Transcript for:
Interview between Upsilon Zeta members, Spring 84 and PG lines

all right Jackson go ahead all right good evening Brothers um I'm happy to be here with uh you guys tonight uh my name is Jackson Farrar I'm uh number four on uh the spring 74 line UPS Salona chapter I'm also a member of the uh U 50th history committee and um tonight we're glad to um be conversing with the spring 84 line um looking forward to the interview um sure it's going to be entertaining and enlightening so um um looking forward to just uh hearing your your story and um what um your impact is on the U chapter a little bit about myself I am um um currently living in Garner North Carolina I'm originally from carry North Carolina and um I um was a business major at ECU and um just I'm currently retired and living the good life so again it's good to be with you guys and I will let the rest of the history committee introduce themselves beginning with um the co-chair uh Mr Delaney what's going on my my friends um Brian fall 89 uh Upsilon Zeta East Carolina University uh Trey dog honcho on my line um I am uh I'm excited to be here to talk with you guys it's been a long time coming um you know um so I'm excited uh to hear what you guys got to say and um I want to say thank you for taking the time out to to join us right now and um you know we're looking forward to speaking with you okay I jump in uh Mara Murphy fall 94 um I'm Brian's back ensured that he crossed um also like later but go ahead go ahe uh currently reside in Silver Spring Maryland and I'm so excited for this interview um tonight so um thank you Brothers all right um Ryan if you're listening in um I'll let you introduce yourself I don't think he not on all right okay well we'll start with uh you guys spring 84 let me let me hear you guys spring 84 good evening Brothers uh my name is Arthur Burks Ace dog uh I currently reside in in Raleigh North Carolina now born and raised in fedil and uh just glad to uh be part of this uh 50th presentation that we're doing tonight pretty excited um so just looking forward to uh hearing what the brothers got to say and and uh every now and again you'll get some input from me as well okay uh I'm Jeff cedy I'm uh a native of Washington DC I currently reside in Tacoma neighborhood of Washington DC uh I'm Number Two spring 84 um so I look forward to this particular uh event and to continue the legacy of the UC chapter of Omega SciFi uh I'm Bruce Murray number three spring 84 uh from Morehead City North Carolina currently residing in Morhead City North Carolina um I'm a commercial electrician right now and uh I'm excited to be here with my lbs and to participate in the uh the historic event good evening Brothers I'm John lud um I'm from Anson County we say Anon County uh it's North Carolina county because the town sh you wouldn't know it from a small town called Ansonville um I was a number four of course glad to be here with some mother fors tonight and I I currently reside in the Charlotte area and um I'm I'm very excited about tonight uh and really get to relive some stories from my lbs we haven't chopped it up in a little while so it's just good to to uh come to this occasion uh 35 plus years which is unbelievable since the day we cross and I'm just looking forward to it so bro little what are you doing now as for me uh I'm finishing up a career in public health actually I'm gonna join you uh Jackson in retirement I've been kind of putting it off but um Wednesday is uh Wednesday before prior of Thanksgiving is going to be my uh last day at work and uh oh man congratulations BR congratulations BR congratulations man I Haven really shared that with very many people but I'm glad to kind of share it publicly I guess with my lbs and with spent a career in public health uh I don't know how I got here but uh I'm where I was supposed to be I I went to East Carolina as a computer science major didn't know nothing about computers didn't get a program right all you know all the while I was there we was doing back processing and that type thing uh so you know I know I wanted to get out of school so I had to switch Majors I I switched to Industrial technology um that's what a lot of brothers did when you know you look up after your South Moore junior year and say you know hey I gotta get out of here I was an industrial technology major a concentration in electronics I got out thought I was going to take on the world I thought the world was you know waiting for me uh had a few difficulties getting the job start you know you know I'm going to do something I'm just not going to sit around so I I start working in textile man working third shift sometimes 12 hour shifts and uh uh in um I think it was April of 87 or somewhere there about my mom took me to my interview uh which was about 50 miles away and after getting off a third shift job and uh came to Charlotte it was a it was a job Public Health I got the job and thought it was just going to you know stay there for you know until I got back in industrial technology and long story short I you know I'm coming up on 35 years in the field and wow is where I was supposed to be all the while that's what's up bro congratulations thank you got got lots of room on the couch for you all right well let's let's I dive into this um um this will be my first time I think talking with u you brother Murray yes sir of course met um Brother Art and brother John and Jeff I miss you on on the committee man I thought you were gonna be hanging with us hanging out with us for a while I have been absolutely uh swamped with work and responsibility so oh it's all but um what I'm what I want to ask first off is um uh what was it that um made you guys decide to come to Greenville um uh particularly when did you come when did you first arrive at ECU uh what was it that brought you there and what was um Campus Life about when you got there and uh brother M brother Murray I'mma let you start us off if you would all right um I came I graduated West Carter High School in Morehead in 1983 so I came in the fall of 83 uh for my freshman year the reason I came to Greenville not many schools would accept me uh I didn't have a lot of college prep courses with the exception of math I was real strong in mad so I was able to get over some of the other hurdles and got into ECU so I went with that and uh as far as uh wanting to be a q uh I had uncles and a couple of cousins down here that was already cues and uh that was all I had seen before I got to East Carolina and uh pretty much had it locked in my head but I said I would give it a chance look at the others and uh see what it was but it was it was already locked in uh as far as I was concerned right and uh then I met these guys so what was your impression of Greenville once you um first arrived well at that time Morehead was a super small little town so I had been released it seemed like uh it was like going to the big city for me and uh uh it was a lot more black people because where I'm from I mean we had black people but not that many so just the black people on the yard was more black people that had been around at at one time you know so and uh I was a kid you know I was nervous you know and uh just nervous and excited you I I never forget it I was in Jones Hall uh first semester right on looking down out the window out the hill right in the middle part like the middle of the H looking straight down the hill out to the road and I just just stand in the window just looking people go by because I ain't know nobody and I was kind of nervous to go out the room I was like I want to go out there but I don't know what's going on you know so I was just excited and I I was glad to be there cool cool what about you brother Jeff I ended up in Greenville because I wanted to be close to my grandmother's I wanted to play division one football and um I wanted to be close to both my grandmothers one of my grandmothers was in Selma North Carolina and the other one was in Spring Hope North Carolina and um I originally wanted to go to University of Virginia and it didn't work out you know to play football and turned down a couple other scholarship offers to come to East Carolina so my first impression of Greenville um I love the anesthetics of the University um but when I learned a little more about the culture I thought I had fallen into a Twilight Zone you know I'm from Washington DC and to see the culture of North Carolina in eastern North Carolina in the mid 80s or the early 80s um I thought I had fallen off the planet and gone back about 30 years in time it was um it it was a you know it was a culture shock and I had experienced one culture shock similar to that when I went to seventh grade from the sixth grade neighborhood in which I I grew up in and so this was the second experience I had uh like that so you know I I just made the adjustment finding out more about the culture finding out more about the people and just you know just tried to give it time soall e you oh oh hold on Jack jackon Jackson hold on one second what was the shock Jeff uh the like I say it was a completely different culture uh it was much slower the values the values the Moors the um the speech um okay uh just you know the thinking you know um uh and then having to deal with Sega having to deal with whites and blacks who didn't really interact with each other on everyday level um that was completely weird you know I never told this story but uh my freshman year the first party I ever went to was like one of the white fraternities and I went down on the yard thinking that you know uh went down to the party thinking that you know all the blacks and the whites were going to be together I think I may have been the only brother there so I quickly realized oh this this ain't going to go down like this so uh you know I I started seeing very quickly um what the racial atmosphere was in North Carolina at that particular time and you know that was a huge shock I mean I was I mean I was just surprised that whites and blacks didn't really um intermingle party and and socialize on all different levels thank you Jackson you were asking them about football no no well yeah I was just curious did you ever play football I just played one year yeah I played my freshman year and he's gone okay cool BR all good evening Brothers uh what brought me to Greenville eventually uh was a track scholarship I had uh sever football offers along with uh track uh but actually let let me let me back up I came down to play football at ECU um but I had already signed um the scholarship for track so back then they would not let me do uh both Sports so I was you know I won't say stuck with running track but that that's what I end up doing um of course I did have other choices I I I had a scholarship down uh in Clemson it was only for one year um NC State Carolina Elon you know some of the smaller colleges around but it was uh was almost like peer pressure because three other guys that uh went to high school back in fville with me we all end up coming to ECU on track scholarship so unlike you Bruce I I I had some friends right away I knew some people um I guess when Jeff was talking about that blacks and whites didn't really mingle and everything that was pretty much opposite for me uh because I got along with a lot of uh you know white students right away uh the school that I went to in you know in fville it was pretty much 7030 but a lot of military based people I was able to just uh I guess just just just fit on right on in and didn't have that that that issue um I don't know I was just so so excited so gung-ho to you know get away from my parents um being in a Strange Land taking on responsibilities myself and um like I said I had some some some real good friends uh that we kind of hung