gay man who becomes straight and woman who becomes a trans man and de transitions back to a woman you guys met living for Jesus now you're doing Ministry around the world yes yeah what break it down earliest memory would be me taking off my shirt jumping in the pool with the guys mom pulled me out and was like honey you can't do that you're a girl and I'm like what do you mean like I would duct tape my chest for 10 hours a day and you're feeling convicted about it enough to say I may need to detransition yeah how are you feeling about are you okay with it or no initially like no that doesn't look like what I want to do I was so worried that he was going to see me as a woman and not like see me as like this like masculine man yeah and not to get too deep into y'all's intimacy space but I'm curious for when you were identifying as a man did you feel an internal struggle being intimate with Nick that's a good [Music] question this is the deep end with [Music] lrae all right ladies and gentlemen so today um I have a distinct pleasure and honor to have two incredible people here um I rarely read intros because you know I just jump into it but I need you to understand the incredibleness and the the the level of sensitivity uh that this conversation deserves so Nick and Lex renick are a couple with a unique story of transformation um Lex has lived as a trans man for years undergoing significant changes um in treatments however after finding a renewed faith in God Nick and Lex who once identified as gay have returned to their biological genders Embrace their new identities as a heterosexual couple and are deeply involved D in serving the lord um they do incredible Outreach to people in the lgbtq community and those who may be struggling with similar issues um they're dedicated to sharing their journey of redemption uh through their incredible Ministry uh revive traveling Ministries and uh I am blown away because I've sat and listen to them share and um man it it touches my heart because there's family members and friends that I know um have similar struggles and I I can't wait to hear more about their story so I I shared a lot um but this is probably one of the most incredible Journeys we've ever had on a deep end so we're talking about a gay man who becomes straight yes s yeah and then a woman who becomes a trans man and D transitions back to a woman yes and then you guys met mhm start living for Jesus mhm and now you're doing Ministry around the world yes yeah so before we dive into this like I need some origin stories from both of you like give us the childhood background whoever you go first no want me to go first okay so I actually grew up in you know a Christian household my parents were doing Ministry we grew up in Corona California and we were at church like 5 days a week but long story short little did people know there is like this inner this hidden demon within my family of just alcoholism and it was so hidden we were like the white picket fence perfect All-American family but no one knew that there was this alcohol addiction mixed with pills that equals like very bad abuse so unfortunately like I experienced a lot of sexual Trauma from a very young age and so I battled seeing like my parents that were Christians my family that was quote unquote Christians I'm like God if if this is who you are then I don't want to have anything to do with him and I built this resentment from like such a young age and on this journey of like resenting God through all the things that I've gone through and the difficulty that I had and uh you know sexual trauma entering I immediately just kind of walked away from the Lord but then once Middle School and High School came and puberty came I was struggling with just this gender identity dysphoria and and this is before it was like you know really pushed on kids these days and I struggled and I had multiple suicide attempts and all this stuff and just finally was like okay Lord like I I'm hungry for you like like I've tried everything you know and there was nothing that was filling that void within my heart and so I just began to return to the Lord at 17 and God walked with me through the confusion of my gender dysphoria through the sexuality you know things that I that I went through I I like that's a lot for a teenager like frontal l not even closed and you're wrestling with the I mean we all Wrestle with identity to some degree but that's a lot especially coming from the the family of origin um and as you're navigating that in your Youth and as in teen years you just like you landed the plane like well this is where I'm going to be right and and there were no outside influences on that it was just kind of like I mean so my family did experience divorce through adultery and stuff and I just really feel that's where the enemy came in once my father's my spiritual covering was removed that's like when the box was open cuz I was only 5 years old when I experienced my my first sexual experience uh UNC consensually and I just feel like the enemy just took that opportunity to place all this on me yeah and um this uncomfortability just kept on brewing and I was running to the church you know as I begin to just feel this pull from God knowing like I need a savior but every time I ran to the church or Christians in my family so much rejection so I ran to the loving queer community that just welcomed me you know and and it was the first time that I finally felt like I can be honest with how I'm feeling and I'm not the only one and that was like so important to me to know that I I wasn't the only one that was struggling with something like this yeah yeah yeah thank you for sharing that yeah Nick yeah how about you um my I grew up in a tiny little mountain town in California pretty sheltered I grew up very um loved by my family I would say and so I'm just so grateful that now we get the opportunity to build our own family it's always something that I wanted but never quite like saw for myself um yeah grew up grew up there had a nice upbringing not too not too eventful not too wild and then I decided to go on my own way when I was 18 and I was going to go to college and decided to just take a gap here it's been eight years since I I still haven't gone to college I I don't know if I'm going to se I've kind of been debating it but yeah decided to go to Hawaii came back for a little bit of time and met my wife and God just completely took control of my life and I rededicated my life back to him after growing up in and out of the church in 2020 so for you as a as a kid you know teenager child when did you start to to like feel the same seex attraction or or wrestle with those things yeah it had always been in the back of my head you know right when puberty hits and stuff and I just think that at that time in the 2000 sex ed for kids was so black and white and cut forward and it was kind of Taken like out of the family's responsibility to teach kids you know what sex education is essentially and so the world the internet everything's just opening up you know like the internet is becoming more and more accessible at that time and so I think the world and the education system has a huge part to play in everyone's um like navigation of their own identity and that's when the devil can kind of creep in I think that's when um you know I started to wrestle with those things coming from a town like when I first even knew that being gay was a possibility I I was like asking my parents so curious and I wish that um my parents had the knowledge of how to like educate us cuz I feel like the whole um what swort I'm looking for agenda would be completely different now whole stigma between what's going on in the lgbtq community with all these youth that are getting their innocence ripped away from them in unnecessary ways but yeah so that's my upbringing a bit in a nutshell yeah um once I left that tiny little town you know and got out into the world I was like so excited to be independent and then realizing that all that I actually want is like to have like a home base and build a family it's like so funny cuz I asked me 5 years ago and I never would have said that i' be here right now with my wife raising our daughter and our second baby in Tennessee Jesus Lise man that this mind blowing crazy I think go ahead oh I was just going to say I think it's important to notate too that so many people put you in a box like we we actually went to high school together but we never talked oh wow so uh I got bullied a lot and I would be like why am I the only gay kid getting bullied like he's clearly over here you know struggling with that too um and everyone's like no he's not but like so many people were putting him in a box because he was a musician because he was you know in drama and talented in all these ways and like when you start speaking things over people like when my mom used to always say you're you're going to become me