the events of the 30th of January 1972 which is when British soldiers from the parachute regiment shot and kill 13 innocent [Music] civilians hello and welcome to the latest film club where Tim Hitt and I discussed Bloody Sunday the 2002 film directed by Paul Greengrass now this is a very controversial subject and Tim and I do best to navigate our the way through it the movie depicts a watershed moment in the troubles after which it seemed there was no end in sight 13 civilians were killed and a 14th died two months later this pod is actually out before my interview with Peter Taylor which will be released next Saturday so when you hear me say listen to that you absolutely should but you'll need to wait until next Saturday make sure you subscribe so you don't miss out coming up I've got Siri py on Ukraine Charles Spencer on Charles II and plenty more in the meantime I'll hand you over to me and Tim huitt talking Bloody [Music] Sunday Tim here welcome back this is the film club listeners we are talking Bloody Sunday and this movie is directed by Paul Greengrass came out in 20 2002 I think actually it was a TV film but might have had a limited release on Cinemas and this is a film that obviously by its very name is a depiction of the terrible events of the 30th of January 1972 and listeners this is going to go very well if you're a regular listener you may already have heard my interview of Peter Taylor the legendary BBC journalist of Northern Ireland who arrived in Northern Ireland for the first first time ever the night of Bloody Sunday um but if if you haven't heard that please please really recommend go back to listen to him and me chat about the troubles and so this is a discussion with Tim um thanks very much for joining me Tim this is I think this is your choice thanks for having me uh yes I remember we talked about this a while ago I think it was because when we did our top 10 film historical film Paul greengrass's United 93 was on mine and we got to talking about this film because it should also be if that is then this should be so I think it was like you okay we've got to do this film because it's so good it really is it's a stunningly good film and I've been trying to find where to watch it for our listeners if they're trying to find it and I struggle to find it on on it's not on Netflix it's not on Amazon Prime I don't think it's yeah I don't think it's an Apple so if if you if listeners want to find another way of finding I I wouldn't not wouldn't say I can't I'd happily lend listeners my DVD of it but um yes but I can't agree if you go down the illegal route no no no I would never you're only robbing the filmmakers exactly and so okay so this this film 20 made in 2002 now it's interesting this film is the events of of the 30th of January 1972 which is when British soldiers parat from the parat reg regiment the first I think it's the first parachute regiment shot and killed 13 innocent civilians so this is a a terrible event and it destroyed any chance of the troubles being over anytime soon at the time so directly LED for to at least another 10 years of of conflict it boosted the the event itself boosted not the film The Event itself boosted the the ranks of the IRA with huge numbers of vol highly motivated volunteers and it was one of the key turning points in the troubles along with the hunger strikes in 1980 81 and then through to Andis skillin 7 and then the peace broke process that broke out and started under Joe m Joe major Premiership and then ended with with the Good Friday agreement with Tony Blair in 1998 so I think we've we've we're at the 25th anniversary this year of the The Good Friday agreement the the peace in Northern Ireland I have a lot of connection with Northern Ireland so it means a lot to me and I think this film is so powerful so well so well done shot in black and white which I think is important black and white oh oh really is that a technical you're picking me up technically I think it's just a very desaturated look so it's not it's not quite full on black and white it's like um very they' squeezed out a lot of the color kind of taken the little the Saving Private Ryan desaturated but a little further okay coming from a documentary filmmaker which you can tell I think you when you were saying it's such a good film I mean it's very difficult at some points to tell it's a film because it's so real that I would I think if you were to come in halfway through you would be forgiven if you thought oh they're just capturing some actual real event here but it's interesting you say that because this is a highly controversial event because obviously it involves the Armed Forces of United Kingdom shooting their own citizens and that's what that's what that's what it is well yeah no argument about that and but there I mean there's a Hu I mean certainly a huge argument at the time and there was a there was a a an inquiry took place the widgery inquiry took place within quite a short period of time which was effectively a whitewash and all members of the platoon uh invol or the the Paras involved in the in the in the shootings were absolved from from any blame which just made matters worse and weren't they actually decorated by the queen you're absolutely right he was he was awarded an obbe the following year but astonishing that that it is astonishing and I mean he himself has given interviews