together as as um as a as a as a track team per se um and believe it or not two of them were kappas and we're still you know tight as of today I mean we we pretty much grew up since first grade and uh we're we're still tight uh culturally like I said I I pretty much got along with just about everybody there um so what what was uh I mean other than the the um two races intermingling or whatever what what was the social life what was that about you know when you got got on campus were there many parties concerts or anything along those lines um well ECU believe it or not they they were known for party school back in the 80s I mean it was in Sports Illustrated it was you know in the news it was a per se partying school yeah um we made it that way yeah yall got there before we did um and it was and I I think what what what hug each other what really just turned as me was the first time that I saw uh a panty raid my wife is here I can't talk so loud yeah y know my wife too but anyway I mean I'm sitting in the in in the dorm room and I hear all the screaming and yelling and screaming and yelling and you know it's it's it's it's what they called a a a panty raid yeah so here I am right in the middle of everything running around trying to grab throw have fun and it was like it was just like one big family it was like everybody was on the same page because we were all trying to you know accomplish the same thing so I didn't I didn't see black white um you know back then so it was just known as a party school and I fit right on in because I I did my share back then yeah gotta gotta all right bro little yeah um regarding the racial overtone that that's kind of really why I ended up at ECU um I came in 1982 I had visited ECU for a basketball camp um leading up to that you know a year or so before that and um um my my parents are well my mom is a high school graduate my dad uh he dropped out to to help help the family so I I didn't come from a family that knew a lot about college I I was fulfilling that for them um you know because of the sacrifice and that type thing so when I can't got to ECU in 82 I'm you know being perfectly honest the main reason I came is I thought that I needed to learn how to get along with white people my school where I grew up in was predominately you know 8020 7030 black white situation and I thought the rural you know I had to go learn how to get along with with white people um the irony of it all I I mean I I had some white people that I associated with but I can't say that I left East Carolina with one white friend and um you know part of that was probably me but we'll talk about probably some of that later just the burden of being black I really felt that and how I was going to you know face the world going forward being very naive I I thought I could prepare myself at East Carolina when when I got there we were talking about what was going on in in in Greenville and that type thing be perfectly honest I I don't really know I mean I Greenville East Carolina was Greenville to me I didn't get off campus very much only when I went to church but I kind of we were kind of insulated I was insulated with what was really going on in the world and at that particular time there was a certain freedom for students that you know I didn't see before like like art was saying the panty raids and they had keg parties out there I wasn't a drinker or anything like that but I hadn't seen anything like that um you know the the parties that we had that I attended of course were you know frat parties or you know parties uh for black organizations so it wasn't like any intertwining with with white people anything like that but uh I had a great time you know in 82 it was a great time well other than the U fraternities and sorties what were some of the other organizations that were active on campus at the time well I think the Gospel Choir had a had a a big presence there um um one of the big organizations or entities was one my frat brother ended up leaving uh Jeff uh you know the newspaper that he uh her yeah that was over so you know maybe let him talk about the influence of that um first let me give sort of a lineup of different groups that was at East Carolina we had Souls um the NAACP we had uh uh various organizations the ECU Gospel Choir was very influen with as John was saying um I did change the name of the eony Harold to the Expressions okay and I I'll give I'll talk a little bit more about that later um uh it it was a vibrant it was a viant uh uh uh black community among on campus and that was something that I learned a lot about um I think that the the for me the lessons of East Carolina uh was something that I knew that I could take and use for life and I'm I'm grateful for those lessons that I learned on campus um and I don't think I would have learned them in well in a unique way um that I learned them outside of being in Greenville excuse me in eastern North Carolina at that particular time okay so now if I can just uh follow up a little bit you say you switched to eony herl which um was formed while I was uh I think it was my might have been my freshman year but you changed it to something called the expression tell me a little little bit more about that okay uh my freshman or my my freshman year uh or maybe my sophomore year there was uh a growing pressure always to exclude African-Americans from certain aspects of campus life right so the Deltas and uh Sharon Kaiser was the general manager of the ebony Herald when I came in and um she along with Crystal Frey were working um you know having arguments you know with different organizations who were trying to end the eony HL because they didn't want black folks representing themselves right so you know I I listened to the arguments they were making to try to continue the magazine and I knew I had enough wisdom at that time just enough wisdom at that time not to go tell those sisters how I thought it would be best to be able to say the organization so I just kept it to myself and I just methodically went about um putting myself in a position to one day get uh that particular position on campus so um when I when I got hired for the job I uh changed the format and I had a wonderful editor at that particular time Ruben Iram and I also had Jimmy Hackett working with me and um they were constantly at odds with each other I think uh Ruben just fired Jimmy so I bought Jimmy back and uh and then I eventually fired him but you know then we came back again I mean it it was an amazing experience I mean one time me and Jimmy we actually uh I went to him and I by this time we had won the top Awards in the country for journalism and this was right after that um the first year of the ebony Herold I mean excuse me of the Expressions we won the best meeting the most improved medium on campus that was the first thing that we won uh the next year we won Top Awards in the country for journalism and but we won them they won the awards for talking about how racist East Carolina was and the university wasn't too happy about that okay so uh I sat down with Jimmy because you know he hadn't delivered what I told him to deliver on time and I fired him and then I realized that you know white folks on campus would use this against the black folks so I went to him I said hey man we can't sit down there and do this you know we can't have white folks dividing us on campus we need to have united front so whatever I need to do to apologize to you I apologize you know I bring you back you know but we got to have united front so at that time Nick was they Nick was engaged through my cousin and he was dating um he he was dating this little reporter tell the story Nick Nick Nick look very happy his interview he Ain thinking about that that's right that's right and so we went to the reporter we went to the reporter her name I can't remember her name but we went to the reporter and me and Jimmy got on Channel uh got on the local news and we blasted East Carolina and they were so mad because now we they tried to play us against each other now we're on the news I mean and we're just going at the University so that made them you know even matter at me because and So eventually this is one of the stories I don't think I've ever shared with the brothers so the university basically tried to fire me but they couldn't because I had just won the top Awards in the country so they tried to replace me so they told they told the students they brought all the black organizations together and at the culture center and they said we want y'all to have a meeting the side you know do the students still support Jeff Canon so it was about 116 117 people in the meeting and the meeting lasted for about 45 minutes maybe maybe an hour so they took a vote at the end of the vote it was a the vote was 116 students voted for me zero voted against me and one abstained and that one of St was [Laughter] Cordell wow that's pretty interesting so so the bottom line is you were a troublemaker on campus huh no I mean I like I said I had a vision of how we could approve black life on campus oh yeah yeah I'm I'm I'm just messing with you bro and I went about methodically planning I went about methodically planning putting in motion that Vision that I had I kept it to myself I didn't let the the school know anything about what I plan to do um and God sent me everything I needed all along the way and let let me let me ask you this is that publication still on campus yes oh okay cool cool when you walk into the new student center uh from the I guess from the East side soon as you walk in you'll see the Expressions it's not in its current form but uh the form that we left it in but is it's still on campus wow that's that's awesome man well moving on a little bit um now that you guys are pretty well established on campus um I'm just curious what was it that um made you decide that you wanted to become a part of the omegas uh the purple and gold now I know um Bruce you said you've got um um Brothers in your family so that was your connection I'm sure that was your your biggest influence but I'm just curious about the rest of you guys what what was it that um brought you into um becoming an Omega anybody well I I'll start off I'll say something um well I I didn't have any Big Brothers Big Sisters that that um pledged any kind of fraternity or sorority be honest I didn't know much about omegas until I had to take him to court and we might get to get to that a little bit later on okay um but all jokes aside I mean that's that's how I met a lot of the omegas and knew who they were and what they were about uh mainly because the the semester that the year before I uh pledged my roommate went online and I'm sure you guys know the story about how he ended up dropping and taking uh Court your roommate my roommate his name was Tony Jones uh he was also from fville he was he was also on the track team and I've known I had known him since you know pretty much first grade pretty much all my life but he was not built uh to pledge put it that way okay and when things went sideways um with the Frat he end up having to take them to court um I was I was away that weekend I just came back and saw my dorm room uh in shambles you know all my little Jet magazine pictures they were burnt the screen was pulled out I mean the room was a mess and I'm like what in the world happened um so I guess it was Dean Spears back then he uh wanted me to uh tell what happened which I didn't see anything I was gone I just had to tell him uh about how my room looked but Lo in the hole a couple of the cues Reggie holiday and Barfield and all them they kind of remembered me when I end up going online so they was like yeah that that that's the guy that took us to court oh yeah we going to we're going to