hey everyone Leo is here continuing the conversation on Azure iot operations today I have Simona to talk to me about opcua stay [Music] tuned hey everyone Leo is here we are continuing with jump lightning and the video series for Azure it operations today I have my friend with me Simona Simona how are you doing I'm very well how about you I'm good I know that we've been waiting a long long time to record this episode we were both pretty busy Sim before we are you know just starting to nerd out on all the things who you are what is it that you do um yeah so I'm a senior product program manager here at Microsoft and I'm actually passionate and driving all the industrial connectivity as part of our um azur operation you know Simona I uh you and I we just came back last week from the MVP Summit here in uh here on campus um you obviously you are based in Europe and you join remotely but you know I gotta I gotta share with you here that you know specifically on opcua and the conversation that we had with the MVPs I really you know I was surprised about how passionate people really are about this stuff you know I uh you know as as someone that sure I have some experience in all of that but I never thought that you know like a network protocol can be so you know uh people can be so emotional about that and I actually like it so what do you think about that um we we like it as well and I think the emotion comes from the problem that we are trying to trying to solve and the the spec that opcua is trying to cover one of the thing I will say ler is in the opcua we don't like it when you refer to us as a protocol and we are going to show to you why we are more than just a protocol talking with with the left foot here with with you Simona yeah yeah y yeah I mean look that's kind of a oversimplified way I know to talk about opca and you're going to school me today which I really like uh and specifically about how we're you know what are the things that we're doing with opcua so with that Simona let's just you know Dive Right In I know that first of all that you w to talk to me about what what opca really is right so um the the the talk today will actually have two parts so I want to still take it easy and introduce the opcua topic as a such so what is an opca server what is an opca client and a little bit the terminology because we are special we have our own terminology to when we discuss you know um opcua in order to make sure that everyone can follow our second part which is more the advanced part where we talk about opcua broker and the way the broker helps iot operations and our customers are you ready leor I'm I'll try I'll do my best okay so let me first say um opca is here for already 20 years right so we and Microsoft has been part of the opca from the moment it was um initially started as as a as an initiative um what opcua tries to um tries to create is the bridge between um the automation that it's already advanced and relatively amazing I mean think about all the factories around the world that are producing Goods in milliseconds and so on and the it that enables a secure standard so we are trying to prach those two words that have for many years grow in in amazing uh with amazing technology but grow separately and we are trying to bring them to bring them together the opcua as a as a standard is uh is um managed by the OPC Foundation which tries to embrace the open openness of the standard and try to drive it going for going forward as an open initiative so what it means is it creates a standard data model we need those data models we are still at the beginning of our journey but basically we want to make sure that every industrial machine regardless of how complex or how simple it is as a model that we can then understand the data that the machine is reflecting at the moment there is there are around 60 open source companion packs as part of the data models and we know organization around the globe have developed their own proprietary data models however the journey is ahead of us and at Microsoft we are really supporting any organizations or any initiative that try to brings the clarity around those data models and try to embrace them as part of the opcua the second part and one of the things that comes really close to our values is the opcua allows us to enforce security profile so we all know one of the main concerns of many factories that are trying to go through the digitalization process is that we are moving from you know air gap or basically no network no internet connection on to my factory into one that includes an internet connection and as part of that we need to take care of the security opca gives us options there options that go from the way we handle authorizations Authentication from the way we set up the security profile in a way that we can still manipulate the data right we we you know if everything becomes too too close it's back to today where we don't have the data out of manufactories and it cannot centralize the um the operation of many um entities out there yeah and the third part and this is where the protocol the especially the word protocol is the one creating some confusion over here because in the area of opcua we claim that we are protocol independent and for that we say from the TCP IP to the UDP to um others and especially embracing the new type of communication protocols like mqtt we support all of them so that means opcua tries to be there where the customer is and tries to evolve as as the market evolves um um as as mentioned at Microsoft we are really um driving the initiatives around um enablement of the OPC over NT which is one of the things we believe it's it's good for the industry and it's good for the openness of this uh of this field and you know Simona one one thing that I wanted to to to mention here and you touched on the on the element of of security right and as we're working to you know as factories or not just factories like Industries in general are just move to more connected world right I think that the one thing to bear in mind here is that you know these physical devices that we're talking about right the boilers the plcs you know the you know all these devices that we refer to as assets and we talk about it a bit later right these are the problem here or the challenge right that they're physically accessible you know at the end of the day uh you know when you when you walking in a factory floor and you have like either a robot arm or you