can everybody be seated please we now move to the final session at the Darbar Hall today secure Waters aan quad and the Indo Pacific we have an excellent cast of speakers and moderator view may I please welcome his Excellency Enrique Manalo Secretary of Foreign Affairs of the Philippines to join us sir please on stage his Excellency Maris sangam ponga Minister of Foreign Affairs of Thailand sir please join us on stage Mr Bren Sadler senior research fellow Naval Warfare and advanced technology at the Allison Center for National Security the Heritage Foundation from the US Mr Hiro Yuki Akita Foreign Affairs and International Security commentator from nikai Japan Dr G Yong Jong assistant professor Department of military history and strategy from the Republic of Korea Naval Academy South Korea and finally our moderator Lisa Singh who's a chief executive officer of the Australia India Institute from Australia Lisa over to you you have the mic with you on the right side excellencies ladies and gentlemen good evening it gives me great pleasure to be here at this 10th risen dialogue and to moderate this esteemed panel discussion on secure Waters aan quad and the indopacific I would like to first thank the Observer Research Foundation Dr Samir Saran and the min Ministry of external Affairs for organizing this very important discussion this forum of course has consistently provided a vital space for engaging conversations on the pressing strategic challenges of our time and today's discussion is no exception to that to just set the scene with the indopacific region standing at a critical Crossroad with regional security multilateralism alliances and strategic Partnerships being tested like never before geopolitical rivalry is continuing to shape this Region's Destiny and the regional bodies that exist within it like aian and the quad are going to need to respond to these challenges that the region faces one of which of course is the shifting foreign policy of the United States which is recalibrating its approach to both Global Leadership and Regional commitments raising fundamental questions about its long long term strategic role in the Indo Pacific region coupled with China's increasing economic and strategic assertiveness in the region such as its claim over the South China Sea all raising further concerns about the future of the rules-based order so with this context aan and the quad countries face a defining challenge how to navigate national interests while sustaining regionalism multilateralism in an Ever rapidly changing security environment and in essence the future of regional peace and stability and of a free and open indopacific region depends on how these groupings will evolve and engage with these shifting Global Dynamics so to discuss this we have an esteemed high level panel who will delve into the pressing geopolitical secur and strategic factors that will shape aan the quad and the broader indopacific region for years ahead and who I will introduce shortly but before we begin let me briefly outline the structure of this session after the expert panels uh shares their insights we will open the floor for around 10 minutes for audience Q&A so the speakers will provide their valuable perspectives and you can take a note and a moment to think about the questions that you may wish to ask them then so let me introduce our our expert panel on these challenges facing aian the quad and Regional security firstly the Secretary of Foreign Affairs from the Philippines Mr HRI Manalo secondly the Minister of Foreign Affairs from Thailand Mr Maurice sangia pong the senior research fellow of Naval Warfare and advanced technology Allison Center for National Security and the her at the Heritage Foundation in Washington DC Mr Brent Sadler the foreign and International Security Affairs commentator nikai Japan Mr Hero hiroyuki Akita the assistant professor Department of military history and strategy Republic of Korea Naval Academy in South Korea Prof Professor G Yong Jung and that is our panel Welcome to our panelists so let me just dive straight into this particular topic and I'm going to ask this first question to our to our entire panel and I'll start with uh our secretary uh from Philippines and and come down from there so firstly the the future of regional peace and stability and of a free and open indopacific depends on how groupings like aian and the quad evolve and Eng engage to the shifting Global Dynamics in our region with China's growing assertiveness and the US's evolving foreign policy position do aian and the quad have a chance to succeed as groupings in tackling these challenges in our region or are we seeing strategic fragmentation rather than cohesion secretary over to you thank you very much uh and uh good evening to all uh well let me try and answer and respond to that question by first saying that definitely uh asan and other Regional organizations or groupings in our region definitely have a chance to succeed the the uh the real challenge here is how to increase cooperation and Partnerships among countries in the region and as far as ASA is concerned it is definitely moved along this direction it's expanded its Partnerships with many countries dialogue Partners also uh uh development partners and asan has also increased its links with other Regional organizations such as GCC EU Etc so definitely uh asan has U really maintained the uh road towards greater cooperation so I don't really see see how there could be uh any fragmentation as Assan is determined to enhance its its role in our region and also enhance its asan centrality of course we're faced with many challenges in the region and these I think asan and the individual members of asan are concerned you mentioned the uh the growing assertives of China which is definitely a fact the Philippines has in fact borne the brunt of that assertiveness in the sense that China has actually prevented the Philippines from asserting its Le rights in accordance with enclos in