we going to make sure he don't go over e either but during that process I had um met some of the brothers Carl you know uh Zod not me just going up to him and saying hey my name is Arthur what's your name blah blah blah it was it was always um camera's going crazy it was always me observing what was going on um so I um just just just kept my distance I actually um saw how the Kappa uh pledge period was going because my best friends Ruben Pierce Eddie Bradley they also was on the track team both of them pledge uh caer together and I was like this this this ain't a real Brotherhood I I I I love y'all to death but I I don't I can't see myself doing this and they just knew since you know we had all grew up together and they pledged that I was going to turn around and and and pledge uh Kappa but that wasn't for me um but I I mean the brothers they did have a lot of good stuff going on on campus uh the unity between them I mean it was like you would you would always see two or three of them together because there was close to 20 Brothers on on on the yard if I'm not mistaken I mean it was a lot of them so I mean I just like The Way They Carried themselves you know stuck together and um that's what kind of led me that way so even though you [Music] were I I'll say at odds to some extent with with some of the guys on campus you still decided that you wanted to to go in that direction what was it that kept that uh kept that drive in you um it just really goes back to my my my line name y'all know my line name uh Etc you know I just had to continue to you know just see it through and just uh not give up just I mean that was my mentality back then I mean I was always on the go and I just I just didn't want to give in too easy um that that that pretty much summed it up right there okay okay little what was it that that uh made you look towards Omega yeah um again I when I came to school I didn't know very much about fraternities as sororities I I had an older friend who had went to North Carolina Central he's about four years older than me and I would hear him talk about the BR and he would describe it so when I got to East Carolina I I finally got to see the BRS but more than anything I I just observed what was kind of going on I did get to know several people and one of the most influential people was uh Donald Gatlin laad play ball a lot in in uh in the gym and he worked in the gym and so I got to know him a little bit Reggie holiday was a good friend we came in together in 82 uh got to know Reggie um you know personally uh outside of Omega um and uh you know we had a lot of lot of things in common and those type things so um the bottom line is you know I saw some other things that was happening and um you know bottom line is I mean the BR was viewed as the best and of course I wanted to be a part of the best and having played Sports a lot you know I did uh value um you know what sports brought so I was looking for that kind of Brotherhood so I did you know looking at people like Carl Pro who had that Persona as being almost like super cute at the time and relationship with Reggie holiday and with Donald Gatlin um you know the BR was the way you know if I was GNA do anything it was gonna be with the brothers and I knew if I started then I had to finish yeah or I had to leave the university um I got on with that and um and here I am gocha what about you remember I remember being a Freshman yeah I remember being a Freshman and thinking well they just got suspended so we probably ain't gonna have it too hard that was not what happened that is not what happened thinking it should have been but it wasn't yeah we said that just got off suspension so it ain't gonna be was so hard yeah yeah my my my you know my roommate took y'all to court y'all know who I am right didn't care Brothers didn't care so um uh brother Murray tell me a little bit more about your family members who were a part of the fraternity uh um but my uncle my mother's uh oldest brother he pledge way back uh uh Elizabeth City and the the cousin I'm talking about is his son um he also plays at Elizabeth City um they were both LG and uh he came home with that brand and I saw the brand I messed with it on his arm and stuff you know and never forget it and uh and he'd I'd always just pick at it all the time and he'd tell me that was he was a cute and I was like what's a cute you know he be trying to tell me you know he would do little steps you know little step and I'd be just looking at him going man that's crazy so when I did you know I kept it in my mind and and and when I did get to the yard and saw the brother stepping and all that I was like wow man it's real you know and I just like like the brothers was saying it was it was quite a few Brothers on the yard and uh I was peeping those guys and wondering you know if I could get in you know really I was wondering if I could M you know would they take me cuz these guys look like they got it together you know and uh so really I was nervous about trying to get in because it just seemed like they were so much more together than I was and and uh I had came to the moment of truth and I was like well you know I'm G try it and uh that's when I met these guys and like the rest of them say once you go on back then it was no option of getting off they had to you had to be almost dead or something or something it ain't no I quit it wasn't none of that in it so yeah once we started it wasn't no quit was no quit yeah and that's one of the things I'm very proud about our line hard times with our line name is that um I mean some people take pride in maybe some people dropping off that line but I I take pride in the fact that all four of us stuck together and a way to make it and you know from beginning to the end I really I don't know that I really knew my lbs prior to us engaging in the Omega process I don't neither I didn't know none of y'all I met y'all at the smoker yeah the smoker I met y'all yeah yeah yeah we didn't know each other so it was just you four from the beginning to the end just beginning remember we had a remember we had a bigger group a interest group that was bigger remember right like nine of us or something like that and and when it came down to it it was just us four that actually went through the process and and we went from the beginning to the end okay yeah I mean we we stuck it out and um I'm I'm still not proud to say this but I end up you know losing my track scholarship because I was so far in it was like you know four or five weeks in and you know I'm struggling to practice and Coach is like coach Carson Bill Carson yeah is like you know what what what's going on he he he knew what was going on and he told me that you know if I wanted to continue scholarship I would have to you know quit that fraternity so I don't even know if I even really you know told my obes you know what I was going through as far as you know losing my scholarship versus continuing to pledge but that was you know the hard times we we we just couldn't give up could give in I mean I knew I would have had to go home if I would have lost my scholarship and and still couldn't pledge so yeah so that was that was that was like one of my toughest decisions ever yeah go ahead J so let me um my pathway uh to Omega um I had a Godfather and cousins who were brothers and my godfather was probably like my father um I spent every day with him almost and he pledged at the University of Pittsburgh back in 53 and when I came to Greenville I don't know how I met Andre but I had two cousins on campus and matter of fact I do I met Andre through my cousin Phoebe spring yes and Phoebe was uh as I told you engaged to Nick at the time so me and Andre became friends and I uh I uh I used to ride every time Andre went home and he Andre went home like every other weekend I would ride with him go see my grandmother so you know I was in and at that time sad and Andre were roommates and so um I would go over there and socialize with them and then on the weekends all the BR I mean all all the brothers would be at my at at Nick's house you know cooking out and I would be over there with them and I was I was the only one that wasn't the Bro nobody ever said anything I mean they nobody I never felt uncomfortable for uh two seconds and this was happening on the regular on the regular on the regular so I was like okay I can do this you know I can do this and um that is you know my orientation to the brother I knew uh I knew just about all the BRS um on on you know in the chapter um before I pledged and like I said I met my lbs at the smoker um as far as someone dropping I can say from the first night online I knew what n my lb is gonna drop and and I and I was I was quite confident in that I was like from the first night or lie it was like uh no ain't nobody going through this and then gonna be walking around campus yeah not you know no huh we met Tony H let's get it only met the brother one time look I see him every other day I see him all the time when we met Tony and Tony hust gave me a thunder smack yes smile oh hell no this not only not only am I gonna play as soon as I get offline I'm G punch you right in his face Tony is Tony is my cousin we he's from Morehead too he's uh I grew up with Tony my grand my grandfather and his grandmother's sister and brother and so Tony got word I was online and he came to see us boy with a with a with a boat or I mean first night online we what we was in for and it you know it was sort of interesting because I think you know some kind of way even though I heard what Bruce said there was this little thought that you know BR just got off suspension yeah they ain't gonna go that hard on us yeah but somewhere the First Night we realized oh hell no yeah oh yeah the first night that all changed first night on it was interesting as you were saying you know we met Tony hust the first first night we were online and everything and and then that they held that over us all the while we were online Tony coming back Tony yeah yeah it was kind of interesting and that's the way we got to know a lot of the brothers actually a lot of the brothers that we never saw online they would tell stories about them and then of course as we learned our history we would hear about these people and it was kind of it was just so fascinating man like you said uh you know dropping wasn't an option but I tell you uh after the first night or that first week I didn't know how I was gonna you know finish up hey y remember shut up y'all remember they used to to call us down there and make us think we were starting we go run into the to the center and they would they know nobody come you remember that they did us like a couple times they like meet us at at the uh you know the studio Center we run out there run out there we stand out there we just stand there nobody never come we go so when when they actually called it was like it's another Bluff but boy they came oh boy did they come son it was crazy but they had us standing out there a couple nights ahead of time just waiting up there nervous and nobody never come I said these Jokers is crazy came they came yeah yeah when they came they came you know we were kind of unique too that we got to see a lot of the older brothers Brothers close to the found and brothers um and uh you know while we were there because uh you know with Willie Everett being our dean of pledgees a more brother who still campus yeah of course you know we had I think we were just better because of that because you know he he was very mature and wasn't really engaging and was there really kind of protecting us but way but uh he he you know in his own way uh was not gonna allow anybody to get into Omega you know kind of way well in one way we were fortunate another way