know if you walk into you know maybe a company that is all about you know has G boilers or something like that right these are physically accessible devices right that someone can be like being a a man in the middle situation is not like science fiction in this type of stuff right yeah no no and there are lots of examples out there where you know um with a USB stick that you run around the device and you can still so that's why security is really important and we need to look at it holistically not not just with from one um one panel there all right okay so going forward I wanted to to show you what are if you look from the it perspective or from digital transformation perspective a couple of the of the things that you need in order to get started with opca as a disclaimer I'm not setting up OPI server we have partners and and lots of um industry experts that are doing that I just try to show you what are the couple of elements that you will see later on as we are talking about iot operations and we are we are um requiring there so let me switch here I have a a very um good simulator that allows me to highlight a couple of things and the terminology as well when I talk about the opcua server we talk usually talk about the server endpoint URL that includes the structure like this so you'll have an OPC you'll have the TCP and then you have the port and a couple of elements that describe this when you look at the security policy I have here a simulator I'm in a very lucky situation to say you know accept sessions for any from any client and then be able to connect to anything this is not a reality on many opca servers out there so that's where I usually say in order to have a smooth transitions in using opca get into a coffee with your OT expert you will be able to tell you about the network topology and the settings and the policy and the certificates that the opcua server are are are requiring we are going to enable more Discovery but you know that helps a lot that sometimes saves a couple of good hours of of work the the security mode so again this is a typical opca terminology the security mode varat from none up to you know sign sign and encrypt and and TLS and then the user so we have two things we have security mode the connections and then we have the the users that are able to connect to this or to trigger these connections this can go from the typical username password up to a user certificate that can be can be added here again you it is our our recommendation we see most of the cases where customer come to us and say I cannot see my opcua data I cannot see the data streamed or I don't see all the data in 90% of the cases it handles to a um connection that is not or that was rejected by the server right and then you don't see your data uh or the data that you like to be able to to manipulate yeah okay and if we look at an opcua client I'm going to just highlight again a couple of the the terminology and the meaning of this terminology so when you look from the client the client usually is going to be the one describing what's happening so I'm going to discuss about the session that's why session because I have this client here communication and between the two of them I need to have the the the idea of of a session the session have has three main things as an object has types and has has the views so if I scroll down into the object this is where I find again my my server and a couple of things for the server the server can be technically identified with the node ID the node ID has this structure that you can see on the screen with I equals equals something right there are multiple um attributes and depending on the project and what um what you want to reach all those attributes can be really useful for your setup but just taking a simple example I just want to connect to the obua server and extract the clients that are behind them and the data that those clients are are generating right I'm going to look at at the node IDs and from there I'm going to to establish the connection to those note IDs this is what I highlighted that in the opcua server I can see as well the available certificates and the certificates that the server accepted so I need usually I need a certificate from the the Brer in or from the connector I need the certificate into the server without this the connection will not be established basically my opca server will say I don't know you I don't trust you I'm not going to share my data with you um therefore we really recommend to look at rejected certificates to see if the that you that that you provided actually has been rejected by the by the server and check as well if you have a particular certificate check with the provider of the opca server how the certificate can be can be enabled or which way the ways which are the ways that the um the vendor recommends to enable your connection into into into their solution the other thing that it's controversial but you know I wanted to highlight um if um if if you are looking into the latest technology that navigates around the UniFi name space so basically bringing data for multiple systems multiple um Solutions into one um one UniFi Nam space opcu already has for many years the idea of of the Nam space and there is bringing already the opca server it's already consolidating particular data from multiple system so it could be that many OT or many factories around the globe already have part of the work done for the UNS and data just needs to be extracted for the opcua namespace in order to fulfill the the the needs of of the business it is right now on the market the controversial if UNS is not already available in opcua I think you don't want to go into that controvers we just want to highlight that there is already this structure and this structure can be a good base for setting up a proper UNS and enriching the data that uh that it's available and I think that you know Simona as your switching here to the schema and all of that I think that the certificate certificate portion here is very important I mean you talked about the notion of you know how hcua is also about standardizing security protocols right you show that you know also in the simulator with the with the encryption methods that are supported and also the authentication right of the username and password but you also mention which you know that's the reaction that I have like you mentioned the you know either expired or drop certificate I forgot the term