust me this does relate to this question um I've been thinking about it a lot probably too much um what ending we're writing it down what ending so you've got three endings we've got the bad ending which is when we give the data driver the data driver goes to Fiona/Mimic we've got the uh parachute ending which I don't know a parachute ending which is the mimic still gets the data driver or you've got the secret ending which is when we end up in David's bedroom and we find the mimic in the closet kind of being David but glitching out because the whole point in this is that like I said earlier the mimic 2 is supposed to be David a recreation of David but sadly because Edwin got mad and raged it means that he learned violence and is glitching out and isn't perfect what Fiona is trying to do is she wants to put her family back together which doesn't that sound familiar she wants to fix this David bot and turn David into uh turn the mimic 2 into the perfect David the perfect David replica so their family can be together again so we've got David mimic so the discussions that are and thought processes that are happening is the connections with David that we have right now is that David both Davids are called David so it was recently theorized by Hyperdroid and we did a co a theory covering it and it seemed we we felt it was a really strong case to be made that crying child CC crying child equals David Afton and so naturally you've got David Murray and David Afton two very very very close connections there the bedroom feels the same so we've got same name Same name same bedroom same toys and what else what else is similar about these two um but those are some of the early connections or at least the initial ones that we that I made uh especially on stream we talked about it uh a little bit as well and with that it begs the question are these two the same thing and if this ending is the true ending then there is a world where that could be true because you would have the mimic being fixed and there was a message we got from the mail logs the group chat that told us about Afton buying or acquiring MCM and all of its IP and even the land on which it stood including the house up on the hill oh that was it the house same house just generally it's the same house on a hill and so if Aftton bought the house where the mimic David mimic ends up at the end sleeping in a bed then Afton would have every right to pick up that character that mimic and go "Huh you're interesting i want to figure out how you work." Which is why we see uh let's get some red in here which why we see him uh observing the mimic he's trying to figure out how it works he's using nightmares to add a stimuli to see ah what what changes with this charact like with this mimic how well does it learn how does it learn let's figure something out he would have the ability to like you know it fit and then it fits in with the whole I will put you back together thing it's not necessarily him wanting to put his son back together but this whole um but it's a robot it's literally the mimic too and so he would want to put put together it would also I could see it with that i could see it explaining why he feels so aloof as like a father he's just talking to it for a walkie-talkie like there's no emotional attachment there right because he's just um it's a robot uh which then brings to mind oh gosh I can't believe that's the connection I'm making um we then have the baby isn't mine the whole thing from uh the immortal and the restless the vampire in a purple suit talking to his wife saying "The baby isn't mine." And we've always wondered is a character adopted is that Michael is that Elizabeth is that the crying child David it now feels like it would be it now feels like it would be that would where that makes sense it's literally him telling his wife "Hey the baby's not mine." Like this isn't like a kid I had with another another woman this is a robot kid that I found in the thing that I bought um so that is interesting that is interesting so that would be the connections to David uh which is yeah a lot to think about thanks chat for that question that's that's a big one there's still some more because the other factor is I think like I there's something about this which is feeling a little weird to me i can't quite figure out what it is um probably that there are some small things where it's like yeah he's observing him and there's nightmare animatronics and things like that but we specifically while the books aren't cannon they are useful for filling in certain blanks in the story and we got uh dittohobia as a story which basically told us that it's hallucinogenic gas that is used and in a recent theory we talked about the gas that is like all around the place in system location and in security breach and for like that gas isn't going to have an effect on a mimic neither are sound illusion discs they specifically don't work oh they do but they don't no in the trilogy they have to be adjusted to work on the robots for the frequency normally they they don't in the same way and so that would be weird to use on the mimic which is not going to have any effect um and and this is what I mean about there being potential options because if like any of the either of these two are cannon there's a world where you have to discuss whether David Afton as a character is even real earlier I said about the games being games within the game because Scott couldn't be you know confusing enough as it was but the games within the game would allow Fazbear essentially rewriting history and we saw that throughout the actual playthrough the whole point is them rewriting the history and like removing Edwin from the equation like and we we so all of these characters that are Fazbear characters yeah Fazbear later owned them but it's kind of re re like wiping away the whole idea that Edwin made them to begin with um and there's a lot of parallels between Edwin's story oh light went out well then that's fine it's Oh good um and so with those sorts of elements you go are they taking the real story i.e edwin's story about his kid that he wanted to build and put back together and rebuild his family instead of and putting it in the game universe in their fictionalized version of the real stories on Afton to kind of keep it in house to keep it within the Fazbear brand because they are reworking through their public image and their stuff like that it's just and again I don't love that as an idea it feels a little odd but it's an interesting It is an interesting concept i think the main thing that's making me lean towards one of these two outside of that wild sort of speculation that I just talked about is the is is the fact that the mimic needs to end up underground it needs to end up still broken so not fixed like it is in the David ending but it needs to end up being cemented underground for the Pizza Plex to be built on top because that's a big part of this is that the the Pizza Plex seems to be built on top of MCM And therefore if all of that cuz we see all the we saw the scoop we saw the costumes in the wooden boxes in the room where we find the mimic in ruin if we have that then at the same time the mimic needs to be locked in that same room but right now in all these endings the mimic has escaped in some way the only thing that helps me lean towards these two is that the mimic is still broken like we see it at the end at the end of Ruin where it still is trying to attack it's still being violent they're still working together um mimic one and mimic 2 whereas in this ending everything's fixed and fine which means we have to insert we would