we were unfortunate yeah cuz once he get mad and go in the room on us and he go to room and go to bed on us he go to bed onou now how the fortunate part about it was that we had wow we had a Dean who had pledged in 76 that all the brothers respected yeah so they knew that we wasn't GNA come into the front yeah that was the good part about it yeah the bad part about it was at that particular time they had a house on what was Harding Street Harding Street oh yeah yeah they had the house 33 because they had a house they had a place that we could regularly meet and nobody it didn't matter how much noise you made nobody was gonna come that's right the coldest house in Greenville too right except that night except that night it was so hot I passed out remember and then the unfortunate part about it was once again we had brothers who didn't get to completely finish pledging the line before us yeah and then we had The Misfortune that the Frat was going change the pledge rules the semester behind us so we so it you know it was Nightmare I mean it was it was just a straight Nightmare on El Street I mean yeah I mean but it was recurring nightmare so you got a chance to get the Rhythm and get used to it and about the second or third week just didn't care no more I mean it was just it's like whatever it was on it was on auto it you know it was like whatever about about the second or third week so the third week if anybody was goingon to drop us it was goingon to be each other we was gonna drop each other yeah you and Jeff you and Jeff was about ready to kill each other the whole time about that time by then our butts was hard and stiff it was we had hard butts I mean you could it was like wood you it we didn't care about wood no more we take it all night we was ready but the brothers did ask the question what when was the moment that I learned something about my lbs what you say now and it brothers did asked the question when was it the moment that I learned something about my lb it was the night I took the might 100 and my lbs I mean you could look at their eyes they was like is that the time we drug you back up to your no you didn't drive whole about that big I mean and you know I knew at at that particular well it was just a different it was just different after that yeah I agree it it was completely different after that because their demeanor and their attitude changed you know and it was like uh you know because at first it was like we they was they were at that particular time trying to avoid in some ways you know taking some of the harshest things that the brothers could give and they was like well maybe we should do this and maybe we should do that and then when they saw that they was like ah the hell with that you know the br's going to do what the br's going to do and that's what I was trying to convince them of the whole time he was gonna ly the brothers gon whether we do it right or wrong they still gonna do what they gonna do yeah and that that didn't mean you had to do it wrong well that just changed the tone Y sound like y'all had a wild card well no I mean that just changed the tone of the whole pledge of spirit because at that point Elizabeth City was coming back they was staying for about a week they wouldn't go home then they come back the next week and stay for another week and it was sort of like you know what it don't even matter yeah you know we we were in such a rhythm and our butts were so hard it was like it don't really matter what they do you know and it really didn't matter they just wasting it was sort of like they wasting time yeah and and that was the thing that I really realized that wait a minute that all the physical stuff that you know the brothers you know would throw at us it was like oh that's that's just Petty you know and it really made the last two or three weeks like and even Hil week Hil week went all I mean it was like what was different from Hil week from the what we had experienced the rest of the time yeah I kind of I I agree with you Jeff on that um yeah we had experience hell week before we got there right and you know I have to give you props uh you know you you knew hell week I I I have to I have to say that um and you know being very distre about everything um you know we learned some things about each other but we definitely learned some things about Jeff and we know uh you know when you're online when one person goes through something everybody kind of goes through it and kind of jump in um but there were occasions that you know we were not allowed to jump in on certain things that's right right justo Jeff was alono they just wanted you was forced to you know make his way across the Burning Sands uh in his own way it won't no you know it was like the poem say you know when it's vain to try to dodge it you just got to do the best you can do um you know we we all would like to say that we can we would do something but and I you know like I said I I knew that I wasn't going to drop but by the same token if my route was the same as my lb my honcho you know I know already a little Twi anyway because it it it wasn't the history we we we knew our history we was on point I mean he probably couldn't St that good but get else pretty decent yeah at some point yeah it weren about what you knew it was about just the road that was you yeah and uh I have to say you know there were times that Jeff's Road was more uphill than now that's right and that night we was talking about earlier there where we ran that where we got away from the house was the first time we decided on our own to run remember we used to always talk about rolling out you know it get too rough it gets too rough we got roll out got to roll out that was the first time we we actually put it in the motion and we rolled out more and they were so mad they chased us with cars trying to cut the screen open and everything that was at the screen we know you in there we was in there just rocked up in the corner man we had rolled on them that night and they were we had movie yeah it was like like a movie they was chasing us then lights across the field we land in the field like in the Army oh man I forgot all about that I forgot about that remember we came up the back road that comes of the hill where the houses was we had to come all the way from over hard Street cross campus jumping in fields diving in leaves yeah went up the back way remember that the funny thing about it was you know and this is the thing about being Honcho when you say roll and you not sure if your lbs going to roll but I was sure that lbs going to roll and after that like I said they we took we actually took command of the Pledge process for ourselves yeah because it was like what can the brothers do that they ain't already done to us that's right I mean and not was I think that psychologically that was one of the mistakes the brothers made and I just gotta be honest I mean they put so much heat on as early that the last few weeks it was like what you gonna do last two weeks it supposed to been the hell week but we had an extra week of we had an extra week of hell the up the paperwork hey y'all remember when uh they had us in the yard back there in the dark and and they slung me around and I had the nail in the palm of my hand oh yeah nail in the Palm my hand and then it got infected and uh I had to take off everything go to the infirmary and uh I went to Lex Luther car forel kept me in his room for two days nurs me back to help with soup and all this mess and and and the and walked me down to the back door sleigh and said go find your lbs but he locked me down for two days I was messed up well we woke up that morning I was over there dizzy and making noise hand was all swoll up they thought it was getting ready to be a repeat of the previous line they like oh God get ready to do it get ready to do straight through your hand man back house and then and then it got affected yeah and then we was doing the Death March I I still got the blood spot on the palm mark on my brick where that thing was still bleeding we was almost there end there boy it could have bled all day but yeah I remember that the nail in the night we was in there getting tightened up they said who wants some more they said it looked like I stepped out I just roll right out in the floor went right out man night let me say this about the pledge period The Pledge period has is something that has helped me immensely for to go through so many Hills and Valleys of my life because once my mind switched to the fact that I can do anything for a six- week period it switched to I can do anything for a 12we period I can do do anything for a 18 week period I can do anything for a year and it just completely allowed me to understand how much you can actually endure to the end and you know that that was the one thing I wasn't expecting really to to experience I mean you really find get to find out you know where your strengths and weaknesses are where your leadership skills are you know the different things you got to work on um and at the whole time in Greenville for me was opportunity to learn how to be a leader and the fact that I needed to be a better leader um and what were my strengths and weaknesses and so I I was absolutely grateful for that I was absolutely by the time I left East Carolina I mean and years later I was always grateful for God putting me in that particular place at that particular time and um you know even to day you know I think about it I only thing I can do is go back to the pledge period and say I went through this for you so you know and then you know looking at that and then looking at the relationships that you create and then as I started off by saying the culture realizing people come from different cultures they have different backgrounds they have different experiences but at the same time they have the same goals a lot of them have the same goals there you go and um and and learning how to respect that you know in other people and you know so it was it was it was an actual good 17 to 21 growing up period um you know and then realizing you still had a lot of growth to do and even today still have a lot of growth to do right good stuff good stuff yeah that that's so true brother Kennedy everything that you said I mean um and that's uh that's a Common Thread that we hear in um probably uh 90% of the interviews that we've conducted so you know it it's just amazing how you know you might start off in uh on a different U level but in the end we all end up at the same spot you know and and I think that's that's one of the things about um uh having your lbs with you you you become a Comm you become a common unit you develop that Bond and uh you just um help each other see it to the end so um it's very that that is another thing that now we glad that Maron and you can hear we took everything the brothers had I mean and they had to admit it they a had nothing left they did everything they could possibly do to her and they had and they had to eat it I mean they they had to just you know admit it and that that allowed a certain freedom in the fraternity um in in the chapter and in the fraternity that you know we could walk around confident that it was like you know we for me I never got into a debate about you know how hard somebody pledged I just look at other people like and and just know if you had to go anywhere close to what we went through you wouldn't probably be a mega right now yeah I mean just I mean just to be completely honest and am I wrong lb you're right you're right it's fun it's funny you say that because um very similar um instances with your line and our line being that our Dean pledged seven years before us our de wasad and so you have a situation where all the brothers around he's older