that you use there right and I think that this is where really the money is right having a certificate to sign a connection or a session like you mentioned from a device that like we said is physically accessible a lot of the time right to you know to be able to establish that connection using a certificate that's a key thing like it's definitely something to you know to keep in mind here for our you know for our viewers that this is not something that we're saying hey yeah sure just have a certificate and you're thinking about cookies like we're thinking about physically physically accessible device that can be sitting in a factory flooor you know so that's a very important piece yeah it is leor and that's why I said that in the opua um they are enrich policies for security as well as um an enriched tool chain that the OT expert I think many of them are already using it so you know we should not just take the one of the things that we see is that many are just looking at the simulator where they see you know like you have seen none and none that's that's not what you will typically find on on a factory there there will be policies and and and force via the opcua and we we are I mean we think this is the the way to go and this is U that's why we are bringing and later on I will explain we are bringing in tools so that this uh uh thrust can be established as well on iot operation interesting yeah and yeah so one other thing that I wanted to to mention we are still at um at at the beginning of our journey but opcua provides the uh XML schema the schema is there to help all of us understand the clients that the opcua server has and later won't be able to establish correlations between the telemetries that those clients are publishing and the interpretation of those I sure we have around our viewers a couple like me that said well industrial data what can be so bad I will I will be able to find temperatures and vibrations have a certain formula and so on and you know give me the row data I will figure it out that's not the case many sensors out there are not giving you the real readable values they're giving you some hardcoded values so for example instead of getting the temperature you might get values like one or two or three that means it was an increase by whatever the configuration was could be one one gr or could be just a couple of uh differences there that depending on what the machine is it you can imagine there is the difference between um you know just um a roller and maybe a burner in the in the setup and the way the temperature is being is being set up so just looking at the raw industrial data especially as a human it's usually impossible to gain good Insight so that's why we need the schema and that's why I wanted to show that they are relatively the opca schema is relatively flexible it's true it requires configurations that means we need to First build the schema so that then we can use it but the schema can you know has components has or can be built with components with um um elements it can be created in a in a Serial or in a parallel set of setup so it it really is flexible and I will say it can be ma to M the majority of the schemas that a customer U will will have in the real in the real factory yeah so opca schema it's a very important topic for us we will advocate for the um broader reach of this of this functionality as well as more openness of of of schemas and interoperability of those of those components as part of the opcua yeah okay so now we move to the second part or I want to present um what we do with opcua as part of of iot operation so we develop an opca broker with the ultimate goal of really enriching and simplifying the experience that many OT experts and developers have when trying to connect to their existing equipments in the factory we um we wanted to have a simplified simplified Plug and Play solution that means I don't want to deal with the complexity of you know going through all my networks I really want to understand what is important for me what type of configuration I need and I want to make sure that I can apply those configurations in a repeatable o way for majority of the factory that I have out there but the other part where we spend a lot and we will continue to spend a lot of the energy is on the scalability and high availability of our solution so we have been providing Solutions open source Solutions based on opcua for already 8 years and one of the problems is that when we reach a certain amount of production data we need a scalable infrastructure so that was one of the area that triggered the um the next generation of what we have today as an open source project or opca publisher and the upgrade to this into the opca broker we will be leveraging kubernetes for this reason for that is one of the main pain points especially when you talk about 100,000 of tax and the publishing interval of um seconds to milliseconds is I really need the the infrastructure to to enable me to scale up and then scale down when I don't need it and for us kubernetes is the answer there so the platform that we build really relies on on on on fundamental uh principles that of the infrastructures enable in order to scale up as the business is required and scale down when this is no longer uh no longer needed we will continue to do the the things that you need from the opcua which is publishing telemetries implementing control loops in a secured way and U dealing with events we get more and more feedback from customers that while we enable events and we are now enabling events as part of the opca we need to work as well with with the uh event generators so basically with the machine Builders out there so that they properly flag their events but we are here to to embrace on that on that Journey right so it's not just showing you the available events but working with you and your C customers and your suppliers as well to make sure that we really have a way to differentiate between normal Telemetry that means the machines the sensor are all green are all reporting good verus there is something that happened and this needs to be triggered and needs to be um published as an event and later on potentially as an alarm with acknowledgement right so something really happen the technician needs to go and have a look at the device those are flows that opcu enable we need the data to be properly structured so that we can then use it and and manipulate it we are targeting as well