have to insert more story to figure out why it suddenly became evil again um and partly that's going to end up on Steel Wool what is there we talked about DLC it's like where is their DLC going to go is their DLC going to be showing us the mimic escaping in these and then ending up backsealed underground to set up a sequel to Ruin and like what we saw in Security Breach is it going to be a follow- on from this where we then see the program Fiona's program fail and the mimic learn violence again or is it going to be something else entirely that's going to take it in a brand new direction which allows them to like refill in the gaps between secret of the mimic and security breach where again if FNAF 1 to like four to seven are potenti are in universe games like how wanted seems to suggest is there a world where they're essentially going to retell the story as it actually is but with the mimic involved and therefore the mimic needs to be released because the mimic needs to get sealed underground later that was a lot thank you for that question that is a wild one and it's that's going to be a lot to think about there's a lot of connections between these two but yeah basically the connection between David and David is it's one of I see it as one of two things it is either the literal they are literally the same character based on the secret ending or it is meant to be FNA Fazbear's taking of the real David Mimic storyline and putting it into the in universe games that they made and putting it onto Afton story line because there are a lot of parallels not just that but I need to think about that some more what else we got i've lost chat by the way but it's all good okay cool so pick one or pick two oh uh pick men uh sorry uh I'll two why not oh okay he chose the wild one oh great here we go here we go so this was a rather specific question in chat but I feel like with the entire timeline really being called into question and with the recurring statement of Tom's that the games are games the games are games they keep telling us this there was a response to that asking if the games are games let's talk those original core games which are games yep the games which are games yep games are games is it possible with the connections between like David Crying Child all that that FNAF 4 and those adjacent games were used to potentially train the mimic oh 100% 100% so uh games used to train mimic you got to write this stuff down got to write it down thank you chat for that question that is that's a good one but yeah I I think this is almost certain at this point honestly we've talked about it in previous theories but the idea is that in Help Wanted which is when we find out the games are games Help Wanted we get told about some circuit boards that are we get about some circuit boards that uh contain some programming which will help them shortcut the development process now even just that phrase about shortcutting development the whole selling point of the mimic is it can fit into any costume and do um take on any character so it can learn a bunch of routines rather than just learning a single routine like a normal programmed animatronic and so they want that those circuits scanned and put into the game in order that they can shortcut the because they're recreating the games right in VR like it's an in universe VR game that they're making during Help Wanted and so they want to go hey like take this this software these things that have taught us uh that that have been shown to like know Freddy's routine know Bonnie's routine shove that into the game and it will shortcut the fact that you don't need to program that in anymore which is so no more programming no more programming running out of room ah um circuit boards no more uh shortcut development no more programming so the only thing that we know can do that is the mimic and from scanning in said software and said circuit boards we then end up with the wonderful one and only Oh no glitch trap who we call that because he looks like Springtrap but is glitchy um you know that I think it's important to remember that we often these names are often fan names that we have come up with based on the information we have but as time has gone on and we learned about the mimic one and mimic 2 programs in the in the books we started to believe that Glitch Trap was the mimic specifically we believed it to be mimic one which is the Fiona program that we now know and so part of it is the but even that you know that could be questionable there's some options here um because again we want to keep things open as we theorize but we believed it to be the mimic program in some form from here it is basically then being fed all this data like look at these old games look at the games that have been made FNAFs 1 to 7 and help recreate these for our VR game so they use the mimic to recreate the VR games which means the mimic is being exposed to the stories that we were all exposed to the purple guy killer who abandoned his son whose son got bit whose other son got scooped out by Funtime animatronics all of these characters and deaths and violence and being shoved into animatronic suits all of that was fed to the mimic in order to make Help Wanted happen the game and therefore the thing that's really interesting just about this game in general is that the mimic here isn't stagnant the mimic is going to evolve be good if I spelled evolve with the correct word first evolve and change it's Gosh my handwriting i apologize this is again welcome to theory crafting where handwriting gets awful um but it is going to evolve and change as time goes on so while right now we're looking at this with fresh eyes of Secret of the Mimic and going "Oh mimic one equals Fiona mimic 2 equals David with Edwin's violence." The more the mimic is exposed to the more it's going to take on uh personalities of other things and characters that it is exposed to be that simple animatronic characters or be that purple murderers which is why it takes on that form it takes on the form of glitch trap because and because that is the new character or one of the new characters it's been exposed to it's been exposed to Afton goes "Oh taking on the form of a of a yellow rabbit." And so I think it is almost certain that the games were accidentally used to train the mimic but I think that's why we're seeing uh in the post-it room for example we see the Afton family sat around and we see all five members of the Afton family now in the game in the the games that are games as we keep talking about they are the aft it's all about putting the Afton family back together we have always talked about well that's why Vanessa is there because she looks like Elizabeth gregory looks like the crying child like these sorts of factors are let's bring the family back together that's what the mimic is trying to do based on its training on Glitch Trap and all of his mer and like Afton and all of his stuff but that original push that original idea of let's put the family back together came from Fiona all the way back in Secret of the Mimic it's just that as it started to get trained with these things its purpose has gotten muddied or could have been muddied because it's going to evolve and keep adapting so it's now still pushing to put the family back together but it's not clear which family it's now trying to put together and even it's confused i think in the post-it room there's a whole there's like one of the post-its the binary talks about like what am I and uh someone found in the moon section I saw it on Twitter today in the moon section um down in secret of the mimic there's a like a poster or