than all the other BRS so kind of like what you all Willie but one of the things you said Jeff is very interesting because the conversation always comes up and my Dean looks at me he says you know y'all pledge hard but that 84 line you know y'all can be like a notch below them or right Bel 86 and but with that being said the conversation the conversation's always been and Jeff and I have started a lot of trouble up here in DC but we tell Brothers hey y'all here they're here I don't care whether G Alpha chapter P chapter whatever y'all wouldn't have made it Carolina and they be like piss we very clear and we not even joking with them no they nowhere in the world they would have made it hey look y'all remember the night when we made dog and and Willie turned us over to Carl and he had his he had his time let his frustration of the first weeks out on us y'all remember that oh yeah then we had to go wash cars the next day the make K was out there we out there sweaters cuz we all we was all jacked up yeah we was all jacked up we had to wear the hoodie on it was hot at that we show ourselves like little abused kids man we can you the sweating washing cars man what one thing other one one other thing that I again like about our particular line but I love about our chapter to you know our chapter handled our own chapter's business that's right you know they would be visiting chapters that would come down and you know the BRS they would they would let them see us but they were some guidelines they weren't U was not pressured to try to prove themselves about anything uh we knew Mighty U well they at the time I later knew that but um you know they weren't going to let somebody come down and wreck their lamps I mean they were going to let them be out with us but they weren't going to let them just wreck us so that you know I appreciated that um you know some of that is really what allowed us to once we cross the Burning Sands you know reconnect with with chapter Brothers um because had to be a bridge um having gone through certain certain things in our process there had to be a bridge that reconnected us all and Le Lex was a big part of that as being um you know taking us we that type thing yeah he did his thing he allowed whatever but then there was a a period where he began to change and transform and you know become uh that brother that you know we were expecting All U Brothers to be and um know I really appreciated him for that and again Reggie holiday and several other Zod yeah um you know to help bring because um you know if that's not done properly some of these things can have a a real negative lasting effect and and you know like any family they are lasting effects on certain things but through it all you know we were able to maintain our Brotherhood with each other but um you know I have real strong connections with with uh Brothers throughout our you know the the life of our chapter and I'm I'm I'm excited about that hey can I jump in here right quick yeah go ahead Brian um with these guys right here for me being in 89 and like Marin just kind of hinted on with Zod as our DP and then dealing with Cordell and then um you know the incident that we had when we were online when Jeff showed up I guess it was homecoming or something like that we got caught at McDonald but we can talk about that some other time but Jeff set us out yeah I didn't tou but what I'm saying you guys are special to me and I just just throwing it in there I don't have a question really to ask it's just that you guys were uh legendary for us um when we were online and whatever ever happened before us it's just it was just so much that y'all put into our chapter that when we were online it was like just okay there's 84 there's 89 84 is crazy this one happened all this stuff just kind of happened and then y'all are legendary in our chapter and I just look at what y'all done um outside of U and then which I've done when y'all came back back I just want to say that when y'all was online and y'all went over and y'all went over to you know to do whatever you did you know moving forward I mean did you even have any idea what you would leave with UI at that time like did you have any idea or did you just kind of come back at you know after the fact like y'all y'all definitely important in that chapter but do you know what you've left with u does that make any sense well I'm sure them guys left a lot more than me uh uh with it being the party school that it was I left I went out early I went to the Army and uh all the years uh that I was in that while they were finishing up I was in the Army I was uh seeing seeing them here and there periodically and uh you know I can't remember exactly when it was when I got back with everyone got full contact information but U uh I didn't think I was leaving anything for being there so short period of time now in terms of our pledge period uh I knew what we had been through was going to last uh for at least some period of time because uh it it was it was unusual it was it was different I knew that that our pledge period was was was a phenomenal one CU they were already talking about it pretty much soon as we finished so I knew it was leaving a little something but I didn't think it would be you know lines in 89 here with that 84 line now I knew it would wouldn't I didn't think it would be something like that I can say that um when I came home to DC um two of the guys that used to come down from East Carolina I mean excuse me from Elizabeth City uh they were from DC and another uh one of my homeboys came from Carolina you remember Aaron Jackson came to the dog house and uh he played football for Carolina right and the thing that was amazing was they would tell the other brothers they was like look we can we can tell y'all for sure these Negroes right here pledged that he pledged and that was one of the that was one of the beautiful things so it was never really a a conversation and even with murf you know nobody questions did murf pledge you know she was I'm like murf pledged you know it you know it goes across but something else that goes across is the internal love uh of the chapter it's the the relationship between your lbs it's the relation it's the relationship the special relationship that You' seen that some of your lbs have been able to create with other lines and other brothers and that's what it was all about U it you know that's what it was all about so we had to endure what we endured um but there was little signs that we were going to endure I mean chill being 76 and then sad being you know where he where he was and later you know you come to learn for at least for our chapter sad is the one bro who sort of sets sets everything off you know uh and he's the quiet instigator you know let's let's just be clear he's the he he he is the instigator of most of everything that happens and um once these brothers gave you a certain level of respect for the way you came into fraternity it just transcend to wherever you were you know and uh I know that was my experience and so um you know that that's that's a good thing I mean I I I would you know I would would have preferred it went down a little different but it went down the way it went down you know it went down the way it went down so so let's add oh go ahead John look you about to say something go ahead John well I was just gonna say Hugh Hugh you might have created a monster man you know we we didn't know I didn't know we were we were you know revered in that manner created a monster by even saying that uh 84 stands out in in a certain way I I knew my did uh people even like Bruce like Bruce so young when he pledged although we didn't know why I was online I mean we knew he was a freshman but all that went out of the out of that um you know went out the window as things hit on but Bruce Bruce left uh shortly thereafter but it's like the legend of Bruce lived on you know people people remembered Bruce uh and he had even been there for a while you you know hear people talk about Bruce I don't I don't think he really understood or knew that I didn't you know he he connected with a lot of people and uh to this day uh you know I hear stories about Bruce uh uh one in particular from Steve sers who had a a certain fun fun this for Bruce and um and again Reggie holiday and um um yeah this this dude was a legend and you know he wasn't even there that long right it does something when you it really does something when you have uh uh taking the best best the brothers could give and they they they I mean it's like you know what else could we have done to you I tell you though it was the BR was a lot of fun though I remember hanging over the reggies and and DJing on his on his DJ's table and stuff we hanging out in there boys uh I missed when y'all got your Brands I had to get my brand by myself I did a lot of things by myself cuz I was missing an action a lot of times and uh I'd show by C and they'd be like yeah we did this I was like man I want to and then you know so they they walked me through getting my brand and all that I remember that I was like oh man that thing gonna be hot they was like we got you man look at that look at that I was ready there I was like yeah but yeah it it was cool the brothers was was a real influence on my life uh to this day to this day and and that's what we wanted to ask you guys okay so talked about the pledge period and Jackson was gonna go here okay and then y'all went over what was that feeling like where was some of y'all first road trips what was some of you all's roles in the chapter you know tell us about that first years being NEOS because I mean the chapter was also you said chapter just come back from being suspended for a little bit so there's some things y'all maybe had to put in place so get reestablished you know tell us a little about about all that you know you get your shirts and you off you're offline tell us yeah and you also mentioned that there were quite a few Brothers on the yard so you had to kind of you know um get him get involved along with them as well so how how did all that fall into place for me for a week or two I I had to remember not to scared to walk on grass and order pizza I was scared of all kinds of things for for a week or so though but I remember seemed like I remember there was big party uh I remember being all around with my lbs and just looking at the group and and kind of thinking you know we made it you know yeah and uh the guys who had just was tightening you up last week was coming by you know grabbing you and hugging you and you know calling your brother you know and uh I I just remember being an exciting time uh being having the freedom and uh that just really made me go further into academic probation but uh those were some of the best times in my life right there after we went over uh uh it was great it really was really was yeah I feel like I'm talking a lot I'm really a quiet person but you know when I get around people I'm really kind of familiar with I I do begin to kind of go ahead talk John talk man go ahead but but once I went over you know really I didn't think brainwashing was a real thing but I have to admit you know I was kind of brainwashed to a certain extent but I I kind of quickly came out of that I went home I could I can clearly remember this and this is another life lesson for me I came home and I was in a social setting around some know some guys that I you know frankly I'm trying to show off for and then some girl around and I kind of did something that was kind of inappropriate and was kind of out of my character and um I was being a Queue at the time and uh that that was one of the Monumental times of my life that I look back on and you know I later had to go back and apologize this this