use cases that go into the area of zero data loss we really want to get closer to the production lines as close as as possible and we know that some that some customers in some use cases will require zero data loss that means the system needs to be available we assume failure so we don't go with the you know we wish you know the weather will be nice we wish the machine will not fail we assume machines will fail we assume network will fail and for that bring in mechanics where we can go and Trigger again the the extraction of data or we can ping again the PLC to see if they in the cach or somewhere we can still extract to understand what happened why did we last data for a couple of seconds and and we have flow building that um provide functionalities into into into this direction um it's we have we are we started the journey I will say I don't want to over promise here we started the journey there is still work ahead of us but um I just wanted to to say we are really going towards this zero data loss which brings a lot of infrastructure as well that we need to have available for us and this brings me back to kubernetes right when I need to I will basically need to spin on another resource to go and grab the data that I last five five seconds AG ago and ingest it at the right time so that for a data scientist the data the data stream continues to be continuously and they don't see that there was a friction then between different different system that is um our um our vision for how to implement zero data loss yeah and then we have seamless integration what this means is um we are not going to ask a user to go and know install a here deal with the device registry there see how you configure Arc over there so we are working in a seamless Integrations Under the Umbrella of iot operations to make sure that the user has a good um has a good experience and Sim I wanna I want to intersect here for a second just kind of talk to you about the data portion here just again a reaction you know this is you know for people that are potentially new to this or you know just getting started with with this entire thing I mean at the end of the day you know the industrial iot or you know people may refer to as industry 4.0 right it's like it's really about the data that's really kind of the point with this entire thing so as we're thinking about you know when we're saying data data data data like it's not there is a thing here that people needs to understand which is look this data is about analyzing how the business operate the efficiency of a factory floor Machinery you know all these stuff so making sure that the infrastructure is reliable right that's the fundamental building block and I think that you know before this you know I would say that with industry 3.0 and all of that I think that that was the thing that a lot of the a lot of the jump between these Evolution period of times right it's that's where it comes to life like this notion of taking care of the fundamental building blocks of the infrastructure that's supposed to support the data pipelines right so when you're saying zero data lost okay without over promising the notion of zero data lost is important that mindset um is just enough to make a change in how we're thinking about stuff you know so I fully agree and as I said while we are presenting and talking about the broker and the opcua here opcua really needs to live on a scalable infrastructure otherwise it will not be able to reach the promise or that the customer or the wish that the customer has that is is simply you know I go with my mobile phone and I see everything that is happening on my factory right or my um headquarter can actually better optimize the supply chain because they have access to all the parts that are the spare parts that are distributed across multiple sectors agree we need the scalability of the infrastructure to be able to fulfill those use cases for for the for our users yeah okay so um very quick on the features the key features so we are a native kubernetes workload it sounds simple it was not that simple to get there because think about we are connecting to an opca server that in in the best case lives on a virtual machines most times it's really um deploy directly on the hardware so in order for us to be able to have a broker that oversees the um you know the res schedule and and Swan of kubernetes we really have to do some twist and and we really optimize for the customer to to have a continuous stream and a continuous operation regardless of the of where the opcua server lives so that's what has been part of our work on really um taking the the broker to the next level and nor pan for us it's um iot mq and I think you have a session to go more into this but basically we are taking opca data and Publishing to our mqtt broker um for those um viewers that are more experts we are not changing the payload right so the payload Still Remains opcua um once data is being available in the cloud then it can be treated as opca data we just use the fast mechanism in order to bring data from the opca server into into the cloud then we are um using acre to do asset detection um and we are at the beginning of the journey here we want to enrich a more flexible way that means assuming in the OT space a new asset is being deployed it could be that there is a spare part A retrofit an upgrade to a particular component and this can be autod detected by the opcua server and from there we want as well to detect this and to show to the um Cloud user to the developer that things have changed that could mean as well that the tags are going to come in a different format because we have a new spare part there that communicates slightly different or it could as well be that changes have been done to the whole machine itself that now can produce at a different speed or can have different functionality so those are important that we detect um what is being changed there and we bring it into the cloud yeah and for the customers that have the um Network isolations and they are following the ISA 95 on or other standards we are using mqtt Bridge so basically we can Bridge from one network to another one only to one tunnel so data is just being pushed out and we we never push back down so that we can um follow their Network U isolations and the separations of the network there okay um let me quickly walk you through what does the broker do actually how does the architecture looks like so we talk