a note that talks about uh memory error so it's written from like the perspective of a mimic and it basically talks about essentially waking up and being a happy family but having no kind of memory before that bit which sounds like a robot that's come to life having never experienced what uh like having no memories because it's literally just been shoved into this moment and here's like who you are and your character with no backstory which would tie into the mimic's confusion as to like who am I what am I as a character am I David Afton am I uh David Murray who who do I belong to and so I think it was basically so in in short I think that that is true i think the games were used to train the mimic accidentally but by doing that it has caused the mess of security breach and what we see when um it's rebuilding the Afton family plus we've got bits of Fiona and like trying to still connect with the mimic downstairs which is what we're kind of seeing here and trying to fix that it's interesting and again also ties into that whole thing of were the stories it fed completely we all good it's all good it's fine offscreen things um all part of it but um it comes down to that question of again are the games totally fictionalized to the point where the character like so Glitch Trap and the Mimic were being fed all this information but that was fictionalized and so that's why it's confused because the stories feel similar in a number of ways um and so it's like mixing the ideas or is it just that the Aftons and the and the Murray's had a lot of similarities in the way they raised family the way they did stuff together and so it was fed on the uh slightly altered but mostly true stories it's just an interesting way to look at it you guys good yeah so so we saw some chats that were so good I fell over and knocked over like several well well hit me hit me with them all right so I've been writing all of that down i am partially covered in coffee and pistachio milk oh no oh no but it's because y'all are doing so well all right so we have some additional things for you okay uh let's start at top level and we'll keep on we'll keep on going and then you'll you'll see the question that maybe uh fall over the desk so I think a big one that I've seen a whole lot is the significance of the number 4625 and what the heck that means also just want to flag for you Tom uh if the chat disappears it's cuz you put the mouse on the ground and you're letting the computer fall asleep ah that's what that is okay good to know just hiding it from yourself it's all good i am I am my own worst enemy which feels very fitting um cuz I did this to myself um so sorry repeat that question that was uh what is the significance of 465 4625 writing it down 4625 so for those of you who don't know this number first showed up during Help Wanted 2's uh mini DLC update that happened to tease Jackie and Secret of the Mimic it was the code that was used to uh activate the mixes it was on like the uh letter box out front of MCM and was used to activate mixes as mixes was driven away in this game it became a recurring number for certain codes i believe it showed up in date form as well like we all thought originally it was teasing when the game was going to come out apparently not 46 so it could be a date right steel are American so it's going to be April 6th 2025 but so like you go you know April cuz you guys are strange and do the date the month first which I have to keep reminding myself so like it could be April 6th 2025 is that trying to tell us like when the game the future games take place uh were we wrong about the timeline could it be that literal it's an option i'm trying to remember specific places where this I remember it showing up a lot and being very confused by it and whether it's now just a number that steel wool are using to I don't know figure like using just to like troll people uh oh I saw someone in chat remind me yes so it was the frequency that Edwin found Fiona which sounds confusing but it's because he is working on the mimic and he can hear he occasionally feels like he's hearing Fiona's voice so he's like retuning the radio frequency and when he does that there's the odd occasion he can hear Fiona which is the mimic like talking to him right as Fiona so there's that so there's that instance of it uh 46 uh yeah 4,000 that's also the number of tasks for Dolly there's a number of times this shows up i think it's a code on one of the walls competed to the full fest maybe everything started on April yeah the other option is Yeah I mean that is also true i see this I'm seeing this a lot which was it could be 1925 which would be super early but we did talk about that in our very very OG timeline we talked about Fred Bear's singing show and how Fredbear's singing show um had a very 1930s 1940s uh pie artistic style and so whether it was originally designed to be like an actual singing bear show that happened in the 1930s people singing people uh like or the bear you know would get up and sing in the way that old musical animal performances would work uh not which is not great if you look at the history of the circus it's not it's not great but it could have been like was that the very start of Fazbear possibly it's one of those ones where the more and more stuff like Fredbear's singing show we now have a record for uh which comes from their favorite restaurant David the Mimic uh Edwin the favorite diner the favorite place they would go is Fredbear's family diner and there was a record for Fredbear's singing show and so it is still a modern thing doesn't mean it can't be older but it feels less and less likely that they're going to go back that far oh that's a good point i just saw that come through thank you thank you chat that is interesting because one of our big discoveries throughout this we found a room which had Edwin and um Fiona as portraits and then right above the main door was another man who we'd never seen before and later on we discovered that there is Mr murray Senior could this be this 1925 date be when Mr murray Senior founded MCM could that be the actual start of things with early costumes early designs sorry I'm just keeping up with chat to try and make sure that I am catching what people are saying but yeah the idea that Murray founded it then i mean there's nothing to say he couldn't he dies it's implied that he Yeah he No he does die because it says he's gone so Mr murray Sior dies at some point we don't really know the dates of those audio recordings there's a bunch of audio recordings that work together to like show Edwin taking over the factory and doing all of that now it dies like mid 1970s like the the the stunks go down very very badly but they start to skyrocket because of Edwin's inventions i think the late '60s early '7s if I remember the graph correctly so he had to have died around then which means he would have been like could have been in his 80s could have been an early death in his 60s but either way he'd have been around during then i guess the question is what would be the benefit of it being then how did Murray Senior die we don't know it just kind of says I can't believe he's gone and he's left everything to me so it's an interesting idea i like I like this and again it ties back to Fredbear's singing show and maybe those businesses do go back really far because uh Edwin when Edwin starts to go more into madness and starts to talk really heavily about like oh um they're going to betray you there's a leak and there's all these things he starts to get into kind of madness and he to he says very very specifically don't I think it's don't trust them