accordance with the arbitral ruling of 2016 and our efforts to to just exercise our rights by letting fishermen fish where they want to fish within our e or even supplying ships which are clearly within our e are being challenged by uh by China which is laying claims to parts of the South China Sea which are clearly within our eec and therefore go against UNCA in the arbitral W so this is a challenge by the Philippines and I think Asad also is aware of that on regarding the um the uh uh importance of a rules-based order is something which asan uh firmly subscribes to the need for all of us to to abide by international law and a rules-based order simply because uh middle powers and and the smaller Powers need international law and a rules-based order to to protect their rights and enable them to thrive and it's also important that middle Powers uh and uh the other countries smaller powers uh have a role and say in their future and that's I think what asan is trying to do we should determine our own future and not let the future of our region be determined for example by just the big po so that's uh somewhere where Asian is also Focus focusing on and again one final point is the importance of multilateral cooperation this could take the form of cooperation uh uh for example bilateral cooperation minilateral cooperation trilateral cooperation uh between individual countries of asan and then asan as I mentioned with other regions such as GCC and and the EU so I think um just to go back to your question yes asan has many challenges but I believe that asan uh is determined as well as the individual countries to succeed and not to allow the geopolitical uncertainties prevent uh our ability to to prepare our people and uh for prosperity in the future thank you thank you Minister song as a fellow aan member how do you see this this particular question in terms of the future of aan and groupings well I'm not sure first of all thank you very much and you know good evening to everyone I'm not sure whether I would say that this is the easy or difficult questions because my colleagues already answered several things on behalf of the r but I will add on um from the secretary um Manalo mentioned I think the Asian has a very special collectives I say to in several occasions that um Asian in fact we've gone through all these things together during the hard time of Cold War periods which is 50 50 something years ago 58 years ago um that uh in that in that period of time it's the um rivalry is not um between country but between the political ideologies and we've gone through that difficult times together and well Philippines and Thailand is a founding member of of asan at that time um I fully agree with secretary malalo that um Asian still very strong together with 58 years of our developments of Asians make us strong and I think it is time for to play very active role in the areas of trying to balance and the power between you know superpower um I think the uh collaborations um between Asian is very important and you know the Integrations of Asians is also very uh very very important for you know to to to maintain peace and stability in the regions um the principle of strategic equilibrium uh balancing of economic uh Securities and diplomatic priority uh while upholding aen roles as a center platform of the region dialogue is very important uh on everything uh ZM have gone through um a collaboration through a constructive dialogue I still believe that the constructive dialogue uh will be the best way to solve all the problems of the rivales of any um major powers in the regions and in the world I think that aans are now playing very um important role uh as secretary Manalo said that we are ready to be part of the uh negotiations and try to um be a model of uh collaborations and enhance these collaborations to extend to several countries uh in the regions and in the world um if I can uh recall um the uh comments made by our former former permanent Secretary of Singapore he said that look at Ain um his name is Mr ghaw and then he said that if you want to learn how to live peacefully together come to Asian and looking to Asians as the motel of you know doing things peacefully together after we established Asian 58 years ago there's no no major conflict in these regions and that is the very special uh collectors that Asian would like to offer that we can work together uh Asian has a number of dialogue Partners indas included and that is the key uh collectors of Asian that we can work with other countries in the world we also are a bridge builder and we also link between uh several Regional groupings like uh secretary Manalo said breaks um even ra um several Regional groupings and Regional and international forums asan uh will be playing very active role together with our country other country to make sure that we live in the peaceful environment and to promote a uh constructive dialogue and Rule based uh of the United Nation thank you Minister Brent Sadler yeah thank you um so I'm very optimistic about aan and even more optimistic about the quad because for the quad this is the one with India the US Japan and Australia there's another quad that I'm also very optimistic about which is in the South Pacific but perhaps for another time and the reason I'm optimistic is that for Aion embracing what Aion is it's not to judge it by the outcomes that it delivers the Secretariat based in Jakarta and the group of Nations all 10 of them because they had they're a mosaic they're not a monolithic coherent group of singular national interests it's fragment it's a mosaic so really the right metric and the one that I've tried very hard to impress upon policy makers in DC for many years is to to judge azan's Effectiveness going forward based on what it enables and and I'll give you one example back about 2012 13 this was the US was rebalancing to the Asia Pacific and Central this was southeast Asia in particular and the notion of small like-minded groupings of