you're going to become an alcoholic you're going to become an abuser you know it's like partner with that thought you know don't speak that over me so I think it's kind of it it's we have to be particular especially with way we want to raise our kids of like what we speak over them and like curiosity yeah that's that's going to happen you know Temptation we already know that that happens in life but like we shouldn't be pushing people you know into these identities yeah so I'm I'm I'm actually curious about that that you brought that up for both of you like I know I have a a close family member um who would identify as gay and I have other family members who say well they weren't like that as a kid they they weren't they and you know the stories vary right um I have have you know some other younger family members who are kids and I remember one of them particularly probably around 10 or 11 everyone was making fun of him saying oh you're gay you're gay you're gay and he goes and he Google like am I gay like it's a quiz online like am I gay and I'm just I'm I'm curious like for you all what Insight could you give cuz you were kind of going there but just like for for y'all as kids like processing this like what what are those emotions what are you thinking through how are you navigating this and how are people bullying you what's that experience like yeah I I experienced a lot of that so I would say I felt like I was the only person that was struggling with this I remember when um the first iPod Touch came out and I googled you know I I'm I'm born a girl but I feel like I'm a boy trapped in a girl's body and the word transgender came up and that definition like fit and I'm like wow I'm not the only one that's struggling with this you know and then I heard of people that you know the hormone process and you know you're you're immediately told well if you take these hormones and you get these surgeries everything will finally match up with your mind and you'll have this freedom and so you're like wow I found the Cure and the recipe to what I need to do to finally feel free but I just feel like if the people around us and if the church was maybe more equipped to like handle and and what I mean by that is like be loving yeah about it yeah to yeah go ahead no go ahead love but also like it's just crazy because this one like section of like such an important part of who we are as humans like growing up in our sexuality and we all you know have our own identity and all of our own interests and perspectives and all of that why is this the thing that like has to be a public struggle you know what I mean like why is it it's like everyone feel so Justified nowadays to to come out or to do this or to announce this or to say you're part of this community which is just never something that I was even comfortable with back then for me I was like why why do I have to put this on display because the world it was just so like and especially around like 20145 all these people are posting all these coming out videos and as it's becoming more accepted like in normalized society I guess you could say um and promoted um yeah so that was just a thought like hearing you say that like we all are struggling through so much especially as like Prett pubescent team teenagers wondering what the world is going to be like going forward you know and so I think for me I always struggled with that and even now it just makes me cringe like why why is this what's illuminated for all these poor kids you know trying to just be awkward and like figure out their growing changing bodies and minds and and we're all uncomfortable at that age you know we we all are so many different things you know I think it's I do think it's interesting I I heard a pastor say before like if you were to go back back into like the 1500s or 1400s or something and a person had this internal burden or desire to like to kill people it would have been like Champion like yeah kill them and and you could like identify as as a person who wanted to kill people and it would have been fine but at that same period of time if you felt like man I'm attracted to the same sex it would have been like never bring that to the Forefront like just deal with that internally you don't identify as that and now in 2024 if you were to say I want to kill people it'd be like shut your mouth like go somewhere else with that but if you say I'm attracted to the same sex it'd be like well Champion that and I think it does a disservice to us as humans to just like limit our identities to like what we feel inside you know what I mean so I think that's kind of what you're you're saying to a degree is like I'm more than just what's going on in here absolutely yeah um so so I also understand that both of you identified as Christians growing up and but at at different points in your life you're like practicing you know yeah we walked away yeah so what is that internal wrestle like okay I'm I say I love Jesus are you feeling like I can participate I can be gay and love Jesus like or not be gay but like actively pursue a lifestyle of homosexuality was that a wrestle for you or were you just kind absolutely okay yeah for sure from like e because even with my upbringing you know I had a stepfather that you know said that he was a Christian but he had a Bible on his nightstand that got Dusty and then would call me like a [ __ ] and tell me I was going to go to hell wow and I was hungry wow I was hungry I'd come home from school I would have all my study Bibles out and I'm looking at the verses I'm trying to get my answers from the word you know I didn't want to get my answers from some preacher holding up some sign saying that I was going to burn in hell like I felt the love of God even from a young age and I'm like he's good he loves me why you telling me that you know like I'm going to hell Etc and so I was just like so so hungry like for God and just looking for for the answers and when I experienced rejection like that it was it was difficult but then I started hearing this Narrative of like oh well God made you that way I just want you to know that outside of your world you have a whole another community that supports you and that's with you and I want you to know that too I want you to know that you have a whole community that is is here for you and we are all on the bside app I mean we're talking about thousands of people connected getting to know each other because we've all subscribed to the bside app and we get to talk about these episodes and share our thoughts share what we're dealing with what we're wrestling with and how we can all grow together I need community so do you subscribe to bide so we can be Community together and it's like if you think about it any sin and and we're not even talking about this one in particular you're looking looking for permission yes yes yes yes so I would go to church uh and I would I rededicate my life at 17 God walked with me on the Journey of my struggle with gender identity and sexuality and I remember looking at people on the worship team and being like why know they are living together and they're not married I know that that couple that's also on the worship team they're having premarital sex so if God is cool with that then God's got to be cool with this looking for permission you know if the church is fine with that then why is the church not fine with this you know so I started wrestling with this like okay this lie that like God made me this way no he he didn't make me this way you know if you think about it like God makes no mistakes at all and like that argument just doesn't work for the trans Community specifically because then I should have been always identifying you know as a woman so as I was on this journey I struggled with that like once a month as I continued my relationship with the Lord and that once a month was like conviction wow of like okay am I really like I don't I don't want to roll the dice on my salvation mhm you know I don't want to roll the dice on like my relationship with Jesus either so it's like Lord but we have to we have to understand too that like when we walk with Jesus if the church is shunning us then we're not going to understand the Jesus that died for us and if we don't know the Jesus that died for us we're not going to be willing to die to self woo you talking yeah so you go I needed people to walk with me on that Journey I I did you know but just like someone who's struggling with porn in the church you know were they finding excuses for that because maybe it's been years and they've been unmarried yep you know I think it's all about perspective and all about inviting God into each and every one of our whatever our struggle particularly is that's good yeah yeah and just watching um from the outside like I always struggled so much with Christianity particularly cuz I grew up in a a pretty religious Church in in our small little town or church