this young girl for for what I said and did but it also served as a time for me to kind of snap out of realizing that being an Omega Man uh you don't have to live up to whatever whatever somebody's you know uh thought of who I am uh you know the reason I pledged Omega was the reason that I thought I can be an Omega and be who I am so I had to come back to that until that end as I was saying some of the brothers how they invited us back uh into the process you know they told us that being an Omega Man meant being a leader and um you know being a mover and Shaker until that end got to we begin to engaged uh with the chapter and and figure out ways to move it along and I think this is another way that our Reign not necessarily 84 but the period of time that we were there that we moved the chapter along we figured out how to make money uh we were the first ones that really um have a um a relationship with the Unlimited Touch where we we had to we had to place every Thursday night every Thursday and it was almost like a job really yeah every Thursday night and and money really wasn't a problem we roll money I mean we had we had it where we we negotiated the contract where we would get all the money on the door and just you know the um the um the club only got what the drink at the bar and we later did some other things where we gave back to the community we we we did a uh partnership with a skating rink where we threw the biggest uh step Show competition we I mean at that time sorroes and fraternities was doing step shows for free but we F figured out a way to monetize it so we had it a Skate World or whatever the name was Sports World Sports World yeah we made a lot of money so much that we were able to give now I question this I mean we gave it to the m Donald's uh house which was just forming in Greenville which is a wonderful organization uh I would have liked for us you know looking back on things to I'm sure there was some black organizations that we could have enriched but we gave a lot of money away to them and anyway we moved the chapter along and figured out how to be businessmen with the chapter party in but as they now say party with a purpose make it mean something we we you know it's interesting I had to uh share with the BR they gave we actually gave too much money away uh we could actually used some of that more more of that money for Fraternity purposes and I don't think my my lbs were aware and because I because I remember having to had a conversation that we only had to give a percentage of that money away and we were giving all of it away I mean and we were I mean so imagine that I I never forget I was walking on campus in one of the aka's approached me and they was like well can we have a party with y'all because y'all have the Unlimited Touch The Party Place locked down and you know we would like to share you know and and I was scratching my head because I was like I wonder why they don't know I'm the worst brother come to and ask something like that I'm like hell no keep all the money but I went to the brother I went to the brothers and and and I think we did I I think we did have a party with the AKA or uh yeah AK yeah it was and because we had the campus locked down to the point where we knew that we could bring in a certain amount of money and at that particular time you know we we we really weren't aware you know and I can say I really wonder we were making a lot of money I mean the door I was in and staying late steady counting money after y'all was you know gone to sleep we were still counting money man we we we made a lot of money un limited touch I remember and and that was a standard that you all left for us because when we came through 89 as lamps and L as brothers that was a standard every Thursday night we had to be to touch by 10 o'clock and you had to be the first ones there and on top of that we got the door we got 100% sent they got the bar and that was the that was the way things continued some years later MH owner of the touch actually owned two strip clubs in DC uh clanes and 55 and when they found out that I went to school in Greenville and I was good for a number of years at home I tell BR about that point but you asked the question about uh going over you know when I went over I wasn't too happy about some of the stuff that happened online now I might be a different person now but uh you know I wasn't too happy about how some of the stuff went down online but um I tried to do my best to um make things work fraternally and so you know I wasn't always I didn't always do it perfect um but I I you know like I said I later learned that uh you know forgiving and and moving on and and and and showing strength in different areas you know it's just something that happens in life I mean we we can't control necessary processes but um what actually happened has oh my God is blessed me uh so much to to endure what I'm going through now I mean it's like I'm used to this you know I'm saying you know I'm just used to it so it allows me to transcend do a whole bunch of stuff that other people just simply couldn't do wow yep yep it was a it was a the rude awakening uh the uh very first um meeting we had frat meeting after we pledged and I still remember I mean you know 84 we we did our thing and you know we we we we was the bomb couldn't nobody tell us nothing so I walk into frat meeting sit down with some Dark Shades on you know all the brothers shirt tie getting ready to you know take care of business I'm in there with shades on and I still remember call looking at me and it's like take them Shades off right now I mean we was brothers and all of that but that hit me below the belt man I I was wakening I'm like yeah let me let me get straight here we thought you would doing it as a joke honestly we thought you were joking that yeah we thought you would just be an auor get them Shades off man they they was about the business and that's what I liked about the brothers too man we would laugh and play we knew our limits we would part but when it was time for meetings the brothers was on point you know we took care of what we needed to take care of and and you know we got out of there we didn't have to prolong some of the meetings uh unlike some of the grad chapters you go to now I'm not they in meetings you know two and three hours Let's Take Care of Business and get on out the way so uh yeah that that was that was a little rude awakening right after I went over but we we we got a chance to uh do do several road trips man I mean we drove all the way out to uh Western Carolina did you go with me John out there in the mountains Zod I know it was uh I can't remember actually but yeah you know West was another thing too road trips to uh Western Carolina that um of course LG Elizabeth City seemed like they they they were so tight with us so um but but the ultimate was you know right after we played went to uh went to the clave uh 84 now that was just mindboggling right then and there that was that was he said where where was it Howard University DC okay okay okay all right stay with me right yeah and look we had three of the brothers we had three of the brothers from North Carolina State staying with us yeah and they stayed in the basement I woke up in the morning me and art woke up in the morning they was out back cutting the grass they was out the brothers was out back cutting the grass we laugh I mean it was it was a beautiful thing all them brothers had 4.0 man all them brothers were smart man they were oh smart but let me say this too I think our best road trip was North Carolina ENT homecoming I was on that one I was still there for that one I believe yeah let me just back up to to to to Howard man to see so many brothers right after you pledge I mean you know how you link up and you and you sing to him man they had a link you know 6700 Brothers strong man it was just it was just mindboggling and all of them my place is your place your place I mean everything was just laid out I was like thank you Jesus this by far was the best frat that I could have you know should have been part of years ago man the brothers they they they laid it out they they they know how to take care of business they know how to treat you and uh yeah Howard University the clave that was m Bo you let me say this uh you I think you asked a question about uh how do we interact let me let me say this for all the younger brothers because I want to make put this on the record the story I hear about the younger brothers that you see the some of the I've heard some of the most amazing stories about not only the younger brothers but some of the older brothers from younger brothers about the work that Maron the other brothers the Freddy I just ran into a br and he was begging me to get Freddy number I mean the the brothers that came in the chapter after us the amazing work that they've done you know that's when you really feel like you made a difference um yes sir the quality of the individuals who came after us because I hear a m i remember what time this brother was going on and on about Vinnie I was like Vinnie I mean he I mean how he how he Mentor how Vinnie mentored him uh and he wouldn't have been a br without Vinnie and all the wonderful things that he was doing I mean you hear so much of that from about different brothers from different Generations including the younger brothers that you know you're like d I'm so happy I've in this chapter right here I mean and and that's what really uh that's what really gets gets me sometimes it's like the the chapter report and the chapter name is so good that um you know it's it's amazing every you know I mean it's just simply amazing for me let me just jump in here and say I'm glad you brought that up uh Jeff because you are in the presence of um the brothers that you're talking about I mean pretty much everybody on this history committee are the kind of brothers that you're describing I mean and I mean I've said it before Maron tro bo uh Brian um Ron even um the brother from 201 who's not here with us man these guys have rolled their sleeves up and you wouldn't believe the kind of work that um that they had been putting into this committee so um if you want to give some props you you you came to the right place because oh yeah here on this interview right now you can't live out can't uh leave out SB as well SB yeah that well I could go on and on I'm just I'm just speaking about the ones who are present tonight you know I understand um and of course you know you guys um are a part of that as well so you know I'm I'm not um discounting anything that uh you guys have um um you know added on to to the presence of U let let me let me Jump Right In here because I think this is a good transition point and a good point that you guys have kind of teed up without even knowing it you guys come in we talk y'all talk about NEOS and you talk about okay these things that you all experience but then okay right after that you all become profits you got fall 84 you got uh 86 what were were some of the things that you all said that you all were um passed on intentionally what was the Legacy that you all wanted to make sure that U continued on um you know and we want to hear some about that what are some of the things that you P put in place intentionally um what are some of the influences that you um left on the campus let's see 86 rest is so Jeff um I think I was pretty gung-ho but I was I was still still out and about and I I tried to take the role of uh dean of pledges and I think after about the first week I figured out how hard it it I mean that that that's that's a tough tough job to do I mean that's that's that's work it ain't as you know peachy as everybody think it is you know I'm the dean of pledges I'm the DP blah