Nations coming together was encouraged by the aan Secretariat one of the tangible very real outcomes was the trilateral cooperative agement greement between which I was mentioned already which was between the Philippines uh Malaysia and uh Indonesia and it was to police the Sulu SE against piracy and terrorist activities of Abu saf and of course that enabled other things and so for that I give High marks for aian because it's enabling other very tangible actions some of which as Burma goes through a very troubling time right now internally and also of course the deight to the rohinga it is going to very likely enable not in aam proper but its members to take real actions because they can come together they can socialize and then find the most optimal path forward it also importantly as as an American up here on this Stage IT enables also partnering with other nations outside of aian in a very I guess constructive manner uh less I think one the original intents of ozion was to give leverage to and strength to all 10 Nations acting together I think aion's strength is at as a platform to enable these smaller groupings to actually do real things which they have uh and the quad of course has taken off new meaning uh in the threats and I guess the return of great power competition most notably driven by a rising China's presence in Southeast Asia but also across the globe uh interests of China don't align with many of its neighbors and other countries in the world and that friction is drawing other countries to come together again because the threat of conflict is becoming much more real as we see in Ukraine today thank you huki hi thank you very much uh first of all uh the this phe doesn't look like is completely different from the photo on the agenda profile but please don't worry this is not a deep fake but I'm a genuine hero aita just don't wear class so since I'm from one of the most dangerous geopolitical location Japan Japan is surrounded by Big and Rich Dragon and also huge bear and also there is a very unpredictable country in Korean Pia so maybe I'd like to present uh more pessimistic uh view about the geostrategic landscape of Indo Pacific if I compare this region to a weather MK it looks like like this for me there is three there are three level of destabilizing factors or threats first level lower level is a tornado tornado can hit you once but may then it disappear maybe from Japanese perspective it is North Korea sorry sorry about that but then can hit once but cannot hit many times and second level of the destabilizing factor is Big hurricane hurricane will hit you maybe several times and it will cause huge impact in the bigger region but it cannot last forever it will hit a peak and fade away maybe that is a Russia that is waging a war in Ukraine so Russia is maybe Russia Waging War in Ukraine is Hurricane and then highest level of the destabilizing factor is a climate change climate change caused by China China is causing climate change of ecosystem of security and geoeconomic relation in this region and this will not hit us today today or tomorrow but it constantly changeed the geopolitical geostrategic landscape to be more favorable to China by using economic cooperation or sometime military intimidation but that is not the end of the story and now we have another climate change coming from Trump Administration and uh this is very very unpredictable climate change so Trump Administration is trying to transform the ecosystem or International and Regional system to be more from rule based or value based to power based or transactional based and big question is last point is big question is that for the Trump administration's climate change will be good news for this region or bad news for this region and I was in Washington DC last month try to find the answer but I'm not sure at all so I would say there are two extreme scenario good scenario and best scenario and worst scenario so best scenario best scenario is that Trump Administration will bring more military asset to this region Maybe by reducing a footprint in Europe and then try to push back the climate change caused by China and maintain thereby maintain the US kind of influence in this region but one scenario is that Trump Administration will make cut a deal with China on a trade and economy potentially at the expense of security and then instead of bringing military asset more military asset to this region but you know choose to coexist with China's sopia influence in that case Asian country Japan everybody will be gradually surrounded by the China's climate change and it may change the way of life so that is my pessimistic but I hope uh realistic perspective thank you thank you Mr aita it's given climate change a whole new meaning Professor J chair and thank you very much for having me here with the distinguished guest um I'd like to uh add a few comments with along with akan that U he mentioned that Japanese placed in the most dangerous World place in the world but I'd like to add South Korea too um uh following that what has been already delivered by the co- panelist I'd like to add a few things for the discussion later and uh actually uh there has been a common understanding where the shared assumptions in the in the Pacific and now the assumptions are changing but there were three assumptions one is that we are living in a uh living with the Indo Pacific framework second one is that most of most of countries are connected by or through the Seas so anything that concerns to the uh Maritime Affairs or Maritime security Affairs are gaining the growing importance and it's going to be more important in the future the last shared understanding uh among the indo-pacific players were the uh us China relation ations where the US Rel uh Russia relations has been a fixed constant factor in a country's diplomatic calculations but um uh previous uh two uh factors may be sustained but the last factor is changing and that gives a lot of concerns for the lot of