was probably 20 to 30 members at any one time it's probably I think 12 now I think my grandma said last time last time she checked or something or 12 during Co not not during Co but um anyway yeah I didn't really associate like a relationship with Jesus to like like Christianity like I had no idea what what even different denominations were and so I went off on my own like way you know my own like spiritual Quest when I graduated high school and living in Hawaii and I and I really was like on a self-discovery path which was I Think Jesus like courting me already being like listen I know what the people say I am I know what what the church is going to say I am and represent this whole religious aspect of your life that you need to check all these boxes and become this like perfect person and then you can associate with me publicly and that's what I thought Christianity was and so it's just really refreshing that Jesus is the exact opposite of that and has warned us about this for you know many years in the Bible that he's going to pervert what Christianity actually means so I'm grateful um I was like right at the end of my own rope like on my own self Journey right when we met and so Jesus picked me up right there and I read dedicated yeah it was really cool to like actually put two and two together that um God like wants an act of relationship with you but at the same time like you need to work on yourself and you need to seek it out it's like both you can't just like sit here and be like all right God you're gonna make me perfect you just sit back you know right he was Hipp he was a hippie in Hawaii you know yeah it's like I still am you know but I'm not I'm not going out not with that so so for for for you were you this Encounter With Jesus did it change your perspective on like oh the way your lifestyle was like what what what was that look what did that look like at the time it was definitely like a an unsettling thought but it never was anything that deterred me from Jesus because I never really thought okay well he's not going to I obviously know now that he's not going to love me any less whether this is right or not so I didn't really know where I settled and so I kind of we kind of just went through life like that because we got married um as as men you know to the world right yeah and we're still involved in churches and still you know navigating different things in that way which was a whole different struggle but now now okay here we go here we go yeah trying to live like that like great gay Christians so so help me out okay like put me in your mind State because that's it's a lot to digest right so you at this time are a transgender you're a male right you're a male MH attracted to men but she's a woman Yeah by origin yeah are you are you finding her attractive because she identifies as a man you thinking about the fact that she was a woman like he didn't know at first okay well I didn't know like yeah I didn't know like our first en date and then my dad's like if you like this dude you need to tell him yeah and it never really was was a deciding factor of oh like I didn't want to I don't want to pursue you anymore kind of thing like I always wanted to pursue you so yeah I don't know it was just kind of like I always had been just exclusively you know trying to like be gay this whole time and it's like at that point it was like you were saying too I was in this box so I never really had understood that like there's this whole other design God's design that that's so much better and so he's kind of quing me like that in the background again like you know okay well then here is a woman who thinks she's a m why don't you all you're you know cuz then I can help you you can help me you know like different things yeah cuz I don't I truly think that we wouldn't have you would not be and I wouldn't be me like if we weren't helping each other God knew what he was doing because it it he worked on the both of us because prior to Nick I was only dating women that's what I'm okay we got to wait we got to rewi we got rewi because this is so much okay let me let me try to cuz as I'm listen okay it's a lot here this is how I know God is real cuz this is the most impossible situation this is crazy you are a woman yes you are attracted to women yes you feel the desire to become a man so you can live as a man and date women you are a man yeah you are attracted to men uhuh you're trying to live for Jesus but you're like I don't know what that looks like exactly I like men you find a man yeah in Lex who's going by Austin at the time right yes and you're like oh I found a guy MH but your guy is a girl MH how do you find a guy if you're looking for girls yeah how like what break it down I don't even know where to begin like I guess I I should begin with um it's all about Jesus and the journey okay I think like we have this lie my husband said you know we we almost illuminate like the gender and sexuality thing above every other sin but like there's even things deeper within people that are like God thinks is more important that he wants to work on first so it's about Jesus and the journey and so as I was on this journey with Jesus like I I struggled yes and I'm losing my train of thought of what I was going to say hold on Jesus in The Journey how you ended up dating a guy yes yes so so since I was 17 you know I I like I said I was walking with the Lord I was I was encountering God the Holy Spirit was speaking to me he was he was removing things from me a porn addiction I was addicted to cocaine I was parting I stopped doing that you know there's things that he was removing but I think it's all about like the freedom that we allow oursel to have in the moment that we surrender yeah so literally a week before or a few days before I met my husband went to this dock in our small mountain town where I'd go hang out with the Lord and I just said okay God this is different I'm going to surrender my sexuality to you wow and I just fell on my face and I cried and I remember being like this is the hardest thing that I've ever done because I could never imagine myself with the man I could never imagine myself marrying a man I I didn't I wasn't ready for the gender identity thing my own identity yeah but I'm like okay God I'm willing to surrender this part of me now wow and it's it's because at that point I'm like I know you I know your heart and I literally pointed up at the sky I'm like God the gospel of John's my favorite like you have the power to do Miracles that magically change me you know like God change my desires I give them to you you know make me sexually attracted to a man uh emotionally spiritually all of that God like you have the power please you know if that's according to your will please and then literally like I go to my favorite Small Town Coffee Shop studying my Bible and the back door opens and and this cute guy comes walking in and he plays best part this R&B song where it says and those brown eyes are the ones that I desire and I've never been so attracted to someone in my life and I was like holy smokes look at this cute guy that just walked in and that was just the start of everything it's like miraculous literally and and you're on your own Journey with Jesus you're like hey I'm gonna date this guy and God work it out and did he yeah yeah really because I always like like I said I wanted to have kids but didn't know what was going to happen in my life I always wanted that family base but I never even dated to even when I identified like as gay I didn't have any like relationships with people okay it was all strictly lustful I would say all my interactions and then I just would you know comp compartmentalize like oh no I'm just like by myself Lone Wolf kind of thing M and so it was just really rare when we met and I was like okay I'm very curious about you I want to pursue you and then you told me that after our first day at the coffee shop and she said it she said it and it didn't really phase me so I just kind of continued with our conversation and she was like do you understand what I'm saying to you right now I don't have like the parts you think I have and I was like well I never wanted to dat anyone and here I am with you so like I don't let's just keep going like quote that he actually said was um he's like I'm not interested in anything other than your heart yeah and that was like the safest thing that he could have said to me like as a man especially me never thinking that I could ever be attracted or Etc and I just remember when we hugged and like he had his the top of his chin on my head I just felt this warmth and I'm like wow God like I think I can fall in love with this man and that was the first time I've ever felt anything like that yeah and I was like okay so it it's funny cuz I think of like there's there's like Bible stories where God uses these like jacked up circumstances to like make something