dad was right and so it feels like because again a lot of the betrayals in this moment while there are people in the company that are leaving there's a lot of emphasis put on Edwin's relationship to Fazbear and so does his dad know Fazbear do both companies go all that way back maybe it's an interesting idea the idea the thought that they they all go that way back so he or at least even if Fazbear is slightly later 30s 40s 50s Edwin knows or Edwin's father at least knows of Fazbear and is like "Hey don't trust them they're snakes." Which is fascinating that the companies could go that far back together don't trust them dad was right yeah it's fascinating as an idea that they go so far back and again it's hard to know exactly what Edwin did to change the business because he's like "Oh let's put some of my designs forward let's uh develop these crazy inventions and crazy ideas uh to shift the company and rebrand." So it's hard to know what they did prior to did they only do costumes before that in which case is that like the origin of the glitch trap costume was actually one of his dad's original designs like all the way back maybe it's interesting but this number just going back to this number this number keeps repeating but I can't tell at this point if it's an Easter egg cuz it's like Dolly's tasks Mar's costume like Mar's potentially founded when he did that if it's 1925 uh it's the frequency which Edwin finds Fiona in it's a secret code to get into one of the back rooms it feels at this like again I wonder if it's sometimes it's just developers trolling and I do wonder whether Steel is trolling us because we put so much emphasis on this one code being oh this is the release date this is an important thing i know John did an incredible theory breaking down what that number is and so I don't know if it's just them going to go we're going to shove this code in so many places as an Easter egg but then it could be an Easter egg that has a meaning deeper down one of these is right but the others are just references to that one thing it's interesting ash you got another one for me i sure do and I'm going to stand a healthy distance away from any kind of liquid on the tech desk that that that's probably wise all right cool so another one I'm seeing quite a lot that I want to make sure gets addressed is uh the matter of Fiona and Fiona being mixes or not being mixes yeah this one yeah this one is so confusing so I think let's So Fiona thank you for these questions chat these are great this is great discussion this is what I wanted this to be is literally just you get to see inside my brain a little bit and I get to see inside your brain and you get to share some cool stuff with me this is great thank you so Fiona equals mixes so we did learn what mixes stands for in this game mixes stands for if I remember correctly mechanical X form experimental [Music] storage that is what mixes stands for now the mixes in the game is part of the cradle.exe so cradle.exe exe is the program that we load which Fiona says in one of the uh group chats that we get there is a message between but in that's the title is in binary so it's implying it's Fiona in the digital mimic one Fiona and she basically says hey something's gone wrong with M2 it's become violent we need to fix it run the cradle.exe exe which will subdue it and fix the problem which the cradle.exe is mixes it's this program when you open the the the message this is what or you open the program this is the message that comes up where this gets confusing and where Fiona's part in it comes in is because the mix's machine is the same one we see Uh it'd be good if I could spell fiona it's writing in numbers it's hard but Fiona as a robot is in the same machine that Mixes is in the M1 program has access to a bunch of other parts of the facility but like cuz it's implied that the Fiona is playing Dispatch so the voice of dispatch is actually M1 i.e fiona mimicking that voice in order to get us to do what she needs uh and then when we basically like start ruining her plan she then goes "Fine come in let's talk." And so she becomes that's where we are revealed to the Fiona and the mimic one program now for me the thing that's going around my brain and has been since Ruin is in Ruin we got two this pen we got two mimics you have little helpy and you have what I believe the fans call the grim which is mimic as Gregory um I probably spelled that wrong it's fine um and so you've got both of them and they talk to one another you have the helpy going like "Oh I've fixed um don't worry they're not going to bother you anymore i fixed it." And then Gregory which is the mimic underground goes "Yeah with my help." So you have two mimics communicating to one another which is interesting and that would speak to me you've got Helpy the program that has control of the facility is actually Fiona and then you've got Grimmik who is M2 the guy underground the physical endoskeleton animatronic cuz it's only able to talk that's only able to talk to you because you have a walkie-talkie so you have these two and they're fighting but they're working together at the end of the day Helpy is trying to help you get to the mimic underground and the reason it's doing that is because Fiona wants to be reunited with her family and wants to fix M2 that's what she wants to do that is her goal and so she needs Cassie to go down into the basement and set M2 free in order that Fiona can fix it mixes on the other hand does not want that mimic does not want fix and free i'm going to write that down because Mixes does not want that mixes does not want M2 to be free it is specifically doing everything it can to stop you from freeing it it is a safety precaution which is what Cradle is designed for so but it's in the same computer this this see this is the stuff where things start to go wild and start to get a little bit crazy uh in theory land because you've essentially got two versions of Fiona with two opposite goals so and but the mixes mixes is the cradle.exe it's not the glitched one that we use to fix uh mimic 2 in the secret ending it's purely what we do at the end of the parachute ending to try and get things to um to progress and to like stop the mimic which doesn't really seem to work so we also see someone picks up mixes at the in the Help Wanted 2 uh one of the Help Wanted 2 like DLC endings someone picks up mixes and drives off with it possibly to try and bring it to security breach unless Security Breach is built on top of that which it does seem like it is which is slightly confusing but did what i wonder So so again remember open minds as we think these things through because what if we've all had the thought that oh it was Gregory who and uh Vanessa because their stuff is down in the basement gregory's bag is down in the basement they put mixes there to stop Mimic which is entirely possible but what if they someone it was whoever actually locked the mimic down there because again her machine is in a different location to where the mimic is in ruin and if you think about the rooms maybe I would need to map out the entirety of Secret of the Mimik because you have her stuff is in like the FNAF one location underground you then run through a bunch of ca you then you end up in the room with the costumes which don't seem like they're connected in secret the mimic then you run through a bunch of corridors and then you end up at the scoop so is she in the same place or was she moved if she was moved did whoever bring Mixes in to try and stop the mimic actually end up bringing M1 Helpy Glitch Trap into the system i don't think so because I think