countries thinking about their diplomatic cost to afford or the other economic cost they need to review so that said that um many changing effect or Dynamics evoled from the US China relations and the US Russian relations actually makes a lot of Indo Pacific players to think about the return of the um hedging strategy or return of the uh strategic Independence or strategic autonomy so that they can maximize their National interest not spoiling or not ruining any kind of the previous cooperation uh and previous platforms of the dialogues so probably the asan world Court are the um the preferable option for many countries to join to talk about the changing Dynamics in the international relations but also the some other Minal platforms may be emerged in discussion of the changing uh international relations so I will leave it here and then I look forward to receiving your questions thank you thank you president G I mean I think we had some fairly varied answers to a fairly broad question about the future of aan and the quad and the region we live in Visa V A China's assertiveness and the changing uh evolving uh foreign policy position of the United States I want to now go more specific to some of our panelists on uh particularly the the countries they live in uh the region they're a part of and and thus ask firstly um to secretary Manalo about the Philippines the Philippines of course has been grappling with ongoing tensions in the South China Sea while strengthening security ties with United States uh under President maros at the same time aan remains committed to diplomatic Solutions and Regional autonomy so how does Manila navigate this balance deepening its alliances with the United States while reinforcing aian centrality and managing tensions with China thank you um actually we're doing all of them and uh first on the on the uh on the issue of the South China Sea tensions as you mentioned I I think I already spoke earlier on that uh we obviously are faced with challenges of the because of China's growing Asser and its excessive Maritime claims uh which certainly go beyond the international law of the unclos and we are determined to of course assert our rights uh but at the same time we're committed to as much as possible resolving whatever tensions we have or disputes through diplomatic or uh peaceful means and uh we have lines of communication with China but nevertheless uh we have made it perfectly clear that any talks we have uh will not be the at the expense of our our position and that is uh um asserting our rights in accordance with the uh for example in our case the UN Convention of the law of the sea as well as the arbitral award uh we have of course uh established a number of growing uh defense and economic cooperation with Partners in the region of course with the United States which remains our our only treaty Ally but we have also enhanced our defense and economic cooperation with countries in the region for example with Japan with Australia with New Zealand even with Republic of Korea and these are only countries in the region we've also strengthened our ties with Canada and also with the EU and individual EU countries in an effort to ensure not only our security defense security but also our Economic Security and economic resilience which eventually be down to enhancing your own National Security so we are um exploring all of these Partnerships with like-minded countries and they're quite a lot of them and including with India today we are already discussing elevating our relationship to much higher level and uh uh because we share similar outlooks not only for a free and open indopacific but a free and stable and growing prosperity and and commitment to uh Democratic Values um so in a way that's how we're navigating it because at the same time while we have economic relations with China we're also uh as I mentioned have lines of communication with China to try and address uh the tensions of course it's not always easy in our discussions as many my country uh Partners here know it's uh these are negotiations and talks they take time but the point is uh it's important we're talking but nevertheless uh we can't rely simply on on um uh one one one line to pursue so we're pursuing these Partnerships as well as various uh uh types of cooperation I mentioned early minilateral cooperation even trilateral cooperation with other countries so we are trying to really uh Shore up our cooperation with likeminded Partners but at the same time addressing uh one of our primary uh security concerns in the South China thank you secretary Minister sangia pong I wanted to ask you how how should the rest of the world see Asian's approach to China I mean on the one hand obviously aan C neity continues to be supported and recognized but that on the other hand there are individual aian countries national interests uh Thailand including for example its its national interests such as its trading with with Russia uh for economic growth um obviously that led to sanctions from the United States as well on on many Thai firms so I wanted to ask you in terms of that sort of landscape the national interest balance Visa V Asian and Asian centrality how how do how do countries like Thailand and others in asan sort of reconcile their national interests with that imperative for cohesive multilateral cooperation within Anan and indeed how do we see that approach in terms of uh azan's approach to China well thank you thank you very much um first of all um I would like to highlight that like Philippines Thailand has a very long standings and long histories of close relationship with us um we have a very special relationship um our relationship they back in almost 200 200 years ago based on the um treaties of you know collaborations and right now during um in the in amidst of the um changings of the the whole geopolitics and which is very fast we are now trying to set up working together take stock of what we have together with the us and we would