beautiful out of it and that's what this reminds me of it's just kind of like one of those like oh well Pharaoh's killing kids and he's coming to kill yours sorry you got to put your baby in the water and send him up the river it's really messed up but God's like don't worry I got this and it's like one of the or like oh Rahab you're a prostitute and you you got guys coming in and out of your house but uh you're these guys you're going to save them and then you're going to become like an ancestor of Jesus like it's like one of those things where you weren't you were trying and God just met you at your try yeah it's like it's like not like he reversed any of what happened or like it's not that I'm not trying to say like he Wills any bad thing to happen to us or like any bad decision that we choose to make but yeah he's going to take it and he's not going to discount discount this story to transform you he's going to use it for his good so good bab that's powerful man so okay there's so much I know it's so much it's like drinking from a fire hydrant because I I I'm I'm genuinely curious about so many things um okay so let's let's rewind the tape a little bit for you Lex you decide to get the gender transformation process you undergo this process what take us from like moment Zer to 10 like how does that happen yeah like how do the how does a transition process happen and even like the decision like how hard of a decision is that are family members talking like what is that process yeah that's a great question I think everyone's journey is different and with me it started the gender identity sexuality confusion started at 6 with you know my innocence being ripped away from me and I mean the the earliest memory would be me taking taking off my shirt jumping in the pool with the guys group with a bunch of guys my mom pulled me out and was like honey you can't do that you're a girl and I'm like what do you mean like I was confused I I I already thought from a very young age that I was a boy so my father actually saw me struggle with this crying when I was put in dresses you know all this stuff and and I remember he wanted me to go to a father daughter dance with him my mom wants to you know put all this makeup on me and I'm balling and my dad's like it's fine she could wear whatever she wants you know I remember us getting to the dance and my dad just saw like how distraught I was how uncomfortable that I was and he's like look just slow dance with me one song we'll go get ice cream he could take off the dress and we'll tell Mom you know and and he sympathized with me and I really felt like that showed the Father's Love because he walked with me and so I I continued my journey with all of all of this and um and uh sorry my pregnancy brain can you remind me yeah you you just saying like you wanted to as a from a little girl yes yes and then puberty came in and then once puberty came in you know my breast started forming and stuff and I had this dysphoria and I didn't really know what that word meant so basically to describe it to you it's like I wanted to unzip myself open my body up and walk out you ever like like I've had sleep paralysis before you wake up you want to like itch your eyes out you're so uncomfortable it was spiritual I was so uncomfortable and so I would duct tape my chest for 10 hours a day to the point where like my stepdad would be like where did all my duct tape go it's because I was so uncomfortable I didn't know what binding was yet I just knew I don't like these and I want them to I want my chest to be flat like a man's yeah and I would peel off the duct tape and I still have scars from it pulling off my skin and I'd be bleeding wow like people don't just do that for fun you know um and then I realized that you know there's things called binders and Etc and and so yeah so the more that I researched the more realized that like I can get on testosterone I you know can get Top surgery I can get bottom surgery if I wanted to and I just believe that lie that like I'll do these things and I'll finally be free and so I started going to gender therapy she immediately gave me a te letter which means I can start testosterone at that point I was 18 okay I wanted to start when I was like 15 or 16 years old and my parents were like no this is a decision that you should make when you're an adult and we don't agree with it if that's something you want to when you're 18 it's your decision but right now the answer is no yeah I'm thankful for that I'm so thankful for that and so I start testosterone um when I'm 18 and I go through this transformation process before I met Nick I was already talking to a surgeon to get bottom surgery I am so thankful that I did not follow through with that because you know like we have two Miracle babies that's crazy so it it's a journey and you know you hear stories of people who say man I I want to reverse it or like is that something that you experienced were you thinking like down the line like wait this didn't like what is that thought process like it didn't solve what you were looking for or is it like no it did oh it did okay it did like once once I started testosterone like my depression my Suicidal Thoughts all of that went away I was way more at peace with myself like I finally looked in the mirror and everything felt right like so I felt like I was actually walking in this freedom but it was really like a knockoff version like it was false for a time but it's like we have this hole in our heart we could put so many things in it but unless it's Jesus you know I didn't realize that my identity became an idol I was worshiping my identity like every time my voice got deeper and you know all these masculine things started changing and like now that I'm on the other side of things and the rosecolor glasses are off I feel like the Lord I ask the Lord I'm like God why why did I go through all of this you know I remember the holy spirit said um you became the man that never protected you during your sexual trauma and I was like wow that makes so much sense I became you know I was an army chaplain assistant I became this soldier that was strong in top of my class you know I became this protector I was just pretending to almost be this like super strong masculine person and then when my husband and I were married and God told me to DET transition I cried at a moment moment of finally being able to feel safe wow like I remember we were playing cards and I'm like thank you so much for loving me so much and and protecting me and allowing me to feel like you're going to take care of me you're going to provide for me and it was like I could finally lay down this this Idol and this identity that I was almost taking up to protect myself yeah so so Nick I'm I'm listening to Lex and she's she's sharing kind of her place that she got to where enough emptiness to say Jesus I need you I'll surrender my sexuality yeah but you met Jesus and you were essentially saying well I'm still going to date a man and when you found out this is not a man like is there a what's the is there a wrestle at all like what's going on with you internally yeah it was a bit different from my timeline because it was like I knew that that God loved me through it no matter what but but it was of course still like it's conviction in the back of your mind you know and if you're questioning your salvation are you saved and so I was and I was questioning my salvation you know struggling with that and so when I saw you like like openly struggling with it you know I I never question like where I was going but I just was wondering like why why we were having these like power struggles essentially because when you were you know taking testosterone like you were just take charge in a in a different way like a woman should like not to say it like that not to say it like that but it's like you were doing things I should have been doing yeah and and it's like when you are like not you know in the role and the will that God has for your life I automatically it automatically put us out of the will of God so because I was trying to be the spiritual leader I was trying to be the provider and the one making all the decisions and you know and we believe in equal submission in our marriage and stuff that's biblical um but we were out of whack with the Lord's will because of that and it did CA stri so honestly it got a lot easier after that everything fell in place yeah yeah so so I want to hear about that like I've been married in for 18 years it's hard marriage is hard I don't know what like I can only imagine the added difficulties that you all have had to deal with so what what are those Dynamics or what were some of the initial struggles and things y'all have had to battle Yeah it was like um you would just take the control of of doing things without me knowing like thinking that it's helping like going out and like cleaning X Y and Z or like you