to Peter Taylor the the BBC journalist where he strongly defended his role and basically defends his men doesn't regret the thing it's it makes for it's interesting you know you read his interviews with him in uh with Peter Taylor and they're available and you you can get find find this stuff on YouTube so listeners I'll put links um in the show notes for for some of the links for the individuals involved but he is interviewed and and he completely defends his men in and these were acts that this film was made before the Bloody Sunday or in fact during the Bloody Sunday inquiry which I think began in 2001 this film was released in 2002 the Bloody Sunday inquiry ended in 2010 was the Prime Minister C David Cameron issued a a full apology on behalf of the British government quite rightly and so but this it's interesting this this documentary is made this film sorry I call it a documentary it's a film made right during the inquiry or just before the you know during the inquiry was being held to find out what happened and actually you know if you look at the findings and I've I've read summary document of the Bloody Sunday inquiry there's a very good book and listeners may be aware of my interview with Douglas Murray who wrote a brilliant book on the Bloody Sunday inquiry so I'll put links in for that as well it's a brilliant book dougas Murray no friend of Republicans is very clear on apportioning blame to those members of the parachute regimen and so we'll talk a little bit more about that but yes it's it's a it's a a hugely controversial I mean it shouldn't be controversial in that everyone should accept what happened but that wasn't the case the Army fought it particularly the parachute regiment and I think they would would challenge anyone who criticized what what happened on on Bloody Sunday but anyway so the film the film itself it's a TV film Tim and I was looking here and it cost it cost two million to make but it only made half a million in the box office but I assume because it was I think it was first shown on ITV so I mean get taken into account you know like like basically what I'm saying is it costs two million to make and I'm worried they only got half a million in the box office they lost money yeah I think it's I think it they did give it a limited release which I think is why it was eligible for for bafs I believe because you need a which it didn't qualify for in the state because it didn't get a theatrical release in the states I don't think in which case you aren't eligible for the big Awards because you I think you need at least a week in a cinema I think things may have changed but yeah so I I mean I think that's probably why it didn't make its money back because it didn't reach enough people which is a shame because it's you know I mean it's it's not easy it's not an easy watch it's yeah I'm a bit worried about one of our categories is best seen I mean I'm not sure it's difficult I mean well I mean you know for anyone who knows the film you know the meat of the film is is one particular sequence you know there's there's the stuff at the beginning that's a little bit you know you kind of want to put in inverted commas bit more movish in its setup you know just kind of like the lead up to the events but it isn't really a traditional narrative in the sense that you know it's it's basically just depicting a sequence of events that happened to the point where this is why I was saying before that you'd be forgiven to think that it's actually real because it it really does play like a documentary in I would say 90% of it but it is linear I mean with the last it's linear our last film club was a film D Kirk which was you know on first viewing a little bit confusing whereas that's not the case in this no I would say this is almost the opposite style of film making to Dunkirk which is an extremely polished piece of work is th this is is so raw and and rough you know evidently made by a documentary filmmaker which is what Paul Green Grass was and and you can see I think you can see in an instant that he got the born Supremacy because of this film you know the born the born identity which is the first film was a great film but green grass just elevated the second one into terms of his camera work in terms of the way he he it's fast editing and cutting and shaky camera and long lenses and and you just go yeah I mean this guy should probably direct most action films now I agree I think Supremacy is the best of of although I love the third um the ultimatum which he did as well of course but he he's he's um and then you know the the fact that he did United 93 in such a similar style and the thing is is he gets quite remarkable performances out of his actors you know we were talking earlier about one in particular who was in who isn't an actor in this film but gives as good a performance as any amazing actor does I think who is that uh so Simon man who plays the who plays it's a fictional version of the real character isn't it yeah yeah he plays Derek will for the commanding off the parachute regiment you know and he he's just he's he is so good because he's so real he did the Sim he did a similar thing with United 93 the the air traffic controller in that film was the actual air traffic controller on the day although we should we should be we should point out Simon man had nothing to do with Bloody Sunday