like to set up the uh strategic plan how we can you know work closely with us in several dimensions and at the same times Thailand is very close to China we have also a very special relationship not just a trading partner but we also sharing the same value of culture histories and also we are part I mean we move from from China and then we have a close a very special relations with China so take the uh example of a very good relationship between Thailand and us and between Thailand and and China now we um um move closely together with Asian which share the same value of collaborations uh to to to not to protect but to highlight the interest of our regional groupings as the whole so take it advantages of being a special relationship with several countries including as secretary malalo mentions that uh Thailand and asan has long histories of relationship with several Regional grouping and has a very long relationship between between you know other countries in in the whole world um Asian has several country who are part of the dialogue with Asian we have like us EU um Australia New Zealand India and Japan Korea um not only that uh some of the Asian country also working very closely in the sub region uh groupings like m uh Mong sub regions and Mong sub regions comprise of countries in clmv this is part of asan and all this kind of good relationship with all the country with all the regional grouping we can you know balance and and as I said from the very Beginnings that the dialogue a constructive dialogue are very important and you know to highlight a good collaboration what I like to see is that we can you know think of something in common interest and trying to uh create the common interest as the sector or the issues that we can work peacefully together that we can work for the benefit of the country for the benefits of the regions and the for the Ben benefits of the mankind I think there's no no no ways or no not not uh a single actions that we can uh get rid of the uh difficulties that we have in this real world but you know we have to start good collaborations change of the mindsets of the conflict into uh collaborations is the best way and you know I believe that constructive dialogue to promote a stronger collaborations will lead to a durable Solutions at the end thank you Minister friend Sadler history has shown that when one power steps back others are quick to step in with the rise of us isolationism to dismantling of usaid and foreign funding freeze and with the US withdrawal from certain multilateral groupings what does this mean for the US's strategic commitment and engagement in this region particularly in relation to aan and the quad and how can such foreign policy postures be beneficial for a free open and inclusive Ive indopacific region well I would push back on the characterization of us moving to an isolationist posture quite to the contrary I would say it's one of uh answering and pursuing America's interest in a very clear and explicit articulation which makes it a lot easier for other nations to adjust but also to engage the United States in meaningful action and because of the the tensions and the threat of major war breaking out most notably between the United States and China over the fate of Taiwan I think it's in all our interest and it's the top of the current administration's priorities is to make sure that a war doesn't break out with China because that would be extremely destructive for all of our nations in this room and many that aren't here and so that is the number one interest of the United States it's certainly the interest of the current Administration and I think if you look to bridge Colby who soon to be the under secretary defense for policy he's articulated this time and time again so if people are policy it's pretty clear that's the direction we're going uh the usaid I think is actually welcomed by many specifically African countries that programs that were not of the asking of the host country that the United States is taking it back and reassessing how it engages more effectively but also with limited resources where our priorities are most important so I'd push back on the characterization that the US IDE is part of a wider isolation spent but again the United States has Mutual treaty obl ations for defense uh that are also mutually entered into it's not the United States imposing the go back decades but have in the last few years under China's actions become reinvigorated that's with the Philippines it's with South Korea and of course with Japan and those are all Frontline countries in China's first island chain and so it's imperative for the United States that force is easy to assess and to measure and to see so military presence is perhaps the the most effective language of diplomacy and quite frankly the Chinese are watching them and so I think that is something you're going to see as an engagement not an isolation that is founded on first and foremost Americans National interest and quite frankly a national interest that's shared by many countries in the region thank you Mr AKO following Japan's uh prime minister's aa's recent visit to United States to visit um president Trump who pledged 100% deterrent support for Japan against what he called China's economic aggression you have written about the deepening Japan us alignment encountering beijing's influence so however given Trump's sort of transactional approach to foreign policy one could say how confident now is Japan uh that this commitment will be sustained what con steps would Co Tokyo like to see from Washington to solidify the security Assurance for Japan and for the region we live in so short answer is maybe as of today they are relieved and maybe in a way they are assured by the uh isas visit without catastrophe but uh if you ask me about one year or two years or four years from now we are not sure we means I'm not at least sure because it's deeply related to the power structure of trump Administration so initially