would go and like pay all the bills and I'm like I need to see these things like I you know you can't just not involve me like I understand you're trying to help but she's like I'm the real man in the family little details like that like what are you like what no and I almost like enjoyed the fact if I can just be vulnerable for them I think I enjoyed the fact as identifying as Austin that he was willing to submit and like be submissive to yeah to that I'm not I'm not saying you were fully submissive or anything I'm just saying in certain aspects of it that that almost helped like my Identity or my ego feel like like I am this strong man like I am this you know back to the hurt you know um and I feel like now like wow like our marriage was great before but like wow when you do it God's way holy smokes like so much stuff changed for the better like our communication you know him spiritually leading him providing protecting and I just feel like that opened um this new raw realness within us and it was like we fell in love with each other all over again but now as husband and wife yeah so and not to get too deep into y'all's intimacy space but I'm I'm curious for when you are identifying as a man did you feel an internal struggle being intimate with with Nick that's a good question I'm trying to figure out what you're asking well I you know like I have friends family members who would say Well they're studs right they're not Goa and for them it's like to be feminine in an intimate way was like a strange thing they don't like that and I'm I don't know how you how y'all's interaction if that was I did struggle with that I there would be times where like I would want the lights off or like whatever because I was so worried that he was going to to see me as a woman and not like see me as like this like masculine man and there was just this uh internal struggle with me I knew with him like he didn't care like he just loved me and it was it was all good but for me there was that internal struggle like I felt like I couldn't even enjoy a lot of our intimacy because I was so worried about you know him seeing me as this feminine person yeah yeah that's what I was wondering that's a good question so I think of my own Journey right love the Lord was walking with the Lord and then went through a deconstruction where I just didn't know if Jesus was real and a lot of times it's my own Frailty and failures that help that just give Satan a weapon to run with right and um and I'm giving him this weapon to run with and I'm depleted you know drugs alcohol running away from God and I get to a place where I don't I'm telling my wife like I don't even want to do Bible study with the kids I'm I don't even know I'm I'm not raising them Christian because I don't know where I stand and I think I was so empty I think I was so like lost that God met me there it's like my deep end moment where God was like man you're you're going to crash and burn and I'm just close to I'm not going to let you like throw it all away and and below it all in in this in this regard and he met me there and that was kind of like my aha moment of just like I'm there's no low I can get I'm done and that's when it started over for me so I'm curious for y'all like what did that look like for you all you know it like being married you're like all we're on the right path but then it's like something had to happen for you to be like all right I'm going to be a woman I'm going to be a straight man yeah we're going to have kids like how yeah well we were living in Las Vegas and we went through like the first couple years of our life or our marriage not our life our marriage in Las Vegas during covid and you know everything was expedited with that and so our marriage was really like right away put under like pressure we decided to get out of debt right when we got married too so we were both working a lot and so we were um D where was I going with that you got my pregnancy brain now yeah when you um heard God tell you that we were moving to Tennessee I was really mad like I didn't want to move to Tennessee I was like no you are actually the one that's wanting to go to Tennessee like like we're just trying to run away from our problems is what I thought like and I was like life is so good in Vegas and we can you know get it together and you know continue to just live there as our two as like two guys it's just funny like Looking Back Now like hindsight is 2020 so looking back at like an older version of yourself you're always so much more like expanded so you're like what was I thinking life was back then but yeah then when we got to Tennessee I could just feel like that was a different season like God was like okay you thought that you were going in this direction and you were going to have these struggles here's some new struggles to to actually like put you on the path I have you on with your identity and with all of that like the starting of that Dynamic change too because then it became the point where we first moved out here and I became at um for a time like the so bread winner in the house and we've always like Switched Off over the years and stuff but at that time it was just me so I was like okay I'm watching you go through this struggle go ask God and really seek your answer and no matter what it is yeah he just kept pointing back because you were really really struggling and you were questioning your salvation all the time and it wasn't as bad or severe as me you know I was like more so internally struggling I think but were like really struggling with it and I was like okay well if if you need to find an answer you need to find it from God directly so go take your time and do this we were traveling in uh I think South Carolina or something and then I thought we were in Indiana but I for that he's my brain so then I came better with the timeline too and I worked like 12 hours or so and Lex was you know super distraught and I was like okay what's up you know yeah let's eat some dinner and she's like I need to tell you something after I falling yeah like we literally like we got together 3 months uh we got engaged 6 months we got married like we just knew and then you know we tried to live in Hawaii that didn't work out we moved to Vegas and we found the church like God gave us everything we prayed for we prayed for the church we prayed for you know community and we found that and I'm assuming it was like a gay affirming Church no it actually wasn't so it was it's a church called Church LV it's Pastor Benny and Wendy Perez's Church they're amazing a welcoming Church very welcoming church and I remember when I I walked in there was actually a Saturday night service and my mom unfortunately was on hospice care and I I drove back from California and I'm like I just need to go worship Jesus because if the Lord takes my mom tonight he's still good and I need to go worship him and I found this church and I remember walking in and and there's this guy with like pink hair and a and a pink fluffy you know purse but he had a beard and he was kind of like in his 20s and the men's group was like what's up dude come hang out with us and I'm like oh my gosh this is a place that I can be at and so Nick and I like we got so involved there and we got invited to like smaller circles outside of church and I really do feel like that's when the deepening happens you know when you go into that intimacy and that Honesty with other believers CU then people know how to pray for you you know and people chose to walk with us and so it so hard when God was like hey it's Johnson City Tennessee like pack up and move I heard it three times in Prayer by the third time by the third time I told told Nick one I need to confess something to you the Lord spoke to me something twice I've ignored it but now it's the third time and I need to tell you for accountability like for some reason we're supposed to pack up and leave and it was hard we did not want to and then we literally threw everything in the car drove across the country and God wowed us I think it's funny to say that we moved into an apartment on Gay Street and by the time we moved off of Gay Street we were no longer identifying as that so I just think that's a little prophetic in a way but yeah no like he said I was just having this one once a month like what if and this once a month conviction and I really really commend my husband for never pointing to the internet never pointing to his wisdom but always pointing to the Lord now what was the what if and what was the like thing that was B the conviction that you wrestling with so we were like I would always say well I mean what if the word of God is actually the truth fully cuz it's like we can't pick and choose what we believe but we were we were kind of cherry-picking the Bible and we're like well what if you know us living as a gay couple is actually wrong even though technically I'm a woman and you're