that's what Help wanted is about is about um Glitch Trap M1 Fiona entering into Fazbear systems it could be that there's like uh split entity split personality that kind of vibe because Mix's mixes is a bunny which is very often coded like it's a program that is designed to stop the mimic it's a bunny which is very strange so it feels like it maybe was altered maybe that's part of it maybe Greg cuz the system it doesn't work it doesn't solve the mimic problem at the end of the parachute ending so maybe it's Gregory maybe it's Gregory does Gregory once he's free of Glitch Trap alter Cradle to actually try and stop it because of his influence under Glitch Trap where he is Dr rabbit in the books you know he has a rabbit connection and so maybe he turns it into the mixes we now know it was originally Fiona and he uses Fiona's hardware because it was the same hardware as where Cradle was first created and so like there's that but he altered it maybe h interesting that's a tough one it is a very confusing detail cuz Fiona is not directly the cradle.exe but she is in the same computer i need to go back and look at the computer in ruin because I don't think it has this written on it i don't think it has Fiona's name written on it i think it has mixes written on it which implies someone's altered it or rebuilt it or done one slightly differently it's interesting and that's the fun of theorizing you don't always solve everything in the immediate otherwise we'd have theories out tomorrow it's going to take a few weeks so let's let's leave let's put a pin in that one that's a great question though chat thank you so much that's great um Ash you got what time is it oh we're doing all right okay maybe time for one or two more yeah I think we got a couple lined up for you let's go so let's zoom out a little bit from this question yeah we're getting very very granular so it's good to reframe yeah so chat is yearning yearning yearning to know what exactly did Afton and Henry Emily invent or make like actually right that was what a lot of my writing down notes were during our stream to be fair what did they do what do so let's Henry I don't know there's probably an in there I don't know um Afton what did they actually invent so again there's some nuance to this question again depending on how how much we want to take the games as pure fiction or as maybe semi loose alternatives to reality cuz if they're pure fiction then we basically have no idea which sucks because if 7 doesn't exist then we basically have no representation of like Afton or anybody in the games um out but beyond that point which kind of sucks um the big one that I know everyone's talking around and it has been a point of discussion is spring locks did Henry create the spring locks it is a thing that has been attributed to him for a very long time we have that line in FNAF 6 that says um trapped in prisons of my making i.e he made the animatronics uh I don't believe in the games it's mentioned i believe but I I may be wrong and feel free in chat to let me know if there is somewhere else in the games where this is referenced i believe his invention of spring locks is a book reference i remember I I've been trying to brush up on some of my book knowledge cuz there's so much uh it is referenced in the silver eyes uh so in the silver eyes it mentions that he creates the spring lock or Afton specifically says "Oh that was a Henry invention that was something he made." Um and so that's kind of why we attribute that to him so often then we get to this game and there are a bunch of Springlock costumes and not only that but he says Edwin has notes that says like "I I got the change orders from hen last night this doesn't make any sense why would they change at the last minute just sh like hire teenagers to to wear the spring suits like we always do which you know talks shows that there's a rel one there's a relationship between Edwin and Henry like though these two clearly are pals these two are pals and so they because he calls him hen which means that there's like a a friendship or at least a more casual relationship than oh Mr afton or William like full name it's like no this is Hen this is my buddy Hen a fellow which implies like again some level of like fellow creative fellow inventor we get on we understand each other but if Edwin but Edwin created a bunch of spring locks so did Henry actually invent the spring locks in the games the one detail that I think has to be pointed out is there's a message from Edwin that says something along the lines of um the new designs for the spring locks are going well even with the water damage so Edwin's I'm just going to go down here for Edwin edwin spring locks can survive water damage he still says there are other quirks which we don't know what those are but it specifically says even with the water damage they're working which implies the fact that he says even with is implying that there were spring locks before that did suffer when there was water damage i.e the ones that Henry made cuz Henry's ones are the ones that had the issue with water at least as far as we know it's his spring locks that have the water issue with sweat and things like that so there is a world where Henry did create spring locks and Edwin was the one that like improved them or helped patent the design or maybe worked in tandem with Henry to get spring locks made because again all of the things that are in his the reason it's been such a question is because everything in Edwin's workshop is for sale rent or sale or sale which means he has to have ownership over everything that's in there and most of what is in there are spring locks all these spring locks uh belong to Edwin so DT have like a contractual partnership with Fazbear where it's like hey I scratch your back you scratch mine like you invented the spring locks let me improve them and then I get to use them in some of my creations we I will make continue making stuff for you was it a PR quid proquo like that or did Edwin really invent them and then just rented them out to Fazbear and this was just a future design that he made where it got better because I understand they're wanting to make sure Henry actually did invent things um like I want Henry to actually have some importance in the franchise and so they did change at the last minute to going "Hey we're changing the work order no more spring locks." Like just because he said "Just get the kids to do the spring locks everyone." But they he asked for a change which implies that they never did the change or they No they never did the change ever it implies that yeah they were wanting to move away from the spring locks but may but that they didn't at the time pick up his order of the new spring locks they were still operating with the old spring locks cuz the ones we find a spring bunny and a gold Freddy down in the basement are which are seem to be Edwin's new design are those the ones they ended up using once they acquired everything they take those and put those in the diner and that's what like caused the bite of 83 is that what that is that what the weird glitches or the weird quirks that Edwin talks about cuz they've got weird weird quirks does that equal 83 maybe because they pick those ones up later but the water damage but yeah that one line about him saying these ones resist water damage does imply there were ones before it's just whether Henry invented those because again as far as I'm aware the only reference we get to him making spring rocks is in the books which is a different continuity so there's that i've seen a couple questions about uh the puppet proper and whether or