I and also many people assume that Trump part structure of trump Administration is a condominium of different factions maybe let's say four factions one the other here is the Maga people make America great again represented by maybe vice president Vance and on the other side of the spectrum there are people like Secretary of State Mr Rubio or national security advisor Walt so people some people Define them as a China hwk or Primacy anyway the other end of spectrum Maga and in between there are people like elbd kby and then here is a mask so if these four faction compete each other maybe we will see more predictability and the expectation in Japan or other us allies or maybe in in India will be that maybe those people like Rubio or Waltz Primacy or China Hulk will make much of insist that Alliance is so important and then try to kind of prevent a US Trump administration's policy to be to drift away from alliances but the I think now power structure is not that is doesn't look like that all at all power structure now is look like a uh solar system solar system instead of condominium F factions means that there aren't any strong factions that can influence Mr Trump but they are just coalition lose Coalition of these people and it's almost like a universe and then under solar system of trump Empire there are sun that is Mr Trump and all the universe are going around sun and it is son who make who make a final decision it is nothing like a competition so much and maybe Mr Trump will pick up advices options that he think it is best from his perspective and if he think that this you know this universe cabinet members or virus will not be important anymore maybe he turn off the switch of the gravity and this planet will go go out of sorry for my journalistic expression but uh that is my if that is a case we have to analyze what the sun do it's more difficult than and analyzing that this you know com utle of these factions how plays in so because of this uh new interpretation of the power structure of trump Administration uh I I I know that the Prime Minister Modi have very good visit to Washington and is visit to Washington was okay but I'm not so sure that any single success of State visit will assure the very very stable relation and in years to come thank you thank you Professor gan's the last question about to go to the audience uh Professor the US and South Korea have been strategic allies for decades um with the 1953 Mutual defense treaty forming the backbone of their security relationship but with the Trump Administration signaling shifts in US foreign policy there's a lot of uncertainty about what it means for long-standing alliances so where does this leave countries like South Korea or more importantly what role do you see South Korea playing when it comes to securing the sees within the indp um thank you for the question and uh probably this question is something I'd like to ask to the other uh experts as well because uh uh us and South Korea has a long history to be uh in the alliance system and sou Korea has been uh one of the crucial partner to the US and uh um some um changes made from the DC is uh making South Korean uh policy makers and the professionals to review their policies but um given the circumstances and given the experience South Korea went uh underwent then there is a consolidation of the US alliance system and South Korea is placed well uh with within the Oni system so probably uh despite of the changing environment or despite of the changing power uh Power in the DC but still uh I I I guess that the two countries relationship is solidified and strengthened thank you Professor look I have so many more questions I would love to ask this panel but we are limited to time and also to dinner so this is your opportunity uh to ask the panel a question please introduce yourself by stating your name and organizational affiliation and kindly ask that you keep your questions brief and focused and please refrain from making statements or comments so where do I go first hello can I speak can I speak um my name is Da Kawai from Tokyo Japan an assistant professor at the University of Tokyo I also serve as a senior advisor to the qut investors Network so my question is about the the institutionalization of qut one of the challenges that I think is um the court has launched numerous initiatives that making it difficult for nonexperts uh to keep tracking of them so this leads misunderstandings among other member states and causing as member states with a uh to view quot with a caues so in that sense I believe we need a more effective public Outreach strategy to better engage with the Asian states such as question can you get to the question so my question is that if such such institutionalization were to take place how would the Asian countries perceive it could the establishment of a parment office or Secretariat be considered thank you who on our panel would like to answer that Brent yes so uh the quad has its Beginnings in the naval exercise that goes back you know to the 90s called operation Malibar and so it was founded with a security a maritime a naval at the par because that was easy and there was a easy for a common interest to align in that regard so fast forward to today common interest between the four countries I think India is the most important one in coming to this new reality in pressure from Beijing that's not all positive and increasingly a threat and so this common threat perception is driving the quad together so formalization instit making institutions about it to enable more actions that deter bad activities or actions from competitors or other countries outside of the Quad contrary to those interests are going to happen organically and is already happening uh I'm not sure that it's necessary to have an Outreach or a public Communications campaign to try to explain the quad to azion uh and again as I mentioned earlier there are countries within aan that do welcome more security assurances from