a man so technically it's all good but we were leading people to Jesus we were doing Bible studies at home we weren't doing that with the church but it's like what if we're giving other people permission to actually live in sin yeah what if we were to change the sexuality and gender thing and it was alcohol you know or if it was substance abuse wow you know like is this really god-honoring and it became more of like I love God enough that I I I know him enough now to where I don't want to go a way that he doesn't want me to go yeah but at the same time like what is the right answer I'm hearing two different you know sides of the coin and uh and I I didn't want to roll the dice you know and but but I just told Nick I'm like I don't know what that looks like I already got surgery and like I got Top surgery so I got a double masectomy and I almost died on the table with complications and I $10,000 cash for it I went to the guy that invented Top surgery cuz my family's like we don't agree but if you're going to do this go to the best of the best so you don't get a botch surgery and still I went to the best of the best and almost died she and they told me I wasn't going to be able to have full lung function and all this stuff and so um I just like even though I got surgery and stuff like if God tells me to detransition I want to hear from him mhm you know directly MH yeah so you're you're saying man what if the Bible's true MH and we're not and you're feeling convicted about it enough to say I I may need to detransition yeah how are you feeling about you are you okay with it or is it yeah I was always you know at like in like in submission to what God wants us to do at that point like God you know will will present us with a path and most often we're always like At first we're like no no initially like no that doesn't look like what I want to do and then it it's always you know always fruitful always I can say whatever that is you know for each person but yeah I was always like okay well whatever you do you know I'm here because I I in my wedding vows I like promise to love you like no matter where you are every day you know what I mean and so I I can't break that no matter what happens going forward on my perspective was I thought that I was going to lose him M like when I thought okay if God tells me to surrender this yeah I'm going to lose my marriage I'm going to lose probably all the friends that I have you know I might lose some of my family members I don't know yeah I just was thinking about all the loss and not all the gain that could have happened and yeah so we're in a hotel room and um Nick actually prior to this happening I think it's important to notate is I I actually got this tattoo of a Ouija board um it looks like it but it says one of my favorite quotes from a book it says we accept the love we think we deserve and for me that was one of my biggest inner demons accepting abuse from other relationships because I was abused as a child you know Etc and just um on this journey of like once I got that tattoo I remember never forget I was worshiping in church and it got super red and my hand got hot and I just felt like I needed to start repenting for it because even though it's technically not a Ouija board I still got witchcraft I marked my body with blood you know and I remember seeing this reel of someone um you know doing Deliverance because of a tattoo that she got I'm not saying tattoos are bad or and Nick comes into the hotel room and I'm like hey I wrote down a Deliverance Prayer if nothing happens cool but like just in case like God's convicting me that I need to repent I want to renounce and repent all of my sin and just see if anything happens well he's saying this prayer and all of a sudden I Collapse I convulse on the floor I start having the like demonic stuff just starts literally showing itself and I'm fading in and out of Consciousness and he's rebuking things back to the pit of Hell this is as I was identifying as Austin and as you know Nick and I are identifying as a gay couple and he's like as a man of God I declare in the name of Jesus that if anything is inside of Austin that is not serving Christ as Lord out and I and I would cry out to God and be like God tell me to change like if if you're not cool with this then tell me to change never heard anything God would you know lead me here and there with different things and I'd get confirmation within that but literally not even a few days after that when I'm crying out to God on my knees in that same hotel room after I'm delivered MH I hear the Lord say Austin do you trust me with this trust me and follow think about how the disciples how they either you know hesitated to follow oh let me go bury my father oh let me go do this no follow me fully follow yeah and and then as I was wrestling with this I'm crying I'm weeping like I'm writing this down in my prayer journal and the Lord's like remember the times that you've laid hands on people and in the name of Jesus have casted out depression and anxiety why do you think that I can't lay my hand upon you and take away dysphoria and take away this uncomfortability trust me oh man so much so much in there and in y'all's level of faith and trust in the Lord is so inspiring it's encouraging um but I I also have to like Wonder after you do because it's it's one thing to trust the Lord but like the Bible says do not grow weary and well-doing because when you do it weariness is going to come with the well-doing so you you make this decision you were already talking about I was scared to lose my husband obviously you didn't lose him yeah but you also talked about losing friends how were y'all viewed by your friends and peers after you say hey this is what we're doing like did you make an announcement did you just show up one day like how did this happen that's a good question so it was pretty slow like it was it was um in November when that happened and then December we went back from Tennessee to California just for a couple days it was only a couple days just to talk to or just to see family for Christmas and so we briefly briefly told our immediate family and we're just like you know it's not going to be like yeah she you just like present with a wig and like makeup after looking like a guy for so many years and and a lot of people didn't even know know that you were transgender yeah his family didn't a lot of them didn't know of didn't know they just thought that I was his husband yeah and so for the most part in my well for all of it and both of our families it's been completely amazing and everyone that didn't know obviously then knew and understood and it's just been nothing but like reconciliation for me and like many of my family members and things like that forgiveness and um you know you can speak how it was for your family and friends but yeah I would say for my dad's side of the family like I with some of the non-believers of that family they would be like well you don't have to be this way for God to love you and I said no that's not it that's not what happened that's not what happened you know and some of them that were atheists would be like Oh I'm sorry that like Christians made you feel like you have to now live this terrible life you know or you know and put these things on me wow but that's not how it happened either it's because I walked Jes I walked with Jesus enough and just obeyed when I didn't agree that's so important to say that when God told me do you trust me with this I chose to trust but I didn't agree I was still holding on to my identity I was still holding on to my own way and I think sometimes we just do it our own way but I'm like God I'm I'm going to choose to trust you and Obey you when I don't agree and then over time you know that's when I started to agree so I just had to reaffirm my family like I'm not doing this cuz I feel like I need to do this for Jesus to love me I'm doing this because I love him enough to trust him with this that's so good and and now like just looking at your journey right it's like the vast majority of the world is not going to experience what you've experienced and we've already kind of uncovered that you know God kind of uses the circumstances that you're in and dealing with to like do something unique and different like what I mean do you feel like God has like called you to specific people groups or mindsets because of everything that you've been in absolutely I believe that God will turn everything around for the glory of him you know what the enemy meant for evil God will use for good and when I rededicated my life at 17 like the Lord told me that I was going to have this traveling Ministry that I was going to buy bus and like serve coffee and I know nothing about driving a bus or coffee other than I like it and this is before bus life or van life was a thing and I remember writing that in my prayer Journal but always saying like oh maybe