about the opca servers behind the servers are assets and then as part of the iot operations we have the opca broker with three components a discovery hander an opca connector and an operator and we have a couple of additional components that uh we are connecting to so first of all we need an acre agent the acre agent will help us trigger um changes or updates that are coming from the cloud then we are actively using the kubernetes API server the kubernetes kit ual in the ETD so a typical flow will be like this I have my asset endpoint this um server URL that I showed a couple of minutes ago with this I create in uh in our digital um experience portal I create an asset endpoint profile this asset endpoint profile is being um D or is being um P pulled down to the edge where an acre agent will will re will get the information that I have a new asset as part of this we will'll identify this is an opcua asset and will trigger the opcua um Discovery handle this C handle picks up the configuration that I provided so this URL as well as a security profile and additional information that I provided about my opcua server and tries to connect to the opcua server once the this is connected it reports back that this was successful and then the opcua connector um it's um it's being activated and triggered in addition to this the operator is going to actively monitor for changes to the kubernetes um CRTs and if there are new changes that means the new asset has been deployed a new asset has been it's available will simply um um take the asset definition and send this information to the connector who will then try to extract the relevant data if I have if I make no changes to the asset as it was discovered that means I take all the telemetries all the tax all the node IDs um then there there will be no difference but we have seen customers and and use cases where they basically want a subset of the information from a particular asset and this is why we still need to have the operator and the connector the operator says there is a new asset and the connector says okay but the asset has a different configur uration that the one it was discovered and the end User it's only interested in those telemetries the as mentioned nor pound it's all mqtt so that means the opcua telemetries with the opcua payload is being sent to mq or it's being published on an mq top um topic and from there um up into into event and I know that you also have a an awesome an awesome demo to show me there Simona one uh again just one commentary here you uh you mentioned before that as we're talking to you know as we're talking to users and customers sometimes we hear this notion of I'll figure that out right and when you look at this type of architecture diagram when you look at the scalability of how we are doing things and again you talked about this in the previous in the previous slide um in the notion of native kubernetes like figuring this out to me also means that you know you need to figure out really how this is deployed in a scalable fashion and looking at this architecture diagram that's exactly what it means right so when people are telling us I'll figure that out that's why I would say you know challenge accepted uh you know because this is this is an all different level of scalability based architecture so again just commentary and reacting to what I'm seeing here on the screen yeah I mean one thing to mention as well many of um of the customers that are trying to build it on their own they will either bring a database at the edge or bring a another um sort of Json um format and so on think about this as the single point of failure because once this becomes unavailable then basically the br will not know where to put the telemetries or for which asset and so on and that's one of the reasons why we really leverage the infrastructure that we have I will say to the best we can you know um but um you know I'm I'm working on this so I have to I have to be a little bit um more engaged or more more excited about this but we leveraging it to the best um in order to maximize the resources so show me the demo Simona show me I know that you have a very comprehensive demo for me and a fun one I always like to look at Terminal screens especially when they are in this color scheme so we make it color me show me how to how think about this right so I have here I um iot operation deployed with the Cod space um following the instructions from learn. microsoft.com I think it's a relatively straightforward um pattern and first I want to show you all the containers all the services that we have available and just to link back to the architecture so you see here that I have the discovery handle this at the moment the discovery handle it runs on demand so that means I trigger the discovery and I finalize the discovery we are working on making this recr that means it will run every second or every five second in order to to bring all the differences and then I have the the connector and um I have as well the supervisor that is that is helping me monitoring again all the the CRTs and looking at um at publishing data into the right mqtt topic structure so those are the services that are running and again this is this is a really deep dive right so those services will be available for the user to um to interact with and here is where things become interesting so in the um in this is an mqtt Explorer right in the mqtt Explorer I see already my my topic structures I see my assets and um I played around for this demo with a couple of them let's take again the the boiler you can see as well here all the data points that are available the events as they are defined and you can see as well here the schema not ideal because my schema is still empty but um one of the things we are going to look at um enriching and bringing more schemas and more things available for for the users and then under the data the same um the same assets are showing me all the all the telemetries um I'm running on a simulator so there is an update every every second on this but you can see um you know these are the typical um obua assets and um and data is just being being published those assets at the moment are being created in our um digital experience or iot operations you can see the same assets being available here um I have as well a fail deployed asset so if I'm not defining the tax if I'm just creating um here like an empty where I go to TX I have no TX this fails as well so