no sorry yeah so he absolutely not involved at all whilst we you've brought him up so we should mention Simon man is an interesting character he was a I think a Scots guards officer who then later left the Army became a mercenary and he was involved in a coup in southern Africa and the coup then the plan was to I don't know if any listeners have seen the film wild geese but it sounds like the coup the people who ran the coup watched the wild geese and thought we should do this let's do that and I think the country was Equatorial Guinea yes yeah it was and Simon man basically was going to overthrow the government install a a government sympathetic to either Zimbabwe or or South Africa I think it was South Africa and there was a power broker who was funding it a sort of um wealthy individual involved in South Africa who might or might not have been Mark Thatcher the son of the former British prime minister Margaret Thatcher anyway the coup got like it was blown Simon man was thrown in thrown in jail in Equatorial Guinea for a while he was basically betrayed I think and it this all came out in the newspapers this is about 10 15 years ago so for listeners if you're interested it's worth a bit of a Google search to look into it because it's basically the wild geese in real life yeah and Simon man is the individual who was commanding it and he plays Colonel Derek Wilford the commander of the first Battalion parachute regiment that was responsible for the actions of that day and as Tim as you just said he's he's he's a very good actor he's I mean it's remarkable how good he is in fact because he's he's so good that of course this is a scripted film so when the other officers are you know in in in when there's chaos going on in the streets and the other officers are talking to him he's listening to them as if he has never heard these lines before and he responds in in such a natural realistic way you know when even little ums and and he's and and can't quite believe what's happened he knows exactly what's going to happen it's it's all written down but he does it so well that it's it's you know he's going to be in the running for a little category later on I would say but okay well we haven't mentioned and and and which is a crime we haven't mentioned the main star of the film I know that is a crime Jimmy Nesbit who is this is his greatest ever performance absolutely undoubtedly followed closely by The Hobbit I haven't seen that don't mention silly films when we're trying to talk of Cinema no I completely agree I say that but I'm terribly sorry um Ivan Cooper he plays Ivan Cooper who is a a me a prominent member of the sdlp the Social Democratic and labor party in Northern Ireland this was the this is a nationalist party that was Pro uh um uh a Republican party but but Pro uniting the island of Ireland but through peaceful me means unlike Shin Fain um so therefore you know John Hume most famously leader of sdlp probably responsible more than anyone if you were to name one person it'd be John Hume if you name two people David Trimble for the peace process and and so Ivan Cooper as a member of the sdlp a Protestant so not Catholic obviously and from Derry London Derry and he was the leader of this Civil Rights march on that day on the 30th of January 72 which ended in in murder and Jimmy nbit plays him and it's just from the opening scenes where he's organizing he's got all these annoying questions from people you know what about the placards and stuff like that and he's just doesn't have time for this annoying he has to have in the bedroom yeah but he's such a nice he's such a nice character oh yeah he's not rude to anyone no and you really sympathized with him when he's kisses his wife goodbye and then he's um and he's got to get the pH he's go I've got answer the phone and and he's being hounded by these people he's and and the thing is is the way he keeps repeating it's a peaceful March you know it's going be a peaceful March peaceful March and you know you just so sympathize with him when it all kicks off you know the terror in his in his face and his eyes think I was going to say that that there there's a moment where he can hear gunshots people are telling him what's happening the look that that Nesbit conveys is I don't know or he get it's just is yeah when when he's hiding behind a car I think and one of the guys comes out an older gentleman comes out is it the priest I think and he's like get down he's shouting get down get down and the guy gets shot and then he and James Nez just gets up and walks over to him and the guy is obviously dead the way he's looking down at him and sort of almost sh you know shock to the point where he can't move is so powerful he's brilliant really it's just a brilliant every every single actor in it from the young guys who at the beginning you know who one of the young guys who's married and has baby yeah and then he goes on the March and he's shoted they're all just so good I I don't know it's just like a brilliantly cast film and just brilliantly choreographed film because the chaos is so potent but obviously it's been carefully put together it hasn't it's based so chaotic it's based on a an account given by a number of witnesses that actually interestingly make up a lot of the the inquiry the Bloody Sunday inquiry which took 10 years and I think 100 million pound the account is the