not that's still Henry adjacent the puppet that's a good one that is a good one the puppet so the only reference to the puppet there are only two references I could spot in Secret of the Mimic one was is Jackie Jackie has a windup music box and said music box plays the same grandfather clock theme that the puppet does so Jackie is the prevolution of the puppet but the only other reference to the puppet is we get um there are designs that are redacted in the very f one of the very final computers in the parachute ending and it just says redacted it basically just says redacted puppet designs we don't know whether those are puppets as in um the puppets that Fiona made so like alternate puppets for like Foxy and things like that or whether it is the puppet so depends on what you define by invent because clearly there is basis in Jackie clearly Henry had inspiration taken from Jackie the idea of it being a thing that pops out of a box the idea that it plays the grandfather clock theme those things are Jackie things and so the puppet is an evolution of that does it mean like Henry absolutely could have made um the puppet as we know it today security puppet to protect Charlie in FNAF 6 as we saw but its design originates here and if the redacted puppet designs are Edwin and are or on that computer then they belong to Edwin and when or they originally belong to Edwin again contract law is funny and they clearly acquired everything that he owned and created so it would be Fazbear it would be rightfully theirs to use but they also poached a bunch of people beforehand which meant the business went under so they kind of like forced the buyout to happen um so and like and people I've seen people talk about the one that ends up being assessed by Charlie was probably Henry's design and that's the thing Edwin dies and or disappears and so once we leave Secret of the Mimic any designs and new characters or versions of designs are coming from Fazbear they're coming from these two and so the puppet is essentially a Henry design depending on if we ever find out what this is because if if Edwin at least designed the initial version of the puppet then it's just Fazbear doing what they do with Chica and Foxy and Freddy and all these characters and remaking them into new versions of those characters um we saw how uh even Edwin was going "Why are they changing the designs these new ones are so creepy i like Fiona's designs and they can't make me change them well eventually Fazbe got a hold of them and decided to change them anyway so it might be that like again Jackie is Edwin's design and they were like we're going to change it to this creepy puppet thing and Edwin didn't want to do that or wasn't keen on that but obviously he died disappeared and they decided to own everything so that's a thing any other Henryisms that people are shouting out or if not we can move over to like Aftton chat here's your chance not seeing many which is fine we can move happily over to Afton because Afton did zilch no Afton what did Afton do realistically Afton really the only thing we know is that he did the fun times fun times were Afton robotics and they are very very different to any other technology they are very different from the mimic they are very different from Henry's spring locks or endos however you want to look at those they are different they are full of wires and all those things and it seems like those are the only only things that after we can truly attribute to Afton um Afton Robotics also made things like the the scoop and some of the distraction boxes i think Henry made uh Lefty so that's something Henry did make his lefty um to trap the puppet uh he made sound illusion discs depends on how you if you think those are cannon anymore i thought they were for a long time and it felt like they were going to be but the challenge is that the sound illusion discs we are with FNAF 4 and FNAF 4 the books then entire sound illusion discs were real in the books but then they also said "Oh by the way FNAF 4 is hallucinogenic gas." So hard to say is the answer but if they are cannon then they definitely are an Aftton invention we'll put those in there in in parentheses sound illusion discs um and so yeah it's a tricky one to kind of know like I'm trying to think blueprints because it's obviously like Mr afton let's talk about your your designs but it's literally the fun times because again we don't spend that much time with Afton and his inventions outside of in the Silver Trilogy and outside of Sister Location Ultimate Custom Knight those worlds right and him already being dead as um Springtrap so and after again in the books and in the early parts of the game he was always described as the businessman he was the brains of the operation we see that in uh Secret of the Mimic he's the one that's poaching other people it's not very businessman like uh respectful but he is a businessman and he is poaching people and offering them more franchises and he's buying the land that Edwin Murray stands on he's the businessman he was never really supposed to be this person um but he ends up kind of becoming very jealous of Henry again this is where like the silver eyes is a fascinating series of books because we really get characterization for both uh uh Henry and William and both of them really we find that Afton is a businessman but he also like worships Henry and his animatronic genius he essentially is just like he he's in awe because Henry can make the spark of life that he can't create even though he's invented the fun times he still can't mirror what Henry did um and that's always a fascinating thing because he he was really just the businessman but he became so jealous of Henry that he wanted to be able to do it himself making the fun times Circus Babies Pizza World it flops kills his daughter is a whole thing so this is where Secret of the Mimic is rubbing a lot of people the wrong way and it's why we had so many shocked reactions over on GT Live because you look at this and every outside of the fun times and maybe the spring locks you're looking at it and going Edwin made most of these things or at least was the originator of the idea which kind is kind of weird and kind of sucks but also it's where it leads into it goes back to the idea we were talking about about the games being games because outside of those we don't know much about Edwin about Henry or Aptton and so it makes sense that in those games it leans into the idea of this is Fazbear rewriting history to make light of the incidents that happened but they're also trying to rewrite history to remove Edwin from the picture and going "It was always Fazbear all along we're going to impose uh this little family unit and the idea of putting all back together onto Afton we're going to make the murders this evil CEO we had that's no longer with us because it allows us to like kind of shove it all under the rug rather than hey by the way it was a killer animatronic that we kind of still have under our possession whoopsie um we can shove it all there we can make Henry this redeemable character who was like the creative genius behind everything to attribute some of the more creative ideas to him and so it could have been them entirely rewriting history in order to hide the fact that they didn't do any of this and so now all these years we've spent 10 years believing that these guys did all of this when in actuality it was this guy which Fazbear has tried to bury and I think it kind of it kind of sucks as an idea but it's it would be within Fazbear's interest it would be within the character we understand and it would be evil it would