we are doing as well validations if the taxs are available and how those are going to um to operate and um yeah I can um I can easily in my cluster I can just create an asset by providing the asset name and the asset end point which uh you it's again the URL the in the case of the opice CA it's exactly the URL that I showed you at the beginning that's one thing that um you definitely need to to be able to to have at hand in order to connect to um to connect your asset I love how uh you know I love how we are like all the dots are connected even if you know in in you if you pay attention to this you know looking at Visual Studio code as you see the the structure right you talked about the schema you talked about you know how things look like I think that looking at this in in in that environment and you know even though it looks like the metric which is kind of cool but um you know looking at this and connecting for me at least to have that mental connection between the theory right and part of that is the architecture diagram and also kind of see how the data is Flowing from you know I think that you had like the boiler there that's that's really where you know that lowlevel conversation happened right this is where the data is coming from and when we're talking again we we talked about this notion of data this is where it's coming from and it's it's kind of cool to see that low-level view of the asset and the pipeline so yeah yeah so um just a couple more things because as part of a introduce the concept of an asset and this helps us to structure the the tax that we have available and the data in that we have available as part of the opca and there are a couple of things so we have an asset end point profile you see I'm already mimicking the opcua model that means the um URL the target address here this um server URL as well as the security profiles are now um um configuration file as part of my asset definitions as part of my asset um endpoint profile so I can actually have config files I don't um need to always you know go over my OT and ask him I can actually structure my data and I can deploy it as part of the configuration of my asset on a particular cluster and then we have the asset type which is basically defining the schema or is uh going to the area of allowing me to import an opcua schema or if I'm more advanced and we know a couple of our viewers are in that situation Define my own schema so if I don't go directly with the opca schema but I want to have a more complex schema that goes even between protocols or it's really Advanced for my AI models I can definitely come with that schema to the asset type and um and Po and posst this the acet type is helping us as well to know which parameters are writeable there are functional safety parameter that we know we should never touch or at least OT will never allow us to touch and that's that's there because we really need to take care of the safety but there are additional parameters that can be adjust and most of the time are adjust on daily operations and those will be flaged as part of the schemas and we will know that I can actually accept the request coming from an AI model to change this this parameter versus I'm not allowed to accept the request because this is a functional safety request and I really should never influence that without a particular approval I I would say we should never influence that um and when we bring together so I have the connectivity um to the asset I have the definition or the schema of the asset and then I have the telemetries that are coming and that I selected for the asset this is basically what we now call an asset and this is the configuration of this asset we show it in the in the portal and the asset itself lives in our device registry and what I will say and for me gets really excited is how do I actually work with those assets and I have two parts one my assets are now resources in arer how amazing is this I had my machine and we started with the industrial machine started with a production line or a boiler or a um a packaging machine and now this machine with all the information that I have available it's in Azure portal and it's available as part of my resource definition and from there my my it groups my data science can interpret and can manipulate the the best they can and I think this is part of this transformation and the support for the digitalization that we are we are providing um and the other part is I have available for my OT colleagues or for the itot conversion as well the portal where they can go in and and simulate here I took some print screens from our partners as well so it's not only direct connection to opcua opcua um it's as well available in multiple partner solution that we can directly use today as part of the iot operation and enich um the um the availability of the data um via Azure awesome this is so uh this is so this is so good really Simona I think that you know as we are wrapping this very extensive and educational conversation between you and I you know usually you know when we do these type of episodes are you know relatively shorter but here such because it's such a it's such a fundamental topic really when we talk about you know as part of this jumpstart lightning video series as we talk about all the components and the moving parts right at the end of the day none of this would have mattered without making sure that we have um a solution a legit solution when it comes to how do we bring the data in a secured fashion right all the way from those assets into you know what you just showed in the you know in the portal to the point that you actually have and obviously not just that but to the point that you have an asset as an Azure resource like this is an arm object that we're talking about and I mentioned this before that this is really kind of the premise of what Arc was all about you know we started with Arc enable servers but now we got to a point that you literally have a boiler that has an Azure resource which is like to me you know that's really mind-blowing so you know super interesting to see Simona thank you so much for for again for schooling me you weren't kidding when you ask me if I'm ready so thank you for that I appreciate that a lot and for our jump start viewers thank you so much for joining us make sure to watch the other episodes in this series make sure to like subscribe and appreciate the support we'll see you next time thank you everyone