film is based on that account and I'm Not For a Moment saying that it's exactly the same as the the bloody Sunny inquiries findings but it's not far off so so we can talk about that but what what I you know one thing that I that I find very frustrating about the British involvement in Northern Ireland or the British army invol in Northern Ireland is there so for example the use of the parachute regimen why you're using a highly aggressive unit known for their I've said that you know known for their aggression they they were even they were stationed in Belfast they didn't really know Derry when they were placed over there they were there a week earlier for another demonstration that went all tits up no one was killed but they were they were criticized for using excess Force and so when they then here in in in Derry in londondary the commanding officer at the time Derek Wilford was saying that he didn't like the way that the the regiments that were based there before the Paris had got there had been a bit too passive not forceful enough and he was going to go in there and show the they called them the dairy Hooligans and I that in inverted commas and so he was going to show them what's what they didn't want to be another word he used another phrase he used was Aunt Sally's we didn't want to be Aunt Sally standing by a barricade being having Stones thrown at us and not do anything any response there was a a controversial message memo written by uh the I think it was the commanding officer of land forces who's played in this film by Tim pigot Smith brilliant he's maor General Robert Ford yes very sadly missed Tim Piet Smith Robert Ford had had had issued a a memo where he had it's a bit controversial and I don't want to get bogged down in in the Wares and the y4s but basically a phrase got picked out of what he had he had suggested which was basically for the Army to to go in hard and and this to me is insane you got a Civil Rights march okay so you're going to have a few idiots who peel off the March and throw stones yeah but they were used to that sort of thing I mean the throwing of the stones you know was just a kind of like a normal occurrence you know it's not something that you would go okay well now we're going to shoot them all and in fact there that line in in the film in the last sort of third of it where one of the parag guys looks at at his colleague and says what the hell what the hell are you doing you were shooting civies and the soldiers says no they're terrorists you don't kid yourself or something yeah I that that's partly yeah so they've they've heard what some of their commanding officers have probably told them you know and this is why like a blanket statement insane to send the Paras in at the time I actually asked Peter Taylor the journalist who's very who's very clued into all sides each side respects him and will speak to him so when I say each side the Army the ru which is now the psni in Northern Ireland the the Police Service the Loyalists par paramilitaries and the uh IRA and all respect him and when I said to him that I was amazed that the Paras were sent in such an aggressive unit they provide a huge number of recruits to the SAS they are they they're they're not Shrinking Violets by any means but he's he even with the benefit of hindsight I would still say it was an insane move to send them in and he was a little bit more understanding saying that you know you have to realize what was happening at the time because the there was a view that the IRA could be beaten and this was a way to beat them but this is a civil rights March so and that's not to say I don't want to sort of misquote Peter Taylor I mean he he is he he is hugely respected and doesn't for a moment sympathize with the Army on that day and uh if you want to hear more you should listen to my chat with him but I still I don't understand I think it was hugely irresponsible to send the parachute regimen in yeah as and and as we can see from the results yeah so we'll get to our category so the first category we we'll do best performance well I mean you can't really not give it the Simon Baker award for best performance the Simon Baker award for the best performance I you know I I I would say you the star of the film is is he's brilliant he it's such a great piece of work and he carries the whole thing on his shoulders really it would be a little unfair of me to say particularly if I were in the presence of James edsb to say I thought you were amazing however I do think that the award should go to the non-actor yeah the amateur yeah you know who is who is i' you I must say astonishingly good did he act I don't think he acted again no the only thing he's done and I think he did it because he he he didn't sympathize with the Army but he did want to to at least I don't know give a little Credence to the position there or or they they were shot at on the day they were shot at by because the IRA as it's interesting they is an actor in it and I I don't know the actor but he plays someone who looks a little bit like a young Martin mcginness right so he's wearing a sort of Parker he's got short curly Ginger hair oh yes he's commanding the IRA and J character goes over to him and says in the car yes yeah you're not going to cause us any trouble today and he says no you can have your little demonstration will will get out of your head he