blah blah you got you you you you got a lot of responsibility and I think I was big enough or the brothers kind of nudge me to say hey Art you know I don't think you need to be Dean and I wasn't fussed I didn't fuss and fight about it I mean I I knew my place and I think that's when you took over John you you became the dean after that yeah so just just summing that up man I mean looking in you want to do that but when you're in that position you know if you ain't if you ain't in the right position you know just you know you got to be manad enough to step back yeah almost like it was almost like you know the dean is somewhat like a coach in a certain way art one wasn't really ready to be coach he still had some game in him he still he Bill Russell playing coach so so we allow art to go back and be a player uh I I took over as coach and at the time you know I had the great Fortune of having two homeboys online at that time scenario um James Johnson and Anthony Rome um and you know and uh you know with Greg and and with Jeff and you know Jeff been in the wheelchair um and at that time you know it was fall 86 and I'm getting out of school that semester I'm already a semester over well that was the semester over so I'm trying to get out of school so you know I'm I'm contemplating you know I'm like I I know what our history has been with with um with Mighty uz and and some of the things that art kind of talked about that happened in 83 that were out of our control and I didn't want to relive that and I'm like my parents didn't send me down here for that I can't go to jail but I said uh these guys can't come in any kind of way either so uh 86 was a very unique uh line to come in with with Jeff being uh in a wheelchair um Jeff did his thing we we we made a good brother and um you know you were asking what do we leave behind I I don't think of us were intentional about you know leaving a legacy or leaving anything behind but we were being taught I have to say you know like I said those people those lines were before us they they were teaching us how to be leaders teaching us how to be men so if anything we were picking up on what they were setting in motion and without us really knowing it uh we were carrying the legacy of U you know everything from the founders we were those things were being poured into us and unknowingly we were we were you know carrying on those things uh you know until this day you know I I'm a member of pii and we want to welcome y'all to Charlotte for the uh conclave next year please get down here and you know I love Brothers everywhere but you know it's nothing like the mighty U Brothers a special affinity for them and um and you know just like Jackson for instance know I've only got to know Jackson for the last couple years is but you know I knew about him before but you know it's something about Jackson and and the Jeff par uh Jeff Parker of the world and I'm getting to know miles more you know Miles Kelly was a was an enigma to me I couldn't figure this dude out you know how he acted with lamps and yet you know first of all he wasn't a drinker or anything but he was just one of the wildest brothers ever want to see but he took care of business yeah but yeah and could flip the switches and take care of business and people like hono um the hono William Davis from from 82 uh you know 82 81 fall uh 83 and 80 they taught us a lot and again they poured in us what it meant to be a u Omega Man man and we were able to kind of Without Really knowing it hopefully pass that on uh and and we hope that continues to this day let me say as far as leaving a legacy um you know I I threw myself in the service um my freshman year I was uh part of the Freshman Honor Society um and it surprised me that um I had the second best grades of freshman on campus and it was another young lady named F Mara and we both were the only blacks that got accepted into the Freshman Honor Society and I was playing football I mean and I remember the coaches a Emory stopped practice well not stop practice it was at the end of practice and he had me stand up and you know acknowledged you know my grades and it it just it it just motivated me that when I got into the Fright you know the different areas that I could serve around campus and and you know I threw myself into it so when you know when everything went down around expressions and I was having a ball and you know it was fun you know I don't think the brother realized you know the ver University was sending me to New York I was going to Cali remember when I when I went to Cali that came back I was like you know I was going to California I went to Texas um and you know University was paying for me to travel all across the country and that you know was just a blessing um that was an absolute blessing and um how the question became how do you represent the Frat in in put the Frat in the strongest light and most POS positive light and you know that was what you know um I wanted to leave on campus and then when I was doing all this I started realizing what some of the earlier Brothers had done and that was the different connection that you know you were making and I was excited and I and I can't and I can't stress this enough I am still excited about the BRS that came after I mean I can't say how much I am delighted at the men of UC see the choices that were made and the quality of people and the character that's in our chapter from before me and after me and I was so impressed I mean I'm still I'm GNA just say this I'm still impressed by murf I mean murf is I mean murf I mean I can tell you right here to have murf as my chapter brother in the DC area and all the stuff that he's involved in and all the stuff that he's doing and the amount of people that love him you know is is you know it's just an amazing thing and you know even with Freddy and you know all the rest of the brothers with Casey doing what he doing you know and then it was funny I don't know how it happened half it seemed like half the chapter moved DC when I graduated I mean you had s KC uh you know a lot of brothers you know was up in his a call lives up here I don't know how it happened Cel moved up here so you know it you know and the things that cordel have done you know and is doing you know is amazing so that's my piece now I'll say this too you know you were like when we became Pro fight what it means to make Pro fight we brought that back too just so y'all know oh and that was fight we didn't know it at the time but tell it tell it lay it out there this is chapter history they they threw it on us we we didn't realize some lines before made pro fight by doing the cards what four what [Music] four they only took four look look hold on hold on and then finally after the battle talk let's talk about it let's talk about it goad everybody relax everybody relax one person at a time um can we again all right Jeff Jeff please all right this what happen so the BRS decided that they wanted to give us 20 and some kind of way we found out that the brothers before us only took four and we was like oh hell no we ain't doing it so after a prolonged battle about you know going back and forth to BRS almost fighting to do what we did we realized what's 20 more to Spring 84 so we gave him 20 but the brothers before us only took four d g man look at Bruce Bruce like what what yeah and then we started noticing a pattern that the brothers after us they wanted them to take 20 also Jackson yes sir you know what no seriously that's the difference between your generation in mine because I didn't know what making Pro fight was until I got back to Raleigh man I never heard of it that we we didn't have that back in the 70s that ain't a bad thing yeah well I mean I'm just I'm just saying what's up man I had never heard of it until I heard Marin and them start talking about it so would have been fine if I had never heard of it either I don't wear that with any kind of Pride I'm I'm and he well you know it it sounds to me like it was just another excuse to whip somebody's ass you know pretty much BR this time and Troy you let us be clear we did not know that they was still doing that I didn't find that out till like last year the year before a never sto but that amazes me is amazes me because we all took 20 look you know BR Ron I got Ron on video now talking hey look I'm off uph holding tradition baby anything for tradition I don't know was it Troy or Hugh I can't remember which one of the brothers I told I was like and they a take no damn 20 they took four because the BR was beefing it may have been a line like it may have been another line but they was like because they were beefing about it when I got down the homecoming so who was it that that started this Tradition at U which line somebody whatever line was mad at Jeff like I said I never heard y'all started that and then now that's what we do you see what I'm saying like that's like automatic it's like okay profight is 20 wow that's our Legacy go ahead write that down wow already written 20 wow well it's it's definitely Legacy now because y'all done did it to so many lines every line all I can say is it must it had to start after I left because I I had never heard of wow well let can I do want to ask a question that attaches to that which actually has never come up in any other interview um and Troy and I will talking about this before but okay let let's ask so one of the other stipulation with that is at U neop fites are not allowed to paddle yeah right and was that in place when you all were there or Jackson was that something in place when you all were there because it was something in place when we were there where like at the end of day only profites were allowed to paddle neop fights were not allowed to um and that was part of becoming a profight that you had enough knowledge at this point in time where you could do that right it did not exist in my time again because there was no making Pro fights so didn't matter if you were a neight or whoever you know now again all of that took place during the actual pledging process yeah you know um but uh after that you know after you crossed you were good you know yeah that's that's that's about one of the toughest things you can do do is is is take wood after you a bro that did not make any sense to me I honestly I did not know it was still going on I came the whole cing one year and the brothers was beef I was like what the beef about they was like we gotta take 20 I said what they got y'all still going like that yeah and and and it was some other little things in there too like if you were late the step practice or late the chapter meeting you took cards so now make sure everybody was on time oh yeah am Brian hell no that that that that did happen but I want to go back to this okay so where did Pro fight you take 20 on profight where did that happen how did that happen and that started with so how I want I want an explanation no they was taking four before that's what they said yeah we didn't know we just didn't know I mean I we knew we figured it I figured it out after you took the 20 no remember we had that big fight about it I mean we were really like going back forth wasn't gonna do it but we had taken so much wood we didn't care I mean it was like what's 20 you know what 20 the spring 84 so who made the suggestion for 20 82 8282 it was 82 more than anybody else 82 um was 832 now yeah 832 but 82 82 then when we found out 83 only took four that's when the real problem started yeah yeah at 82 at 81 now newy I don't I have no idea about I was a you know we'll ask him we'll go back and ask him for an addendum to his interview with ask yeah hey but this is one of the thing I mean we finish talking but I want to make sure that this is recorded this is one of the uh