a broader array of Partners the quad is one way India's act East kind of policy comes to mind which has a history of more than 10 years now inside the construct of a quad it's welcomed by numerous countries inside aan so I don't think there's it much explaining if the actions and the delivery of a public good is understood and appreciated by specific countries it's not going to be everything to everybody but it never but alliances and Partnerships and multilateral organizations hardly ever are hello on your left please uh can I take the second question yeah uh so uh my question is on the military industrial complex in the indopacific so on one side we are seeing uh increasing uh militarization in the indopacific on the other side there's a Atlantic rift and Europe is going to diversify its uh military supply chains so they want to supply to the indopacific so are we going to witness a competition or coordination between us and Europe or the European powers in the indopacific on militarization thank you our panel would like to answer that question on militarization Professor X um um I guess that the there are a lot of uh Industrial Corporation government to government uh Corporation building the kind of ecosystem on the defense industry as well as the other things and so on so for example the ship building industry is the emerging emerging item for making the old countries getting together because uh uh ship building is sounds like a simple but it's not a simple uh things to approach and a lot of countries need to build up up the multilateral platform for developing the the ship building Technologies and the production and maintenance as well so uh in one side on one side that us and Europe may be in competition to approach to the Indo Pacific players for the ship building industry for example on the other side uh us and Europe and the other uh even the US allies and Asian countries are all together to build ships commercially or the the the militarily so on one side we can see the competition on the other side we can see the cooperation thank you at the back hello thank you how critical do you see sorry vanik Mer Germany how critical do you see the rising T tensions between China and Taiwan and how are aan us allies coordinating with Taiwan on the security threat of the region thank you thank you who in our panel would like to take take that question regarding China and Taiwan T yes secretary uh well I I of course the the um the uh issue of Taiwan is a great concern to all the countries in our region if not to the world and uh I think that uh for example from the perspective the Philippines uh our northernmost island is only 70 kilometers away from the southern tip of Taiwan and uh we have over 150,000 Filipinos living and working in Taiwan so the the point here is our position basically and I'm sure this is probably shared by many countries is that our hope is that whatever uh resolution whatever outcome of the situation in Taiwan uh uh is uh it has to be done through peaceful means and I think uh we have made that message very clear we have urged parties concerned to maintain regular lines of communication in order to uh prevent uh uh tensions escalating tensions are always simmering sometimes they get higher sometimes lower but the important thing is to ensure that uh the tensions do not erupt into something uh even more uh dangerous and believe me a conflict in Taiwan involving some of the major Powers we'll have ex fantastic ramifications not only on our region but even globally and I think it's really in our interest to try and ensure that the tensions do not escalate thank you we have time for one last question ma'am you're on the left side and yes uh as we heard about the evolving uh role of cod and asan the shifting us Dynamics and the glob and the growing economic and security challenges given this complexities how can these Regional groups continue to play a strong role and maintaining the stability and cooperation it's a bit like your open question I think anyone can take this well I think asan has a very key role uh in in the sense that uh uh uh by enhancing the asan centrality in the region I think the asan um is probably the only organization or Regional grouping which has the necessary infrastructure institutional mechanisms to bring about the participation of all the uh big and mid middle and small powers in the region and also those outside the region we have two key u mechanisms the East Asia Summit and the Assan Regional Forum which uh every year bring together uh all the key players uh who have interest in the Indo Pacific and this doesn't just include those in our region but also the EU United States Canada and other countries so asan has I think a very important role in bringing together the uh various uh uh countries in the region bringing them together to discuss uh issues of not only Regional concern but also uh of uh Global concern and these can range from climate change to the security situation for example in our region and asan is also reaching out to other regions from Latin America Etc so asan is really trying to uh serve as a kind of bridge builder to bring together various regions at least provide a forum for discussing uh issues and hopefully through those discussions finding uh Solutions well thank you secretary and thank you to those questions and on that slightly positive note uh facing uh all of the issues uh for aan and the quad in the region we live in I want to thank our panelists please join me in thanking our our expert panelists on this session today thank you so much could I request the speakers and the moderator to join us at the front of the stage for a quick photograph thank you ladies and gentlemen for joining us for this session we now move to the dinner sessions for the evening we have rethinking Partnerships minerals materials and monopolies at Shaha Jahan we have policy and pallet at mumtaz for the young fellows we have capitals gender bias making money flow to women on