goes it's easy for you to say with your Westminster paycheck yes Yeah ironic given Martin mcginness was later a Westminster MP yes very if that was intended to be meant to be yeah yeah looked a little bit like a young Martin mcginness though but I think you've got I think we've got well I think I've got to nominate I've got to give it to James neb because it's it's it's his career best performance it's he's so good in it so so well done James he wins the aspects of History best Simon Baker best performance award um yeah it's incredible it really is I mean a shout out though to Tim bigot Smith he plays General Ford and then also Nicholas Farrell yeah like him he plays Aubrey in the not Charge of the Light Brigade he plays Aubry in the Chariots of Fire uh yes and is a wellknown sh he's always yeah he's in he's always in Kenneth Brer films he's he plays Horatio in br's Hamlet and and the lead one of the leads in uh the other another very small bran of film called In The Bleak Midwinter which is quite a sweet film which is about a bunch of actors putting on a production of Hamlet by the by Kenneth Brer famous son of Belfast of course yeah of course and and then I think another shout out to Jared molley who I I just think is a brilliant actor is in he plays there's a very good TV film made of the OM bom bombing where he plays he plays the father of one of the victims of the OM bombing which took place in in 98 killed 30 people or something he was the worst truste of the troubles J almost every single film about Northern Ireland yes yes he's in the box with Daniel de Lewis he is yeah he's in Braveheart he is in Brave I was gonna mention that yeah Jared M's actually he play but in this he plays he plays a ro the role of um inspector Chief Inspector Lagan who was um a member of the r the senior officer in Derry London Derry um the Chief Inspector of the r on the day and legan is an interesting character because he was largely ignored by the Army well as is depicted in the film indeed quite obviously yeah and he was a Catholic so quite unusual in the I which is po predominantly Protestant officers and he had involvement in I highly recommend the the Peter Taylor books but legan is an interesting character that that MSY plays is because he had a he had a sort of indirect line in through a through a friend of a friend of Martin mcginness so he had a kind of an IND indirect route into the IRA which was with which was helpful in that he could ask for weapons to be removed if there was going to be a demonstration taking place unfortunately I think I don't know the ins and outs of it I don't think anyone does but he was removed from his position a few years later and who knows why possibly because he was Catholic in in a lar Protestant but who knows anyway uh so we've done best performance we're now going to move on to the best scene which is is difficult because one doesn't want to describe it as best but no but it's I mean it it's just so real that the the when the shooting starts it's it's quite it's just like the cameras capturing this chaos Miss is bits of the action captures you know some bits wherever the camera's pointing obviously very planned out because you can't really do this and wing it I wouldn't say when you're making a film like this but it's so it's so gr it's so intense that I would probably have to to to say the best I it's kind of what the film's gearing towards isn't it I agree I've got to be honest some of the scene you know like for example the scenes with Jared m and Nicholas Farrell in the off when they're inside where uh green grass tends to shoot most of this film evidently with very long lenses so that the camera's a long way away from the actors kind of capturing it from a distance yes you know and and this just like quiet talk and and you know they're sort of talking at this level and blah but it's flipping intense stuff that that that scene where Nicholas Elliot Nicholas Elliot Nicholas Farrell who plays J uh Brigadier mlen he is talking General Ford Tim pigot Smith through the plan everything looks fine you know and they sort of we'll only send the Paras in if we you know get trouble and he seems to want sort of contain it and Ford's like uh yeah but we you know we need to send them in if if there's even a hint of trouble yeah and and you just see the sort of this is this is events moving whilst one man man which is the mlen character who's who's devised the plan and just events just completely get away from him and he is no longer in control I've got to give a shout out to even the little characters like the guys who in that same scene in the when pigot Smith is is being told what the plan is you know even guys who I mean I wouldn't even know their names as the actors but what when they're asked so you know what's the movement here there and where and the guys who who just start talking they talk not as actors who tend to talk fluently yeah but when you're making when you're when you're thinking on your feet and you and you don't know exactly what you're going to say there's a a stutter there's a little bit of it's a it's a bit of a a military patter there's a sort of military yeah and it's they nail it so well yeah that you go absolutely they've learn these lines though they've actually leared the script but they're doing it soldiers but soldiers and officers in particular don't talk like you