one day M on first date my husband's like what is your biggest dream I told him about that day and I said maybe in another life and he said no what do we need to do to make that actually happened oh wow and like come to find out God God's doing everything like he's in Hawaii working on a coffee Farm now he's working all these different coffee businesses higher up you know knowing how to manage things and so like God just like you know he he brought us together within that and so we're just here to love the Misfits and equip the body of Christ I love that well it's funny because in our heads too we thought that like we would be like a gay Christian couple doing that and it's funny because the call was like the same but now like actually seeing how God wants us to do it and how it's played out in his will is so cool yes so we we want to bridge the gap between these two like communities the like religious Christians and the like radical LGBT like Community like in just like somehow you know create some sort of bridge yeah through just vulnerability honesty and just one cup of coffee at a time sharing the love and transformational power of Jesus not spreading this message that like you need to get it all together yeah but like come hang out God wants to sit at the table with you that's aming the Lord wants you so when I look in the scriptures I see you know certain people who blind people get healed and you know demons are cast out of the the the different Folks by Jesus but then also see Paul saying I still have a thorn in my flesh but his grace is sufficient so good and I I think about the spectrum of people um you know who have same-sex desires and there's some who say the desires are still there but I just obey the spirit and I don't succumb to them some people say the desires are gone I've been delivered and all that's up to the Lord right yeah where would you say you fall on that Spectrum you go first yeah for me right when I met my wife I was instantly like so enamored physically sex like you know in all of the ways that I knew that any Temptation wouldn't last and so from that moment I kind of like I was like all eyes in like fixated and it hasn't changed whether you were Austin or Lex like it didn't really oh you're so sweet and then like on my journey um I again I trusted God when I didn't agree at the time and so we were just devoted daily after that encounter with God pray for the renewing of our mind I think when we pray for the renewing of our mind people think oh I've already prayed the prayer it's like it's it's a daily thing if I'm getting angry in my marriage God renew my mind you know things like that and so we would just daily lay it at the feet of Jesus and over time the dysphoria was gone over time you know full sexual attraction not even Temptation at all was ever there for women ever again and even when we when we will talk about our previous experience you know um with same sex and stuff it it almost weirds me out I'm like that's so crazy that I've been with so many women that that blows my mind that you know that I could have ever even done anything like that yeah um but I think that just goes to show like the transformational power of God and but I also think too you know sometimes God doesn't remove that attraction or that desire and you know what God can use anything you know God can use anything to build the kingdom like I have will forever have an Adam's apple because of the testosterone injections I will forever have these scars unless God removes him you're telling me he won't use that to you know glorify him so it's like I remember we spoke at this college recently and this this guy said how do you feel about saying I'm a gay Christian and I said well what is the context of it he said for context I'm gay and I and I paused because I really wanted the Holy Spirit to give me an answer I didn't want to lead on my own and and I'm like okay if I was Austin and you said hey Austin my name's such and such and I'm struggling with sex attraction but I'm choosing to deny that to walk with the Lord M and to just deny that Temptation you know I'm like that would have ministered to me so much to know that you have the willpower and the strength to be like God I have this temptation and this desire and in sexuality in Sex In general the Bible says flee yeah it does you know it doesn't say like oh you know let's barter With the Enemy No it says flee and so I'm like that would have ministered to me so much so I'm like you should tell people that and just see what seeds are planted that's really good that's very helpful um you know we had a former gay man here and he mentioned like there's some things that can be left over from your past Identity or how you identified um the way you walk or the way you talk or the way you portray yourself just because that's and some of it may have been like things that that accumulated over the years some of it may just be your natural tendencies um you know is that something that you all process or think through or deal with to navigate yeah I think so like subconsciously in the back of my head still like in public situations I don't know like am I standing feminine right now yeah yeah honestly and then it like makes me though I always like take a look at the source of that thought I'm like okay well that's just like the world's view of what a man should be standing like you know like not how God doesn't care I'm if I have like if I'm resting my leg on my hip you know or whatever yeah or if I like say something with like a TW like I it is still on the back of my head for sure because when you're like going through that as like as somebody who is in that involved in those communities and like has the because it's like it takes courage to bring it out and express it and then it's like a choice on whether or not you believe if it's sin or not but speaking on like the courage it takes to like like get these things out in yourself and these characteristics you know on the outside everyone's like oh yeah I knew it cuz the way you walked I'm like no you no you actually really don't like just because the way someone talks so I just feel so bad that the world Jud like more feminine presenting men or more masculine presenting women or like whatever it is whatever people it sucks that nowadays you like people feel like they have to not identify as like their sex at Birth to like explore those traits you know what I mean like it should be okay this may controversial for a man to like explore feminine things without being gay you know I've always been in the Arts I've always been a musician and that doesn't make you quote unquote feminine things as femin what the world yeah has categorized these activities as so I don't know where where I was going with that but like yeah no I think that that makes a lot of sense like there's this pressure from culture and Society but it's biblical there's Jacobs and there's Esau's yeah you know so it's like you're allowed to have feminine and and masculine um but yeah I I I know from just seeing Nick you know Walk With Jesus our whole relationship how much he's changed and I'm sure he's seen how much that I've changed and I think people that maybe don't really know the ins and outs of our relationship think like oh well they just changed overnight no this wasn't something that we're like it's not like Nick's like oh well I can't talk like this or I can't do this anymore it's just like God just started changing things it's not like we even had to think about it or M you know I yeah oh yeah I don't know how else to explain that I'm curious I mean your stories alone are like the ma just the biggest testimony of God's goodness and his grace and just it's so encouraging and inspiring to me I'm I'm curious for you all like you've seen what he's done in your lives are you seeing the beauty from ashes like are you seeing how he's you like what is how he's using what you've gone through for others are you seeing that yes yeah I'd love to hear what that's looked like yeah a couple of the prayer call calls you've been on especially that I've overheard and helped like helped out in very rarely um it's just cool to hear people's like own personal like relations to like our story and like a specific thing that they've gone through that we maybe have also gone through in whatever like either of our stories you know speak to them in that way so yeah it's been really cool like that one guy that you were on the prayer call with it was heartbreaking but I feel like such good seeds were planted like he was just saying no one he's he's like no one could the world is telling me no one could ever love me and all of this and my parents and very similar to like what things were spoken over you and now it was giving him hope oh it made me want to cry I was like it's like we can all go and find any motivation we need like online or whatever it is but if someone like actually looks