be truly evil and like this game as well one of the big things they kept doing is really emphasizing how just evil Fazbear is partially that was the mimic pretending to be dispatch but it learned how to do that from Fazbear and it's like you know I've been working for 36 hours please let me sleep that's great Arnold thanks and it just does that whole stickick so it is it is hard to say exactly what they made it doesn't feel like all that much and Afton again is happy to poach people he was happy to take people away from and take the and for them to take the ideas and the other contact with them he was not above stealing ideas and claiming them as a Fazbear thing and claiming them as his own then he bankrupted uh Edwin and MCM and bought it out so that he could take all the credit and it would all be above board so for him not to have invented much tracks and makes sense it's the Henry stuff that I think I and a lot of other people we want Henry to have done something to have been somewhat involved and he clearly has a relationship with Edwin so there is some semblance of like oh maybe they were creatives together but we just don't have the evidence right now we'll have to see if DLC comes up and gives us an answer right i think we have time for maybe one more yeah all right oh Ash is giving me the eyes knowing the knowing eyes that this is going to trip me up okay where are we going all right Tom tell me about the goo the goo the goo the goo not the faz goo no not the faz goo but the orange goo the orange the orange goo that we refused to name our entire playthrough yeah tell us what's up with that goo what do goo what do this goo ash and I danced around this goo the entirety of our playthrough it is there it is powering the facility so let's let's write this down let's write down the thoughts so what what is the goo and what does it do in the context of this game it is an orange liquid it powers the facility it is connected to Dolly and the recycling because we see the furnace and when you melt all that metal down you get like so when you have like molten dolly it is orange goo which implies those two things are the same and so Edwin's whole point of recycling is taking old things and turning them into new useful things that might be new machines but it also seems to imply that he's using the cuz I think we have to power the furnace or you once Dolly goes in we can like hit a power button that like powers a door and powers the lift so it is the recycled metal that is this orange goo that is powering the facility and powering the various puzzles we have to do and especially when we go down to R&D down right into the the heart of the facility the basement we see a lot of this orange goo going down into the basement for uh Edwin to create the first Fazbear animatronics the first Fazbear location so there is a discussion to be had or a thought process to be had around some of it is just doing exactly that it's powering the facility but it is also being used to create I wish the OG baztronics so Freddy Chica all of those guys that are down in the basement are being remade all those scrap pieces are being like reformed and remade down there as well as powering the facility it might also be power part of the powering of uh Fiona and Fiona's power which implies it therefore has a connection to the mimic and this is where we get to the thing that Ash has been trying to tease me into talking about the entire time is remnant woohoo the word i said it so we've got to write that down obviously cuz this is the thing that everyone's been wondering is is it remnant and I think cuz the thing about this game and the modern steel wool era of games is there aren't any spirits there we go there's chat going off love it love to see it thanks guys um this is where we get there are no spirits in these games it is all about the mimic and AI taking over the world right in taking over Fazbar and so it doesn't make sense for this to actually be remnant in what we believe remnant to be which it's descri the remnant it should be noted uh that remnant is described as a silver I think sometimes black maybe but like a silvery black metal so it's not orange but that's because it's in like I mean it is hot so it's like it's not molten but it is in a hot form for it to be liquid and it's then injected into things there is a difference i also think again lines up with the thing I'm going to have to talk about this in a video aren't I like the idea that the games are games and more fictionalized than we maybe first thought because if if that's like if again if we're looking at Fazbear trying to go how do we retell this story in a way that puts all emphasis on Fazbear takes away emphasis from Edwin Murray and makes it turns it from technology corrupting that could still be a problem into spooky ghosts go bump in the night and Uh this is like a oh it's a spooky ghost story that you tell around Halloween and we're leaning into all of that to make people kind of like nonchalantly not worry about Fazbear and all of that if you've got all this orange liquid and goo which is powering the facility powering the mimic the thing that might be the the murderer and like possessive element do you recontextualize it is the game's remnant them fictionalizing and like turning into a bigger thing remnant so it's that it's taking the orange liquid and going rather than it just being a power source rather than it just being you know the thing that creates animatronics and creates the mimic the mimic is a thing that creates brings dead people back to life and so you end up with essentially what the games then call remnants is a metal liquid that brings life to animatronics and it's just a recontextualizing spooky ghost story version of what this orange liquid is that is powering the facility that would be a more easy straightforward thing because again in secret of the mimic and in every steel world game possession is less of a thing it is more about an AI taking over uh technology and it is also taking over the minds of humans but it is not like oh you're possessed by glitch trap or in in the sense of like William Aton's spirit it is an AI like imprinting itself onto your brain onto a human brain almost like uh the Matrix where uh Agent Smith is trying to get into the real world and so he is trying to imprint on like Neo and people so that he can enter the real world it feels kind of like that and so it's a recontextualizing of what this orange goop is that they have as opposed to the orange goo actually being Remnant it feels maybe it's the inspiration for what Remnant would become or maybe it is where after again if the games aren't just like completely fictional maybe it's where Aftton got some of his inspiration for Remnant and the creation of Remnant and the Fun Times was because he saw all this orange goo flying around and he was going "How do we connect may maybe this is the connection maybe this is the piece that will answer And he kind of tries to copy Edwin with what he knows which is here's an animatronic with a life in it i.e like Fiona like the mimic but it's like possessed this time and so he tries to melt that down and turn that into the orange goo that was powering his entire facility and allowed the creation of the mimic two interpretations there it's either literal or it's an inspiration but that's what I think like so which one do I think I'm leaning more towards it being an inspiration for the game's like fictionalized idea of what Remnant is and the idea that they've turned this this Remnant spirit juice they has come from a real life thing that they saw with Edwin rather than it being