or I do they talk like you know we've got to move our Bridge head here and then we move your men forward there and that's how we're going to do it and there's the so with yes uh we have the uh troops moving um the you know it's kind of like this kind of little stast so but the way it's the guys who are listening to the this podcast who watch the film now if they watch it after this just remember that point because they are so good even Simon man does it as well yeah he's listening to his his men but his eyes are kind of looking off slightly kind of devising as if he's actually picturing the situation in his head which maybe the reason why he's so good at it is because that's what he does yeah you know literally just doing what he does he's got a lot of experience yeah yeah James Nesbit I absolutely because he's you know at no point do you think well he's he's an actor playing the role he's just absolutely brilliant and and utterly authentic as well so I I Ag and the woman who plays bernardet Devin's very good I just I don't know if she's done anything ever since she's not she's not particularly I've not seen her in anything Mary mold met Mary molds yeah anything else I haven't either um but she's really I mean bernardet Devin is sort of wonderful Firebrand politician who never went all the way into Shin Fain and you know down the violent route I mean but was always passionate Republican was actually shot by loyalist shot many times by loyalist paramilitaries in the early 80s I think it was and funnily enough ironically enough the one unit that came to to save her I I say that in inverted commas because there's a lot of confusion about this particular attack but the parachute regimen took her to hospital after she was shot by lawy paramilitaries I didn't know that yeah so so she she I mean she's an incredible person bernardet Devin um right so so I think we have to say as horrible it is the scenes of of the Paras shooting innocent civilians is the most powerful scene in the movie No Doubt sure sure absolutely Okay so we've done best performance Simon Baker um Award for best performance goes to Jimmy Nesbit done best scen most unlikely seen this is going to be very very very difficult it depend you know this is where it gets a bit political because some people might argue that Martin mcginness was very active on the day so the vision of of of a Martin mcginness in his car if it is Martin mcginness saying oh don't worry we'll we'll we'll you know you you go and um do your thing and we'll we'll we'll chill out back here some people argue that didn't happen but I think by all accounts and I think the inquiry found this is the they did stand down that day so I don't know I I don't I I think it's going to be very difficult to find a scene that we find unlikely yeah because the thing is is the it's easy like when this scene was born in Argo which is you know a a a Hollywood film let's not as much as we love it it's a Hollywood film this isn't kind of you can't paint this with the same brush this isn't trying to soften any edges it's not adding any scenes in that is like you know we've got to make this a little bit more audience friendly and a little bit more accessible you know he made this film evidently going I'm G to depict exactly what happened so it's very tricky okay what about okay I'm gonna try and I'm gonna try and go through it and we've just talked about a scene involving the army officers there is no or at least the filmmakers I I don't know how they would have known that that that you know that you would have had that uncomfortable scene between the I officer and the and and the ML briger mlen and General Ford so I mean I'm I'm scraping the barrel here but if I if I were to be forced I would say maybe the scenes that we think are so good and effective are the ones that are maybe it's not even unlik I said do you think we're gonna have to suspend the uh we may have to yeah this speaks to the obsession with realism I have in film uh my favorite films the ones that are most realistic yeah I agree I mean to be honest I when I watch films like this and I I watched this last night again because I think that's probably my fourth time that I've watched it when I watch films like this it it and this is me um everyone who's listening when being a filmmaker they they shatter your confidence because that's you go if only I you're filming at the moment listeners Tim is is making a feature film as we speak yeah but now it's you know when I as I say when I watch something like this I kind of go actually maybe I should just just forget it all because it's these are such good films they're so well put together they like I don't but for two million that's actually in in for it cost two million to make that's not actually that much it's not that much but you but well it's not that much for a feature I mean this was made in 2002 so it is 20 years ago odd but it's quite contained even though it's outside with crowds on the streets but they probably did it I don't they didn't shoot in Dairy they I know that they didn't shoot in dery they shot in name for escaping me but regardless of that that probably actually wouldn't have cost very much money but it's the it's the realism that's so astonishing I mean it as I say you forget you're watching a film because it's so real which is credit you know it's real credit to the to pul Greengrass