the best times that we would have when we were online man after a nice session or whatever um we laughed about this a little earlier we used to go to Hardies man and Order 16 sausage p and and all the jelly you can get us yeah that seemed to made things right man Hardy had this special during that time where you can get four sausage biscuits for what four four for dollar yeah something like that but we a 16 sausage biscuit and and you know not supposed to have sweets but we would definitely get some jelly with it man and uh we we would lick our wounds while we would them sausage that was some good times yeah had a van John had a van when we was online yeah remember my cousin Lisa fed us and before we could get back to the room she had done told Steve yeah my home girl I'mma feed y'all we went over there she cooked up everything the the news beat us back to the room yeah yeah I heard about I mean the Deltas and the AKA were amazing when we were onl I mean they they gave me half my money for the uh the pledge to wash my clothes and the cute pearls the C PE yeah came whis the house I mean PE came through we had everybody on campus sorry for yeah and and certain Brothers had more influence over certain people and you know but they made sure that the whole line benefited from it so about that hey John you remember I took your van and and I took John's van and the brothers came and and found me out at at the church parking lot y' remember that I took your van off campus and uh I remember the BR found me off campus with your van we was online and I was with a girl boy and they was all outside around the van boy it was bad day was bad listen that was bad I gotta say this and I gotta say this I just gotta throw this out here right quick and then I think I think uh Ron and Troy is on the call right now I need an explanation about Prof fight y'all y'all doing everything I need to understand y'all doing a lot of stuff I need understand Pro fight right now and uh Troy and Ron can y'all take notes cause like 84 is right here right now and we understand this is how profight is what it is right now I just need y'all to to take some notes I wrote everything down lb what I wrote everything down lb I know you did I know you did so talk with them because 84 but I took my 20 I didn't know no better I thought that's what everybody did when we when we took the wood I thought that that was just the way everything you know that's where it's always been so I ain't know no better and I didn't know hear about the aftermath about the the following lines or anything after I thought that was just the way it goes now Bruce that's how that's we've been taking 20 C of you like like Jeff said though it was just just Just Another Hill to climb for us though I mean we didn't care I mean honestly I mean it was like after I players spir we was like we had I mean when we really did the analysis we was like what is 20 more by given by them we took our we took our five years later wow that's all brother that's hard right there though yeah yeah I don't know I might have never been Pro fight they never been near fight for like five years later Troy that's a damn line that [ __ ] was in y'all was 10 we was 98 we took our 10 years later yeah y'all was 10 we was five the chapter was suspended and it was it was long debates about when you then finally we got tired of hitting everybody mouth we like you know whatever so we took it and gave it the same night because we took it and gave it to 93 yeah all right now now we find out we didn't had to take [Music] it we had to take it we had to take it we hey look we don't want to hear that f up 20 is the Mandate and that's 20 I mean it's 20 hey look a ain't nothing like having the ability to edit this video ain't nobody that it's Twi just messing brother it's Twi it's Quinny oh man wow good let me say if let me say this too because I said something about the outstanding younger brother if I didn't call your name please don't take offense it it was not um because I think all the younger brothers I think all of y'all are just marvelous so if I didn't say your name please don't take offense of that oh bro you good no offense Tak yeah be be perfectly honest I'm I'm still amazed by how many older brothers are still you know really engaging with u i mean which is evident by look who's on here tonight um and I'm also very proud in realizing how that as our chapter has grown over older you know we're experiencing some of the grow Growing Pains of a older chapter now and uh you know we're having to kind of migrate our way through us but uh for older brothers to still be willing to serve is is is a real big deal um I don't know that that happens every every other place I I will say you know um that the young brothers that we have my God they are some accomplished guys and and um you know the things they into you mean when you know because we've interviewed allall now we're just like oh my God I mean the some of the things the brothers are doing are just blowing are just blowing things away but even the way the chapter is doing you know they've been chapter year a couple times best chapter on the best campus organization at East Carolina I mean it's just mindblowing brothers are entrepreneurs starting their own companies you know ronell the one Brothers on the on the committee 31 years old and he's fully retired wow I mean he's blown us way this dude's 31 and fully retired his his days consist of picking up his kids wow and they two and three or whatever or one and a couple months and and it's amazing but very accomplished Brothers well this has been one hell of an interview is know um Marlon had asked if uh there was any any final words that anybody wanted to leave um now as you your time to do so uh I'll shoot on that uh I'd like to appreciate the committee you know for for what you guys are doing uh uh I didn't know what I would really have to offer for something like this you know uh and it's just great to be with my lbs and and and I'm thankful for what y'all done and and I'm really glad that I decided to be a part part of it and uh just proud to be U I'm just I'm proud of you guys and I see some of the the young guys as well and on things like Facebook or whatever and uh I'm proud of what what these guys are doing you know and uh it's just great to be a part of U thanks bro you muted all art you muted my bad uh yeah I was just going to piggyback off uh what Bruce was saying you know hats off to to the brothers that's putting this together um when you guys put all the stuff out and I looked at what committee I could join I said you know I I wasn't in the right position to do it and you know I'm glad that you guys jumped on top of it and it seems like it's it's coming into play and and I'm excited of you know the the the the final product and um just keep doing what you're doing man I love all of y'all man dearly I really do I mean it's it's it's you don't hear that often when you hear a grown man tell another grown man that they love him and I can truly say that through this pledge process and and through life and kids grandkids and things that's going on pandemic so forth when you can still look at another brother and say man you know I'm glad you you know stand safe uh doing what you're doing and um you know I love it I love you guys thanks Z thank you I I'll follow up with you and and say you know I love you guys as well I I agree as I'm getting older uh those those words mean more to me uh it's amazing how you find yourself getting a little Misti eyes about certain things too as you that's gonna come but uh U is very special we'll get into this conversation another time I don't know how I gotta um gr always kid me about why are you U instead of YZ and we'll talk about that later but I tell them yeah we're forever Mighty U and don't forget it and I got a story on that yeah okay please give it but uh I love this chapter um you know I love the brother but I love this chapter and I'm I'm I'm very proud to to say that um Upsilon Zeta allow me to come through all right um I almost feel like uh preaching but uh I'm not going to do that um you know it's it's I said it's it's a thoroughly humbling experience to know that your life was transformed and and changed by going through a process with other men and um I am grateful for the humility um one of the things that did not share on here uh that if you would just allow me a moment I want to say for my lb John uh one morning John asked me to go to church with him and I was already mad because John hadn't asked me to go to church with him and I was waiting for John to ask me that's John asked everybody else to go to church but he had to ask me so when he finally asked me I took the uh opportunity and that changed my spiritual life I mean just elevated my spiritual life that that one Church experience at Cornerstone um completely changed the course of my life and just to have a frat brother do something that small you know to make sure that he included you in his particular walk uh at that particular moment was it was a change was was a life changing uh thing for me so uh again I say I am humbled I am grateful for being a brother made at abson H the chapter of East Carolina University founded in 1973 um and just to hear again the you know what our chapter has done and all the people who I am associated with is um you know it's just it's just an awesome thing you know really an awesome thing okay um Ron did you or Troy have anything any final words that you like to add before we shut this down hey sure I'll jump in guys hey it's just uh it's just a pleasure um getting an opportunity to listen to you guys tonight um just to just to see where some of the things that you know we continue to do throughout the years that we as we just discussed um you know me and my lb um we were talking last week I guess topic came up of some of the most influential lines that ever come through U and uh uh you know 884 you definitely going to be in the top running you know but I appreciate everything you all have done you know you all been a a big influence on 89 which are near and dear to my heart so I just appreciate you guys man and thank you all for taking the time to uh conduct your interview yeah I just pick it back on my lb I'm just getting back to the house so y'all probably can't see me because I'm in the car but y'all have uh you know y'all influenced 93 y'all don't know it y don't y' don't even realize y'all influenc 93 just back then even when y'all was coming Brothers had us kind of nervous when when the 80 brothers were coming you know we were just trying to make sure everything was done right because y'all just set an example you know um for us and I just appreciate you guys being being here bro you know me and my L we run tight and that influence y'all's influence believe it or not trickered all the way down to 93 uh and on down to I was a dean of 97 so those principles and that getting work done carryed on man and and the tightness and like you said it's rarely that black men tell the black men that you love them I don't see that much outside the FR appreciate you guys thanks Troy yeah well we're going to we're going to um end the interview but before I do that I just got one thing to say I know this could start another argument for another hour but we're talking about influential lines and [ __ ] hey we started this so I don't want to hear nothing Elsey I don't want to hear nothing hey number one hey so the conversation is over agree I agree I'm done now we Marin you can cut it right now I'm done jackon sure Jackson make sure usually he tell me where to cut the tape he made sure that was on [Laughter] tap right but yeah once again guys I appreciate you guys hang out with us this this was on point I'm G stop