Afton basically trying to make his own his own I don't think it's that but as with all of these things I am more than open to having my mind changed i am open to uh things existing uh outside of my initial brain knowledge they'll be I'll be doing a ton of research after this anyway so with all of these things with any of these kind of discussions I'm always looking to kind of go this is where my brain currently goes based on the logic but I am open for that to be changed and for that discussion to shift may if not now maybe in the future maybe things will shift I think oh Ash is leaning up to the mic have you got something for me um if you're done with this I just wanted to ask you one more thing oh go for it yeah sure why not okay so first of all uh shout out to our theory mods in chat who've been helping out there's been a lot of cool questions and things and yeah thank you guys thanks y'all for sending me some of the some of the questions that have been scrolling by real quick so I asked this a little bit at the beginning yep and uh I wanted to bring it back you touched on it a little bit in the middle there um but I just wanted a clean sound bite for all of our theorists at home uh do you still think Gregory is a robot after everything that we've seen ah [Music] it was Gregory a robot my first FNAF theory that was Trial by Fire um where because everything ends in fire with FNAF anyway so it was good to it felt good to start with it um is Gregory a robot honest answer right now is no i don't think Gregory is a robot i think there was a lot of stuff that pointed to it early on and again robot kids clearly a thing that exists somewhere because we have now have David as a robot but again having every every kid be a robot kid feels like a lot uh we now have David Murray robot kid M2 and we saw Gregory now being a kid who is actually going to school and is actually uh walking around the Pizza Plex in uh multiple versions of the books but specifically we talk about him being uh a kid in uh uh Escape from the Peter Plex which is the canon choose your own adventure series or feels very cannon anyway I will And in that book we have Gregory and Cassie are friends but that isn't to say that Gregory isn't being affected by Glitch Trap because Vanessa's being affected by Glitch Trap and she feels very human as well again if we suddenly go well anyone that's affected by Glitch Trap is a robot suddenly you've got like four five six robot people on your hands and that's just a lot from a storytelling perspective to like swallow right so I feel like now that we've got this David M1 robot that is the robot kid we were supposed to be looking at gregory I think is a kid that screams visually crying child and I know people we we people like to mock uh our theories where we pointed out some of the visual connections but I think him and Vanessa having those being infected by Glitch Trap is an important visual thing for the whole we need to put the family back together which was originally Fiona trying to put the Murray's back together but it became uh putting the Aftons back together because the games infected how the mimic's mind worked and so I think Gregory was chosen because he felt like a good fit for Crying Child and so was infected to be Dr rabbit and to run around the pizzalex be uh causing havoc and hacking them and similarly Vanessa was in a similar boat but I don't think right now that therefore Greg I don't think Gregory is a robot kid i think we have uh a different robot kid to worry about right now i.e the mimic uh but again I've we we've been wrong before we've been right before so I'm open to seeing where that interpretation goes but that's where I would sit right now great so uh that was the last major question I had if there was anything else that you specifically Tom Game Theory wanted to say about the Secret of the Mimic game yeah now now is the chance honestly love this game from a gameplay perspective i mean I didn't get I didn't play a lot of it i'll probably play a lot of it in my own time ash crushed it playing this game you crushed it Ash i forget you're here i did not but I appreciate it yeah but you you you did you did especially when we started collecting stuff so you know credit where credit's due um but gameplay-wise it felt really good it actually felt a lot less buggy than games we've experienced before um which was nice to see it felt like a very clean experience very enjoyable uh lawwise it's strange this is the first game we've had a lot of law upfront i like all of this stuff like look look let's look back at everything we've like talked about today all of this stuff we wrote down because there are so many questions that are going on right now and so many things we are wondering so many small de some small details that are are confusing and other details that are much more in our face the whole Edwin story line is very in yourrface as a story like it's in the notes it's in the audio logs and you get to the end and you kind of have this sense of story which is unusual for FNAF normally it's all hidden details whereas this has a lot more like in-your-face obvious storytelling which I is really fascinating it's great for fans of this franchise to really reset uh the story reset sort of the bar rather than it being theory upon theory upon theory we now actually have some kind of base to build theories on but there is still some stuff to theorize about i think what a lot of this is going to do for the theory space which I'm excited for is rather than theorizing about this game specifically and like the law within this game it's about theorizing where does this what does this change which is what we've been doing today is what does it change what did Henry and Afton actually create are the games really just complete fiction or are they ba re truly more based on real life um all of those things uh what is the deal with Fiona and Mixes all of those things affect future games as opposed to changing our perspective on Secret of the Mimix specifically and that's a really interesting direction for this franchise to go so I'm very very excited uh to see where that goes i'm really I've really enjoyed this game and diving into it and I look forward to diving into this and coming up with some really really out there theories for this one cuz I think there's going to be a lot all across the platform so it's been great fun and now you know if we talk about some of these things I can call back to this live stream and thank you guys during game theories to be like hey we started solving this during this live stream which is exactly what the point of this is so I really want to thank you guys so much for showing up for being part of this for helping us uh write everything down and and talk through some of these things ask questions that I maybe wouldn't have asked myself this has been a really really fun experience i hope you guys have enjoyed this as well and you know uh sound off in the chat if you've enjoyed being here if you want to see more of these let us know like in the comments of this of this stream because I've really enjoyed this i would love to do this for more franchises coming up i'm sure we have more more FNAF more Poppy more many other things so let us know what you would like us to cover uh down in the comments and you know let us know what you thought of this format in general it would be really really helpful but with that I think it is time to say goodbye for today thank you everybody so much for watching and remember at the end of the day that's just a theory a game theory thanks for watching [Music] [Applause] [Applause] [Music]