in your eye and like mhm it's like you know I understand what what pain you were feeling in that moment it's just like such a human connection thing you know that helps yeah and I think it's something that's not really talked about a lot I think the church is unsure how to have the conversation or you know and and people ask us the question too like are you reaching more of the LGBT community and I'm like no I'm reaching all the Misfits um because when when God presents an opportunity and we pray and get the okay from him to go speak at a church it's not that there's a bunch of gay people coming to the altar I will never forget the first time that I spoke at church El at a Women's Conference and this woman came over and after I just listen to the Holy Spirit like if I go lay hands on people if I'm going to pray for people or to Worship the Lord led me to this woman and she was just weeping on her face and just uncontrollably crying and and I held her and she was telling me she's like I was going to kill myself tonight I've never been in this church um I've never had an encounter with God but as I was on my way to go to my house to kill myself the Lord told me take a left turn and I walked right in here wow she had no idea what event was happening she didn't know you know the topic of what I was speaking on and she said one thing that you said radically changed me you said that forgiveness isn't for the other person forgiveness is for yourself to release more space in your heart to allow God to heal you and she's like tonight I chose to forgive the man that raped me oh wow and that's what was driving her crazy to where she wanted to kill herself cuz it was she had night tears and all these things and she just fully surrendered and gave her life to the Lord and I just wept yeah because I think sometimes you know we get uncomfortable and we're worried okay is this 2 seconds of uncomfortability to talk about Jesus um going to be too uncomfortable for this person but it's like let's talk about salvation it's worth the two seconds of uncomfortability amen and like the level of vulnerability that we share with others N9 out of 10 times we're going to get that back amen and it's like we got to use our testimony to bring glory to God so to see that I think it's been it's worth it we do everything for the one so what would you say the difference is between like how the church responds to you and the lgtbq community responds to you now that's a good question I think we actually face more negativity from the Christian Community than we actually do the queer Community because there's so many Christians that think why would God use you yeah when befor more like people would would realize oh they're like a gay couple we're going to treat them like babies you know we're not going to let them in we're going to gep Jesus and just treat them as kids to entertain them for our church service welcome them into our home but like you would a kid like not let them you know have full rain or like you know wow and I didn't even realize that until now that that we weren't really quite like accepted like it was like acceptance on like like a facade but it wasn't quite like let's get into relationship with you and like dive deep yeah but even now we we get most of our hate from Christians still yeah wow yeah which blows my mind that's crazy blows my mind yeah that's crazy to me but I mean they hated Jesus too yeah I know it's like y'all are in good company Jesus says in somewhere in the scripture how much longer do I have to deal with the people man yeah that's mindblowing actually but I mean obviously God has raised you up not for the religious community but for the irreligious community we experienced that rejection like when personally when I experienced that rejection from the church you know wanting to go to youth group and all of that and you know being publicly said like like told you have to get up and go out because you're going to hell and you're not welcome here and stuff I remember driving away crying suicidal and the Lord's like you have to forgive them and I remember being like God why would you want me to forgive them but like God would give me this overwhelming amount of Grace to forgive and pastors would say like okay you're clearly walking with the Lord because I just said some horrible things and you're choosing to forgive me yeah like they would start to feel conviction so it's like God used that almost hate and he gave me the supernatural amount of Grace that I knew that even though I was struggling like he was walking with me and I just didn't know you know we'd be here now but yeah yeah there was just this grace that he he gave me to give people oh I love that I'm supporting even more now I'm like I love that that's you guys touch my heart man because you know there's so much in my journey of just dealing with push back and disbelief and struggle and just a lot of scars and Trauma and just being able to push through that and seeing God use it it's like phenomenal to me man so I don't I like I don't share the story that much but like when I was in I was with my my buddy Andy and we were in the Bronx and we're um we're walking on this bridge and I see this what what I I think is this woman in her face is bleeding and she's running and she runs into a pillar and bangs her head again against the pillar and I'm like what the heck is going on and as she gets closer I see that it is a man who's like transitioning into a woman and he runs to the bridge and he commits the jump and subconsciously my brain just reaches out and grabs him and and grabs him and holding him before he jumps and he's like let me go let me go I'm trying to meet God and I was like you can meet God on this side of the bridge I'm like I'm in shock like I don't even know what's going on um so we get him off the bridge and I'm holding him and he's bleeding and I'm like call 911 I'm telling people to call 911 they call 911 and the ambulance comes and straps them in and takes them away but it always stuck in me like what what was he struggling with like what is that what like what would put obviously we all have different struggles and I'm not saying like even his transgendered state was the the cause but my but I just empathize with him so deeply from that moment of just like man you know and so just to see y'all story and to see like man that internal wrestle and just God just showing y'all Grace I pray to God God has shown that man Grace and just loved on but it it what you all are sharing just brings so much joy to my heart man like I see scars but I see scars are the evidence that wounds heal and I see like your wounds and similar to Jesus he's just showing off his wounds saying healing is possible and your story just says he like I don't like you said Misfits there's no one too far way out to Like There's No One Like Jesus wants everyone goodness and that's really what I feel like your story articulates is like what's holding us back from running to the arms of the Lord like I don't know after meeting y'all I'm like what's holding you back yeah the story is crazy man um I like before we go I'm I do I'm curious just like now like if people are praying for you what's the opposition what are the things that people should be praying for the good the bad the ugly like how can they be praying for you all um I'll say definitely be praying for our marriage you know be praying for the protection of our family because it is a difficult topic yeah you know um and I would just say mainly pray for the hearts of those that are going to hear our testimony that's good because we know that like it's such a difficult conversation to have but just prayers that like it would come out in such a way filled with love and grace that magnifies the Lord that they know that they can be welcomed and yeah also like we're working on you know different things like funding to raise um a certain amount of money to get a bus to start this traveling Ministry okay so definitely prayers for that and yeah for us to reach you know the right people that God is leading us to and is there a website that you want to that people can go to to they yeah so on our Instagram we have a link in our bio and there's a giving option right there and so right now so far we've saved $118,000 towards the bus okay so we're almost halfway there let's go uh and we plan we're like okay God like we'll see the his perfect timing with that okay I love that man any additional no you said it perfect that's awesome man I'm extremely grateful for you all um God bless y'all man you guys are the the epitome of Salt and Light you are the epitome of man God can use anybody do anything and uh my heart's encouraged and I pray that you know the work y'all are doing we'll continue on I'm going to support so I'm going to put something on that van too thank you thank you man I love y'all man thank y'all so much for sharing thank you thank you