he's he's he's one of the best at doing this um no wonder he got the film after the borns after the film he did called green zone he did a a film called July 27th about the massacre in yeah it's excellent in Norway which is amazing as well it's because he's he doesn't gloss over with any sentimentality or anything he just literally goes for the point so this this didn't get a nomination of the Oscars which I think is because it wasn't officially because it wasn't officially released no but it was nominated in the batist for best single drama but it lost out to conspiracy the Brana one which is yes which is the depiction of the vany conference which actually is excellent It's really good yeah but I not sure you can compare it to this I mean it's in fact it is the opposite of this because that's in a room table for the whole thing I mean in all honesty I would pick this over that I mean I love conspiracy conspiracy is great but it's it's I still have an issue with things like conspiracy which is the whole you know they're all English playing the Germans talking in English but uh yeah I and and and this is this is I mean this was the the the the springboard for the Paul Green Rass his career and then of course he went on to make another film which I think is amazing called Captain Phillips with Tom Hanks which you know was the the birth of I am the captain now line uh which is legendary now and and you can see his style in pretty much every film he makes I would say maybe not so much in a film that he made with Tom Hanks or Weston which he wrote as well called News of the World which is an excellent film again based on a true story I mean he does well with his true stories which I recommend for listeners they haven't seen that it's on Netflix I think it's a it's a bit it's a bit comfortable it's the most comfortable film Paul Green Grass has ever made but it's still very good I think it's still powerful yeah great filmmaker amazing film so that's okay fine if you're G to go I think you have to sacrifice that category now I think we I think we're gonna have to no yeah it would feel very chish chish okay yeah okay so so Legacy I I I mean I don't know this is certainly it's certainly a lot to me this film but I don't know do you think it was seen widely and therefore has that kind of I don't think it's been seen widely enough I do know people who know it who think it's astonishing but they know films you know that they kind of watch everything like like you and I do but it's not I you know I don't think I've ever seen it in any 100 best films that ever made this would be in my top 100 films of all time oh yeah absolutely me too but I don't think I've ever seen it in any Empire magazine or timeout or I don't know channel four have done I think top films and blah blah blah I mean it really should be I'm sure the born Supremacy is in the top hundred fils on some list this really should be I think is arguably poor green grass's best film yeah well you will upset him if you say that because this is his sort of isn't this his first first feature film well yeah he cannot this is the where the whole TV thing comes in because he's made he made TV films before this of a feature length but I think this was the first that ever got a theatrical release orbe a limited one but you know he made up for it with his next film which was the the second born film so you know I'm sure he's happy well you know he he did a brilliant account of I think the book is it's interesting the book itself is important the book Blood I think it's called voices of Bloody Sunday eyewitness Bloody Sunday I think it is actually right which is what he's based the film on and it's you know obviously the clue is in the title and that was quite an important book in that it helped where with the Bloody Sunday inquiry as well so I think for that reason that makes the Legacy Mark quite High we' forgot to mention it also won the audience award at the Sundance Film Festival and it got the golden bear at the Berlin Film Festival which are both huge film festivals why it didn't get a theat a bigger release I don't know but it should have done it's got it now so here we are thanks to you and you it's now got its it's got its place as a as a legendary film so listeners is it really is worth hunting down and finding and if you have to pay pay and it's worth it because it's just a it's just a brilliant film and and as close to what happened is we'll probably ever get yeah absolutely and I I think it is available on DVD so so what a DVD is what like two pounds now so I I'd highly recommend hunting it down if you can brilliant well Tim thank you so much again we'll we'll be joining up uh it'll be July and we'll have another film to discuss but we haven't worked out what that is yet but we will I'm pushing I'm pushing well we should I would say it would be sacriligious not to talk about Oppenheimer when it comes out nice one that sounds because it's it's extraordinarily significant okay let's do that and then we've got you know well we've got the whole of Cinema to choose from and I'm I'm still rooting for gipo in my list we'll do gipo okay Tim thank you thanks so much bye everyone thank you very much for listening links are in the show notes and don't forget to listen to next Saturday's episode with Peter Taylor on the troubles until then thank you and good [Music] night